Any tips for a beginning Nethack player?

Mike

Splendid
Apr 1, 2004
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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Any tips for a beginning NH Player?

I'm using beginning in the sense that I've gotten to Sobokan once, and
that's as far as I've gotten. So any tips, besides not drinking from
fountains.
As a monk, I like drinking from fountains due to poison resistance, but I
understand the risks generally outweigh the benefits.

Things I know already:

Floating eyes are best to be killed from afar.
Items can be b/u/c at an altar.
Sacrificing corpses can appease your god.
Pestering your god too much is not a good thing.
Eating a yellow mold corpse is not always a good thing.
Stumbling around blind is not always a good thing.
Pets can be helpful in a shop.
Sometimes nymphs can be helpful.

Anything else?
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

I think it's only possible to reply either with a 140-page treatise on
the Many, Many, Often Confounding, Frequently Fantastic, At Times
Esoteric, and Nearly Always Surprising At Least The First Time Ways and
Means of Nethack or as those above have done. So I'll try to follow in
their footsteps, not having the time for a tome :)

1. Take COPIOUS NOTES. Whatever character you're playing, start a
notepad file or a notebook page about him and his discoveries and write
stuff down that seems important, especially stuff that you think will
pertain to the game as a whole. That's probably the best way to
unspoil yourself naturally :)

....it's also mighty handy for when you bump into a mind flayer or a
potion/scroll of amnesia.

2. Relatedly, remember that there's nearly nothing in the game that is
without meaning. Not on a grand scale, necessarily (although there are
some of those too, depending on how you're interpreting "grand scale"),
but the game gives any new player a LOT more information than any new
player thinks they're getting.

3. Sometimes I could swear in a fit of superstition that my personal
tendency to pound keys during a furious attack and race to move around
the level while fighting is helpful. Upon reflection, usually
reflection closely related to the demise of yet another character, this
is not really the case. The game gives you all the time you need to
consider your next act, and if you don't take advantage of that time,
expected to get pounded but good, if not now, then next time :)

4. Blindness is remarkably helpful AFTER one of those tasty floating
eyes.

5. Pets like tripe. A lot. You can train them to do things with
tripe.

6. Try to keep your invisibility voluntary at least until you have a
mighty powerful pet that can wallop shopkeepers for you. You won't be
allowed in if you're invisible.

7. And, at the risk of angering the rgrn Ascended, I can't help but
mention that the game is so deep and complex and surprising (speaking
as one that's read basically every spoiler she could get her hands on)
that it is honestly difficult to spoil it. If you're really in a rough
spot, search here and nethack.de - and there are several links in sigs
here that are also very helpful - without too much shame, especially if
you're looking for a specific solution to a tricky problem.

7.5 I found the freeware sokoban apps out there a great help to
practice for doing sokoban without the spoilers. Also they're great
fun in and of themselves. I liked the one I found for the Mac better
than the weird graphic-y ones I found for the PC, but the principle's
the same. Doesn't deserve a whole mention on its own, but there you
have it :)

hth a little bit, and welcome to the club!
ygg
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

yggdrasil wrote:
> 1. Take COPIOUS NOTES. Whatever character you're playing, start a
> notepad file or a notebook page about him and his discoveries and write
> stuff down that seems important, especially stuff that you think will
> pertain to the game as a whole. That's probably the best way to
> unspoil yourself naturally :)
>
> ...it's also mighty handy for when you bump into a mind flayer or a
> potion/scroll of amnesia.

Your right, it will help you ascend, and I generally keep lose notes,
but in a roleplaying sense (which only some people follow), its a bit
wrong, and I personally delete my notes whenever I get amnesia / MMF
attacked, as well as trying not to use my memory (although sometimes I
cant help it but remember what forgotten items were)
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

> but in a roleplaying sense (which only some people follow), its a bit
> wrong, and I personally delete my notes whenever I get amnesia / MMF
> attacked, as well as trying not to use my memory (although sometimes I
> cant help it but remember what forgotten items were)

Personally I prefer to roleplay super-intelligent semi-clairvoyant
characters who have the presence of mind to research mind flayers in
advance and be aware of likely impending doom, and who would therefore
take their own notes anyway, a la Memento 😉

Another thing to orig.poster: check out explore mode and wizard mode.
they'll help you get a better understanding of what's going on. The
help files will tell you what they are and how to enter those modes.

-ygg
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Mike babbled on for HOURS on 13 Jun 2005:

>
> Any tips for a beginning NH Player?
>
> I'm using beginning in the sense that I've gotten to Sobokan once,
> and
> that's as far as I've gotten. So any tips, besides not drinking from
> fountains.
> As a monk, I like drinking from fountains due to poison resistance,
> but I understand the risks generally outweigh the benefits.
>
> Things I know already:
>
> Floating eyes are best to be killed from afar.
> Items can be b/u/c at an altar.
> Sacrificing corpses can appease your god.
> Pestering your god too much is not a good thing.
> Eating a yellow mold corpse is not always a good thing.
> Stumbling around blind is not always a good thing.
> Pets can be helpful in a shop.
> Sometimes nymphs can be helpful.
>
> Anything else?


Nope, you have discovered every useful bit of info by yourself! 8o)

Actually there are LOADS of info....anything from vague advice to virtually
an English translation of the code. Best thing to do is first decide how
"spoiled" you want to be and then ask your questions in that context.

But here is a nice bit of info that may help in regard to the fountains:

Shrieker corpses can get you what you seek without the ill effects.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Mike <thekellysli@optonline.net> wrote:
>
> Any tips for a beginning NH Player?
>
> I'm using beginning in the sense that I've gotten to Sobokan once, and
> that's as far as I've gotten. So any tips, besides not drinking from
> fountains.
> As a monk, I like drinking from fountains due to poison resistance, but I
> understand the risks generally outweigh the benefits.
>
> Things I know already:
>
> Floating eyes are best to be killed from afar.
> Items can be b/u/c at an altar.
> Sacrificing corpses can appease your god.

Only the right corpses. Some won't matter either way, others will...
be detrimental.

> Pestering your god too much is not a good thing.
> Eating a yellow mold corpse is not always a good thing.

if 'not always' == 'almost always not'

> Stumbling around blind is not always a good thing.

ditto.

> Pets can be helpful in a shop.
> Sometimes nymphs can be helpful.
>
> Anything else?

A hungry rock mole can you get you out of your just desserts.


Keith
--
Keith Davies "Trying to sway him from his current kook-
keith.davies@kjdavies.org rant with facts is like trying to create
keith.davies@gmail.com a vacuum in a room by pushing the air
http://www.kjdavies.org/ out with your hands." -- Matt Frisch
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

In article <Vpore.20666$So7.478@fe10.lga>,
Mike <thekellysli@coptonline.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> Any tips for a beginning NH Player?
>
> I'm using beginning in the sense that I've gotten to Sobokan once, and
>that's as far as I've gotten. So any tips, besides not drinking from
>fountains.

Play random characters at least once in a while. Don't quit just
because you rolled a caveman or and orcish rogue or something.

Also, with many character types and situations, it can be to your
advantage to try to keep your kills to a minimum. Explore ways of
scaring things off, killing them indirectly, trapping them, escape
tactics, making them kill each other, or having your pet(s) do it.
For the early game, leveling up results in a steep curve for what
the game throws at you.
If you have success with this approach, there are one or two
controversial strategies that might interest you.

>Anything else?

The rabbit hole goes much, much deeper.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Mike wrote:
> Any tips for a beginning NH Player?
<snipping all the good tips mentioned>

One of the biggest breakthrough in my game playing came from...

Knowing your pets can help you with the cursed status of items.

Knowing the prayer can fix the hunger when weak/fainting.

Those two helped me go over the *hump*

-K
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Mike wrote:
>
> Any tips for a beginning NH Player?

Take your time. Nethack is not real time and I always
want to play at my typing rate. *Much* too fast. Almost
all of the characters I lose are from rushing.

Watch your hit points. If they start dropping fast
get the bleep out of there. Being in a crowd of hostile
monsters is a *very* bad place to start watching your
hit points. One soldier ant in a corridor followed by
the next one just isn't the same risk as one in every
direction. Encountering a new type of monster the
first time out in the open is a *very* bad time to
start watching your hit points. Monkeys and apes may
both be Y but they aren't the same risk. Same with
hobbits and bugbears, rothes and baluchatiums or
however it's spelled, and so on.

Learn to tell when you can and can't pray. Prayer can
solve all manner of problems once you know how to tell
when it is safe. Learn the consequences of praying
when it's not safe.

Learn the luck system. There's a special stone at the
bottom of the mines that's worth more than any weapon
or piece of armor once you know the luck system.

Read all of the messages. Figue out which ones are
common and pay special attention to the ones that are
not common. Every single message carries meaning. The
ones about swings and hits and misses tell you how
your battles are going. The ones you don't expect,
those are the ones you should write down and figure out
what they mean.

Throw everything. Daggers, rocks, whatever. Fight
remotely. For fighting classes do use spells. For
spellcaster classes do use fighting.

Lower armor class equals better survival. Carrying
heavier stuff means worse survival. Combine these
two and it tells you a lot about what armor to wear.
Try on all blessed or uncursed armor. Any time you
find one with a better enchantment than a provious
one switch to the better one. Among types of armor
consider AC plus weight plus other effects.

You want both better armor and better weapons, but if
you are forced to chose, chose better armor.

Shopkeepers in general stores will #chat about prices.
Within classes (say armor to armor) the price difference
say much about the relative value. Consider just how
much more a crossbow costs and then think about my
point of throwing everything. Consider how much really
good armor costs in a shop compared to how much a really
good weapon costs, and you'll get my point about needing
to pick excellent armor if you're really forced to chose
between armor and weapon.

The mines are crowded so they are risky. Be ready to
retreat. On the other hand the mines are crowded so
they plentiful combat gets your experience higher faster.
Sokoban makes the mines easier, the mines make Sokoban
easier, so think which you want to tackle first. Some
do the mines to the town then Sokoban then mines end,
but when it comes down to it the strategy tht works for
you is the one to use.

Learn what corpses have what effect. This goes back to
my comment about reading all messages. But stuff in
nethack is based on chances. Some monsters are sure to
have benefits when you eat them fresh, some do so only
sometimes.

Being burdened equals dying young. I mentioned this in
my armor section but it bears repeating. Gather stuff
into a pile or leave it where you found it, but don't
just pick up everything. When you pick something up,
either carry it to a pile near a stairs or have in mind
what you'll be doing with it. Only go past burdened if
you have very good reason. Encounter even an easy
monster and drop heavy stuff to fight it.

Weight management and inventory management. Think about
them, do them.

There's never only one right answer. It's a great thing
about Nethack. There's never only one wrong answer,
either. There are always several fatally wrong answers.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On Mon, 13 Jun 2005, Phlimm wrote:

> Mike babbled on for HOURS on 13 Jun 2005:

> > As a monk, I like drinking from fountains due to poison resistance,
> > but I understand the risks generally outweigh the benefits.

> But here is a nice bit of info that may help in regard to the fountains:
>
> Shrieker corpses can get you what you seek without the ill effects.

Monk get poison resistance at XL3 and so can drink from fountains with few
bad effect (summonning can be handled from XL5 to 7), only "that water is
no good" remaining.
Magic fountains may act as potions of gain ability which is always a nice
thing and that may be the good effect one is looking for (plus the slight
chance of getting an early wish).

Shrieker corpses are (almost) useless for monks (except that they are
vegan, of course).

Hypocoristiquement,
Jym.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On Tue, 13 Jun 2005, Marky Mark wrote:

>
>
> yggdrasil wrote:
> > 1. Take COPIOUS NOTES. Whatever character you're playing, start a
> > notepad file or a notebook page about him and his discoveries and write
> > stuff down that seems important, especially stuff that you think will
> > pertain to the game as a whole. That's probably the best way to
> > unspoil yourself naturally :)
> >
> > ...it's also mighty handy for when you bump into a mind flayer or a
> > potion/scroll of amnesia.
>
> Your right, it will help you ascend, and I generally keep lose notes,
> but in a roleplaying sense (which only some people follow), its a bit
> wrong, and I personally delete my notes whenever I get amnesia / MMF
> attacked, as well as trying not to use my memory (although sometimes I
> cant help it but remember what forgotten items were)

Once I had a MMF attack while comming the long way up.
After that attack, I started swapping my rings as usual, knowing by heart
which inventory letter correspond to which ring.
A few level upper, I realized that all my rings were now unidentified and
so this was like cheating by using my out-of-game memory to make the game
easier.

Maybe amnesia attacks should also randomize letters in your inventory.

(just like in slash'em hallucination also hallucinate your inventory,
making it all the more usefull to have unihorn assigned to a fixed
invletter...)

Hypocoristiquement,
Jym.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

1. Eating

You are what you eat. In Nethack, this is doubly important - there are
several creatures which, when eaten, will grant an intrinsic quality
that they once possessed.

Pay attention to special creatures, and any attacks they use that
differentiate themselves from others like them. Look at brown and red
molds for example, and the sorts of things they do to your character.
You can eat them - and it's possible you'll gain something out of it.
It's usually not a 100% chance, mind you.

As you progress, the corpses of more powerful creatures with this sort
of attack have a greater chance of helping you - and some will have
even more exotic qualities to share. Keep in mind, however, that not
all qualities are good things, and some can be downright harmful.

You probably already know about poison resistance - you'll probably be
pleased to know that this is one of the most important qualities you
can gain from consuming fallen enemies.

In general, most creatures are safe to eat. The big no-no's are:
Corpses that have been dead too long (with one or two exceptions.
Corpses that don't rot away are generally safe to eat no matter how
long they've been out.) Note that zombies, while moving, are by
definition corpses that have been dead too long. (Incorporeal undead
are another matter entirely.)
-Poisonous creatures, until you get that resistance.
-Creatures who are dangerous merely to touch.

Your Deity and You

You're the chosen instrument of your deity even at level 1 - and that
comes with certain benefits. The most obvious is prayer - when in a
fix, your god can help you out. Praying too often tends to get the
gods irked, though, so watch out.

Praying in the right circumstances, however, can be beneficial beyond
simply quick fixes. Praying upon altars in particular can lead to
great boons.

The gods also accept sacrifices of the creatures you've defeated in
combat - not just to appease them, but to glorify them. The more
difficult the creature was, the more beneficial to sacrifice. If you
sacrifice enough foes to your god, you may eventually receive something
in return for your efforts.

Altars aren't always to YOUR god, though - more often than not, they're
altars to a different god. But that doesn't mean enterprising mortals
can't help shift the balance with some effort.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

While not a great player by any streach of the imagination I have
learned recently that Nymph courpses are more troble than their worth:
enaqbz gryrcbeg = onq

Now some players may disagree with me, but I've lost sevral charaters
to that...however if you have a evat bs pbageby gryrcbeg then I could
see Nymph corpses being your friend.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

"Mike" <thekellysli@optonline.net> writes:

> Any tips for a beginning NH Player?

There are three main threats at the very beginning: starvation,
monsters, malicious items. Hence you have to care for food,
try not to get beaten up, and somehow make sure you won't use
malicious items.

Fighting:

- Your pet is a great fighter at the beginning, since it is fast
and monsters only attack it after the pet attacked them. It
gets stronger while killing monsters, too. So let your pet
get its lot of monsters.

- Proceed slowly. A rule of thumb is that you should not proceed
further down in dungeon levels than you have char levels at first.
[However, food needs might press you further down.]

- Keep an escape route, and never be too proud to use it. The Art
Of Running Away To Fight Another Day is quite important.

- Try to have means of one-turn escapes. This includes scrolls
of teleport, wands of digging, or cursed potions of gain level.
[that's, IMHO, one of the most useful things you can do with
them].

- Fight in tight corners, make sure only one opponent can fight
against you at a time, don't run straight towards a monster
which has missile weapons.

- Fighting from a distance is sometimes a good idea, though.
But

- Be careful to the edge of paranoia about seemingly harmless
humanoid monsters who all too often have wands of great harm.

- The most important combat stats are speed, armor class, strength
and weapon skill. Check your weapon skill regularly if it can
be improved. Try to get better armor (see under items); this
might even be worth the risk of visiting the gnomish mines if
you are fat on HP.

Food

- Monster corpses are, for the most part, eadible. As a rule
of thumb, almost anything your pet eats is eadible; many
corpses it does not like are harmful. However, there are
exceptions in both directions.

- Praying for food is absolutely acceptable, but keep in mind
(a) that this should not occur too often (Prayer time-out)
(b) that usually your god only helps if you're already weak or
worse.

- Careful adventurers which have one food ration left often
prefer to pray when weak; if the god is angry for some reason,
they still have one ration and hence some time.

- For getting your share of monster corpses, it is better to
have your pet kill a monster; this increases the chances
that you are first at the corpse.

Items

- The simplest rule is not to use any items at all, but without
them, you'll have a hard time. Hence, you should try to gather
as much information about them as possible.

- The ultimate for this are scrolls of id. They can be recognized
by their shop price, which is far below all other scrolls. A
blessed scroll has a much higher chance of identifying all items
in main inv.

- There are special strategies for a partial identification of
wands, potions and other items. Read the spoilers if you want,
else just be reminded that one can engrave with wands and
dip things into potions.

- Concerning cursedness of items (particularly armor), your
pet is a good judge. Watch how it behaves when you drop
a cursed item.

Best,
Jakob
 
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In news:<Vpore.20666$So7.478@fe10.lga>, Mike <thekellysli@optonline.net>
says...
> Any tips for a beginning NH Player?
[lots of mostly intelligent discoveries snipped]
> Anything else?

I think Mikko Saari's "Absolute Beginner's Guide for NetHack" would be
of help to you. It used to be posted frequently to this group (not
anymore though, it seems) and is linked to in the FAQ for this newsgroup
(section 3.1A). It hasn't been updated since v3.4.1 of Nethack, but that
shouldn't matter much.

Here is the relevant FAQ section reproduced for your convenience:

---
3.1A:

Believe it or not, people can and do "win" NetHack! The main key to
winning and not dying is patience. Nothing happens in the game if you
don't hit a key; this lets you think each of your moves out
carefully. Each time your character meets a grisly or stupid demise,
use it as a learning experience, and try not to repeat your mistake
the next time you play.

"The Complete Beginner's Guide to NetHack" contains a great deal of
advice on playing NetHack. It's posted to the group frequently, or
find it online at
<http://www.melankolia.net/nethack/nethack.guide.html>.
It does a good job of balancing advice against spoilers.
---

Best luck and even if the RNG isn't with you, RGRN will probably be!

/Kristoffer

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