3400+ or 3500+???

[noidea]

I can't decide between the two. According to toms hardware guide and the tech report the 3400+ w/ 1MB L2 cache performs nearly as well or better than the 3500+ in all areas. Is it worth the extra $30 for the 3500+? There are also multiple models of the 3400+ that i haven't seen much info about. Does anybody know if the 2.4ghz 3400+ w/ 512KB L2 cache is better than the 1MB L2 cache model? Does the socket 939 3400+ outperform the other 3400+s and the 3500+s? Which is better, the Winchester 3500+ or the Newcastle? thanks for your help

 

[bjpatrick]

Hey if your going to spend the money on a 3500+. Then why not get a 4000+?

bjpatrick@gmail.com

 

[pjordan]

I would say get a 3200+ winchester for around $250 and overclock it to ~2.6 Ghz, where it should be faster than the fastest FX, do to higher ram speeds. Cheap (relatively) speed. Save the rest for upgrading later. Check out this
Anandtech article.
<A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2242" target="_new">http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2242</A>

 

[coylter]

No dont listen to that guy.

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[jammydodger]

Ok so you think that a 2.6Ghz Athlon64 with 512kb of L2 cache, is going to beat 2.6Ghz Athlon FX-55 with 1Mb of L2?
You justify this how?

 

[wschuerm]

a 3200+ S939 would be best buy at the moment, the 3400+ will loose out on an overclocked 3200+ (compared at same speed say 2.5 ghz) there are reviews out there... It's the dual channel that does the trick. So my advice is 3200+ s939 90 nm, this is cheaper than either thing u are considering and has more overclocking potential (unless you buy a 90nm 3500+ of course 😛 )

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[noidea]

i read that article on anandtech, and that seems like a good deal, but I'm still not sure. It seems a little too good to be true, so im a bit uneasy about it. Would there be a better model to overclock than the 3000+? I see there are two lower-end socket 939 cpus - the 3000+ and 3200+. I'd think that the 3200+ would be better since its 200mhz faster for only $30 more, but then an OCed 3000+ ties with an OCed 3500+, so who knows. oh, and that article on anandtech doesn't say what motherboard they used, so what should i get if i decide to go the 3000+ route? I've never overclocked a cpu before, so im curious as to what the dangers are. Is my warranty voided if I change the clock multiplier? how often and under what circumstances does overclocking ruin a cpu? will i be sure to get the kind of results that the guy from anandtech got? thanks for your help

 

[wschuerm]

you should also visit <A HREF="http:// www.madshrimps.com " target="_new">http:// www.madshrimps.com </A> there is an article the that does the same as anandtech but i think the comparison is better they oc different cores to 2.5ghz.

Yes I think you do have a better chance with the 3200+ and thats what i would buy. Also visit <A HREF="http:// www.xtremesystems.org " target="_new">http:// www.xtremesystems.org </A> they have treads where they show 3200+ s939 overclocking results and i must say I'm jealous.

Read a lot about overclocking and ask quistions in forums and always go slow when setting something in bios when your new. you warranty is voided if you overclock (you only have warranty on boxed amd cpu's) BUT if you do kill one (which isn't that easy when you don't do crazy) they can't tell if it died from overclocking or from other causes most of the time. So u do get your warranty in several cases. Overcocking is dangerous when you apply to high vcore voltages over cpu stock this can kill your cpu. A cpu is very safe to oc when you don't raise vcore but when you do raise it a bit yoou can overclock a lot further. A very important thing when you oc is COOLING. Keep that thing cool as higher voltages mean more heat.



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[Spitfire_x86]

A64 3400+ (2.4 GHz, 512k L2 cache) beats both 2.2 GHz 3400+ and 3500+

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[wschuerm]

Please do your research before you state something like that... <A HREF="http:// http://www.madshrimps.be/?action=getarticle&number=3&artpage=906&articID=230 " target="_new">http:// http://www.madshrimps.be/?action=getarticle&number=3&artpage=906&articID=230 </A> I don't see to many benches where the 3400+ really comes out on top. It has some advantage with its 1mb cache but the overclocking potential and added bandwidth of s939 90 nm compensates this and will even give you headroom for better overclocks. The 512k version at 2.4ghz might just beat the other 2 at stock speeds but in order to compare overclock cpu's you need to compare them at equal speeds. Here are some benches of my system at various speeds and settings, note that I have a 130nm. The 90nm has slight achitectural ameliorations adding to its performance.

Sisift Sandra 2004:
Memory bandwidth
Int buffered Float buffered FSB memory
4919 4901 11*200 3-4-4-10-2T
6824 6767 10*250 3-4-4-10-1T
6767 6681 11*230 3-4-4-10-1T
6043 6046 10*255 3-4-4-10-2T
6101 6101 9*260 3-4-4-10-2T
6967 6882 10*255 3-4-4-10-1T
6890 6831 11*237 3-4-4-10-1T

CPU arithmetic
Drystone ALU Whetstone FPU FSB Memory
11514 3955/5157 10*250 3-4-4-10-1T
11656 4004/5220 11*230 3-4-4-10-1T
11693 4017/5237 10*255 3-4-4-10-2T
10728 3686/4805 9*260 3-4-4-10-2T
11742 4034/5259 10*255 3-4-4-10-1T
12007 4124/5376 11*237 3-4-4-10-1T

Note that the figures at 11*237 are better than THG's test figures of the athlon FX-55. (and my memory isn't that good) I am sure from reading the reviews and looking at winchester overclocking results that the 3200+ is the better choice and will outperform the 3400+, most cases in equal ghz speeds and the 3200+ will most likely overclock further.

My cpu temp is 32C as I'm typing this, 90 nm's run cooler. What more do you want. 3400+ and it's s754 platform doesn't leave you with any upgradepath.

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Watercooled by Innovatek<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by wschuerm on 11/07/04 10:50 AM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

[Spitfire_x86]

I was talking about speed @ stock speed, not overclocking potential or overclocked performance.

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[noidea]

ok i think that i've decided on the 3200+. do you think that it would be worth the extra $15 to get the 3-yr manufacturer's warranty? thanks for all your help so far

 

[jammydodger]

Not if you are going to overclock or use a different CPU cooler to stock. Both of these invalidate warrenty's.

 

[wschuerm]

Pay the extra 15$. If you clean up the cpu and install the stock heatsink once you can't tell how it was used just don't do cray stuff with it (eg crazy vcore of vdim or short ciquiting your computer...) The tray version doesn't give any warranty (or very limited) I nver had any problems with cpu's so I don't know how eitehr AMD or Intel costumer care is. Maybe your shpo will just replace the part after testing.

BTW did you read the reviews, be sure on the s939... and not s754. How long till you buy the stuff, and are you doing the entire system or just the cpu and mobo. Else I'd look out for nForce 4 mobos coming out this month with pci express for you graphix card (more upgradable) and nForce 4 has SATA 2 and 1 support and other ameliorations to nForce 3. Also look for good memory because the A64 can be fussy about that sometimes.

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[wschuerm]

Sorry I thought so. In stock speed I would have to agree.

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[noidea]

i've been looking at various overclocking forums and i've been hearing that every cpu amd makes of the same core is about the same thing as every other cpu of the same core and the cpus get a rating (3000+ etc.) when amd tests them and then their multipliers are locked accordingly. is this true???

 

[endyen]

Yup, Amd saves the best bins for low power, everything else is pretty much equal.

 

[wschuerm]

they are tested to see what they can handle but yes all are the same (not sure about 512:1024kb versions, probably 512kb of cache disabled) for instance my cpu's architecture is made for max 3 ghz. (not that i can get there because the are minor inefficiencies in the manufacturing etc

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[noidea]

so then if i get a higher rated cpu theres a better chance to overclock it higher?

 

[wschuerm]

Yes, higher speedgrades will overclock to a higher speed but the percentual increase in speed is verrry likely to decrease the higher the speedgrade you buy. This is because AMD itself isn't able to produce chips that can run faster AT THE MOMENT. The highest speedgarde is not a good buy when you plan on overclocking to get value/performance. The 3800+ and 4000+ are not valid options if you want say 2,6 ghz. For hardcore benchmarking and people wanting to get all they can out of the archoitecture it is but for a system that has to run stable all the time I'd choose for either the 90nm 3200+ or 90nm 3500+.

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