[SOLVED] AIO for i9 12900k and gigabyte z690 ud ax ?

[LeeSuperPosey]

Hello,
I'd like to know which AIO is suitable for my following configuration: System Builder.
The ARCTIC Liquid Freezer II LGA 1700 was my first choice, but according to this article, my motherboard may have a compatibility problem. So I asked Arctic's support and still waiting for the answer.
Why Are You Upgrading: This is my first gaming computer
Budget: +/- 300 € - 252 £
Approximate Purchase Date: the closer (but I can wait for a better component)
Use Case:
Gaming: CSGO, League of Legends, Cyberpunk, The Witcher 3, Forza horizon 5
Development: Mutli instance IDE Eclipse/IntelliJ, Docker, VM, Node, ...
Streaming: If my computer can perform it
Design: Photoshop, Illustrator, Blender
Your Monitor: Samsung G9 Odyssey NEO
Parts Preferences: I would like to get a AIO watercooling
Overclocking: No (If I would, would it change the AIO ?)
Additional Comments: Most of my components are quiet but the GPU, if I can get a quiet AIO it will be nice, but I rather like an efficient AIO over a quiet one. This link is the technical data about my case, I'd like to place the AIO in top (max size 360 mm for radiator).

Is a AIO with native support for LGA 1700 is better than an AIO with a upgrade kit for 1700 ?

If you need any additional information, let me know, thank you !

 

[Lutfij]

The cooling block/plate won't be revised until someone comes out with a new design for said AIO. I'd side with either. I'd look at a 360mm AIO at the very least to cool that i9 K suffix processor. The larger the better. Your case does support 420mm of radiator space.

 

[LeeSuperPosey]

If we put the radiator in front for 420mm, the pump must be higher than the output of the cables from the radiator, right?

Would it be possible for you to link me some of AIO you would pick in my case please ?

 

[geofelt]

For gaming, you are not going to load all cores of the 12900K.
You do not need exceptional cooling.
Your case is a nice one and is particularly well suited to air cooling.
You will find that a simple noctua NH-D15s will do the job quietly and safely.
Three front 140mm intakes will provide exceptional airflow to cool an air cooler, the gpu, and the motherboard vrm coolers.
AIO cooling in the 240/280 size is about what the twin towers of the noctua will do.
To do better, you would want a 360 0r 480 radiator.
Then, you will have a catch 22 situation.
If you mount the 360 radiator in front, you will cool the cpu the best.
But, then, the heated cpu air goes to cool your 3080 card and the motherboard components.
OTOH, if you mount the radiator on top to use warm case air, the cpu cooling becomes less effective.

I tested my 12900K using CPU-Z stress test and a noctua NH-D15s. My front intakes were a pair of 140mm fans.
In the summer, when my room ambient was hot, most cores were in the 95c. area but two fastest cores did reach 100c.
No stoppage, the test kept on trucking.
For a gamer, you will never fully load all cores.
This 12900K is so stupidly fast that it will just loaf on most workloads.

I might add that 750w may not be sufficient to run a 3080ti. Apparently the 3000 series cards can have power spikes that need a stronger than normal psu.

Rest of the build looks good.

 

[LeeSuperPosey]

First, I'll change my PCU for >= 1000 W, you're right, thank you.
About the catch 22 situation, is there still a "best" solution ?
Since the graphics card has its own cooling system, would it make more sense to focus on cooling the CPU ?

As the case already has 2 fans in front, if I go for a front AIO, i will be able to move fans to top right ?

About the Noctua, with the RAM (no low profile) that I have chosen, can it still fit without problems with the LGA 1700 adapter kit on the motherboard ?

 

[geofelt]

First, I'll change my PCU for >= 1000 W, you're right, thank you.
About the catch 22 situation, is there still a "best" solution ?
Since the graphics card has its own cooling system, would it make more sense to focus on cooling the CPU ?

As the case already has 2 fans in front, if I go for a front AIO, i will be able to move fans to top right ?

About the Noctua, with the RAM (no low profile) that I have chosen, can it still fit without problems with the LGA 1700 adapter kit on the motherboard ?

I don't know that 1000w is good, 850 0r 950w perhaps.

Yes, you can always move fans.

On cooling, the Noctua NH-D15s has 65mm ram clearance which is considerably more than the better known NH-D15.
https://noctua.at/en/nh-d15s/specification
With two towers, the radiator space is about the equivalent of a 240/280 radiator.
The only difference is where the heat exchange takes place. It will not have the cooling potential of a 360 or 480 aio, but how good do you need to be.? The most cpu heat generation will come when all cores are fully utilized.
Not common in gaming which may only effectively use 4-6 threads. More common for batch multithreaded apps or aggressive all core overclocking.
For gaming, avoid overclocking, use the turbo mechanism which boosts a couple of cores past what an OC might do.

I love the case with two 140mm front intakes. 140mm fans move a lot of air at quieter, lower rpm.
And, I think you can install a third. I think front intake airflow is what is most important.
Whatever comes in the front will exit somewhere, taking component heat with it.
Such airflow is particularly helpful for the gpu.
Today's gpu's(unlike blower style coolers) do a good job of getting heat off of the gpu components, but they then depend on case cooling to get the heat out of the system. 3 140 intake fans will do a good job of that, and one can always use higher capacity fans if needed. I would add another 140mm before going to higher rpm intakes.

 

[LeeSuperPosey]

I won't risk anything and I'm going for a SeaSonic 1000W, if it's a good one.

but how good do you need to be?

Actually I dont' know, I'm a rookie. If you tell me "put x fans in front, x in top, this AIO and you won't have any trouble for years" I will follow the call. I don't mind about RGB, price, but I want to make it clean, safe and powerfull.

Is MSI MEG CORELIQUID S360 a good choice ? Do you know if it fits in my case at top position ? EDIT: looks like this AIO works only with MSI mother board... And it does not seem to be a good one - link.

According to my case's user manual: radiator compatibility in top is 360mm max. But I measured the top bracket and it's 420mm. So the AIO should go in despite the indications of the box ?

 

[geofelt]

If this is your case, then yes, you can mount a 360 radiator in either the front or the top.
https://www.newegg.com/black-be-quiet-silent-base-atx-mid-tower/p/2AM-0037-00075
Reviews/experience, I am told, do not seems to like the msi aio coolers.
Some 15% negative reviews on newegg.
https://www.newegg.com/msi-liquid-cooling-system-meg-series/p/N82E16835846029
MSI put the pump where the radiator is. That is for legal/patent reasons.
I understand that the Asetek based aio units are better.

Until the advent of Intel 12th gen, every cooler had mounting kits for both amd and intel.
Lga1700 has slightly different motherboard mounting holes spacing. Some modern motherboards have two sets of spacing to allow older coolers to fit.
Not the best idea since the cooler needs to also handle the slightly thinner processor.

Most all new coolers will have added the ability to mount their coolers to lga1700. New stock will include the mounts, and the mounts can be ordered separately if needed for a small fee(about$10 and often gratis)
For proper cooling on a 12900K you should get this right.

You should also know that an aio cooler is not designed to last a long time.
In time, air will intrude though the tubes and make it increasingly ineffective.
The addition of a mechanical pump increases the opportunity to fail.
If the pump should fail, your cpu is at risk.
Of an air cooler fan should break, there is still some cooling capability there until you can replace the fan. While uncommon, aio coolers do, on occasion leak with disastrous consequences to the rest of your parts.

Then, you want best performance.
For the cpu or the gpu?
You can't have both.
The best cpu cooling comes with mounting the radiator in front to use fresh air.
But the hot radiator air will be used to cool the graphics card and the motherboard vrm coolers.
OTOH, if you mount the radiator on top expelling air, the cooler will be using hotter ambient air in the case that was generated by the graphics card for cooling.

For gaming, you are not going to load all of your cores like a multithreaded rendering app would. The heat generated by a few heavy cores will not be great. A cpu core will monitor it's own temperature and will slow down if it detects a dangerous temperature.
That is around 100c.
The 12900K is so crazy fast that you can game well with half it's cores tied behind it's back.

Sorry for the aio vs. air rant.
I would use a Noctua NH D15s in your system.

 

[Karadjgne]

No, Msi makes lousy AIO's, prone to coolant failure and that in-rad pump is and has been a good idea that just doesn't work out well.

The issues with the 12900k stem from the motherboard. The cpu has 2 power limits, Intel specs them as PL1 and PL2 and the turbo time is Tau. When something starts, it hits PL2, which is maximum power usage, Tau being 56 seconds. After that, the power drops off down to PL1. So for a minute you are running the cpu at upto 250w+, then supposedly it drops to 125w. That's Intels recommended settings.

That doesn't mean motherboard vendors will play nice and follow that guideline. They prefer to mess with that some, so they can claim a marketing advantage, saying the cpu performs better in their mobo's than the competitors. To accomplish that, Tau gets basically ignored, lasting 99999 seconds (give or take), which puts the cpu at a constant 250w+ possible.

And that's when aircooling takes a nose dive in capability, the largest coolers like the D15 or Assassin III are basically maxed out and heat soaked in seconds. A 360mm AIO is generally recommended if you want the temps to stay under the 90's. The cpu has the highest thermal rating, 115°C I believe, but that doesn't make it good.

You can get an Arctic LGA1700 mounting kit seperately, or give Arctic a call and they may just send you one. The brand new units will have one included, but since 3rd party builder sites like pcpartpicker.com can't guarantee that you will get a new unit, they put the warning up that it might be incompatible.

And yes, geo and I generally oppose each other by default, I have no issues with liquid cooling, or air cooling, just a preference for liquid. 😁 Either will work, both have advantages, disadvantages, strengths and weaknesses, upto you as the owner to decide which you can live with, and which you'd prefer to live without.

 

[LeeSuperPosey]

Thank you for you help and your explanations !

I chose the Arctic liquid freezer II 360. I assembled all the parts of the computer and it boots.
Only when I want to install Windows 11 from a USB boot key, the NVMe disk is not displayed, only the SATA.

So I'm stuck at this level of the installation. I updated the BIOS of the motherboard, but it didn't change anything. I wonder if it is necessary to install drivers. I think I installed the NVMe correctly because the screws in the right place and I couldn't push it any further.

Do you guys have any idea or I should open a new post ?
Thank you !

 

[Karadjgne]

https://forums.tomshardware.com/thr...-7-x3800-build-problems.3548101/post-21430174

The nvme should be put in at @ 45° angle, until it stops, then pushed down to screw. It doesn't slide in sideways. Doesn't take much pressure at all to install.

 

[LeeSuperPosey]

Actually the BIOS found the nvme, that's mean is it correctly installed, right ?
Thank you for the link, I will follow the instruction !

Anyway this is another topic, this one is solved

Thank you so much all of you for the help