AMD and Heat II

Matisaro · Sep 25, 2001

It is in the Palomino. The inclusion if the "thermal diode" in the Palomino was a direct response (in my opinion) to the "heat related" problems of the AMD cpu line. It was really just a marketing ploy, saying "we have thermal protection too". On one level they do, but just nowhere as good as the Intel solution.

AMD has never claimed the palomino has thermal protection, it has a thermal diode. All of the reviews insinuated this is thermal protection, and true it can be used as such, but AMD themselves never claimed so.

I can use a butterknife to unscrew my case screws(when I cant find the screwdriver) if the butterknife is unable to unscrew the screw, it is NOT a failure of the butterknifes design, as it was not designed to be a screwdriver.

OK, thats a bad analogy but it gets my point across, calling this test a failure of AMD's thermal protection is not right, because AMD never claimed to have any thermal protection.

~Matisaro~
"The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark"
~Tbird1.3@1.5~

lakedude · Sep 26, 2001

FatDude that is so unfair

All that stuff is out of context. I never said anything bad until I was called a dumbass. Griz drew first blood as usual. That is my whole problem. I will post something informative or happy like "don't burn up your cpu" or "hey I just got a great deal from Dell on a system that I can't even build yet" and I get attacked and called stupid or a dumbass. Once I'm attacked I may blow it off or I may attack back. The point is if you look at the thread Griz and other AMD heads attacked me first. I am not an Intel head or a troll. If you look at my posts they are mostly either questions or informative. I hate being drawn in to flame wars but I'm not gonna take a bunch of crap sitting down.

Ok I just saw the little smiley face so I'll let you live for now.

FatBurger · Sep 26, 2001

Don't worry, the smiley face didn't mean too much, you're still a troll.

Anytime you start swearing at and lying about me and others when I haven't even said anything to you, suddenly you are despised by many on this board. Remain civil and open-minded, and you'll go far.

In memory of all the Americans that died 9/11/01
Rest in peace

lakedude · Sep 26, 2001

Dude you are getting on my nerves but I will be civil and try to straighten this out. I confess to the cussing but it is a matter of record that I was called a dumbass first.

What lies are you refering too?? Honestly??

The only time I can remember having a run in with you was over a wiring problem. What are you talking about?

Griz is another matter. He has attacked me without provacation several times and so I would be likely to jump on him without much additional provacation from him.

flamethrower205 · Sep 26, 2001

Personally, I like fans. In my area, the more fans some one has, the coller their comp is. I like fans, I like the fact that they keep my processor cooler, and the fact that I sleep better when I hear the sound of fans. hence, fans aren't a problem, but a good thing. Oh yeah, btw, my friend has P4, and I noticed his blows out a lot more hot air than my T-Bird- I mean I can barely put my hand in teh back of his computer- mine on the other hand is only lukewarm.

Your brain: PC
You brain on drugs: Mac

jlbigguy · Sep 26, 2001

"AMD has never claimed the palomino has thermal protection, it has a thermal diode. All of the reviews insinuated this is thermal protection, and true it can be used as such, but AMD themselves never claimed so."

I see. So why did AMD add a thermal diode with pin outs for the outside world if not for thermal protection? They may not have claimed to have thermal protection, but that is what a thermal diode is for.

"All of the reviews insinuated this is thermal protection, and true it can be used as such, but AMD themselves never claimed so."

Hmmm.... What else can the thermal diode be used for???

This is a Forum, not a playground. Treat it with Respect.

Boondock_Saint · Sep 26, 2001

Fans (Low Speed 120mm Sunons) = Quiet and Powerful. Looks d*mn cool too. Also an excuse for me to have bought a Dremel.

AMD = Runs Hotter, Faster, Cheaper.
Intel = Runs Slower, Cooler, More Expensive.

Simple. Admit the flaws and the truth will prevail. Personally I would rather have a cheaper main system that I have to spend a small amount of cash on to cool with the same preformance as a more expensive (MUCH) rig that I don't have to spend money for cooling on. That large cash surplus can then be used for video cards, HD's, sound cards, etc.

Matisaro · Sep 26, 2001

How about accurate temprature monitoring for one?
Comparable temprature monitoring across multiple platforms?

Many reasons to have a thermal diode.

~Matisaro~
"The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark"
~Tbird1.3@1.5~

jlbigguy · Sep 26, 2001

"How about accurate temprature monitoring for one?
Comparable temprature monitoring across multiple platforms?"

Good point. We can all use temperature charts for comparison, especially when temps start to exceed 90c. Why would one want to monitor CPU temperatures other then for thermal protection? Perhaps this is a new feature of AMD processors, the ability to monitor CPU temperature? Why hasn't Intel added a separate diode for temperature monitoring in addition to its excellent thermal protection?

Be realistic. It is a poor stopgap solution for shutdown purposes. AMD recognizes the heat problem with the Athlon, and responded with the Palomino core, which runs 20% cooler, and surprise, has a thermal diode for protection against HSF failure. The main problem is that they put the responsibility of shutting down the chip on the motherboard, and not on the CPU itself, where it belongs.

This is a Forum, not a playground. Treat it with Respect.

Matisaro · Sep 26, 2001

Comparing temps on different motherboards is a crap shoot at best, the thermal probes for the cpu are ALL in different places, on board thermal diodes would allow the temp readings to be more accurate and universal. You asked me for other possible uses for a thermal diode and I gave you some.

As for me being realisitic, what the diode was put there to do is anybodys guess, and maybe amd felt it would be a decent thermal protection solution, HOWEVER AMD NEVER CLAIMED IT WAS THERMAL PROTECTION, so the test was pointless and not a failure of amds "thermal protection" it was a failure if anything of the motherboard companies own bios instituted thermal protection.

Why hasn't Intel added a separate diode for temperature monitoring in addition to its excellent thermal protection?

Because any kind of thermal solution would INCLUDE a temprature diode, Intel dosent need to have a second diode to monitor temprature, amd does NOT have thermal protection, so they added a temp diode(who knows why, probably for thermal protection, but THEY HAVE NOT CLAIMED THIS PUBLICALLY SO WHAT WE SURMISE THE DIODE TO BE FOR IS POINTLESS).

I maintain my stance that thermal diodes have OTHER uses besides heat shutdown, as I have shown in my previous post. You can continue to call toms test a failure of AMD's thermal protection, but you cannot fail a test of something you do not, and never claimed to, have.

~Matisaro~
"The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark"
~Tbird1.3@1.5~

FatBurger · Sep 26, 2001

Ok, maybe not outright lying, but anytime someone starts making blanket statements about all AMD owners, that really pisses me off.

In memory of all the Americans that died 9/11/01
Rest in peace

jlbigguy · Sep 26, 2001

"I maintain my stance that thermal diodes have OTHER uses besides heat shutdown, as I have shown in my previous post. You can continue to call toms test a failure of AMD's thermal protection, but you cannot fail a test of something you do not, and never claimed to, have."

The "other uses" for thermal diodes that you proposed both measure temperature. And for what purpose? To shut down the chip before it damages itself. AMD has not brought attention to its themal diode solution because it is inferior to Intels solution. Plain and simple.

AMD CPU's are superior in many ways to Intel chips, but not when it comes to thermal protection. Though an extreme case, THG demonstrated this. Both Intel chips survived, and the Palomino (with the thermal diode and monitoring motherboard) failed.

Even if we assume that the Palomino has no thermal protection, in a test designed to see how each chip handles excessive heat production, the Palomino failed the test. Why did it fail? IT WAS DESTROYED, AND TOOK THE MOTHERBOARD WITH IT. Regardless of what AMD has and has not claimed, the Palomino failed the test.

If you cannot fail a test for something you do not have, you cannot pass it either. If you cannot pass a test, then you fail. There is no in between.

This is a Forum, not a playground. Treat it with Respect.

Yahiko81 · Sep 26, 2001

Ok, drop this already. How many times do you guys have to fight over nothing. If you take a step back you will see how silly you look. And if someone flames me and tells me that all my post are silly I don't really care because I just try to bring some humor to this forum.

Nice Lizards crunch Trolls cookies.......

Yummy!!

jlbigguy · Sep 26, 2001

No one is flaming. We are discussing. You don't have to read it if you are bothered.

It is a bit on the side of nonsense, but so what? Sometimes you just feel a need to respond, then it feeds both ways.

Like a radio or television show that you don't like, turn it off or tune to another station....

This is a Forum, not a playground. Treat it with Respect.

AmdMELTDOWN · Sep 26, 2001

dude, stfu already, in response to public outcry on thermal issues and fried cpus, AMD released a cpu with four pads, when that didn't work they came up with a half assed thermal diode that failed. therefore that cpu flawed.

AMD never claimed it was thermal protection because they knew it was half-assed and didn't work. I say recall the AthlonMP.

"AMD/VIA!...you are still the weakest link, good bye!"

jlbigguy · Sep 26, 2001

"in response to public outcry on thermal issues and fried cpus, AMD released a cpu with four pads, when that didn't work they came up with a half assed thermal diode that failed."

I can agree with this part of your post.

As for the rest, it is typical AMDMeltDown. Nonsense....

This is a Forum, not a playground. Treat it with Respect.

lakedude · Sep 26, 2001

"Ok, maybe not outright lying, but anytime someone starts making blanket statements about all AMD owners, that really pisses me off."

Sorry BurgerDude. I do not intend to insult all AMD users. I only intend to insult the people who attack me and cannot admit that there are two sides to every issue. I bought an Intel CPU and an ATI AIW because I use my computer for video. I hate being called stupid by SOME AMD people and SOME nVidia people for not buying their stuff. For what I do the stuff I bought is great. If I used different software I would have bought different hardware. I would have no problem owning a Gforce or Thunderbird. The ATI card is clearly not up to Gforce speed in games and the P4 cannot hang with AMD's FPU. I am not blind or stupid.

FatBurger · Sep 27, 2001

Ok, that's alright then. Before you were coming off blantantly biased, and hating everyone who even considered buying an AMD (or worse, actually owned one!!

I post so you don't have to!
9/11 - RIP

Matisaro · Sep 27, 2001

Measuring temprature has other uses than just shutting down in the event of a failure, it can be used to test hsf effectivness etc etc.

ALL I AM SAYING, is that amd never claimed to have thermal protection. Nothing more nothing less. Tom tested a feature of amd chips that DOES NOT EXIST, of course it failed the test.

~Matisaro~
"The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark"
~Tbird1.3@1.5~

FatBurger · Sep 27, 2001

the Palomino failed the test. Why did it fail? IT WAS DESTROYED, AND TOOK THE MOTHERBOARD WITH IT.

The Thunderbird did that, not the Palamino.

I post so you don't have to!
9/11 - RIP

killall · Sep 27, 2001

shut up you idjut... every single time you open your mouth it isnt for any good reason so shh... and moo

if in doubt blame microsoft...

killall · Sep 27, 2001

my point, a heatsink being removed is not at all likely... ivenever had anything like this occur on any of the boxes i have built... going to build myself a new box in october, all i can say is i hope the XP does the same to the p4 as the tbird did to the p3

if in doubt blame microsoft...

AmdMELTDOWN · Sep 27, 2001

moo, moo, moo!

I like that gateway commercial too!

"AMD/VIA!...you are still the weakest link, good bye!"

Yahiko81 · Sep 27, 2001

Did you get dumped by a chick who like AMD?? I'm just trying to figure out where your intense hate for AMD comes from. Obviously it's not from an intellectual stand point.

Nice Lizards crunch Trolls cookies.......

Yummy!!

killall · Sep 27, 2001

hahahaha... NO!

if in doubt blame microsoft...

AMD and Heat II

Splendid

Distinguished

Illustrious

Distinguished

Illustrious

Distinguished

Distinguished

Splendid

Distinguished

Splendid

Illustrious

Distinguished

Illustrious

Distinguished

Distinguished

Distinguished

Distinguished

Illustrious

Splendid

Illustrious

Distinguished

Distinguished

Distinguished

Illustrious

Distinguished

Share this page