AMD & ATI making a come back?

MikuMiku

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I have heard that AMD and ATI is going to blow Intel and Nvidia away with there new AM3 technology. i know that most of you probally know this but i need specs on this. i know that ATI just realease a new GPU that blow the new 9800 GTX's out of the water. how will the new AM3 technology work out?
 

yomamafor1

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AM3 technology = AM2 with DDR3. Personally I wouldn't expect much from the AM3 socket. When socket 939 was abandoned in favor of the AM2, there were very little performance gain. I would expect AM3 to be the same.

The newer 4800 series is another story though. I think its a great comeback for ATi (or AMD), and it will definitely help AMD in the long run.
 

MikuMiku

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yeah.i heard that they benchmarked it at 25000 on the new AM3 with 3DMark06. they also ran crisis at a splitting 55 FPS.
 

yomamafor1

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I can definitely tell you, either its a fake, or they ran GTX280 Tri-SLied @ 1600 x 1200.
 

jimmysmitty

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Well the 4870 did run Crysis at 55FPS @ 1600x1200 with all settings at high (except shaders at very high) and 4xAA no AF but that was with an Intel system not AM3.

The main benefit is DDR3 and a boost to the HTT links but those will more than likely benefit the server arena not the desktop arena much like HTT 2.0 has not show a direct benefit to the desktop market yet.

And just one more thing, by the time AM3 hits Nehalem will be out so it will have a bit more than just a FSB chip to compete against.
 

MikuMiku

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hehe that makes me a happy b/c i am a die hard Intel supporter i just need to figure out wat all the hype is about on this.
 

cjl

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Even as a die hard intel supporter, you should hope that AMD stays competitive. Competition is what keeps Intel innovating and keeps the prices low on awesome midrange stuff like the E8xxx series and the cheaper quads.
 

zenmaster

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#1 - NVIDIA's 280GPU is the single fastest GPU on the market right now, ATI is not "Blowing NVIDIA" out of the water. However, from a Price/Performance ration, NVIDIA needs to seriously lower their prices which they are doing. This will help ATI because that will limit the research dollars that NVIDIA has.

#2 - AM3 will do very little for AMD in general until memory becomes a constraint. At this point, AMDs memory controller is faster/better than Intel's but Intel still pretty much destroy's Intel because memory is not the limiting factor. Improving a non-bottleneck area will not help. They actually need to improve their CPU which they will not be doing seriously for quite a few years. They will be adding some cache and going to the 45nm process, but that will only get them so far. And that is likely not even where Intel is now, which is not where Intel will be by the time Q4 comes around.

#3 - Yes, Even Intel Fan boys want AMD to be competitive. And if I were to recommend a system today, it would by with an Intel CPU and AMD GPU.
 

jimmysmitty

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zen, I will wait to see what happens. If anything the 4870 OC edition looks interesting. From a stock 750MHz to 950MHz GPU (200MHz jump or 27%) and from 3.6GHz memory to 4.8GHz memory (1.2GHz jump or 33%).

If anything that could be a killer in performance really. I can't wait to see what it could do and might have to pick one up. Might hurt NVidias bottom line more than we think.
 

xxjudgmentxx

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#1 - NVIDIA's 280GPU is the single fastest GPU on the market right now, ATI is not "Blowing NVIDIA" out of the water. However, from a Price/Performance ration, NVIDIA needs to seriously lower their prices which they are doing. This will help ATI because that will limit the research dollars that NVIDIA has.

i know you said "fastest GPU on the market right now" but ati is DEFINITELY going to blow nvidia clear out of the market if they don't drop the price of the 280 to under $300.

4870X2 beats or matches GTX280 SLI
$550 is waaaaaaay cheaper than $920 ($460 per card)
(benchmarks are out that back this up)
 

cow_moo

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even if AM3 is better nehalem is gonna blow it out of the water. I agree nvisia has the single fastest GPU out now but the 4870X2 might destoy the GTX280 or nvidia needs to make a new faster card soon
 

zenmaster

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Oh, I definitely think NVIDIA's bottom line is going to be hurting.
And Yes, ATI may be able to get out some cards that OC well and really hurt NVIDIA.

However, they are not going to be easy to do and I read somewhere these cards are going to have built-in Water Cooling.

They will not be cheap.

I really think ATI is hitting the mark better than NVIDIA right now.
I would really be hard pressed to recommend an NVIDIA solution right now near the higher portion of the market.

#1 = I think Intel's CPUs are the best so I would start there.
#2 = I prefer Intel's Chipsets to NVIDIAs and Intel would require the use of CF instead of SLI.
#3 = AMD is clearly the Price/Performance winner and they have good performance. Especially with the 4870x2.
#4 = ATI is more "Future Proof". ATI currently supports DX10.1 vs DX10 for NVIDIA. As soon as NVIDIA released DX 10.1 cards, I think you will see more games supporting DX10. I suspect the lack of proper DX10 support now is "political". Game companies don't want to make their games look far better on one GPU than another. I think NVIDIA is applying pressure to keep DX10.1 support limited for the time being. This means that by this time next year, the 3870 will start to beat the GTX280 in games it is now losing in.

 

jonyb222

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I fully support the 4870X2, but let's not get too far ahead of ourselves: (when comapring single 4870X2 to 280 SLI)



~50% difference (ATI's loss)

Though you're quite right when it comes to AoC (I was about to do the apples-apples one again but realised they were different Rez)

Though ti's up to you to figure out how 4xTRSS compares to 12xCF AA
 

the last resort

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@yoma 2 IS NOT GREATER THAN 3.
Second, AM3 raelly is that great. All of the benches done now usually use DDR2 for AMD, and usually DDR3 for Intel. BESIDES the fact that the new processors that are coming out for AMD are probably going to rock. I read somewhere, IDK where, that AMD is kidna of going to skip 45nm, and go to 32nm, whereas Intel's new Nehalem is still 45nm. Could see something good comeout.

In other news coming from AMD, the new Deneb chips that are 45nm are operating 3 GHz and up. And they will be selling them for <$1000. Intel had better watch their back, and not slack off to much, or they may get completely blown away because they don't know what AMD is up to.

O, and, please, flame me for this, cause I know you will.
 

jonyb222

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@last resort, I fully a gree with you, though I think when they say they'll go directly to 32 nm I think it's for the next gen CPU and not deneb.

Phenom(65nm)==>Deneb(45nm die shrink)==>N-gen(32nm)
while normally N-gen would be 45 then go down to 32

*Edit* I just realised that's what you probly meant, sorry
 

njalterio

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@ the last resort: If the new AMD processors outperform and are better value (price/performance) than the Intel processors I will ditch my Intel setup and switch to AMD.

Oh wait, that wasn't what you wanted to hear was it?

YOU HAVE JUST BEEN REVERSE FLAMED!
 

jimmysmitty

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Well don't forget about SM 4.1 where as Nvidia does not have it yet either.

Also I saw one of the new OC 4870s from Diamond and they had a heatsink/fan on it instead of water colling though I did hear that as well. I would love one cuz it sounds tasty really.



Um no they do not. They use the same DDR2. That and DDR3 still does not (and will not) make any difference until the latencies get lower and the clock speeds go up.

Unless AM3 changes the CPUs arch its not going to change much.

AMD is not skipping 45nm because IBM has yet to get fully working 32nm chips. Until IBM gets that AMD will not get it. Remember AMD relies a lot on IBM for their process technolgy among other things.

That was not operating but OCing. And from what has been seen so far Deneb clock per clock has yet to do anything more than add about 10% clock per clock meaning its about the same as Conroe (Q6600+) and near Penryn (Q9300+).

Seriously do your research first and don't believe everything you read.

*edit* I personaly think that Intel approach is a bit safer. Few reasons, mainly being that they get all the quirks out of the 45nm process so that they can focus on tweaking on Nehalem itself. Then once Nehalem is good they will shrink it to 32nm and work that out even better. Then Sandy Bridge will come out on 32nm and then go to 22nm.
 

cow_moo

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I'm gettig ahead of the game but in 2009 Q? Intel is releasing nehalem-C (pretty sure that's the code name) and its 32nm
 

yomamafor1

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Please look up "Deneb". Thank you.

EDIT: owned.


 

jimmysmitty

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Westmere (might be spelled wrong) is the name. That will be more than likely Q4 2009.
 

cow_moo

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thx jimmysmitty for the info I just knew that there was a 32nm intel coming out in 09 supposedly caled nehalem--C
 

xxjudgmentxx

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also,
http://anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3354&p=7
 

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