News Alleged Zhaoxin KX-6000G benchmarks surface — Chinese-made chips perform like CPUs from the late 2000s but uses less power

[Admin]

A Geekbench 5 result for Zhaoxin's KX-6000G has appeared, and it performs like old Core 2 Quad and Phenom II CPUs.

Alleged Zhaoxin KX-6000G benchmarks surface — Chinese-made chips perform like CPUs from the late 2000s but uses less power : Read more

 

[ThomasKinsley]

This must be what Pat Gelsinger meant when he said China is 10 years behind. This level of performance is old by any modern standard, but the pace of innovation is remarkable. If Zhaoxin learns how to properly scale up to higher tdp and add hyperthreading, then they could quickly reach 6th or 7th gen i7 performance, and that is definitely still useable today. I'd like to see more on the KX-7000's performance.

 

[TCA_ChinChin]

This must be what Pat Gelsinger meant when he said China is 10 years behind. This level of performance is old by any modern standard, but the pace of innovation is remarkable. If Zhaoxin learns how to properly scale up to higher tdp and add hyperthreading, then they could quickly reach 6th or 7th gen i7 performance, and that is definitely still useable today. I'd like to see more on the KX-7000's performance.

The next 1-2 generations of Chinese chips and their improvment will be really interesting. They're about a decade behind in most aspects of processor design and fabrication, and it'll be cool to see where they end up.

 

[tomscomments]

Zhaoxin isn't the cpu china rely on most. That doesn't mean it won't be performant. They may have some bottlenecks like lithographie or drivers or test or whatever they want to leak. I think it is just a cpu X86 they need to have but i don't think they'll go for X86 CISC
We make a mistake if we think zhaoxin is their battlehorse

LoongArch is the mainstream cpu for China.

 

[TCA_ChinChin]

Zhaoxin isn't the cpu china rely on most. That doesn't mean it won't be performant. They may have some bottlenecks like lithographie or drivers or test or whatever they want to leak. I think it is just a cpu X86 they need to have but i don't think they'll go for X86 CISC
We make a mistake if we think zhaoxin is their battlehorse

LoongArch is the mainstream cpu for China.

I think LoongArch is also about 10-ish years behind their western analogues though. Maybe better than this Zhaoxin arch, I'd say they're pretty comparable.

 

[eric79xxl]

The thing that is evident in action, but not really talked about is how jank communist produced stuff is. We didn't really know it until after the cold War, but that Soviet equipment was total jank. Even if designed well, it's always built so poorly that it's not reliable. Look at Russia today, having to adopt tactics of the Ukrainians that were kicking their asses with drones.
Chinese communist produced equipment is similarly of poor workmanship. Synthetic benchmarks of a prototype or early production are one thing - but the jury is still out on if they can achieve and maintain the quality level needed to power their entire country on their homegrown CPUs.

 

[DavidC1]

Though the CPU certainly isn't very fast, it does operate at such a low power level that might make it suitable for laptops, which would put it roughly between Intel's 4th Generation Haswell and 5th Generation Broadwell Core i3 CPUs. Treat the results with a pinch of salt.

Why mislead?

The Pentium Silver N5000 from 2016 that has 6W TDP performs much better than this.
https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/20869323

The performance is on par with a 2015 N4200 6W TDP:
https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/21565847

The modern N100 gets over 1000 in ST, meaning a single core Gracemont is equal to quad KX-6000.

 

[bit_user]

This must be what Pat Gelsinger meant when he said China is 10 years behind. This level of performance is old by any modern standard,

These aren't even new CPUs by their standards. This microarchitecture appears to have launched way back in 2019:

https://en.wikichip.org/wiki/zhaoxin/microarchitectures/lujiazui
​

If Zhaoxin learns how to properly scale up to higher tdp and add hyperthreading

These are client processors. They have an entirely different product line for server CPUs. Their next gen KX-7000 CPUs will feature 8 cores.

As the last paragraph mentions, the 7000-series is on the cusp of launching. Those promise marked performance gains and that will be the real test.

 

[bit_user]

They're about a decade behind in most aspects of processor design and fabrication, and it'll be cool to see where they end up.

Where do you get a "decade"? SMIC allegedly has at least a 2nd generation 7 nm process (possibly better), which I think puts it only about 5 years behind TSMC.

Of course, with the supply of lithography machinery now cut off, the key question is now whether they can stay only 5 years behind.

 

[bit_user]

not really talked about is how jank communist produced stuff is.

In its economic system, China isn't really communist, though. It's basically a market economy with selective state supports.

Chinese communist produced equipment is similarly of poor workmanship.

Given the vast amount of tech & other products currently manufactured in China, I think we can safely say they know how to make stuff properly.

 

[bit_user]

The modern N100 gets over 1000 in ST, meaning a single core Gracemont is equal to quad KX-6000.

True. Here's are GeekBench 5 results for N100:

https://browser.geekbench.com/search?k=v5_cpu&q=N100
​

 

[ThomasKinsley]

These aren't even new CPUs by their standards. This microarchitecture appears to have launched way back in 2019:

​

https://en.wikichip.org/wiki/zhaoxin/microarchitectures/lujiazui​

Thanks for the link. I've got to explore that site some more.

These are client processors. They have an entirely different product line for server CPUs. Their next gen KX-7000 CPUs will feature 8 cores.

As the last paragraph mentions, the 7000-series is on the cusp of launching. Those promise marked performance gains and that will be the real test.

A year ago I was under the impression that China was putting x86 on the backburner and focusing more on RISC-V and ARM. Now I doubt that theory, and I'm not even sure if China has a strategy beyond throwing everything at the wall and seeing what will stick in order to catch up to the West.

 

[bit_user]

Thanks for the link. I've got to explore that site some more.

It's very uneven. Some entries, like Zen 1, are a treasure trove of information. In other cases, you can barely even find a mention of a CPU or microarchitecture. I think it never quite reached critical mass and is now in some shambling, zombified state. I hope I'm wrong.

That said, I've never tried to edit it, myself. Maybe I'll give it a go, at some point.

They also have a news portal that's only updated a few times per year (but tends to have some nice morsels, when it is):

WikiChip Fuse

Your Chips and Semi News

fuse.wikichip.org

Although they have a little bit of subscriber-only content on there (not sure who'd bother subscribing, given the slow pace of their output), most of the info is public. In the public category, they have some very nice summaries of process node roadmaps and ARM IP developments, for instance.

A year ago I was under the impression that China was putting x86 on the backburner and focusing more on RISC-V and ARM.

You know it's a big country, right? It has almost twice the population of Europe - they can do more than one thing!

Now I doubt that theory, and I'm not even sure if China has a strategy beyond throwing everything at the wall and seeing what will stick in order to catch up to the West.

x86 is an undeniable part of the computing landscape. It makes total sense to me that they want to be self-sufficient in x86 computing capacity, even if it's not going to comprise the mainstay of their computing market. The idea is probably to keep from ever getting 100% cut-off from buying more x86 processors, if it ever came to that.

In that regard, I think they don't need to have CPUs on par with the likes of Intel and AMD. Being 3-5 years behind is probably okay, if not ideal. That would still let you run most of the x86 software that's not feasible to run anywhere else.

 

[tomscomments]

I think LoongArch is also about 10-ish years behind their western analogues though. Maybe better than this Zhaoxin arch, I'd say they're pretty comparable.

they are more confuceans than communists in my opinion but i never went there, that's just culture from my kungfu movies 😀
China practice capitalism in its special zones. I'm not an expert but they are after all, through their history, they think as merchants. They even invented paper money and they don't rely on state.
i saw on YT an american economist who described their tech zones as closer to california model, to economical liberalism It depends on the state.
And on others, like the capital (beijing) the economy is more state controlled.
they have less tax than a country like France for instance
their healtcare system is closer to ours and it depends on each province.
60% of chinese GDP comes from privite sector. More than France
90% of new jobs comes from private sector
I don't think their economy is communist, it is following liberal rules.
I don't say it is my model because i believe in personal freedom but on the pure economical aspect, they built their tech with liberal economic principles
i don't think systems can be similar between countries. There could be inspiration
Our system won't work in Europe where in some countries the state decides in a lot of things
our constitution gives us much more freedom. I don't think they have a thing that goes as far as the first amendment. Switzerland is the closest to us


And there is confucianism heritage too, they'll let you know you are the best
some quotes : "

"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance."
"He who speaks without modesty will find it difficult to make his words good.""
"A superior man is modest in his speech but exceeds in his actions.""
"When it is obvious that the goals cannot be reached, don't adjust the goals; adjust the action steps."

 

[j_123]

"Like CPUs From the Late 2000s" ... wow, so they've got that 2990-era tech, sweet!

 

[bit_user]

"Like CPUs From the Late 2000s" ... wow, so they've got that 2990-era tech, sweet!

No, they mean the decade spanning from 2000 to 2009. Personally, I much prefer "the 2000s" to calling it "the aughts". ick.