7.1 or 2.1?

[athlon3400]

I listen to music, play games and watch movies all pretty much equally. I like quality as much as volume and low end just as much as high end so I am pretty stuck on what to buy, the creative T7700's or the 3500's, they are 165 for one and 169 for the other so price makes no difference.

anyone have any input? it would be greatly appreciated!
http://us.creative.com/products/product.asp?category=4&subcategory=113&product=5076

http://us.creative.com/products/product.asp?category=4&subcategory=27&product=4912

 

[Clob]

How about 5.1?

"If youre paddling upstream in a canoe and a
wheel falls off, how many pancakes fit in a doghouse? None! Icecream doesn't have bones!!!"

 

[the_Prisoner]

Or at least 3.1. The center channel is very important for movies.

7.1 is overkill I think for a computer, but like Clob said a 5.1 is the best solution between 2.1 and 7.1.

the Prisoner

I'm not a number, I'm a free man! 😡

 

[Clob]

Yeah. Centre channle is very important, especially for games. Creative, Logitech, and Antech all make good 5.1 system. If you want quality, I suggest a Klipsch system.

"If youre paddling upstream in a canoe and a
wheel falls off, how many pancakes fit in a doghouse? None! Icecream doesn't have bones!!!"

 

[umheint0]

Klipsch is about as good as it gets, but a fair priced alternative is Altec Lansing. They've always provided really good hardware at a fair price.

umheint0's phat setup --> <A HREF="http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~umheint0/system.html" target="_new">http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~umheint0/system.html</A><--

 

[the_Prisoner]

You could make your own speakers and maybe save some money but the quality will be much better.

Like a 4" fullrange driver on the mains and 4" fullrange driver on the center. Then a decent sub. Pretty easy to make.

the Prisoner

I'm not a number, I'm a free man! 😡

 

[Crashman]

Center channel important? Really? You know you can split a sound across stereo speakers to make it sound like it's comming from the middle!

<font color=blue>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to a hero as big as Crashman!</font color=blue>
<font color=red>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to an ego as large as Crashman's!</font color=red>

 

[the_Prisoner]

Yes I know that but I still like my midrange tweeter midrange center channel speaker better! For discreet channels it works better for my ears. And I mean for movies and somewhat for games.

I have used the so called phantom method but I like a dedicated center speaker better. But I have time on my hands and like to build speakers,amps and etc.

I have heard you have built speakers also, so you know how people like to try different things. You should see my next project! When I get a chance I will post a link.

the Prisoner




I'm not a number, I'm a free man! 😡 <P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by the_Prisoner on 10/10/04 08:48 AM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

[Crashman]

Confirmed

<font color=blue>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to a hero as big as Crashman!</font color=blue>
<font color=red>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to an ego as large as Crashman's!</font color=red>

 

[Clob]

Wheres that link 😉

"If youre paddling upstream in a canoe and a
wheel falls off, how many pancakes fit in a doghouse? None! Icecream doesn't have bones!!!"

"Battling Gimps and Dimbulbs HERE at THGC"

 

[the_Prisoner]

here is the link. my woodworking skills arent good enough for these. 110db.
<A HREF="http://www.passdiy.com/images/projects/kleinhorn.jpg" target="_new">http://www.passdiy.com/images/projects/kleinhorn.jpg</A>

the Prisoner

I'm not a number, I'm a free man! 😡

 

[Clob]

Wow. Thats awsome. What drivers are those?

"If youre paddling upstream in a canoe and a
wheel falls off, how many pancakes fit in a doghouse? None! Icecream doesn't have bones!!!"

"Battling Gimps and Dimbulbs HERE at THGC"

 

[the_Prisoner]

It is a Lowther DX 55 6" mid/full range driver. One driver costs about 1000.00US.

Pretty cool. It gets down to 50Hz with this speaker cabinet.
Not really low but not bad for a 6" driver.

the Prisoner

I'm not a number, I'm a free man! 😡

 

[Clob]

That is cool. How well does it do with the highs and vocals? Interesting!

"If youre paddling upstream in a canoe and a
wheel falls off, how many pancakes fit in a doghouse? None! Icecream doesn't have bones!!!"

"Battling Gimps and Dimbulbs HERE at THGC"

 

[the_Prisoner]

Goto this website. It has alot of interesting info on these speakers, single driver speakers, cool DIY pre amps and amps.<A HREF="http://www.passdiy.com/default.htm" target="_new">http://www.passdiy.com/default.htm</A>

the Prisoner

I'm not a number, I'm a free man! 😡

 

[Clob]

So.... Why not a larger speaker for the low tones and a well designed crossover? I would think an 18" would do great with a huge mouth cabinet. RUMBLY RUMBLY!

"If youre paddling upstream in a canoe and a
wheel falls off, how many pancakes fit in a doghouse? None! Icecream doesn't have bones!!!"

"Battling Gimps and Dimbulbs HERE at THGC"

 

[the_Prisoner]

The reason for the single driver is not to have a crossover.
Even the best crossover still splits the sound to 2 or more
speakers.Another advantage to a small single driver is it very efficient. A design like this would get very loud with only a 1-3 watt amp. So good for low power tube amp.

These speakers werent made for bass, eventhough 50Hz is still pretty nice. And that is a clean 50Hz. These speakers I think were made for jazz and vocals, midrange stuff.

I would think due to the physics of sound waves, that type of design you would have to much larger cabnet, for an 18" subwoofer. Plus the smaller speaker is faster.

Read the article though, I'm no expert. I just got into this speaker building thing becuase a friennd of mine has been building speakers for 30 years.

If you want make a speaker for cheap, get like a full range 4-5" driver, some cardboard and duct tape. You would be surprise how decent it sounds. 1" styrofoam would be a better choice for the front of the speaker. You dont even need to build a box. Just the front baffle is enough. So for a few dollars you can make a speaker.

Anyways, read the article, it can get techy but still interesting. I want to build one of those light bulb amps.hehe

If you are thinking about making a subwoofer, if you want to see how it sounds, get some pipe organ music or some other low Hz music, like classical music.

the Prisoner


I'm not a number, I'm a free man! 😡

 

[Clob]

I see. So I could take a 3-way (1", 2", 6.5") car speaker and throw it in a box and get realy good results? Mind you that the market down the road has then for $20 a pair at 200W rms! My father put some in his car for a quick fix for a long trip and was way suprised! Awsome... Now all I need is a cheapo reciever and mabie I can get rid of these Klipsch Ultras cuz the amp on them suck!

"If youre paddling upstream in a canoe and a
wheel falls off, how many pancakes fit in a doghouse? None! Icecream doesn't have bones!!!"

"Battling Gimps and Dimbulbs HERE at THGC"

 

[the_Prisoner]

I not sure how car speakers would sound for home stereo.
But putting them in a box would probably be fine for the car. I like car speakers better in a box also. But you trade room for sound.

If you can find or make a cheap box it might be worth going for it. I was never much a fan of car speakers. Unless you spend some money not alot of money.

Like the better Infinitys, JL audio and etc good brands.

Anyways have fun experimenting Clob.

the Prisoner

I'm not a number, I'm a free man! 😡

 

[Clob]

Hmm. They dont sound half bad in the car. Music is good and responce seems resonable. The 30watts gets prety loud from a cruddy stero. I think I'll give it a try. Im going to go with a Yamaha HTR 5760 reciever.

Why wouldn't car speakers be good for HT, besides the fact that their cheap. Any design differences that make them soly for cars?

"If youre paddling upstream in a canoe and a
wheel falls off, how many pancakes fit in a doghouse? None! Icecream doesn't have bones!!!"

"Battling Gimps and Dimbulbs HERE at THGC"

 

[rx7000]

I had my sound output going to my 2600 watt bass rig for awhile (mesa 4x10, mesa 1x15, 2600 watt power amp). Although it was overkill, shooting a shotgun in a game and having it knock [-peep-] off your walls in real life is pretty awsome.

The option of building your own system may seem silly, but you can actually do it fairly cheap and get some pretty nice results. 2x10's in a sealed sub enclosure will give you bass for days. Some nice componet speakers will give you highs that will drip clarity. But it would be a pain.

Asus p4c800 Deluxe,1 Gig Mushkin PC3200 Dual Channel Level II V2,Pentium 4 3.0 512k 800fsb HT, Thermaltake Xaser III, Thermaltake Spark 7+, Sound Blaster Audigy2 ZS Platinum Pro, eVGA GeForce 6800 GT

 

[Clob]

Drip? Dont know what you mean by this.?.?

Coaxials dont seem to bad, especially the Infinity and Pioneer series. I have read some reviews of the JL audio subs, and the 18" is definatly going in my car.

What I never understand is the frequency responce on most subs. That JL 18" in a sealed enclosure of the correct size specified by the manual is usefull down to 34hz. IMO the 18"s of sub should move enough air to get lower responce. The 2x 8" drivers in my Klipsch box hit 25hz no problems and im sure they move less air.

How do high excursion subs fair for responce? Im thinking of building one with a JL audio driver later down the line for my HT.

I do not like boomy subwoofers.

"If youre paddling upstream in a canoe and a
wheel falls off, how many pancakes fit in a doghouse? None! Icecream doesn't have bones!!!"

"Battling Gimps and Dimbulbs HERE at THGC"

 

[umheint0]

First, drip as in really really good highs.

Second, frequency response. This is managed by how you design the enclosure. Larger sealed enclosure means lower response, lower power handling. You must also remember this things will hit 20hz or less, however, the resonant frequency, or the frequency where the rebounding sound waves inside the enclosure reinforce each other and make it sound like it's twice as loud as usual. You can change it by changing the size of the enclosure.

High excursion subs just mean the driver can physically move further, which in theory means it has higher power handling than an equivalent driver with lower excursion.

If you don't like boomy subs, you'll have lots of problems getting that 18" to work well in your car. 18's are meant for extreme SPL (sound pressure level), which means unbelieveably loud, low bass. Don't expect anything higher than 60hz out of it, which means you need some really good midbass drivers.

Just checking out the specs on that driver, it doesn't have really high power handling or excursion. You could do just as well with a couple 12" or even 10" drivers in a proper enclosure, and it would be a smaller enclosure and easier to fit in your car. 2cu-ft is still fairly big, and 4 cu-ft is just huge, no room for an amp anymore.

Large excursion would be more like something from the 13" W6v2 (.85" one-way linear, about 70% more than the 18" W3). It also has slightly more power handling. Guess which one will get louder in a properly designed enclosure? Heck, look at the 13W7. 1.25" one-way linear excursion, 150% more. Plus 1000wrms handling, more than twice the 18W3.

Sound is all in the design of the driver, the design of the enclosure, the quality of the amp driving it, and the quality of the input power. Not just size.

If you want quality, get away from JL. Overpriced, overrated. Look at something like this <A HREF="http://www.focal-audio.com/gb/car/utopia/27wx.htm" target="_new">http://www.focal-audio.com/gb/car/utopia/27wx.htm</A>. Just about the best subwoofers money can buy. Go through their website and see what products they offer.

umheint0's phat setup --> <A HREF="http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~umheint0/system.html" target="_new">http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~umheint0/system.html</A><--

 

[RichPLS]

That is the most awesome home built speaker enclosure I have ever seen!
Reminiscent of Klipsh Horn speakers.

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

 

[the_Prisoner]

First of all, umheint0 a great post.

I don't like boomy subs either. I like clean and tight.

Im not a car audio person. Home audio, just practical experience. I would agree that smaller drivers/woofers would be better. I mean, even two 8" drivers would be good.

I just have old classic cars and would never rip them up for car audio, but if you want some bass, you can make/buy and put a sub in the back seat. I have a box with dual 8"s in my Corsa Corvair.

For the car audio stuff, Focal is good.

A cheap driver can sound decent in a good box, a great driver will sound bad in a bad box/enclosure.

Good times,
the Prisoner



I'm not a number, I'm a free man! 😡