KnightsCross

Distinguished
Feb 7, 2015
92
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I had never used 3dmark before today and wanted an opinion on my results, as Radeon Software has been telling me I am getting "marginal" performance out of my system. Are these figures good?
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Solution
It's not a very good score, and there could be a good many reasons for that but the first thing that jumps out is that second Gen Ryzen CPU which is definitely holding back your FPS.

If there are any steps listed here that you have not already done, it would be advisable to do so if for no other reason than to be able to say you've already done it and eliminate that possibility.



First,

Make sure your system has the MOST recent BIOS version installed. If it does not, then update. This solves a high number of issues even in cases where the release that is newer than yours makes no mention of improving graphics card or other hardware compatibility. They do not list every change they have made when they post a...
It's not a very good score, and there could be a good many reasons for that but the first thing that jumps out is that second Gen Ryzen CPU which is definitely holding back your FPS.

If there are any steps listed here that you have not already done, it would be advisable to do so if for no other reason than to be able to say you've already done it and eliminate that possibility.



First,

Make sure your system has the MOST recent BIOS version installed. If it does not, then update. This solves a high number of issues even in cases where the release that is newer than yours makes no mention of improving graphics card or other hardware compatibility. They do not list every change they have made when they post a new BIOS release. In cases where you DO already have the latest BIOS version, simply resetting the BIOS as follows has a fairly high percentage chance of effecting a positive change in some cases so it is ALWAYS worth TRYING, at the very least.


BIOS Hard Reset procedure

Power off the unit, switch the PSU off and unplug the PSU cord from either the wall or the power supply.

Remove the motherboard CMOS battery for about three to five minutes. In some cases it may be necessary to remove the graphics card to access the CMOS battery.

During that five minutes while the CMOS battery is out of the motherboard, press the power button on the case, continuously, for 15-30 seconds, in order to deplete any residual charge that might be present in the CMOS circuit. After the five minutes is up, reinstall the CMOS battery making sure to insert it with the correct side up just as it came out.

If you had to remove the graphics card you can now reinstall it, but remember to reconnect your power cables if there were any attached to it as well as your display cable.

Now, plug the power supply cable back in, switch the PSU back on and power up the system. It should display the POST screen and the options to enter CMOS/BIOS setup. Enter the bios setup program and reconfigure the boot settings for either the Windows boot manager or for legacy systems, the drive your OS is installed on if necessary.

Save settings and exit. If the system will POST and boot then you can move forward from there including going back into the bios and configuring any other custom settings you may need to configure such as Memory XMP, A-XMP or D.O.C.P profile settings, custom fan profile settings or other specific settings you may have previously had configured that were wiped out by resetting the CMOS.

In some cases it may be necessary when you go into the BIOS after a reset, to load the Optimal default or Default values and then save settings, to actually get the hardware tables to reset in the boot manager.

It is probably also worth mentioning that for anything that might require an attempt to DO a hard reset in the first place, IF the problem is related to a lack of video signal, it is a GOOD IDEA to try a different type of display as many systems will not work properly for some reason with displayport configurations. It is worth trying HDMI if you are having no display or lack of visual ability to enter the BIOS, or no signal messages.

Trying a different monitor as well, if possible, is also a good idea if there is a lack of display. It happens.


Second,

Go to the product page for your motherboard or exact laptop model on the device manufacturer's website. Download and install the latest driver versions for the chipset, storage controllers, audio and network adapters. Do not skip installing a newer driver just because you think it is not relevant to the problem you are having. The drivers for one device can often affect ALL other devices and a questionable driver release can cause instability in the OS itself. They don't release new drivers just for fun. If there is a new driver release for a component, there is a good reason for it. The same goes for BIOS updates. When it comes to the chipset drivers, if your motherboard manufacturer lists a chipset driver that is newer than what the chipset developer (Intel or AMD, for our purposes) lists, then use that one. If Intel (Or AMD) shows a chipset driver version that is newer than what is available from the motherboard product page, then use that one. Always use the newest chipset driver that you can get and always use ONLY the chipset drivers available from either the motherboard manufacturer, AMD or Intel.


IF you have other hardware installed or attached to the system that are not a part of the systems covered by the motherboard drivers, then go to the support page for THAT component and check to see if there are newer drivers available for that as well. If there are, install them.


Third,

Make sure your memory is running at the correct advertised speed in the BIOS. This may require that you set the memory to run at the XMP profile settings. Also, make sure you have the memory installed in the correct slots and that they are running in dual channel which you can check by installing CPU-Z and checking the Memory and SPD tabs. For all modern motherboards that are dual channel memory architectures, from the last ten years at least, if you have two sticks installed they should be in the A2 (Called DDR4_1 on some boards) or B2 (Called DDR4_2 on some boards) which are ALWAYS the SECOND and FOURTH slots over from the CPU socket, counting TOWARDS the edge of the motherboard EXCEPT on boards that only have two memory slots total. In that case, if you have two modules it's not rocket science, but if you have only one, then install it in the A1 or DDR4_1 slot.



Fourth (And often tied for most important along with an up-to-date motherboard BIOS),

A clean install of the graphics card drivers. Regardless of whether you "already installed the newest drivers" for your graphics card or not, it is OFTEN a good idea to do a CLEAN install of the graphics card drivers. Just installing over the old drivers OR trying to use what Nvidia and AMD consider a clean install is not good enough and does not usually give the same result as using the Display Driver Uninstaller utility. This has a very high success rate and is always worth a shot.


If you have had both Nvidia and AMD cards installed at any point on that operating system then you will want to run the DDU twice. Once for the old card drivers (ie, Nvidia or AMD) and again for the currently installed graphics card drivers (ie, AMD or Nvidia). So if you had an Nvidia card at some point in the past, run it first for Nvidia and then after that is complete, run it again for AMD if you currently have an AMD card installed.



And lAnd last, but not least, if you have never done a CLEAN install of Windows, or have upgraded from an older version to Windows 10, or have been through several spring or fall major Windows updates (OR if you have installed ANY, EVEN REMOTELY QUESTIONABLE SOFTWARE, ESPECIALLY ANYTHING THAT'S BEEN PIRATED), it might be a very good idea to consider doing a clean install of Windows (AND THEN NOT PUT THAT QUESTIONABLE OR PIRATED SOFTWARE BACK ON) if none of these other solutions has helped. IF you are using a Windows installation from a previous system and you didn't do a clean install of Windows after building the new system, then it's 99.99% likely that you NEED to do a CLEAN install before trying any other solutions.


How to do a CLEAN installation of Windows 10, the RIGHT way
 
Solution

KnightsCross

Distinguished
Feb 7, 2015
92
2
18,535
It's not a very good score, and there could be a good many reasons for that but the first thing that jumps out is that second Gen Ryzen CPU which is definitely holding back your FPS.

If there are any steps listed here that you have not already done, it would be advisable to do so if for no other reason than to be able to say you've already done it and eliminate that possibility.



First,

Make sure your system has the MOST recent BIOS version installed. If it does not, then update. This solves a high number of issues even in cases where the release that is newer than yours makes no mention of improving graphics card or other hardware compatibility. They do not list every change they have made when they post a new BIOS release. In cases where you DO already have the latest BIOS version, simply resetting the BIOS as follows has a fairly high percentage chance of effecting a positive change in some cases so it is ALWAYS worth TRYING, at the very least.


BIOS Hard Reset procedure

Power off the unit, switch the PSU off and unplug the PSU cord from either the wall or the power supply.

Remove the motherboard CMOS battery for about three to five minutes. In some cases it may be necessary to remove the graphics card to access the CMOS battery.

During that five minutes while the CMOS battery is out of the motherboard, press the power button on the case, continuously, for 15-30 seconds, in order to deplete any residual charge that might be present in the CMOS circuit. After the five minutes is up, reinstall the CMOS battery making sure to insert it with the correct side up just as it came out.

If you had to remove the graphics card you can now reinstall it, but remember to reconnect your power cables if there were any attached to it as well as your display cable.

Now, plug the power supply cable back in, switch the PSU back on and power up the system. It should display the POST screen and the options to enter CMOS/BIOS setup. Enter the bios setup program and reconfigure the boot settings for either the Windows boot manager or for legacy systems, the drive your OS is installed on if necessary.

Save settings and exit. If the system will POST and boot then you can move forward from there including going back into the bios and configuring any other custom settings you may need to configure such as Memory XMP, A-XMP or D.O.C.P profile settings, custom fan profile settings or other specific settings you may have previously had configured that were wiped out by resetting the CMOS.

In some cases it may be necessary when you go into the BIOS after a reset, to load the Optimal default or Default values and then save settings, to actually get the hardware tables to reset in the boot manager.

It is probably also worth mentioning that for anything that might require an attempt to DO a hard reset in the first place, IF the problem is related to a lack of video signal, it is a GOOD IDEA to try a different type of display as many systems will not work properly for some reason with displayport configurations. It is worth trying HDMI if you are having no display or lack of visual ability to enter the BIOS, or no signal messages.

Trying a different monitor as well, if possible, is also a good idea if there is a lack of display. It happens.


Second,

Go to the product page for your motherboard or exact laptop model on the device manufacturer's website. Download and install the latest driver versions for the chipset, storage controllers, audio and network adapters. Do not skip installing a newer driver just because you think it is not relevant to the problem you are having. The drivers for one device can often affect ALL other devices and a questionable driver release can cause instability in the OS itself. They don't release new drivers just for fun. If there is a new driver release for a component, there is a good reason for it. The same goes for BIOS updates. When it comes to the chipset drivers, if your motherboard manufacturer lists a chipset driver that is newer than what the chipset developer (Intel or AMD, for our purposes) lists, then use that one. If Intel (Or AMD) shows a chipset driver version that is newer than what is available from the motherboard product page, then use that one. Always use the newest chipset driver that you can get and always use ONLY the chipset drivers available from either the motherboard manufacturer, AMD or Intel.


IF you have other hardware installed or attached to the system that are not a part of the systems covered by the motherboard drivers, then go to the support page for THAT component and check to see if there are newer drivers available for that as well. If there are, install them.


Third,

Make sure your memory is running at the correct advertised speed in the BIOS. This may require that you set the memory to run at the XMP profile settings. Also, make sure you have the memory installed in the correct slots and that they are running in dual channel which you can check by installing CPU-Z and checking the Memory and SPD tabs. For all modern motherboards that are dual channel memory architectures, from the last ten years at least, if you have two sticks installed they should be in the A2 (Called DDR4_1 on some boards) or B2 (Called DDR4_2 on some boards) which are ALWAYS the SECOND and FOURTH slots over from the CPU socket, counting TOWARDS the edge of the motherboard EXCEPT on boards that only have two memory slots total. In that case, if you have two modules it's not rocket science, but if you have only one, then install it in the A1 or DDR4_1 slot.



Fourth (And often tied for most important along with an up-to-date motherboard BIOS),

A clean install of the graphics card drivers. Regardless of whether you "already installed the newest drivers" for your graphics card or not, it is OFTEN a good idea to do a CLEAN install of the graphics card drivers. Just installing over the old drivers OR trying to use what Nvidia and AMD consider a clean install is not good enough and does not usually give the same result as using the Display Driver Uninstaller utility. This has a very high success rate and is always worth a shot.


If you have had both Nvidia and AMD cards installed at any point on that operating system then you will want to run the DDU twice. Once for the old card drivers (ie, Nvidia or AMD) and again for the currently installed graphics card drivers (ie, AMD or Nvidia). So if you had an Nvidia card at some point in the past, run it first for Nvidia and then after that is complete, run it again for AMD if you currently have an AMD card installed.


Graphics card driver CLEAN install guide using the Wagnard tools DDU



And lAnd last, but not least, if you have never done a CLEAN install of Windows, or have upgraded from an older version to Windows 10, or have been through several spring or fall major Windows updates (OR if you have installed ANY, EVEN REMOTELY QUESTIONABLE SOFTWARE, ESPECIALLY ANYTHING THAT'S BEEN PIRATED), it might be a very good idea to consider doing a clean install of Windows (AND THEN NOT PUT THAT QUESTIONABLE OR PIRATED SOFTWARE BACK ON) if none of these other solutions has helped. IF you are using a Windows installation from a previous system and you didn't do a clean install of Windows after building the new system, then it's 99.99% likely that you NEED to do a CLEAN install before trying any other solutions.


How to do a CLEAN installation of Windows 10, the RIGHT way
I have never performed a BIOS reset before. Does this put my disks in jeopardy at all or do I need to disconnect them before doing this? I dont want to lose any data. 4TBs worth of valuable memories, I will back them up if I have to.
 
A BIOS reset should never affect any of the data on your drives. It MIGHT, in some rare cases, affect the boot ORDER, but not the drives themselves or anything on them. What it WILL affect is any custom settings you have configured for overclocking, or CPU or case fan cooling profiles, or any other custom settings you have previously configured in the BIOS you will have to probably reconfigure those settings afterwards.

Is this a new build or did you recently upgrade the graphics card? It may not be necessary at all to do a BIOS reset in your case. I usually recommend it after updating the BIOS but only for problems that are likely BIOS setting related, and yours may not be.

What are your FULL hardware specifications including exact model numbers for CPU, motherboard, memory kit or kits, power supply, case, CPU cooler, case fan configuration and locations, graphics card and any other installed hardware like internal RGB or fan controllers, sound cards, etc.?

And, you should not need to be told or have to wait for a "situation" to happen before backing things up. It's too late then. Your important data, files, movies, music, pictures, etc. should ALWAYS be kept backed up in multiple locations because a problem isn't going to wait for a convenient time to happen. Drives die, all the time. Once they start it's usually too late to start worrying about "oh I haven't backed it up in months" by that point. Every time you add something new that is important to you, back it up. At the VERY least, back up everything important on at least a weekly basis so that if something does happen in between you at least don't lose things too far back.

So yes, back up everything important, now, before you do ANYTHING. That should ALWAYS be the RULE. No matter what you are doing other than simply using the system. And even then, regularly.
 

KnightsCross

Distinguished
Feb 7, 2015
92
2
18,535
It's not a very good score, and there could be a good many reasons for that but the first thing that jumps out is that second Gen Ryzen CPU which is definitely holding back your FPS.

If there are any steps listed here that you have not already done, it would be advisable to do so if for no other reason than to be able to say you've already done it and eliminate that possibility.



First,

Make sure your system has the MOST recent BIOS version installed. If it does not, then update. This solves a high number of issues even in cases where the release that is newer than yours makes no mention of improving graphics card or other hardware compatibility. They do not list every change they have made when they post a new BIOS release. In cases where you DO already have the latest BIOS version, simply resetting the BIOS as follows has a fairly high percentage chance of effecting a positive change in some cases so it is ALWAYS worth TRYING, at the very least.


BIOS Hard Reset procedure

Power off the unit, switch the PSU off and unplug the PSU cord from either the wall or the power supply.

Remove the motherboard CMOS battery for about three to five minutes. In some cases it may be necessary to remove the graphics card to access the CMOS battery.

During that five minutes while the CMOS battery is out of the motherboard, press the power button on the case, continuously, for 15-30 seconds, in order to deplete any residual charge that might be present in the CMOS circuit. After the five minutes is up, reinstall the CMOS battery making sure to insert it with the correct side up just as it came out.

If you had to remove the graphics card you can now reinstall it, but remember to reconnect your power cables if there were any attached to it as well as your display cable.

Now, plug the power supply cable back in, switch the PSU back on and power up the system. It should display the POST screen and the options to enter CMOS/BIOS setup. Enter the bios setup program and reconfigure the boot settings for either the Windows boot manager or for legacy systems, the drive your OS is installed on if necessary.

Save settings and exit. If the system will POST and boot then you can move forward from there including going back into the bios and configuring any other custom settings you may need to configure such as Memory XMP, A-XMP or D.O.C.P profile settings, custom fan profile settings or other specific settings you may have previously had configured that were wiped out by resetting the CMOS.

In some cases it may be necessary when you go into the BIOS after a reset, to load the Optimal default or Default values and then save settings, to actually get the hardware tables to reset in the boot manager.

It is probably also worth mentioning that for anything that might require an attempt to DO a hard reset in the first place, IF the problem is related to a lack of video signal, it is a GOOD IDEA to try a different type of display as many systems will not work properly for some reason with displayport configurations. It is worth trying HDMI if you are having no display or lack of visual ability to enter the BIOS, or no signal messages.

Trying a different monitor as well, if possible, is also a good idea if there is a lack of display. It happens.


Second,

Go to the product page for your motherboard or exact laptop model on the device manufacturer's website. Download and install the latest driver versions for the chipset, storage controllers, audio and network adapters. Do not skip installing a newer driver just because you think it is not relevant to the problem you are having. The drivers for one device can often affect ALL other devices and a questionable driver release can cause instability in the OS itself. They don't release new drivers just for fun. If there is a new driver release for a component, there is a good reason for it. The same goes for BIOS updates. When it comes to the chipset drivers, if your motherboard manufacturer lists a chipset driver that is newer than what the chipset developer (Intel or AMD, for our purposes) lists, then use that one. If Intel (Or AMD) shows a chipset driver version that is newer than what is available from the motherboard product page, then use that one. Always use the newest chipset driver that you can get and always use ONLY the chipset drivers available from either the motherboard manufacturer, AMD or Intel.


IF you have other hardware installed or attached to the system that are not a part of the systems covered by the motherboard drivers, then go to the support page for THAT component and check to see if there are newer drivers available for that as well. If there are, install them.


Third,

Make sure your memory is running at the correct advertised speed in the BIOS. This may require that you set the memory to run at the XMP profile settings. Also, make sure you have the memory installed in the correct slots and that they are running in dual channel which you can check by installing CPU-Z and checking the Memory and SPD tabs. For all modern motherboards that are dual channel memory architectures, from the last ten years at least, if you have two sticks installed they should be in the A2 (Called DDR4_1 on some boards) or B2 (Called DDR4_2 on some boards) which are ALWAYS the SECOND and FOURTH slots over from the CPU socket, counting TOWARDS the edge of the motherboard EXCEPT on boards that only have two memory slots total. In that case, if you have two modules it's not rocket science, but if you have only one, then install it in the A1 or DDR4_1 slot.



Fourth (And often tied for most important along with an up-to-date motherboard BIOS),

A clean install of the graphics card drivers. Regardless of whether you "already installed the newest drivers" for your graphics card or not, it is OFTEN a good idea to do a CLEAN install of the graphics card drivers. Just installing over the old drivers OR trying to use what Nvidia and AMD consider a clean install is not good enough and does not usually give the same result as using the Display Driver Uninstaller utility. This has a very high success rate and is always worth a shot.


If you have had both Nvidia and AMD cards installed at any point on that operating system then you will want to run the DDU twice. Once for the old card drivers (ie, Nvidia or AMD) and again for the currently installed graphics card drivers (ie, AMD or Nvidia). So if you had an Nvidia card at some point in the past, run it first for Nvidia and then after that is complete, run it again for AMD if you currently have an AMD card installed.


Graphics card driver CLEAN install guide using the Wagnard tools DDU



And lAnd last, but not least, if you have never done a CLEAN install of Windows, or have upgraded from an older version to Windows 10, or have been through several spring or fall major Windows updates (OR if you have installed ANY, EVEN REMOTELY QUESTIONABLE SOFTWARE, ESPECIALLY ANYTHING THAT'S BEEN PIRATED), it might be a very good idea to consider doing a clean install of Windows (AND THEN NOT PUT THAT QUESTIONABLE OR PIRATED SOFTWARE BACK ON) if none of these other solutions has helped. IF you are using a Windows installation from a previous system and you didn't do a clean install of Windows after building the new system, then it's 99.99% likely that you NEED to do a CLEAN install before trying any other solutions.


How to do a CLEAN installation of Windows 10, the RIGHT way
would it be acceptable to use the jumper to reset BIOS?
 
It doesn't do the same thing as the full procedure I outlined. I could link you to a dozen or more threads where the OP had reset the BIOS using the jumper and it did NOT fix the problem, and they wanted to argue the point, but when they actually followed the procedure, poof, it's like magic. Not in every case to be sure, but enough cases to be provable as a viable troubleshooting option.
 
I don’t see a problem with your score. You got a score of 4084 vs an average of 4262. Your results are going to include being compared to people overclocking the gpu, possibly running PBO or overclocking the cpu and maybe running faster RAM. Then temperature of components can have an impact on the score. Finally there will always be results under the average but your deviation from that average is fairly small.
 
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I'll have to look again but seems the averages I saw when I looked originally were significantly higher. I could be wrong, wouldn't be the first time, but had I seen this score fall within normal range I would almost certainly have said there is no established problem. And seems like it was a Techspot review, although I can't be sure, and they are usually pretty spot on.
 
I'll have to look again but seems the averages I saw when I looked originally were significantly higher. I could be wrong, wouldn't be the first time, but had I seen this score fall within normal range I would almost certainly have said there is no established problem. And seems like it was a Techspot review, although I can't be sure, and they are usually pretty spot on.

Any chance it was a regular Time Spy review instead of the extreme version? No idea if it changed or it was mistake. No problem if it was a mistake, I’ve made my fair share and I’m not finished yet :ROFLMAO:
 

KyaraM

Admirable
I'll have to look again but seems the averages I saw when I looked originally were significantly higher. I could be wrong, wouldn't be the first time, but had I seen this score fall within normal range I would almost certainly have said there is no established problem. And seems like it was a Techspot review, although I can't be sure, and they are usually pretty spot on.
200 points is not significantly smaller. It's, like, 2-3FPS lower than the average iirc, which is essentially nothing. And that's not even a 200 points difference, it's less. For comparison, when I overclocked my 3070Ti, I suddenly scored higher than average while before it would be at, or slightly below, average for the card. The difference? A measily 2 FPS. Woohoo...

EDIT: Actually went and compared differences between Time Spy (non-Extreme) before and after OC. Score difference is over 340 points and the actual FPS difference is less than two. Yeah, TC's differences seem marginal to me, even if those two tests aren't completely comparable. To actually compare them, I would have to drive home and to a test. And Time Spy has to actually recognize my components again since for some reason that went poof a couple days ago. Fine on the 14th, not recognized on the 18th. Tests run without any issues and I still get the same scores as always. But for some reason, neither CPU nor GPU are recognized when they were before...
 
Last edited:

KnightsCross

Distinguished
Feb 7, 2015
92
2
18,535
I carried out all of your steps and got no statistically relevant improvement in performance. I raised my score on the same benchmark from 4084 to 4130. However I did clear up a lot of redundant files.
 
Any chance it was a regular Time Spy review instead of the extreme version? No idea if it changed or it was mistake. No problem if it was a mistake, I’ve made my fair share and I’m not finished yet :ROFLMAO:
So, seems I must have been looking at the standard time spy results as taking another look at the extreme results does seem to indicate mostly mid 4000's scores which means OP's scores definitely are right there in the mix.