8700k worth buying If I won't be overclocking?

[refmon]

Is the difference between a 8700 enough to justify buying it?

 

[jankerson]

Just my thoughts on spending $300 + on a CPU that is by all accounts warmer than most and $25 on a CPU cooler which wont really give any room to play with especally under sustained loads, and taking into account case, room temp, global warming (joke) et all...I would rather spend a little more on something that cools a little better but hey thats me..He is the one who has to make tthe choice and no doubt whatever he chooses will be right for him..

He said he has no intention of overclocking. The 212 is plenty good enough.

Spending more on a better cooler is fine, and I would probably do the same, but no need to scaremonger the guy into buying a another cooler when the 212 will be sufficient.

If they enable MCE the 8700K will overpower the cooler, it's not strong enough.

The 212 EVO is actually pretty weak, being a budget cooler it's no surprise.

 

[genca]

As vMax and Jankerson said. Never try to save money on cooler, it is not worth. I'm not sure if i would use hyper 212 on i7 8700 non-k. And as everyone said, try to get K version and buy z370 motherboard. Currently, you wont really see difference between 8700k and 8700 but for a few years you will see. And you will be easier for you to sell K version than non-K version. Now that you know pros and cons, it is up to you to decide.
Recommendation for motherbaord
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157789&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-PCPartPicker,%20LLC-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID= i see there is 20% promo cod too so you can save about 30 dollars i think
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075RJHN2D/?tag=pcpapi-20
Recommendation for cpu cooler( i will list a few air coolers, but take a look at aio)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075FX95F2/?tag=pcpapi-20
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00S7YA5FQ/?tag=pcpapi-20 or quad lumi for 60usd
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002VKVZ1A/?tag=pcpapi-20 or try to get nh-d15
Dont forget high quality thermal paste: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut or Noctua NT-H1

 

[jankerson]

As vMax and Jankerson said. Never try to save money on cooler, it is not worth. I'm not sure if i would use hyper 212 on i7 8700 non-k. And as everyone said, try to get K version and buy z370 motherboard. Currently, you wont really see difference between 8700k and 8700 but for a few years you will see. And you will be easier for you to sell K version than non-K version. Now that you know pros and cons, it is up to you to decide.
Recommendation for motherbaord
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157789&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-PCPartPicker,%20LLC-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID= i see there is 20% promo cod too so you can save about 30 dollars i think
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075RJHN2D/?tag=pcpapi-20
Recommendation for cpu cooler( i will list a few air coolers, but take a look at aio)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075FX95F2/?tag=pcpapi-20
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00S7YA5FQ/?tag=pcpapi-20 or quad lumi for 60usd
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002VKVZ1A/?tag=pcpapi-20 or try to get nh-d15
Dont forget high quality thermal paste: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut or Noctua NT-H1

As we know CPU coolers and PSU's are the 1st two things people will cheap out on.

Unless they know better.

 

[genca]

As vMax and Jankerson said. Never try to save money on cooler, it is not worth. I'm not sure if i would use hyper 212 on i7 8700 non-k. And as everyone said, try to get K version and buy z370 motherboard. Currently, you wont really see difference between 8700k and 8700 but for a few years you will see. And you will be easier for you to sell K version than non-K version. Now that you know pros and cons, it is up to you to decide.
Recommendation for motherbaord
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157789&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-PCPartPicker,%20LLC-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID= i see there is 20% promo cod too so you can save about 30 dollars i think
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075RJHN2D/?tag=pcpapi-20
Recommendation for cpu cooler( i will list a few air coolers, but take a look at aio)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075FX95F2/?tag=pcpapi-20
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00S7YA5FQ/?tag=pcpapi-20 or quad lumi for 60usd
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002VKVZ1A/?tag=pcpapi-20 or try to get nh-d15
Dont forget high quality thermal paste: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut or Noctua NT-H1

As we know CPU coolers and PSU's are the 1st two things people will cheap out on.

Unless they know better.

I learned from my " mistake". It wasnt really mistake, but i wanted to get RX-400XT from raidmax. Thanks to you guys from Tom's Hardware, i realized that i have to get better psu and i ended up ordering seasonic m12-ii 620w Btw, i wanted to put that psu on r5 1600 and rx 570.
Edit: I wanted to overclock r5 with that psu.....

 

[vMax]

Just my thoughts on spending $300 + on a CPU that is by all accounts warmer than most and $25 on a CPU cooler which wont really give any room to play with especally under sustained loads, and taking into account case, room temp, global warming (joke) et all...I would rather spend a little more on something that cools a little better but hey thats me..He is the one who has to make tthe choice and no doubt whatever he chooses will be right for him..

He said he has no intention of overclocking. The 212 is plenty good enough.

Spending more on a better cooler is fine, and I would probably do the same, but no need to scaremonger the guy into buying a another cooler when the 212 will be sufficient.

It would be good to no where I used scare tactics? Did I suggest the CPU would melt? or drop of in performance? or just plain overheat?

 

[genca]

Just my thoughts on spending $300 + on a CPU that is by all accounts warmer than most and $25 on a CPU cooler which wont really give any room to play with especally under sustained loads, and taking into account case, room temp, global warming (joke) et all...I would rather spend a little more on something that cools a little better but hey thats me..He is the one who has to make tthe choice and no doubt whatever he chooses will be right for him..

He said he has no intention of overclocking. The 212 is plenty good enough.

Spending more on a better cooler is fine, and I would probably do the same, but no need to scaremonger the guy into buying a another cooler when the 212 will be sufficient.

It would be good to no where I used scare tactics? Did I suggest the
CPU would melt? or drop of in performance? or just plain overheat?

My bad, i didnt see he said that he wont oc it, again sorry.

 

[RobCrezz]

Just my thoughts on spending $300 + on a CPU that is by all accounts warmer than most and $25 on a CPU cooler which wont really give any room to play with especally under sustained loads, and taking into account case, room temp, global warming (joke) et all...I would rather spend a little more on something that cools a little better but hey thats me..He is the one who has to make tthe choice and no doubt whatever he chooses will be right for him..

He said he has no intention of overclocking. The 212 is plenty good enough.

Spending more on a better cooler is fine, and I would probably do the same, but no need to scaremonger the guy into buying a another cooler when the 212 will be sufficient.

If they enable MCE the 8700K will overpower the cooler, it's not strong enough.

The 212 EVO is actually pretty weak, being a budget cooler it's no surprise.

Do you have any evidence of that? As I really doubt it would. The 8700k even with MCE doesnt pump out that much heat.

 

[jankerson]

Just my thoughts on spending $300 + on a CPU that is by all accounts warmer than most and $25 on a CPU cooler which wont really give any room to play with especally under sustained loads, and taking into account case, room temp, global warming (joke) et all...I would rather spend a little more on something that cools a little better but hey thats me..He is the one who has to make tthe choice and no doubt whatever he chooses will be right for him..

He said he has no intention of overclocking. The 212 is plenty good enough.

Spending more on a better cooler is fine, and I would probably do the same, but no need to scaremonger the guy into buying a another cooler when the 212 will be sufficient.

If they enable MCE the 8700K will overpower the cooler, it's not strong enough.

The 212 EVO is actually pretty weak, being a budget cooler it's no surprise.

Do you have any evidence of that? As I really doubt it would. The 8700k even with MCE doesnt pump out that much heat.

Actually... Yeah... The 121 EVO isn't really all that great at all.... Maybe for an I3 or something...

I ran mine MCE before I got the 8086K, but then I have a NH D15 so... I am putting it in another system with and will use the NH U12S. But then the NH U12S is much better than the 212 EVO.

https://techreport.com/blog/32661/just-how-hot-is-coffee-lake


8700K MCE with 212 EVO over 100C running Prime 95. At only 1.308 VCORE....


"We are glad that Gigabyte's Z370 firmware makes the correct choice with regard to multi-core enhancement behavior, though, and we hope other motherboard brands have followed or will follow suit.
Regardless, I fired up our system in this state and cued up Prime95 Small FFTs again. The chip proceeded to throttle on several cores with a 1.308V Vcore (a difficult figure to monitor given the plunging core clocks, but I tried). That throttling meant the chip was running into its 100° C Tjunction limit on some cores, so the motherboard's automatic voltage control is probably a tad too aggressive given my manual overclocking experience. I also tried running Blender with multi-core enhancement enabled, and while all of the cores got to around 89° C under that load, the chip didn't throttle. That result still suggests a Hyper 212 Evo-class cooler probably isn't sufficient for holding the overclocked i7-8700K in check, given how little headroom it offers.
This behavior shows why "multi-core enhancement" is undesirable: it's overclocking through and through, and it requires cooling to match. Builders who are buying heatsinks under the assumption they'll be facing all-core Turbo speeds of 4.3 GHz from the i7-8700K could be surprised if their motherboard tries to "help" by modifying Intel's factory Turbo Boost behavior. Our Gigabyte Z370 Aorus Gaming 7 test motherboard commendably ships with the feature disabled, but we'd imagine the feature could still catch both reviewers and builders alike off guard. We've been protesting this "feature" for years, and we'll continue to do so when it rears its head."

 

[RobCrezz]

Thats more that using the garbage Gigabyte boards puts too much voltage through. Its well documented how bad the Gigabyte Z370 boards are, especially the vrm implementation.


I ran my 8700k with MCE turned on my spare air cooler a phanteks TC12DX, pretty similar to a 212 evo, ran fine, didnt go over 80 in stress testing, in normal use it barely went over 50'c.

 

[jankerson]

Thats more that using the garbage Gigabyte boards puts too much voltage through. Its well documented how bad the Gigabyte Z370 boards are, especially the vrm implementation.


I ran my 8700k with MCE turned on my spare air cooler a phanteks TC12DX, pretty similar to a 212 evo, ran fine, didnt go over 80 in stress testing, in normal use it barely went over 50'c.

It was just one board that one reviewer was crying about and then a few more parroted what they said in reality.

Was the AUROS Z370 Gaming 7.

I have a AUROS Z370 Gaming 5 and it's not a issue.

 

[jankerson]

I ran my 8700k with MCE turned on my spare air cooler a phanteks TC12DX, pretty similar to a 212 evo, ran fine, didnt go over 80 in stress testing, in normal use it barely went over 50'c.

Actually the Phanteks TC12DX is a lot better than the 212 EVO from what I saw review wise.

 

[RobCrezz]

Thats more that using the garbage Gigabyte boards puts too much voltage through. Its well documented how bad the Gigabyte Z370 boards are, especially the vrm implementation.


I ran my 8700k with MCE turned on my spare air cooler a phanteks TC12DX, pretty similar to a 212 evo, ran fine, didnt go over 80 in stress testing, in normal use it barely went over 50'c.

It was just one board that one reviewer was crying about and then a few more parroted what they said in reality.

Was the AUROS Z370 Gaming 7.

I have a AUROS Z370 Gaming 5 and it's not a issue.

Either way its beside the point. The article you posted is not evidence, it suggests the 212 evo isnt going to be suitable for overclocking a 8700k, which we all agree with.

Can it do MCE with a 212 evo? I still believe it will be fine based on my own testing with a small air cooler.

 

[jankerson]

Thats more that using the garbage Gigabyte boards puts too much voltage through. Its well documented how bad the Gigabyte Z370 boards are, especially the vrm implementation.


I ran my 8700k with MCE turned on my spare air cooler a phanteks TC12DX, pretty similar to a 212 evo, ran fine, didnt go over 80 in stress testing, in normal use it barely went over 50'c.

It was just one board that one reviewer was crying about and then a few more parroted what they said in reality.

Was the AUROS Z370 Gaming 7.

I have a AUROS Z370 Gaming 5 and it's not a issue.

Either way its beside the point. The article you posted is not evidence, it suggests the 212 evo isnt going to be suitable for overclocking a 8700k, which we all agree with.

Can it do MCE with a 212 evo? I still believe it will be fine based on my own testing with a small air cooler.

Still not a 212 EVO is it?

Your cooler is rated a lot higher than that was.

Temps were 20C higher on the 212 EVO compared to yours.

 

[RobCrezz]

Thats more that using the garbage Gigabyte boards puts too much voltage through. Its well documented how bad the Gigabyte Z370 boards are, especially the vrm implementation.


I ran my 8700k with MCE turned on my spare air cooler a phanteks TC12DX, pretty similar to a 212 evo, ran fine, didnt go over 80 in stress testing, in normal use it barely went over 50'c.

It was just one board that one reviewer was crying about and then a few more parroted what they said in reality.

Was the AUROS Z370 Gaming 7.

I have a AUROS Z370 Gaming 5 and it's not a issue.

Either way its beside the point. The article you posted is not evidence, it suggests the 212 evo isnt going to be suitable for overclocking a 8700k, which we all agree with.

Can it do MCE with a 212 evo? I still believe it will be fine based on my own testing with a small air cooler.

Still not a 212 EVO is it?

Your cooler is rated a lot higher than that was.

Temps were 20C higher on the 212 EVO compared to yours.

Exactly, shows that anecdotal evidence doesn't really help.

Only way to really know is to strap a 212 evo to a 8700k and turn on MCE. I still think it would be fine.

 

[cryoburner]

And as everyone said, try to get K version and buy z370 motherboard. Currently, you wont really see difference between 8700k and 8700 but for a few years you will see.

I didn't say that. : P

In a few years, if there's any difference, you'll only see it when overclocking. At stock clocks, the 8700K and 8700 will be nearly identical in performance. Just look at the CPU tests in Tom's Hardware's own review, for example...

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-core-i7-8700-cpu-review,5638-8.html

Even when pushing these CPUs to their limits, the differences in performance at stock are almost nonexistent with an identical cooler. Lightly-threaded CPU tests showed up to a 3% difference at most, and heavily-threaded workloads saw no difference whatsoever, since both CPUs have the exact same boost clocks when all cores are active. This minimal to nonexistent difference in performance carried over to their gaming tests as well.

The differences in CPU-limited workloads were more notable with their 8700K overclocked to 4.9GHz, amounting to about 7-10% more single-threaded performance up to around 15-20% more heavily-threaded performance over the 8700. For gaming, the differences tended to be smaller though, even with a GTX 1080 running at 1080p. And again, an overclock like that requires not only a more expensive processor, but also a more expensive cooler at the very least.

As for the 212 Evo, it certainly wouldn't cut it for overclocking an 8700K, but it's also certainly better than the inadequate Intel stock cooler that the 8700 ships with. It might depend on case airflow and room temperature, but I suspect it may be enough to enable an 8700 or 8700K to maintain it's stock boost clocks under real-world workloads. A stress-test like Prime95 might result in the CPU dropping to lower clocks, but that's not exactly a real-world workload, so performance there shouldn't really matter much. At the very least, it would likely be worth trying the 212 Evo and seeing how it performs in a somewhat more realistic heavily-threaded workload like Cinebench. Of course, I'm sure it would be more audible under such a workload compared to most higher-end coolers.

One other thing to consider when deciding on whether to get a Z370 motherboard is if you are willing to pay a little more for faster DDR4 memory. While it makes a bit less of a performance difference on Intel's CPUs compared to AMD's, moving from DDR4-2400/2666 up to 3000/3200 can actually make a 5% or greater performance difference in many workloads, including gaming in situations where performance is limited by the CPU, rather than the graphics card. That can actually make for a larger difference in performance than you'll see when moving from an 8700 to an 8700K at stock clocks. And at least at online retailers in the US, DDR4-3000 only costs around $10-20 more for 16GB than DDR4-2400/2666, so faster memory is something you may want to go with if you decide to get a Z370 motherboard. Intel's other motherboard chipsets don't support speeds over 2666. These faster RAM speeds are technically considered "overclocking", but the RAM is rated by its manufacturer to run at these speeds, and enabling higher memory clocks typically amounts to simply selecting its XMP profile in the bios, and unlike CPU overclocking, shouldn't require a higher-end cooler or increased fan noise.

I don't think it was ever mentioned what the rest of this gaming system or its overall budget was going to be though. What are the planned system specs, and what resolution and refresh rate will you be gaming at? If you were intending on pairing the processor with a more mid-range graphics card, then it's very possible that putting the money toward a higher-end card would be a lot more beneficial to performance than components like the CPU and RAM.

 

[abodeking1]

No, just buy a 8700 with a cheaper H370 or B360 motherboard. The 8700 will give you more then enough CPU power for pretty much any application.

b360 mobo is not working good withhigh end cpu .. so if some1 plan to get high end cpu just get Z mobo