[SOLVED] Aorus Z390 Master + i9-9900K - Looking for Over-clocking guidance.

Feb 17, 2019
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The BIOS on these boards, while the layout is well intentioned, do not make manual over-clocking easy. Anyone have any decent resources concerning overclocking with these boards? I may just be at the limit of my CPU, but I show no throttling and my max temps on any given core are only 87 under an hour stress using AIDA64. I just feel like I can get more out of the CPU but there is something that I am missing.
 

Darkbreeze

Titan
Moderator
First of all, at 87°C you are already 7°C over the recommended maximum temperature for any Intel Core-I processor.

Read the Intel temperature guide.

Intel temperature guide by Computronix

As far as the thermal testing is concerned, Aida is practically useless as a metric for thermal testing as it fails to approach actual thermal design power specifications.

Regardless of architecture, Prime95 v26.6 (And only version 26.6) works equally well across all platforms. Steady-state is the key. How can anyone extrapolate accurate Core temperatures from workloads that fluctuate like a bad day on the Stock Market?

I'm aware of 5 utilities with steady-state workloads. In order of load level they are:

(1) P95 v26.6 - Small FFT's
(2) HeavyLoad - Stress CPU
(3) FurMark - CPU Burner
(4) Intel Processor Diagnostic Tool - CPU Load
(5) AIDA64 - Tools - System Stability Test - Stress CPU

AIDA64's Stress CPU fails to load any overclocked / overvolted CPU to get anywhere TDP, and is therefore useless, except for giving naive users a sense of false security because their temps are so low.

HeavyLoad is the closest alternative. Temps and watts are within 3% of Small FFT's.

Computronix
Author - Intel temperature guide

This is how I recommend testing for thermal compliance and stability to validate an overclock to a CPU.

Quick and dirty overview of overclocking/stability validation procedure.

Set CPU multiplier and voltage at desired settings in BIOS. Do not use presets or automatic utilities. These will overcompensate on core and other voltages. It is much better to configure most core settings manually, and leave anything left over on auto until a later point in time if wish to come back and tweak settings such as cache (Uncore) frequency, System agent voltage, VCCIO (Internal memory controller) and memory speeds or timings (RAM) AFTER the CPU overclock is fully stable.

Save bios settings (As a new BIOS profile if your bios supports multiple profiles) and exit bios.

Boot into the Windows desktop environment. Download and install Prime95 version 26.6.

Download and install either HWinfo or CoreTemp.

Open HWinfo and run "Sensors only" or open CoreTemp.

Run Prime95 (ONLY version 26.6) and choose the "Small FFT test option". Run this for 15 minutes while monitoring your core/package temperatures to verify that you do not exceed the thermal specifications of your CPU.

(This should be considered to be 80°C for most generations of Intel processor and for current Ryzen CPUs. For older AMD FX and Phenom series, you should use a thermal monitor that has options for "Distance to TJmax" and you want to NOT see distance to TJmax drop below 10°C distance to TJmax. Anything that is MORE than 10°C distance to TJmax is within the allowed thermal envelope.)

If your CPU passes the thermal compliance test, move on to stability.

Download and install Realbench. Run Realbench and choose the Stress test option. Choose a value from the available memory (RAM) options that is equal to approximately half of your installed memory capacity. If you have 16GB, choose 8GB. If you have 8GB, choose 4GB, etc. Click start and allow the stability test to run for 8 hours. Do not plan to use the system for ANYTHING else while it is running. It will run realistic AVX and handbrake workloads and if it passes 8 hours of testing it is probably about as stable as you can reasonably expect.

If you wish to check stability further you can run 12-24 hours of Prime95 Blend mode or Small FFT.

You do not need to simultaneously run HWinfo or CoreTemp while running Realbench as you should have already performed the thermal compliance test PLUS Realbench will show current CPU temperatures while it is running.

If you run the additional stability test using Prime95 Blend/Small FFT modes for 12-24 hours, you will WANT to also run HWinfo alongside it. Monitor HWinfo periodically to verify that no cores/threads are showing less than 100% usage. If it is, then that worker has errored out and the test should be stopped.

If you find there are errors on ANY of the stability tests including Realbench or Prime95, or any other stress testing utility, you need to make a change in the bios. This could be either dropping the multiplier to a lower factor or increasing the voltage while leaving the multiplier the same. If you change voltage or multiplier at ANY time, you need to start over again at the beginning and verify thermal compliance again.

A more in depth but general guide that is still intended for beginners or those who have had a small amount of experience overclocking can be found here:


*CPU overclocking guide for beginners


Just about anything you need to know about the specifics of overclocking on Z390 can be found here:

https://www.tweaktown.com/guides/8812/gigabyte-z390-9th-gen-oc-guide-vrm-thermal-test/index.html
 
Reactions: tmitch205
Feb 17, 2019
8
0
10
0
First of all, at 87°C you are already 7°C over the recommended maximum temperature for any Intel Core-I processor.

Read the Intel temperature guide.

Intel temperature guide by Computronix

As far as the thermal testing is concerned, Aida is practically useless as a metric for thermal testing as it fails to get anywhere near TDP. This is how I recommend testing for thermal compliance and stability to validate an overclock to a CPU.

Quick and dirty overview of overclocking/stability validation procedure.

Set CPU multiplier and voltage at desired settings in BIOS. Do not use presets or automatic utilities. These will overcompensate on core and other voltages. It is much better to configure most core settings manually, and leave anything left over on auto until a later point in time if wish to come back and tweak settings such as cache (Uncore) frequency, System agent voltage, VCCIO (Internal memory controller) and memory speeds or timings (RAM) AFTER the CPU overclock is fully stable.

Save bios settings (As a new BIOS profile if your bios supports multiple profiles) and exit bios.

Boot into the Windows desktop environment. Download and install Prime95 version 26.6.

Download and install either HWinfo or CoreTemp.

Open HWinfo and run "Sensors only" or open CoreTemp.

Run Prime95 (ONLY version 26.6) and choose the "Small FFT test option". Run this for 15 minutes while monitoring your core/package temperatures to verify that you do not exceed the thermal specifications of your CPU.

(This should be considered to be 80°C for most generations of Intel processor and for current Ryzen CPUs. For older AMD FX and Phenom series, you should use a thermal monitor that has options for "Distance to TJmax" and you want to NOT see distance to TJmax drop below 10°C distance to TJmax. Anything that is MORE than 10°C distance to TJmax is within the allowed thermal envelope.)

If your CPU passes the thermal compliance test, move on to stability.

Download and install Realbench. Run Realbench and choose the Stress test option. Choose a value from the available memory (RAM) options that is equal to approximately half of your installed memory capacity. If you have 16GB, choose 8GB. If you have 8GB, choose 4GB, etc. Click start and allow the stability test to run for 8 hours. Do not plan to use the system for ANYTHING else while it is running. It will run realistic AVX and handbrake workloads and if it passes 8 hours of testing it is probably about as stable as you can reasonably expect.

If you wish to check stability further you can run 12-24 hours of Prime95 Blend mode or Small FFT.

You do not need to simultaneously run HWinfo or CoreTemp while running Realbench as you should have already performed the thermal compliance test PLUS Realbench will show current CPU temperatures while it is running.

If you run the additional stability test using Prime95 Blend/Small FFT modes for 12-24 hours, you will WANT to also run HWinfo alongside it. Monitor HWinfo periodically to verify that no cores/threads are showing less than 100% usage. If it is, then that worker has errored out and the test should be stopped.

If you find there are errors on ANY of the stability tests including Realbench or Prime95, or any other stress testing utility, you need to make a change in the bios. This could be either dropping the multiplier to a lower factor or increasing the voltage while leaving the multiplier the same. If you change voltage or multiplier at ANY time, you need to start over again at the beginning and verify thermal compliance again.

A more in depth but general guide that is still intended for beginners or those who have had a small amount of experience overclocking can be found here:


*CPU overclocking guide for beginners


Just about anything you need to know about the specifics of overclocking on Z390 can be found here:

https://www.tweaktown.com/guides/8812/gigabyte-z390-9th-gen-oc-guide-vrm-thermal-test/index.html
Thank you!!! I will go through all of this with a fine-tooth comb.
 

dshort01

Distinguished
Feb 14, 2006
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I am not a fan of overclocking.........at all. I appreciate the enthusiasm but software just does not take advantage that much of it (my belief). I would look more at your video card or your ssd if you are looking for performance. I would look at your chipset and performance there. Overheating a CPU and then trying to keep it cool is just silly. That is my perspective. Overheating for the sake of a few percentage points is an expensive, frustrating experience which multiplies the complexity of the problem.
 

dshort01

Distinguished
Feb 14, 2006
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0
18,860
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The BIOS on these boards, while the layout is well intentioned, do not make manual over-clocking easy. Anyone have any decent resources concerning overclocking with these boards? I may just be at the limit of my CPU, but I show no throttling and my max temps on any given core are only 87 under an hour stress using AIDA64. I just feel like I can get more out of the CPU but there is something that I am missing.
I know not all people can afford to build a new computer system.... in my opinion over clocking as you will soon find out is a frustrating experience and often introduces complex problems rather than being able to enjoy your computer and software. I would never walk that road.
 

Darkbreeze

Titan
Moderator
He has a 9900k, if you bothered to even read his title or subsequent posts. It doesn't get any newer than that, and it doesn't realistically get any higher end than that either. SO overclocking is about the ONLY way to gain an increase in performance with his configuration and contrary to your belief that overclocking is a waste of time, which is usually expressed by those who are either uncomfortable or clueless about the process in it's entirety, with any system where you already have sufficient aftermarket cooling anyhow, any gains you achieve by overclocking, whether small or sigificant, are essentially "free", so I see no reason EVER to not take advantage of them unless you have a low quality motherboard or insufficient cooling, and so long as you don't push things past the point where the gains are reasonably sustainable without incremental thermal damage and fatigue.

Since you only came here to express your feelings against overclocking, and this is an enthusiast forum where overclocking is often a big part of the "enthusiastic approach" that enthusiasts are known for, perhaps you might be better served to find a nice knitting forum or an anti-overclocking sub-Reddit. LOL. Ok, I'm just kidding, but only sort of.
 
Reactions: chuffedas
Feb 17, 2019
8
0
10
0
He has a 9900k, if you bothered to even read his title or subsequent posts. It doesn't get any newer than that, and it doesn't realistically get any higher end than that either. SO overclocking is about the ONLY way to gain an increase in performance with his configuration and contrary to your belief that overclocking is a waste of time, which is usually expressed by those who are either uncomfortable or clueless about the process in it's entirety, with any system where you already have sufficient aftermarket cooling anyhow, any gains you achieve by overclocking, whether small or sigificant, are essentially "free", so I see no reason EVER to not take advantage of them unless you have a low quality motherboard or insufficient cooling, and so long as you don't push things past the point where the gains are reasonably sustainable without incremental thermal damage and fatigue.

Since you only came here to express your feelings against overclocking, and this is an enthusiast forum where overclocking is often a big part of the "enthusiastic approach" that enthusiasts are known for, perhaps you might be better served to find a nice knitting forum or an anti-overclocking sub-Reddit. LOL. Ok, I'm just kidding, but only sort of.

Thank you for that. I couldn't figure out why be here if you felt that way concerning over-clocking.

It's definitely thermal throttling and not a power issue. I have some options for that... I just need to decide if I want to go that route or be happy with what I can get out of it currently as it sits.
 

Darkbreeze

Titan
Moderator
Where are you reaching a plateau at while still remaining both stable and thermally compliant? Where are you running into a wall?

What are your FULL system specifications including all segments of your cooling configuration? Case, case fans, case fan orientation, CPU cooler, etc.
 

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