16GB RAM kit compatible with sabertooth z77?

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jaquith

jaquith

Glorious
Feb 8, 2009
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That kit is fine, the F3-2133C9D-16GXH is 1.6v but the most important voltage is the VCCIO or VCCSA which is fine for the kit (1.1v~1.2v).

In contrast the VCCIO or VCCSA of 1.25v on any Ares kit's I looked into does considerably more harm than a DRAM Voltage of even 1.65v to the CPU.

The difference between the totally stable DDR3-1600 and faster Frequency kit is that once in a while error(s) or worst BSOD from faster frequency RAM makes little sense to 'me' on the SB, SB-E or IB CPUs. The gaming difference might be at best +0.5FPS~+1FPS, but at what cost?!

My suggestions:
16GB Kits:
(low profile) Mushkin Enhanced Blackline 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3 1600 (10-10-10-27 @ 1.50v) Model 997055 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226316
(low profile) Mushkin Enhanced Blackline 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3 1600 (9-9-9-24 @ 1.60v) Model 997050 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226314

(better IC's but tall for some HSF) CORSAIR DOMINATOR 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3 1600 (10-10-10-27 @ 1.50v) Model CMP16GX3M2A1600C10 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233288

32GB Kits:
(low profile) Mushkin Enhanced Blackline 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR3 1600 (10-10-10-27 @ 1.50v) Model 994055 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226317
(low profile) Mushkin Enhanced Blackline 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR3 1600 (9-9-9-24 @ 1.60v) Model 994050 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226315

(better IC's but tall for some HSF) CORSAIR DOMINATOR 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR3 1600 (10-10-10-27 @ 1.50v) Model CMP32GX3M4X1600C10 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233229

Ideally 1.50v is best with a VCCSA (VICCO) of 1.1v-1.2v. CAS 9 with 8GB/stick is faster but requires more voltage to remain stable. Using any of those kits set use the e.g. ASUS AI Overclock Tuner -> XMP then save and everything will be set optimally and with any of the kits IF needed (8GB/stick or >DDR3-1600 is typical) set the VCCSA -> 1.10v~1.20v which is safe.

Any of those kits are good and safe long-term, VCCSA of 1.10v~1.20v and or DRAM Voltage of 1.50v is safest, but again 1.60v~1.65v is still fine especially on SB-E and IB CPUs. A higher than 1.50v DRAM Voltage is common for either Higher Frequencies (fast) and/or Lower CAS (fast), and CAS 9 with 8GB/stick is very fast plus as important as Frequency -- so the (2) kits of Mushkin 1.60v are very good.
 
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Proximon

Proximon

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Apr 10, 2006
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I'm shocked. Is this by your own tests or did you find this data somewhere? I've been wondering why Intel hasn't been specifying the controller voltage.
 
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jaquith

jaquith

Glorious
Feb 8, 2009
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Unshock yourself...

VCCSA (I find it very funny from G.SKILL's Admin) - http://www.gskill.us/forum/showthread.php?p=56501

"In addition for long term CPU lifespan and reduction of draw and heat considerations VCCSA and VTT value of 1.100 are advised. When exceeding 1600 speeds 1.150 to 1.200 may be required for 1866+ it is strongly advised you attempt lower operating voltage levels first and if all possible maintain 1.100 as your maximum. Considerations for defining and maintain a 1.200 can be considered but are still under analysis currently ASUS has reached frequencies in excess of 2800 in full 8 DIMM population when the quality of the IMC is high. Highest DRAM scaling has been achieved with 1.300 to 1.400 with currently no signs of issues until more analysis is completed though it is still only advised to use up to a maximum of 1.200v with an ideal recommendation for 1.100."/

Ares example (same for all of them):
ref - http://www.gskill.com/products.php?index=475
G.SKILL's doc -> https://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=17VKzOB5CL5EtIelw5tGsj2CqjBk3O0OU5VPe6CUoFso
 
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Proximon

Proximon

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Apr 10, 2006
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What determines these? How am I going to know what a particular kit is going to require? Gah, this is awful news.

I knew shortly after I heard from Intel support that they wanted 1.5V RAM that something was wrong with that. Clearly the voltage going to the controller is a much bigger deal.

So, are we back to careful selection of RAM like we were 5 or 6 years ago?
 
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jaquith

jaquith

Glorious
Feb 8, 2009
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Most of my posts are in this section so I look at most of the new kits from Corsair, G.SKILL, Mushkin and few others.

Frankly, I was of the opinion of >1.50v DRAM did no harm on the SB since day one because most of that voltage is directed at the RAM itself, BUT in contrast QPI/VTT/VCCIO/VCCSA is (essentially CPU IMC voltage) is directed at the CPU and the CPU's IMC. The reason >1.50v on the SB got such a bad rap is because the difference between the CPU's IMC voltage and DRAM Voltage needed to be around -0.30v~-0.40v and the default SB IMC voltage is 1.00v and 1.15v was Intel's max spec. The problem was 1.6v kits initially like the older X58/P55 kits required >1.15v CPU IMC voltage to remain stable. Nothing has really changed other than 1.20v CPU IMC has proven to be fine and non-degrading to the CPU, plus improvement in RAM design to increase that gap between CPU IMC & DRAM Voltage disparity.

In contrast the P55/X58 (CPUs) could sustain 1.30v~1.35v (QPI/DRAM Voltage) and maybe even 1.40v without degrading those CPUs.

The degrading of the SB, SB-E, and IB is around 1.35v VCCIO/VCCSA Voltage (proven) and 1.30v is borderline 'safe'ish' (1.20v is my max), This is just like vCore -- but the 'degrading' differences between the CPU vCore on the SB, SB-E and IB are 'somewhat' different so it would seem the architectural similarities are the CPU's IMC.

Although, IMO and from what I've garnered (blown CPU's) a vCore of 1.55v and higher will degrade SB, SB-E, and IB regardless of cooling including LN2.

/my 2 cents.
 
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M

moornix

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May 2, 2012
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Not an expert, but thought I should point out that the Sabertooth z77 was designed to go up to 1866 mHz. There is no reason to pay extra for the 2133 if you don't intend to OC up to it.
 
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geekapproved

geekapproved

Splendid
Dec 10, 2010
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Regardless of all that jibber jabber, I say use any ram you want with your cpu, whether it be 1.25v or 1.65v, your cpu and mobo have a 3yr warranty, if you don't plan on keeping it for more than 3yrs, who cares about all that technical crap.

Note: I run 1.5v memory. lol
 
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Proximon

Proximon

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Apr 10, 2006
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Neither of you get the point. It's not about the voltage going to the RAM, it's about what voltage is required for the CPU to control the RAM. An entirely different, and for the most part hidden value. This may be why Intel wants the RAM frequency and latency to be set at 1333 and 9 though.

 
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jaquith

jaquith

Glorious
Feb 8, 2009
14,235
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The Sabertooth's QVL lists up to DDR3-2400; see manual 2-11 (more updated) or the older QVL - http://dlcdnet.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/LGA1155/SABERTOOTH_Z77/SABERTOOTH-Z77-Memory-QVL.pdf

This 'Forum' is all about "technical crap" and if it weren't them 'we'd' be talking about Sports or the Weather...

Controlling the RAM is the VCCIO or VCCSA Voltage (CPU's IMC).
 
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M

moornix

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May 2, 2012
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