8700K delid - high temps - need advice

[PC-GAMER_1]

Morning all,

I am not new to the computer front with over 16 years experience but when it comes to overclocking I am a total noobie and need advice.

As the title states, I have delided my 8700k with liquid metal following a numerous of guides/videos closely and running an overclock at 5ghz I am getting bsod with temps at about 78-90c still so something clearly is not right.

Specs
8700k 5ghz delid LM
gigabyte gamer 5 Motherboard
dark rock pro 4
DDR4 3200mhz xmp

Settings of the motherboard
1.28v - 70-78c - Unstable in Prime95 using small fft
1.29v 75-85c - unstable in Prime95

I can get stable at 1.33v with all cores at 100% but the temps hit 95c which clearly something is wrong - basically the overall settings i am using are from this video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcZkEZ8x3oA

Idle temps are about 30-38c even with cooler reseats multiple times.

Can't think of anything else i need to tell you all to help me out but it is driving me crazy! and constantly on my mind even at work now thinking about it. Just so you know I have tried doing research all over the internet but still no luck - i hear about avx offset as prime95 uses it ?

Thanks in advance all

James

 

[RememberThe5th]

Maybe the ihs is bit off? They are known to be not conpletley flat and creating scenario like you have.
I guess if you have will you can take out cpu and spin the ihs on flat table/surface to check that, if it does its not flat.
And if you have will to sand it down, its kinda long process.

 

[PC-GAMER_1]

That is a very good point, I will give this a go tonight ... if its not flat - I work in manufacturing, possibly get the guys to cnc it flat ? or would sanding be just enough.

You got any other ideas what it could be ? It feels like i have done something wrong now but i honestly took my time and followed guides/videos precisely. i forgot to mention i have xmp profile is at 3200mhz.

Kind regards

James

 

[RememberThe5th]

XMP screws only amd platform above 3200.
Just sand it, or if cnc is precise (as it should be) just enough 0.5-1mm to see the copper of ihs.
I think jayztwocents and gamernexus did those guides, you will get idea from them how much (youtube).
(I guess this is the video?) https://youtu.be/bSwbi2igNOM

 

[PC-GAMER_1]

Thanks for responding Robert.

Sorry to be pain to ask another question but if it isnt the IHS or my new dark rock pro cooler - could there be anything else within the bios I am not setting correctly do you think ? based on youtube link i supplied on why prime95 at small fft would be giving me a BSOD ?

Regards James

 

[RememberThe5th]

Dunno, 1.33V used H100i with i7-8700k pulled around 70-80*C (On JayZTwoCents video)

Which settings do you use*?

Try der8auer's guide https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoUtA7DKXhU

Im not quite expert on OC, I've only mastered the FSB oc on 775 socket. Sorry if im not quite "useful".

 

[CompuTronix]

... 8700k 5ghz delid LM
dark rock pro 4 ... 1.28v - 70-78c - Unstable in Prime95 using small fft ...

PC-GAMER_1,

Which VERSION of Prime95?

... stable at 1.33v with all cores at 100% but the temps hit 95c ... I have tried doing research all over the internet but still no luck - i hear about avx offset as prime95 uses it ? ...

Did you happen to find this in your research? Intel Temperature Guide - http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-1800828/intel-temperature-guide.html

CT

 

[RememberThe5th]

OOF, Forgot that avx thing...

 

[PC-GAMER_1]

... 8700k 5ghz delid LM
dark rock pro 4 ... 1.28v - 70-78c - Unstable in Prime95 using small fft ...

PC-GAMER_1,

Which VERSION of Prime95?

... stable at 1.33v with all cores at 100% but the temps hit 95c ... I have tried doing research all over the internet but still no luck - i hear about avx offset as prime95 uses it ? ...

Did you happen to find this in your research? Intel Temperature Guide - http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-1800828/intel-temperature-guide.html

CT

Hi Compu,

I am running version 29.4 - I have read about this AVX setting which some people have switched it off in results to NO bsod but as soon as they turn it on and stress test they started to get bsod.

I know there are certain programs that use AVX but is it a true test if it turned it off and see if i get my bsod ?

attached is my settings via windows aorus easytune (Obviously i used the bios to change my settings originally)

Thanks for responding and the link - I'll have a read.

Regards

James

 

[CompuTronix]

... 8700k 5ghz delid LM
dark rock pro 4 ... 1.28v - 70-78c - Unstable in Prime95 using small fft ...

PC-GAMER_1,

Which VERSION of Prime95?

... stable at 1.33v with all cores at 100% but the temps hit 95c ... I have tried doing research all over the internet but still no luck - i hear about avx offset as prime95 uses it ? ...

Did you happen to find this in your research? Intel Temperature Guide - http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-1800828/intel-temperature-guide.html ...

Thanks for responding and the link - I'll have a read.

PC-GAMER_1,

Here's the nominal operating range for Core temperature:

Core temperatures above 85°C are not recommended.

Core temperatures below 80°C are ideal.

“Stress” tests vary widely and can be characterized into two categories; stability tests which are fluctuating workloads, and thermal tests which are steady workloads. Intel tests their processors at a steady 100% TDP workload to validate Thermal Specifications.

Prime95 version 26.6 Small FFT's is ideal for CPU thermal testing, because it's a steady 100% workload with steady Core temperatures that typically runs Core i variants with Hyperthreading, such as your 8700K, within +/- a few % of TDP. No other utility so closely replicates Intel's test conditions.

• Prime95 v26.6 (non-AVX) - http://www.mersenneforum.org/showthread.php?t=15504

Utilities that don't overload or underload your processor will give you a valid thermal baseline. Here’s a comparison of utilities grouped as thermal and stability tests according to % of TDP, averaged across six processor Generations at stock settings rounded to the nearest 5%:

Notice the brutal 130% TDP workload due to AVX in Prime95 v29.4 (upper left) compared to v26.6 without AVX. All tests will show 100% CPU Utilization in Windows Task Manager, which indicates processor resource activity, not % TDP workload.

Core temperatures respond directly to Power dissipation (Watts) which is driven by workload. Prime95 v26.6 Small FFT’s provides a true and steady 100% workload so if Core temperatures are below 85°C, then your processor should run the most demanding real-world workloads without overheating.

... running version 29.4 - I have read about this AVX setting which some people have switched it off in results to NO bsod but as soon as they turn it on and stress test they started to get bsod.

I know there are certain programs that use AVX but is it a true test if it turned it off and see if i get my bsod ? ,,,

Yes, however, "some people's" explanation doesn't make sense, as "they" worded their experience contrary to how AVX offsets are intended to work. Did "they" perhaps transpose "off" and "on"? Let's take a closer look:

4th through 9th Generation i9, i7, i5 and i3 CPU’s have AVX Instruction Sets. Prime95 versions later than 26.6 run AVX code on the CPU's Floating Point Unit (FPU), which is an unrealistic workload that can cause Core temperatures up to 20°C higher. Many 6th through 9th Generation motherboards address the AVX problem by providing “offset” adjustments (downclock) in BIOS.

Due to the extreme demands AVX workloads can impose on processors, -3 (300 MHz) or more may be needed to reduce clock speeds and maintain stability while limiting Core temperatures to 85°C. Keep in mind that lower Core temperatures are inherently more stable. Even if you don’t use AVX apps such as for rendering or transcoding, BIOS should still be configured for it, as certain utilities use realistic AVX workloads for stability testing, such as Asus RealBench.

There are certain motherboards with BIOS versions in which AVX offset doesn't work, or doesn't work properly, or works properly but the user has misconfigured an AVX offset of only 1 or 2 with a "fixed" Vcore that's too low for stability. Such a combination will cause BSOD's. But when AVX offset works as intended, and BIOS is configured properly, the resulting downclock allows the processor to maintain stability when AVX code is encountered.

AVX can be disabled in Prime95 versions later than 26.6 by inserting "CpuSupportsAVX=0" into the "local.txt" file in Prime95's folder. However, since Core temperatures will be the same as 26.6, it's easier to just use 26.6.

As per Intel’s Datasheets, TDP and Thermal Specifications are validated “without AVX”.

8th and 9th Generation Intel® Core™ Processor Datasheet, Volume 1 - https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/docs/processors/core/8th-gen-core-family-datasheet-vol-1.html

See page 87 - Thermal Management, Section 5.1.1 - Thermal Considerations, first paragraph.

CT

 

[thtran6]

Yea I second what CompuTronix posted.
You were running a newer version of Prime 95 which uses AVX instruction. If you don't have AVX offset (typically -3) in your BIOS then you're basically running at 5.3 Ghz when stress testing.

What you should do now is switch to Prime 95 version 26.6 and run small fft for 2~6 hours. You should see your temp lowered by a lot.

My 8700k (Not delidded) is also running at 5.0 Ghz at 1.25 Vcore (everybody's chip differs). Under prime95 26.6 small fft test, temp is around 68~70C. I'm using the evga clc 280 with push pull config.

 

[PC-GAMER_1]

... 8700k 5ghz delid LM
dark rock pro 4 ... 1.28v - 70-78c - Unstable in Prime95 using small fft ...

PC-GAMER_1,

Which VERSION of Prime95?

... stable at 1.33v with all cores at 100% but the temps hit 95c ... I have tried doing research all over the internet but still no luck - i hear about avx offset as prime95 uses it ? ...

Did you happen to find this in your research? Intel Temperature Guide - http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-1800828/intel-temperature-guide.html ...

Thanks for responding and the link - I'll have a read.

PC-GAMER_1,

Here's the nominal operating range for Core temperature:

Core temperatures above 85°C are not recommended.

Core temperatures below 80°C are ideal.

“Stress” tests vary widely and can be characterized into two categories; stability tests which are fluctuating workloads, and thermal tests which are steady workloads. Intel tests their processors at a steady 100% TDP workload to validate Thermal Specifications.

Prime95 version 26.6 Small FFT's is ideal for CPU thermal testing, because it's a steady 100% workload with steady Core temperatures that typically runs Core i variants with Hyperthreading, such as your 8700K, within +/- a few % of TDP. No other utility so closely replicates Intel's test conditions.

• Prime95 v26.6 (non-AVX) - http://www.mersenneforum.org/showthread.php?t=15504

Utilities that don't overload or underload your processor will give you a valid thermal baseline. Here’s a comparison of utilities grouped as thermal and stability tests according to % of TDP, averaged across six processor Generations at stock settings rounded to the nearest 5%:

Notice the brutal 130% TDP workload due to AVX in Prime95 v29.4 (upper left) compared to v26.6 without AVX. All tests will show 100% CPU Utilization in Windows Task Manager, which indicates processor resource activity, not % TDP workload.

Core temperatures respond directly to Power dissipation (Watts) which is driven by workload. Prime95 v26.6 Small FFT’s provides a true and steady 100% workload so if Core temperatures are below 85°C, then your processor should run the most demanding real-world workloads without overheating.

... running version 29.4 - I have read about this AVX setting which some people have switched it off in results to NO bsod but as soon as they turn it on and stress test they started to get bsod.

I know there are certain programs that use AVX but is it a true test if it turned it off and see if i get my bsod ? ,,,

Yes, however, "some people's" explanation doesn't make sense, as "they" worded their experience contrary to how AVX offsets are intended to work. Did "they" perhaps transpose "off" and "on"? Let's take a closer look:

4th through 9th Generation i9, i7, i5 and i3 CPU’s have AVX Instruction Sets. Prime95 versions later than 26.6 run AVX code on the CPU's Floating Point Unit (FPU), which is an unrealistic workload that can cause Core temperatures up to 20°C higher. Many 6th through 9th Generation motherboards address the AVX problem by providing “offset” adjustments (downclock) in BIOS.

Due to the extreme demands AVX workloads can impose on processors, -3 (300 MHz) or more may be needed to reduce clock speeds and maintain stability while limiting Core temperatures to 85°C. Keep in mind that lower Core temperatures are inherently more stable. Even if you don’t use AVX apps such as for rendering or transcoding, BIOS should still be configured for it, as certain utilities use realistic AVX workloads for stability testing, such as Asus RealBench.

There are certain motherboards with BIOS versions in which AVX offset doesn't work, or doesn't work properly, or works properly but the user has misconfigured an AVX offset of only 1 or 2 with a "fixed" Vcore that's too low for stability. Such a combination will cause BSOD's. But when AVX offset works as intended, and BIOS is configured properly, the resulting downclock allows the processor to maintain stability when AVX code is encountered.

AVX can be disabled in Prime95 versions later than 26.6 by inserting "CpuSupportsAVX=0" into the "local.txt" file in Prime95's folder. However, since Core temperatures will be the same as 26.6, it's easier to just use 26.6.

As per Intel’s Datasheets, TDP and Thermal Specifications are validated “without AVX”.

8th and 9th Generation Intel® Core™ Processor Datasheet, Volume 1 - https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/docs/processors/core/8th-gen-core-family-datasheet-vol-1.html

See page 87 - Thermal Management, Section 5.1.1 - Thermal Considerations, first paragraph.

CT

Oh wow, thank you for this detailed response ... it does make total sense!

Told you I am totally new this overclocking malarkey and here was me thinking I have buggered my CPU and made it worse!

I ran Prime95 26.6 for about 2-3 hours and my temps were under 74c at 5ghz with 1.30v.
When I have time I will play about with the voltage and see if i can drop it further but we will see! It's quite exciting overclocking but of course I will take precautions .

@Thtran6

It's good to hear a second confirmation it does make me feel better, I am not happy with the case I currently have as I went for more looks than performance and my spare Case which is the corsair 540 air is too big!

So I am looking at getting the meshify C midi if the misses allows me

Once last question regarding AVX offset - Where is this option within the bios? I can't seem to find it ... how do I put an negative offset ?

Thanks all for the help so far much appreciated.