Build Advice Advice for (largely) chess-related, CPU-Intensive build - under $2000 ?

[Brian D Smith]

My old HP Envy with a fairly nice Intel I7-6700 @3.4 GHZ desktop (paired with a really lousy GPU... and) 16 gb RAM...seems to have kicked the bucket so I am looking at a new desktop. I spend most of my time on the computer doing chess related items that are CPU intensive.

I also use CPU Intensive chess engines A LOT (they do not really benefit from multi-threading) - for evaluating many openings in Chessbase (largely a database program, but with many other nice repertoire maintenance features) where I run engines like Stockfish or Dragon. I also like to pit engine vs engine in large test suites. I would also like to be able to game a bit - in the sense of the word as most 'gamers' think of it and was thinking the minimal RTX 3060 ti would do the job....Chessbase 'can' also use retracing for diagram rendering.

My question has to do with the new 12th generation Intel CPU's and their "P" and "E" cores and how they might play with my chess engine usage needs.

I was at Costco yesterday and noticed a PC with the specs below. I was thinking that's about the max I really wanted to spend anyway (and am none to sure of my ability to 'build a PC'...) so I started considering it:

Dell XPS 8950: $1,849.99

Processor & Memory:

• 12th Gen Intel® Core™ i7-12700 12-Core Processor
• 32GB DDR5 4400MHz RAM

Drives:

• 1TB 7200 RPM Hard Drive + 512GB PCIe NVMe M.2 Solid State Drive
• Tray Load DVD Drive (Reads and Writes to DVD/CD)

Operating System:

• Microsoft® Windows 11 Home (64-bit)

Graphics & Video:

• NVIDIA® GeForce® RTX 3060 Ti™, 8GB
• Monitor Not Included

Communications:

• Killer™ WiFi 6 (2x2/160) Gig+ and Bluetooth® 5.2

Audio:

• Integrated 7.1 Channel Audio with Waves MaxxAudio® Pro

Keyboard & Mouse:

• Dell Wired Keyboard & Mouse

Ports & Slots:

• 5x USB 3.2 Gen 1 Type-A
• 2x USB 3.2 Gen 2 Type-C
• 2x USB 2.0 Type-A
• 1x Headphone Jack
• 1x HDMI
• 3x Display Port 1.4a
• 1x SD Card Reader (SD, SDHC, SDXC)
• 1x RJ-45

Additional Information:

• Dimensions: 14.68" x 6.81" x 16.80"

That said, I tried to build the same thing on the DELL website...and the cost there (no discounts that I know of) is a good $200-$300 more compared to the Costco item. You might ask 'why 32 GB RAM?'. Well, I know at 16 GB, and with multiple engines running and doing database searches, internet surfing, maybe watching a video, etc at the same time...things would sometimes freeze up and at time might even shut down unexpectedly. Certainly the fans would run a full speed, not that I minded.

I had been considering the 12th Gen Intel® Core™ i5-12400 12-Core Processor based on a Tom's Hardware reviews and possibly the i5-12600 until noticing the Costco i7-27000 item. I have not really considered any overclockable CPU's...figure they all need water-cooling and...somehow that frightens me unless of course they required ZERO maintenance.

The clock speeds for these: Default - Turbo - Max TDP - Single Thread Rating
i7-27000: 2.1 - 4.9 - 65W - 3945
i5-12400: 2.5 - 4.4 - 65W - 3823
i5-12600: 3.3 - 4.8 - 65W - 3524

BUT...all these number can appear to be 'smoke and mirrors' to me sometimes...particularly with the new 'P' and 'E' cores. Also, I never really considered something like an AMD RYZEN 5900X. Despite having plenty of cores for similar reasons as I have mentioned.

Without more than the stock cooling that comes with each, won't these CPU's simply throttle down pretty quick if I tried to get the speed up for any period of time? I could let an engine run at full throttle all night long, crunching away on many different chess positions or games with my old i7-6700 at 3.4 ghz..
Also, I've never heard of DDR5 4400 MHZ RAM. Doesn't DDR5 START at 4800 MHZ??

Any thoughts...suggestions? I would just hate to spend all that $$ and find that even with the extra cores and newer generation...I am possibly getting less accomplished - or at least slower, than with that old 4 core CPU.

 

[lvt]

Can you upgrade to W11 Pro from their Home edition?

 

[Why_Me]

Cheaper to build it yourself or call around to local PC / laptop repair shops and see how much they will charge to build it for you if you were to bring them the components after you recieve them.

https://www.newegg.com/black-corsair-4000d-airflow-atx-mid-tower/p/N82E16811139156
Corsair 4000D Airflow CC-9011200-WW Mid Tower Computer Case $94.99

https://www.corsair.com/us/en/Categ...ered-Glass-Mid-Tower-ATX-Case/p/CC-9011200-WW

https://www.newegg.com/corsair-rm-series-rm750-750w/p/N82E16817139277
CORSAIR RM750 750W 80+ GOLD Modular Power Supply $98.99

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1687328-REG/msi_mag_b660m_mortar_wifi.html
MSI MAG B660M MORTAR WIFI $159.99

https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/MAG-B660M-MORTAR-WIFI

https://www.amazon.com/Intel-i7-12700F-2-1GHz-6xxChipset-BX8071512700F/dp/B09NPJDPVG/
Intel Core i7-12700F $311.96

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/u...2700f-processor-25m-cache-up-to-4-90-ghz.html

https://www.amazon.com/Rev-B-Cooler-LGA1700-LGA1151-Towers/dp/B09NZGH4RD/
Scythe Fuma 2 Rev.B CPU Cooler $65.99

https://www.scytheus.com/fuma2-rev-b

https://www.provantage.com/kingston-technology-kf552c40bbk2-32~7KIN9405.htm
Kingston FURY Beast DDR5 5200 32GB (2x16GB) CL40 $175.32

https://www.amazon.com/PNY-CS1030-Internal-Solid-State/dp/B08M446772/
PNY CS1030 2TB M.2 NVMe PCIe Gen3 x4 Internal SSD $164.99

https://www.amazon.com/GIGABYTE-REV2-0-WINDFORCE-GV-N3070GAMING-OC-8GD/dp/B098Q4M4WH/

GIGABYTE GeForce RTX 3070 Gaming OC 8GB (REV2.0) Graphics Card $599.99

https://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Windows-11-Home-USB/dp/B09V6R9QZZ/
Microsoft Windows 11 Home USB $139.00

Total: $1810.20

 

[Bob.B]

My old HP Envy with a fairly nice Intel I7-6700 @3.4 GHZ desktop (paired with a really lousy GPU... and) 16 gb RAM...seems to have kicked the bucket so I am looking at a new desktop. I spend most of my time on the computer doing chess related items that are CPU intensive.

I also use CPU Intensive chess engines A LOT (they do not really benefit from multi-threading) - for evaluating many openings in Chessbase (largely a database program, but with many other nice repertoire maintenance features) where I run engines like Stockfish or Dragon. I also like to pit engine vs engine in large test suites. I would also like to be able to game a bit - in the sense of the word as most 'gamers' think of it and was thinking the minimal RTX 3060 ti would do the job....Chessbase 'can' also use retracing for diagram rendering.

My question has to do with the new 12th generation Intel CPU's and their "P" and "E" cores and how they might play with my chess engine usage needs.

I was at Costco yesterday and noticed a PC with the specs below. I was thinking that's about the max I really wanted to spend anyway (and am none to sure of my ability to 'build a PC'...) so I started considering it:

Dell XPS 8950: $1,849.99

Processor & Memory:

• 12th Gen Intel® Core™ i7-12700 12-Core Processor
• 32GB DDR5 4400MHz RAM

Drives:

• 1TB 7200 RPM Hard Drive + 512GB PCIe NVMe M.2 Solid State Drive
• Tray Load DVD Drive (Reads and Writes to DVD/CD)

Operating System:

• Microsoft® Windows 11 Home (64-bit)

Graphics & Video:

• NVIDIA® GeForce® RTX 3060 Ti™, 8GB
• Monitor Not Included

Communications:

• Killer™ WiFi 6 (2x2/160) Gig+ and Bluetooth® 5.2

Audio:

• Integrated 7.1 Channel Audio with Waves MaxxAudio® Pro

Keyboard & Mouse:

• Dell Wired Keyboard & Mouse

Ports & Slots:

• 5x USB 3.2 Gen 1 Type-A
• 2x USB 3.2 Gen 2 Type-C
• 2x USB 2.0 Type-A
• 1x Headphone Jack
• 1x HDMI
• 3x Display Port 1.4a
• 1x SD Card Reader (SD, SDHC, SDXC)
• 1x RJ-45

Additional Information:

• Dimensions: 14.68" x 6.81" x 16.80"

That said, I tried to build the same thing on the DELL website...and the cost there (no discounts that I know of) is a good $200-$300 more compared to the Costco item. You might ask 'why 32 GB RAM?'. Well, I know at 16 GB, and with multiple engines running and doing database searches, internet surfing, maybe watching a video, etc at the same time...things would sometimes freeze up and at time might even shut down unexpectedly. Certainly the fans would run a full speed, not that I minded.

I had been considering the 12th Gen Intel® Core™ i5-12400 12-Core Processor based on a Tom's Hardware reviews and possibly the i5-12600 until noticing the Costco i7-27000 item. I have not really considered any overclockable CPU's...figure they all need water-cooling and...somehow that frightens me unless of course they required ZERO maintenance.

The clock speeds for these: Default - Turbo - Max TDP - Single Thread Rating
i7-27000: 2.1 - 4.9 - 65W - 3945
i5-12400: 2.5 - 4.4 - 65W - 3823
i5-12600: 3.3 - 4.8 - 65W - 3524

BUT...all these number can appear to be 'smoke and mirrors' to me sometimes...particularly with the new 'P' and 'E' cores. Also, I never really considered something like an AMD RYZEN 5900X. Despite having plenty of cores for similar reasons as I have mentioned.

Without more than the stock cooling that comes with each, won't these CPU's simply throttle down pretty quick if I tried to get the speed up for any period of time? I could let an engine run at full throttle all night long, crunching away on many different chess positions or games with my old i7-6700 at 3.4 ghz..
Also, I've never heard of DDR5 4400 MHZ RAM. Doesn't DDR5 START at 4800 MHZ??

Any thoughts...suggestions? I would just hate to spend all that $$ and find that even with the extra cores and newer generation...I am possibly getting less accomplished - or at least slower, than with that old 4 core CPU.

The new intel coolers are pretty good they might get a little noisy as temps go up.

Run your stuff and monitor temps and throttling.

 

[Brian D Smith]

Can you upgrade to W11 Pro from their Home edition?

Kind of an irrelevant question, isn't it? Besides, one can always upgrade to Pro.

 

[geofelt]

I think you are correct in that single thread performance is what you need for your chess engine.
To that end, run the cpu-Z bench test and look at what your i7-6700 does.
It should score about 438:
http://valid.x86.fr/bench/y97x8m
You can get an idea of the capability of other processors in the list.

Clock rates do not tell the whole story.
The work done per clock is much better on current gen processors.
Current processors are binned, and the better chips are used in more competent processors that can be sold for more.

No longer is overclocking a way to get more performance for nothing.
It is more effective to let the default turbo mechanism turbo up a few cores past all core overclocking limits,

K suffix processors can be overclocked.
But, the K processors are a tad faster natively than their similarly named non k versions.

12th gen can have P or Performance cores that will do the heavy lifting.
The E or Efficiently cores are tasked with low priority stuff.
Windows 11 scheduler is supposed to be able to direct needy tasks to the P cores.
On my system, I think windows 10 is doing the job, based on what I observe in task manager.

The ability to turbo up high depends on having decent cpu temperatures.
That means a good cooler.
Your particular app running one or two cores full out does not need the same cooling as a batch app using all cores would.

If you doubt your ability to build, I would look at the Lenovo Legion gaming series:
https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/p/desk...owers/legion-tower-7i-gen-7-intel/len102g0003

It looks to me like the dell case has limited cooling capability, and their parts can be proprietary.
Lenovo is constantly having sales.
If you know a lenovo or IBM employee or retiree, they can get you a discount.
It is worth calling and talking to a salesman to see what might be offered; I think they can offer a similar discount.

 

[Brian D Smith]

Hello Bob -
Thanks for the reply.
But, how does 'monitoring' temps and throttling AFTER I have already spent close to $2K help me?
Again, this would be a rig that I will at times need to run the CPU(s - some anyway) at max speed for sometimes several hours without issue....single core performance (not multi-thread) being what is key to get the most of of chess engines.
What I am trying to do is determine up-front what might cause me to regret a purchase. My intuitive thought is that the CPU and RM1 stock cooler - with these new 'P' and 'E' cores might be an issue. They are so new that I just can't find much if anything on the net about this - at least pertaining to all the number crunching chess engines do.
I do read that the purpose of the stock cooler is to "keep 65W TDP chips operating at reasonable temperatures without causing a racket" BUT...isn't pushing some of those cores to their limit (not talking about unclocking...just the stock limit) going to cause massive throttling after a while? Would some throttling be normal? Perhaps throttling is just unavoidable regardless....just not sure how much of a performance hit we are talking about. I would not want to have to run the engines at the slower base clock speeds.

Perhaps i am just worrying over nothing...(?)

 

[geofelt]

Throttling is what a processor does when it detects a dangerous temperature.
For Intel, that is about 100c.
It is unlikely that running a few cores at 100% is going to generate sufficient heat to cause throttling.
A good cooler can try to keep the cpu under 70c. which is where you gt the maximum turbo boost.
Cooling starts with your room temperature.
A processor at idle might run at 10-15c. over ambient.
Ambient(temp of the air inside the case that feeds an air cooler) might be a bit higher if you are actively running a hot graphics card.
Good case ventilation goes a long way.
Think two front 120/140mm intakes.

The cooling potential of a cooler is based mainly on the volume of the cooling fins.
Then fan speed/size and noise comes into effect. Stock coolers are relatively small with 92mm fans.

There was a recent thread about a user who bought Dell workstations with 12900K processors that were constantly throttling. It was clear to responders that the case was the problem, but Dell support did not seem to understand.
I don't know how that was eventually resolved, if at all.

 

[Bob.B]

Hello Bob -
Thanks for the reply.
But, how does 'monitoring' temps and throttling AFTER I have already spent close to $2K help me?
Again, this would be a rig that I will at times need to run the CPU(s - some anyway) at max speed for sometimes several hours without issue....single core performance (not multi-thread) being what is key to get the most of of chess engines.
What I am trying to do is determine up-front what might cause me to regret a purchase. My intuitive thought is that the CPU and RM1 stock cooler - with these new 'P' and 'E' cores might be an issue. They are so new that I just can't find much if anything on the net about this - at least pertaining to all the number crunching chess engines do.
I do read that the purpose of the stock cooler is to "keep 65W TDP chips operating at reasonable temperatures without causing a racket" BUT...isn't pushing some of those cores to their limit (not talking about unclocking...just the stock limit) going to cause massive throttling after a while? Would some throttling be normal? Perhaps throttling is just unavoidable regardless....just not sure how much of a performance hit we are talking about. I would not want to have to run the engines at the slower base clock speeds.

Perhaps i am just worrying over nothing...(?)

The rm1 is designed to handle 65w.
How well it can do that might depend on case temp.
You won't know how well that works until you run your stuff and monitor.
Worst case is you need to fit a different cooler.

 

[Brian D Smith]

Thanks Why_Me,

I am not sure why you would recommend a $599 RTX 3070 (that's 1/3 the price of the whole rig) when I specified something like the RTX 3060 ti should suffice.

Is the reason for the i7-12700FX (instead of the X) so that one could rely on the Scythe Fuma 2 Rev.B CPU Cooler $65.99 in a good case for cooling?

Any thought how much a 'local PC repair shop' might charge to put it all together?

 

[lvt]

Kind of an irrelevant question, isn't it? Besides, one can always upgrade to Pro.

Kind of an irrelevant question, isn't it? Besides, one can always upgrade to Pro.

Just want to know if it's free for you or you have to pay extra.

I upgraded from Win7 to Win8 for free, but Win10 Home to Win10 Pro is not free.

 

[Why_Me]

Thanks Why_Me,

I am not sure why you would recommend a $599 RTX 3070 (that's 1/3 the price of the whole rig) when I specified something like the RTX 3060 ti should suffice.

Is the reason for the i7-12700FX (instead of the X) so that one could rely on the Scythe Fuma 2 Rev.B CPU Cooler $65.99 in a good case for cooling?

Any thought how much a 'local PC repair shop' might charge to put it all together?

They'll most likely charge anywhere from $100 - $200 if I had to guess. 650w psu is what's recommended for an RTX 3060 Ti.

https://www.amazon.com/ASUS-DisplayPort-Axial-tech-Protective-Backplate/dp/B098682XKX/
ASUS Dual NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 Ti V2 OC Graphics Card $499.99

https://www.newegg.com/evga-supernova-120-gp-0650-x1-650w/p/N82E16817438131
EVGA SuperNOVA 650 G+ 650W 80+ Gold Modular Power Supply $69.99

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bM_TgpKqb8

 

[Lafong]

Is the reason for the i7-12700FX (instead of the X) so that one could rely on the Scythe Fuma 2 Rev.B CPU Cooler $65.99 in a good case for cooling?

Any thought how much a 'local PC repair shop' might charge to put it all together?

12700 comes in 3 varieties:

12700; with RM1 cooler which can spin as high as 3000 rpm.

12700k; no cooler, buy your own

12700kf; no cooler, buy your own; does not have integrated video.

Are you indifferent to fan noise?

I seriously doubt an assembler would get off the couch for less than 100 and I wonder how many such stores there are around now as compared to 10 or 20 years ago.

 

[Why_Me]

12700 comes in 3 varieties:

12700; with RM1 cooler which can spin as high as 3000 rpm.

12700k; no cooler, buy your own

12700kf; no cooler, buy your own; does not have integrated video.

Are you indifferent to fan noise?

I seriously doubt an assembler would get off the couch for less than 100 and I wonder how many such stores there are around now as compared to 10 or 20 years ago.

You left out this one.

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/u...2700f-processor-25m-cache-up-to-4-90-ghz.html
Intel Core i7-12700F

 

[Lafong]

You left out this one.

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/u...2700f-processor-25m-cache-up-to-4-90-ghz.html
Intel CPU Core i7-12700F

Yep, I did.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkicmZxasdE


Has a cooler. I guess that is the RM1, with 3 pre-applied thermal strips.

65 watts, no integrated video?

 

[Why_Me]

Yep, I did.

Has a cooler. I guess that is the RM1, with 3 pre-applied thermal strips.

65 watts, no integrated video?

It's the no video brother of the 12700. Going for $311 atm.

 

[Brian D Smith]

12700 comes in 3 varieties:

12700; with RM1 cooler which can spin as high as 3000 rpm.

12700k; no cooler, buy your own

12700kf; no cooler, buy your own; does not have integrated video.

Are you indifferent to fan noise?

I seriously doubt an assembler would get off the couch for less than 100 and I wonder how many such stores there are around now as compared to 10 or 20 years ago.

 

[helper800]

@Brian D Smith If you build it you will end up with a PC you can actually repair, with a great cooler for the CPU, and for 1450 rather than 1800.

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: Intel Core i7-12700F 2.1 GHz 12-Core Processor ($312.96 @ Newegg)
CPU Cooler: be quiet! Dark Rock Pro 4 50.5 CFM CPU Cooler ($89.90 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: MSI MAG B660M MORTAR WIFI DDR4 Micro ATX LGA1700 Motherboard ($157.78 @ Amazon)
Memory: G.Skill Trident Z 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16 Memory ($110.98 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 970 Evo Plus 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive ($104.99 @ Amazon)
Video Card: Asus GeForce RTX 3060 Ti LHR 8 GB DUAL OC V2 Video Card ($499.99)
Case: Phanteks Eclipse P300A Mesh ATX Mid Tower Case ($79.98 @ Amazon)
Power Supply: EVGA G5 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($89.99 @ Amazon)
Total: $1446.57
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2022-06-06 12:09 EDT-0400

 

[Brian D Smith]

Curious: why the i7-12700F with it's base freq of 2.1 ghz? Would not a CPU with a higher base freq be better? I mean, you can't exactly run something like the 12700F at or near peak overnight without serious throttling. I am probably wrong, but would not an i5-2400 or i5-2600 might have less throttling and in the end (lets say, 'overnight') churn thru more positions (?). Heck, maybe even an AMD...

 

[Brian D Smith]

Sorry, I am not sure why you are talking about 1080P or comparing the different i7-12700 versions.

Chess engines do not utilize multi-threading...just raw speed and I am thinking along the line of performance in that respect along with CPU's running as high as possible for a rather long time...and therefore as cool as possible to avoid bad throttling.

That's why I was thinking maybe the i5....or even an AMD as engines like Stockfish are often built now to utilize AVX 512 even for the NNUE (Neural Net)...probably not that much of a speed/performance gain though over AVX 256, but it appears to be some.

 

[helper800]

Curious: why the i7-12700F with it's base freq of 2.1 ghz? Would not a CPU with a higher base freq be better? I mean, you can't exactly run something like the 12700F at or near peak overnight without serious throttling. I am probably wrong, but would not an i5-2400 or i5-2600 might have less throttling and in the end (lets say, 'overnight') churn thru more positions (?). Heck, maybe even an AMD...

You seem to have some confusion about how CPUs work wand what clock speeds are and how modern CPUs use them. Neither intel or AMD CPUs ever sit at their base clock speeds unless you heavily modify stock BIOS options for the motherboard. CPUs of both companies are constantly boosting their clock speed as high as is sustainable for any given tasks albeit in slightly different ways. A 12700f will boost higher than either i5 12400 or the 12600, and this is mostly due to better silicon and limits placed on it. The reason why you might want a 12700f over either i5 is that the computer would work better while you try to use it for other tasks at the same time as running these simulations. More cores means more stuff you can do at the same time while maintaining a higher level of performance in all of the simultaneous tasks. With your budget saving 100 dollars on the CPU to get an i5 instead seems like a waste to me and others as well.

 

[g-unit1111]

You seem to have some confusion about how CPUs work wand what clock speeds are and how modern CPUs use them. Neither intel or AMD CPUs ever sit at their base clock speeds unless you heavily modify stock BIOS options for the motherboard. CPUs of both companies are constantly boosting their clock speed as high as is sustainable for any given tasks albeit in slightly different ways. A 12700f will boost higher than either i5 12400 or the 12600, and this is mostly due to better silicon and limits placed on it. The reason why you might want a 12700f over either i5 is that the computer would work better while you try to use it for other tasks at the same time as running these simulations. More cores means more stuff you can do at the same time while maintaining a higher level of performance in all of the simultaneous tasks. With your budget saving 100 dollars on the CPU to get an i5 instead seems like a waste to me and others as well.

Especially on something where you need a high end CPU. I've heard some chess programs out there can put real undo stress on a CPU, so the more room you have the better. This is one area where you can't cut back on something like that. This is one instance where I'd recommend spending as much as possible on the CPU and not as much on the GPU in this case. An i9, high end AM4 or even a TR4 would be worth spending the extra money on.

 

[Brian D Smith]

Especially on something where you need a high end CPU. I've heard some chess programs out there can put real undo stress on a CPU, so the more room you have the better. This is one area where you can't cut back on something like that. This is one instance where I'd recommend spending as much as possible on the CPU and not as much on the GPU in this case. An i9, high end AM4 or even a TR4 would be worth spending the extra money on.

 

[Brian D Smith]

Thanks for all the advice. Question: What about AMD? I say that because I remember late late year someone talking about Thread-ripper. As I recall, it is a less powerful CPU, but has a lot of cores. Of course, it's way out of my price range! In general though, I think the AMD processors use less power at higher speeds than do they Intel's...but perhaps I am wrong about that as well.

I guess what you are saying is the more CPU power the better...be it threaded (rather useless for chess engines) or not...and that the amount of heat the CPU puts out really doesn't matter in regards to throttling...as they are all going to throttle if you run the long enough.

 

[g-unit1111]

Thanks for all the advice. Question: What about AMD? I say that because I remember late late year someone talking about Thread-ripper. As I recall, it is a less powerful CPU, but has a lot of cores. Of course, it's way out of my price range! In general though, I think the AMD processors use less power at higher speeds than do they Intel's...but perhaps I am wrong about that as well.

I guess what you are saying is the more CPU power the better...be it threaded (rather useless for chess engines) or not...and that the amount of heat the CPU puts out really doesn't matter in regards to throttling...as they are all going to throttle if you run the long enough.

TR4 and TR4x are good CPUs, but they are starting to become a bit dated. If you're going to go AMD, I'd wait for AM5 and the Ryzen 7 series, which should be coming very shortly. It's a new socket design, the CPUs will reach 5GHz+ and it will also make use of DDR5.