ATi trying too hard?

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No, they don't refuse to see the truth. The fact remains that at 25x16 GTX295 has incredible low FPS. You just choose to ignore that resolution because it contradicts your argument. You are like a marketing guy trying to convince everyone that your company's car is wonderful on all terrain, but you fail to tell your customers that on rocky ground your car can tumble and crash. In the mean time the competitor's car is a little slower than yours but it can really say that it is all terrain.
PS. Before contradicting TGGA, please try to be as informed as him. Ooo...wait...you can't...he has some years ahead of you 😛
 


I understand what you're saying (it was well discussed in the DriverHeaven review for Need for Speed Shift and the better performance of the cards despite lower min and avg, but the playing experience was better);

http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews.php?reviewid=855&pageid=11

plus low HD5K dual GPU fps in Res Evil;
http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews.php?reviewid=855&pageid=10

It's not even just avg fps that matters either, because a very high high end with a consistently low and erratic min fps, gives you a good avg, but terrible gameplay. Which is why histograms like [H]'s are best IMO.

However, I think you can agree that in the case of the GTX295, if it's something where avg and minimum are '0' then it doesn't really matter which is which, because THAT SUCKS ! 😉
 


That's not a fact, since 0 is not greater than a positive #, so once again, you fail to disprove his original point which is supported 4 times by the THG review where the GTX295 cannot render a single frame.

Seriously, why you try so hard to support that the GTX295 sucks so much.
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I didn't have to try hard at all, I pretty much grabbed those two reviews out of my sleep, perhaps you should actually try hard next time to come up with a coherent statement that actually has some facts, not claims facts without any support for them. Especially when you go around calling others fanboi when it's so clear you're acting more fanboish than he was.

From the start I posted both poor ATi and poor nV performance, which is nothing new in the multi-GPU realm, even just the CPU overhead of SLi and Xfire are bad, but not necessarily worse than burden of a game, but your ignorance of the possibility just makes your words empty.

The reality is that the GTX295 is still the fastest card out there for almost 10 months!!! and some people refuse to see the truth.
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What does it being the fastest a most things have to do with it sucking at some things, like he mentioned and your seem to refuse to see? It might be the fastest card more often than not, but as more than one review showed, it can also be the slowest card at times, and thus isn't always a good choice, nor offering as consistent performance as a single card.

The only person who consistently refuses to see the truth is you, either because you can't understand what is being said, or you simply don't want to see it out of that fanboi loyalty you accused hallowed of, or maybe you were just alerting people that you were a fanboi, and just didn't make it clear enough so people could ignore you and your 'facts'? :pfff:
 
EDIT: Replying to your previous post.

Oh, absolutely. What I was getting at was a technicality. You can't have a consistently low min FPS because min FPS only refers to a single frame in the whole benchmark run (unless min, avg and max are all identical, which never happens unless you are are rendering with a static scene and camera or not rendering at all :)).

Those [H] graphs, while messy and hard to read, provide the only truly useful information about framerate. Min and max are meaningless as they provide the time taken to render a single frame. Average takes into account the entire dataset but doesn't show how smooth the framerate variation is.
 
They are messy and hard to read because they put like 3-6 comparisons together on one graph so if they all perform in the same range which most of them do it's hard to follow.

if they applied an avg over like 3-5 secs chunks graph it vs accurately displaying every second would make a smoother graph and be easier to read instead of just looking at clusters and estimating slow downs and spikes in game play.
 

2560x1600 is a resolution that a very few people play and nobody cares how a card performer in this resolution. Is like comparing the GTX295 in 800x600 that nobody use and nobody cares. The 1920x1200 is all that matters.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/radeon-hd5870.html
Here is the proof that the GTX295 get higher min fps than every single card on these benchmarks, except at 2560x1600 that nobody cares.

I am not a fanboy I have own many card from nvidia and ati without having any problems. My next card will be the 5870x2 because dual GPU are always ahead of time(with insane speed) but many people will hate the 5870x2(just like the GTX295) because they do not have the money to buy one (and with lame excuses will try to connives them selfless and the others that a single GPU is always better than a dual GPU).

And my argument from the beginning was between dual GPU vs single GPU not nvidia vs ati. Also I didn’t say that ati cards sucks or anything negative. On the other hand you say lies about the GTX295 that it suck…and bla…bla…bla… so that makes you an ATIFanboy. 😉
 
The GTX295 beats all the other cards in rendering a single frame. What a win!

I don't understand your argument. You are saying that NVIDIA has the fastest card, yet the people who are most likely to want the fastest card won't be able to use it because for them it can't even render at a decent framerate? 2560x1600 does matter when you are talking about top end hardware. Sure if we were looking at a GTX275 then fair enough, but we are talking about the most powerful card NVIDIA can sell you, and it can't run at that resolution.
 
It doesn't matter if few people use it. That resolution exists, and some/many high end gamers use it, so it cannot be ignored.

However, i think the problem here is that as you have said many times, that resolution does not matter to you, so to you the GTX295 is the fastest. Fine, I see no problem with that. Just whenever recommending it, we should put "GTX 295 is the fastest single card*"


*Except at resolutions over 2560x1600 and when SLI is not supported and in DX11 (which it cannot do) and only with current drivers.
 
Would anyone voluntarily drop their resolution down? Didnt think so.
OK, since no ones wanting smaller screens, and larger screens are dropping in price, guess what? 25x16 is going to matter more and more, especially at the high end.
Just let me know when Im not making sense here.
OK, so, the 25x16 gets cheaper to own, and gets within reach of alot more users, cards become more powerful, and can use it, tho, as shown, that excludes the 295.
Now, since we know that the 295 cant do this res worth diddy, but the newer ATI cards can, whats so hard to figure out here?
I guess, as you said, some people cant afford 25x16, and have to be a peasent using 19x12
 


In my country we have a saying:
If 1 man tells you are drunk ignore him (me),
If 2 people tell you are drunk think a bit (me+TGGA),
If 3 people tell you are drunk go home and sleep (me+TGGA+randomizer).

 

In my country we have a saying: "who the hell are you and why should I care what you say or think?"
 


Mousemonkey, my reply was not directed to you so I don't expect you to listen to me or any other forum poster if you don't want it. I was expressing my opinion about michael's logic. From what I know this is still a forum which promotes freedom of speech so I guess I will ignore you 😛
 

I didn't feel (nor do I care if) it was.

You fail to appreciate that michael may have a similar saying in whatevever country he harks from. :kaola:

That my friend, is of course your prerogative and I for one will not stand in your way (unless you contravene the ToS of course 😉 ).
 


Once again, you're rejecting it because it doesn't support your lame accusation.
Obviously people care, more than one reviewer tested that resolution, and people read it and took note. so they care enough to record and read it, that's what you call a fact; whether anyone uses that resolution or not outside of reviews would be a supposition unless you studied and researched it, but it's highly likely that number is greater than nobody.
So dismissing it as nobody, means it's not an issue to you or anyone else, as if it weren't an indication of a limitation that the other cards it's being compared to don't posses? Anything that isn't positive for them or doesn't match your theory is something that 'nobody cares about' or 'doesn't matter'; when the G300 version of Fermi launches, if it's performance is poor because of a lack of games that can use it's hardware to it's maximum utility, what's your posts going to be like: 'no one cares about games' ? :heink:

I am not a fanboy I have own many card from nvidia and ati without having any problems.
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Sounds to me like the 'I'm not a racist I have a bunch of Xxxxx people as friends' excuse. :sarcastic:
Perhaps hallowed dragon has to, would that mean you're now going to retract your statement because he owned something like a GF4ti at some point?

My next card will be the 5870x2 because dual GPU are always ahead of time...
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Like the Volari V8 DUO? GF7900GX2 ? :kaola:

And my argument from the beginning was between dual GPU vs single GPU not nvidia vs ati. Also I didn’t say that ati cards sucks or anything negative. On the other hand you say lies about the GTX295 that it suck…and bla…bla…bla… so that makes you an ATIFanboy. 😉
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No if you learn how to read, it's that I say it has performance holes, and that getting low fps, or 0 fps SUCKS!
And then provide examples of both ATi and nV, this generation and last SUCKING.

You misread what he says and call him a fanboi, and then misread what I say and call me a fanboi.
Maybe you should actually read what's being written and then you could see that the problem is with you, not everyone else. :hello:
 


In my country, Soviet Kanukistan, we have a saying: "If you're still arguing, you're not drunk enough !!" [:thegreatgrapeape:3]

This is beginning to sounds like a Yakov Smirnoff joke: "In Russia Interenet Searches You !!"



PS, I was very drunk last night after the Moby concert, so I'm surprised I made sense. Or maybe I'm still drunk and I don't. 😗
 

Well I'm working on a drunken one right (I love friday afternoons 😍 ) now so it's all kinda melding into one for me. :lol:
 
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