Build Advice Best possible build up to 2.5k for multi-tasking, charts, 4 monitors, productivity [No gaming] ?

nate12

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So i am 1 week away for making an order. By now i know a lot(i think) so just want to confirm with you guys and get few more ideas to get best possible setup.

I was told that for my needs i7-12700 is way more than enough and there is no point in going for i9, same with motherboard that z690 should be a pass and i should go with B660. So far i picked B660 Wifi DDR6 Mortar from MSI. Was told its more than enough, no need to go with Tomahawk. Same with DDR5, so far as i understand its really no sense in going for it(even though i dont play to make any changes for few years at least) and that DDR4 will be enough. I was suggested 32 GB 2x 16 with Cl17 3600. After reading a bit i saw some of you saying it might be better to get 3200 with Cl16? Also i noticed i have a very good deal for Kingston Fury Beast 32GB with CL18 and 3600 so actually at this point i am willing to go with 2x32GB for a total of 64. But now is it better to go with Kingston Fury Beast 3600 at CL18 or maybe Patriot Viper Steel 3200 Cl 16, or Fury Best or Renegade also at 3200 CL16. Its all about similar prices here.

SSD i'll go with WDBlack SN850 1TB. I was going to pick Samsung Pro 980 but noticed WDblack is higher basically in all tests and its cheaper here than Samsung.
Water cooling will be SilentiumPC Navis F240, case most likely Bequiet 500DX

Power Supply Seasonic Focus GX650 or 750
. Was told 650 is more than enough but i want it as quiet as possible and maybe its better to get 750 assuming i wont get bad GPU too.

So Main question remains with RAM + power supply. I assume rest is fine but if not of course please let me know. Currently i am using alienware laptop with i7-4700 MQ CPU @2.4 GHZ, 24 GB Ram, Geforce GTX 770 that i bought like 7-8 years ago and its time for a switch.

I am working for home, spending like 10 if not more hours every single day for work and all the other stuff so i want this maching to be best possible. I dont have a cap, if you tell me its not enough and i should go with i9 12900, DDR5 and Z690 i will go for it. But as far as i understand if i go with the above specs its still will be way more than i need and i wont notice any difference with i712700 vs i912900, same with DDR4 vs DDR5. Also was told that for my needs(even though 32GB is more than enough) its more about how much RAM i have, rather than ram speed so just figured that if i go with 64GB i can be set for many years.

I just want as smooth/fast machine possible for what i need for many years and help you very much in advance for all the help.


Budget (including currency): 2000-2500 $. So far i was told 2000 is enough for what i need but i dont have cap here so can stretch if if needed.
Country: Europe
Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: Stock apps, charts, multi tasking on many tabs, 4 monitors. Not really gaming but for the sake of discussion lets cut graphic cards out of this topic I know i dont need a good one but i just want one just in case i decide to play like flight simulator or a new game. I have ps5 for gaming but still want to be able to play something if i decide to. There just will be one, but will focus on that once everything else is set :)
 

Why_Me

Champion
You will be fine with the i7 12700. No idea what country you are located so I'll use the manufacturer's site. I'd go with air cooling as it's quiet and more dependable.

DeepCool AK620
https://global.deepcool.com/products/Cooling/cpuaircoolers/AK620-High-Performance-CPU-Cooler/2021/13067.shtml

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/deepcool-ak620-review

or ...

Scythe Fuma 2 Rev. B
https://www.scytheus.com/fuma2-rev-b


if you plan on doing any gaming at 1080P then I would look at this card.

ASUS TUF Gaming RTX 3060 OC Edition 12GB
 
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Lafong

Respectable
So Main question remains with RAM
There is a price premium for DDR5 over DDR4

How low would that premium have to be for you to go with DDR5?

I don't know about Europe, but I just checked here in the US about an hour ago.

For an MSI Mortar B660 board, the premium is about 30 dollars for a 2 x 8 kit. This is for known compatible Crucial.

I'm not sure how easy it is to find a MSI Mortar B660 DDR5 board. Might be difficult?
 
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nate12

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There is a price premium for DDR5 over DDR4

How low would that premium have to be for you to go with DDR5?

I don't know about Europe, but I just checked here in the US about an hour ago.

For an MSI Mortar B660 board, the premium is about 30 dollars for a 2 x 8 kit. This is for known compatible Crucial.

I'm not sure how easy it is to find a MSI Mortar B660 DDR5 board. Might be difficult?
No problems with getting Mortar B660 with DDR5, 30$ more than DDR4 so its nothing to be fair. Problem comes with DDR5 "sticks" Those are really premium here so even though i would really prefer to go with DDR5 motherboard and ram just for the sake of having it and no need for change in future, i think its better for me to go with DDR4 but 64GB and then in future still have option to go for another 64 DDR4 instead of looking for DDR5.

with DDR5 i think there is no point in going for 4800 and 5600 CL40 2x16GB cost more that i would pay for 64GB DDR4 in all the below options.

Will more than 32GB be used? At my current laptop i have 24 and its getting really slow. If i go with DDR4 its a no problem to get 2x32, prices are really fine. If DDR5 than its more like 2x16 for now.

Also another question as posted and of course IF you say "go with DDR4" should i go with 3600 CL18 or 3200 CL16. Basically got just Kingston Beast with 3600 CL18 but 3 options with Kingston Beast , Renegade and Patriot Viper Steel with 3200 CL16.
 

nate12

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You will be fine with the i7 12700. No idea what country you are located so I'll use the manufacturer's site. I'd go with air cooling as it's quiet and more dependable.

DeepCool AK620
https://global.deepcool.com/products/Cooling/cpuaircoolers/AK620-High-Performance-CPU-Cooler/2021/13067.shtml

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/deepcool-ak620-review

or ...

Scythe Fuma 2 Rev. B
https://www.scytheus.com/fuma2-rev-b


[/URL]
Well somehow i was locked on that water cooling from Silentium PC Navis F240 but You are another person saying that air one will be more quiet and as mentioned i want it to be like that.

Why Rev. B option? I have 2 here, Scythe Fuma 2 and Scythe Fuma 2 Rev.B. The first one is more expensive, Rev.B is cheaper.
 
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Why_Me

Champion
Well somehow i was locked on that water cooling from Silentium PC Navis F240 but You are another person saying that air one will be more quiet and as mentioned i want it to be like that.

Why Rev. B option? Can i go with Regular Fuma 2 instead?
You can't go wrong with either one although I believe the Scythe will be the quieter of the two but not by much.
 

KyaraM

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Mar 11, 2022
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So i am 1 week away for making an order. By now i know a lot(i think) so just want to confirm with you guys and get few more ideas to get best possible setup.

I was told that for my needs i7-12700 is way more than enough and there is no point in going for i9, same with motherboard that z690 should be a pass and i should go with B660. So far i picked B660 Wifi DDR6 Mortar from MSI. Was told its more than enough, no need to go with Tomahawk. Same with DDR5, so far as i understand its really no sense in going for it(even though i dont play to make any changes for few years at least) and that DDR4 will be enough. I was suggested 32 GB 2x 16 with Cl17 3600. After reading a bit i saw some of you saying it might be better to get 3200 with Cl16? Also i noticed i have a very good deal for Kingston Fury Beast 32GB with CL18 and 3600 so actually at this point i am willing to go with 2x32GB for a total of 64. But now is it better to go with Kingston Fury Beast 3600 at CL18 or maybe Patriot Viper Steel 3200 Cl 16, or Fury Best or Renegade also at 3200 CL16. Its all about similar prices here.

SSD i'll go with WDBlack SN850 1TB. I was going to pick Samsung Pro 980 but noticed WDblack is higher basically in all tests and its cheaper here than Samsung.
Water cooling will be SilentiumPC Navis F240, case most likely Bequiet 500DX

Power Supply Seasonic Focus GX650 or 750
. Was told 650 is more than enough but i want it as quiet as possible and maybe its better to get 750 assuming i wont get bad GPU too.

So Main question remains with RAM + power supply. I assume rest is fine but if not of course please let me know. Currently i am using alienware laptop with i7-4700 MQ CPU @2.4 GHZ, 24 GB Ram, Geforce GTX 770 that i bought like 7-8 years ago and its time for a switch.

I am working for home, spending like 10 if not more hours every single day for work and all the other stuff so i want this maching to be best possible. I dont have a cap, if you tell me its not enough and i should go with i9 12900, DDR5 and Z690 i will go for it. But as far as i understand if i go with the above specs its still will be way more than i need and i wont notice any difference with i712700 vs i912900, same with DDR4 vs DDR5. Also was told that for my needs(even though 32GB is more than enough) its more about how much RAM i have, rather than ram speed so just figured that if i go with 64GB i can be set for many years.

I just want as smooth/fast machine possible for what i need for many years and help you very much in advance for all the help.


Budget (including currency): 2000-2500 $. So far i was told 2000 is enough for what i need but i dont have cap here so can stretch if if needed.
Country: Europe
Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: Stock apps, charts, multi tasking on many tabs, 4 monitors. Not really gaming but for the sake of discussion lets cut graphic cards out of this topic I know i dont need a good one but i just want one just in case i decide to play like flight simulator or a new game. I have ps5 for gaming but still want to be able to play something if i decide to. There just will be one, but will focus on that once everything else is set :)
Don't go 4×16GB if you can't help it, as others said, 2×32GB is ideal for the controller.

About DDR5, it's still exorbitantly expensive and not worth it. For example, slow DDR5 RAM where I live, so 4800 with crappy timings, costs 120€ fot the 16GB kit. 4800 with better timings is already achievable wit DDR4, and that will likely be a lot faster, too. You would be looking for 450+€ for decent 64GB DDR5 5600 RAM, which is ridiculous. Just don't tbh. For the RAM Kits you listed, they are about the same speed really when factoring in latencies, but 3600 would still be slightly better. Depending on cost, if prices aren't too different, I would go with the 3600 kit, if one is massively cheaper than the others, take that. Another good and probably cheaper option would be Corsair LPX, btw. I got those in 32GB DDR4 3600 CL18, they are really good. What do you need 64GB for, btw? 32GB should work fine and is quite cheap nowadays.

That leads me to, what exactly are those stock apps? Office? More? Are you programming, video encoding, or performing other tasks that need many threads? If not, you might be able to get a smaller CPU. A 12400 still has 6 cores, which would be enough for office and multi-tasking.

About the board, are you sure you even need that MSI Mortar, or might an MSI Pro B660M-A be enough already? It's cheaper and one of the best B660 on the market. I would also reconsider water cooling. That CPU would do fine with a Dark Rock Pro 4 or NH-D15 or probably even smaller air cooler. A Fuma as mentioned above works, too. I know a 12700k that runs with a Pure Rock 2...

Your SSD is an excellent pick, I got the same one.

PSU, I think it's a good unit. Honestly, though, I wouldn't overdimension on the base of noise levels. Never noticed a PSU fan and other components are potentially louder anyways. Using BeQuiet! PSUs, though, so that might play a part as well.

What resolution are you planning to use? Also, sorry if this is an intrusive question, but what country in Europe are we talking? Prices differ even here and there are sometimes pretty good offers in certain shops. For example, I've been buying from Mindfactory.de for years since they have good prices, among the best in Germany. They also have pretty nice deals on certain GPUs currently, for example
https://www.mindfactory.de/product_info.php/12GB-MSI-GeForce-RTX-3060-Gaming-X--Retail-_1399584.html
Or
https://www.mindfactory.de/product_info.php/8GB-XFX-Radeon-RX-6600-SWFT210-Core-Gaming-DDR6-3xDP-HDMI--Retail-_1428682.html
And others, at times as much as 100€ below the next cheapest offer. Only seem to deliver to German addresses, though. Especially the Radeon card is really nicely priced.
 

nate12

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You can't go wrong with either one although I believe the Scythe will be the quieter of the two but not by much.
But i saw that Rev.B is newer and its weird as Regular Fuma 2 without Rev.B is more expensive. Rev. B is simply cheaper here so is there any significant difference?
 

nate12

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About DDR5, it's still exorbitantly expensive and not worth it. For example, slow DDR5 RAM where I live, so 4800 with crappy timings, costs 120€ fot the 16GB kit. 4800 with better timings is already achievable wit DDR4, and that will likely be a lot faster, too. You would be looking for 450+€ for decent 64GB DDR5 5600 RAM, which is ridiculous. Just don't tbh. For the RAM Kits you listed, they are about the same speed really when factoring in latencies, but 3600 would still be slightly better. Depending on cost, if prices aren't too different, I would go with the 3600 kit, if one is massively cheaper than the others, take that. Another good and probably cheaper option would be Corsair LPX, btw. I got those in 32GB DDR4 3600 CL18, they are really good. What do you need 64GB for, btw? 32GB should work fine and is quite cheap nowadays.
Poland and yea i noticed some GPU's were better priced in Germany. But want to stay away from GPU as it takes all the action and want to focus on the rest of the build first :)

I have 24GB in my laptop, its not fast anymore and i am not getting DDR5 so to feel better i am awarding myself with 2x32. Having this bundles in very similar prices, but have no idea which one to pick :

Patriot Viper Steel 3600 CL18
Patriot Viper 4 Blackout 3600 CL18
Kingston Fury Beast 3600 CL18
Kingston Fury Beast 3200 CL16
Kingston Fury Renegade 3200 CL16
G Skill RipJaws 3200 Cl 16
G Skill RipJaws 3600 Cl18

G Skill maybe a little bit more expensive. Patriots the cheapest ones out of this list. You said you would go with 3600 but is there any difference at all between those or should i just pick the best deal i have for either Patriot, Kingston or G Skill.
 

KyaraM

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Poland and yea i noticed some GPU's were better priced in Germany. But want to stay away from GPU as it takes all the action and want to focus on the rest of the build first :)

I have 24GB in my laptop, its not fast anymore and i am not getting DDR5 so to feel better i am awarding myself with 2x32. Having this bundles in very similar prices, but have no idea which one to pick :

Patriot Viper Steel 3600 CL18
Patriot Viper 4 Blackout 3600 CL18
Kingston Fury Beast 3600 CL18
Kingston Fury Beast 3200 CL16
Kingston Fury Renegade 3200 CL16
G Skill RipJaws 3200 Cl 16
G Skill RipJaws 3600 Cl18

G Skill maybe a little bit more expensive. Patriots the cheapest ones out of this list. You said you would go with 3600 but is there any difference at all between those or should i just pick the best deal i have for either Patriot, Kingston or G Skill.
3600 RAM will be a tiny bit faster at same latencies (both 3200 cl16 and 3600 cl18 have latencies of 10ns), but you are unlikely to notice since both are very fast already. Which is why I said get the cheapest. Still, if prices are the same, as I said, get 3600.
 
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nate12

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You can't go wrong with either one although I believe the Scythe will be the quieter of the two but not by much.
Well i will go with the air cooling then, but just last question. When i started to read about this Scythe i noticed that Dark Rock 4 Pro be Quiet is on the top and here its the same price as this Scythe. Isint it better to go with Dark Rock 4?

@Lafong at 2.22 they say few differences. Still weird to me its cheaper than the old one :)
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bM_TgpKqb8



3600 RAM will be a tiny bit faster at same latencies (both 3200 cl16 and 3600 cl18 have latencies of 10ns), but you are unlikely to notice since both are very fast already. Which is why I said get the cheapest. Still, if prices are the same, as I said, get 3600.
But if its 3600, is there any difference if its Patriot or Kingston for example?
 
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KyaraM

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Well i will go with the air cooling then, but just last question. When i started to read about this Scythe i noticed that Dark Rock 4 Pro be Quiet is on the top and here its the same price as this Scythe. Isint it better to go with Dark Rock 4?

@Lafong at 2.22 they say few differences. Still weird to me its cheaper than the old one :)
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bM_TgpKqb8





But if its 3600, is there any difference if its Patriot or Kingston for example?
The Dark Rock Pro 4 is indeed the better option if you can grab it at the same price.

RAM: I'm not sure about that. Probably best to read a review of them, preferably where they are directly compared. Give me a couple minutes and I can see if I find one.

EDIT: not so easy finding something, but I found a comparison. It's in German, but I think you can at least look at the graphs:
https://gamezoom.net/artikel/Kingston_FURY_Beast_RGB_DIMM_Kit_64GB_DDR4_3600_Test_Review-49668-2
According to this, the Kingston RAM would be minimally better but the difference is so small its essentially within margin of error. Get the cheaper, unless someone else has a reason to recommend one or the other. Tests don't say anything about durability etc. after all...
 
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Lafong

Respectable
Isint it better to go with Dark Rock 4?
What is "better"??

Lower temperatures?

Lower noise?

At what cost?

At what weight of the cooler?

In what case?

According to what "authority"?

What if you are wrong and whatever you buy turns out to be "not better" according to some link?

Do you curse yourself for that "poor" decision?

Are you willing to research for 200 more hours or 2 more hours?

Etc etc etc ad infinitum.

It's unending. To what avail?
 
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nate12

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What is "better"??

Lower temperatures?

Lower noise?

At what cost?

At what weight of the cooler?

In what case?

According to what "authority"?

What if you are wrong and whatever you buy turns out to be "not better" according to some link?

Do you curse yourself for that "poor" decision?

Are you willing to research for 200 more hours or 2 more hours?

Etc etc etc ad infinitum.

It's unending. To what avail?
I'd say lower temperatures and mainly lower noise. I just saw few reviews including the one from the link i posted above saying how good Scythe Fume 2 is but there i noticed that in all tests Dark Rock 4 was in the first place. Then i checked prices and it is exactly same as Scythe Fume 2 here.
 

Lafong

Respectable
I'd say lower temperatures and mainly lower noise.
I read that as wanting both.

Regardless of your cooler choice........

If noise is a factor, you will have to compromise between temps and noise.

Pick your poison.

Fans will become increasingly audible as you climb above 1000 rpm.

If you cannot stand temp X, then you increase fan speed.

If you cannot stand noise Y, then you increase temps by slowing fans.

Some people would have an aneurysm at 70 temp. Is that you?

Some CPU cooler fans can spin as low as 500 rpm. Some cannot. I have no idea about the fans on your prospective choices.

Are you the type who can say "that's pretty good, I can live with that"? Or will you be second-guessing yourself endlessly? Perfectionist tendencies?

You can't accurately judge what you will experience until you assemble the parts....despite links, despite reviews, despite what someone tells you here or elsewhere. Your case, your case fans, your personal tolerances all come into play.
 

KyaraM

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I read that as wanting both.

Regardless of your cooler choice........

If noise is a factor, you will have to compromise between temps and noise.

Pick your poison.

Fans will become increasingly audible as you climb above 1000 rpm.

If you cannot stand temp X, then you increase fan speed.

If you cannot stand noise Y, then you increase temps by slowing fans.

Some people would have an aneurysm at 70 temp. Is that you?

Some CPU cooler fans can spin as low as 500 rpm. Some cannot. I have no idea about the fans on your prospective choices.

Are you the type who can say "that's pretty good, I can live with that"? Or will you be second-guessing yourself endlessly? Perfectionist tendencies?

You can't accurately judge what you will experience until you assemble the parts....despite links, despite reviews, despite what someone tells you here or elsewhere. Your case, your case fans, your personal tolerances all come into play.
They produce around the same noise levels. Since the Pro is slightly better at cooling, it will run slightly quieter at the same temperatures, too. I don't know why you have to be like this, though... it sounds as if you feel personally insulted and I got no clue why.
 

geofelt

Titan
Tell me about the 4 monitors.
You will not be able to manage them with integrated graphics.
As a suggestion, look into a single large screen like the LG 48" 4k OLED units.
You can size and place many charts as you wish. There are 55" and larger if you want.
A single large monitor relieves desk mounting issues.
While that would work with the hdmi on most motherboards, I would still suggest a 3000 series card like theRTX3050 which will have hdmi 2.1 that can refresh the LG mentioned at 120hz.

For trading apps, you want sufficient ram to hold all of the apps you have running.
I would imagine that 32 gb in a 2 x 16gb kit would be fine.
But, since budget is not an issue, get a 2 x 32gb ram kit.
Intel 12th gen is dual channel only so a 2 stick kit is appropriate.
If you want more, you need to look at a 4 x 32gb kit.
Ram speed makes a difference, as does timings.
But, I think those factors are secondary to having sufficient enough to keep all active apps resident.
My guess would be 3600 speed is about the sweet spot.
Usually, cas 18 is what you find, but cas 16 is a tad better.
Cas 14 and 15 are out there, but I would spend the money elsewhere.
Pick low profile ram to clear a good air cooler.
Corsair lpx for example.

On performance, look for the best single thread performance.
That is what makes your apps responsive.
If money is not an issue, and you use this to make a living, the best available processor out there will be the I9-12900KS.
Here is a listing of the single thread performance of a number of processors:
http://valid.x86.fr/bench/wns60f
I might suggest the I5-12500

Look at the max turbo capabilities of the candidate processors.
Turbo happens when conditions of load and cooling permit.
Namely a few active threads, and a cpu temperature of 70c.

To get best cooling, I would buy a more airflow friendly case.
I might suggest something like the Lian Li Air mini.
It comes with two front 140mm fans that can move a large amount of air quietly.
It has 170mm height available which lets you use a tall dual tower air cooler like the Noctua NH-D15s.

On the m.2 ssd, there is less difference in performance than you might imagine.
We do things one at a time in small bursts. Most ssd's will appear to you to be the same performance.
I think I would use a samsung 970 evo+ of sufficient size.
Samsung is highly regarded by puget systems for reliability:
 
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nate12

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On performance, look for the best single thread performance.
That is what makes your apps responsive.
If money is not an issue, and you use this to make a living, the best available processor out there will be the I9-12900KS.
Here is a listing of the single thread performance of a number of processors:
http://valid.x86.fr/bench/wns60f
I might suggest the I5-12500
This is interesting. Might be stupid question but may i ask why there is no regular 12700 version? Same with 12900. Just K and KF and that should be better as far as i am aware or results are same/similar here?

I used to think about F version but with no price difference i thought its better to have one with integrated card just in case GPU fails. Of course i am assuming its 1:1 other than that.

The problem with i9-12900 is that from what i understand(even even though i would want one) is that i7-12700 is more than enough. Kind of feel like getting a same spec BMW with 12700 mark on the back vs 12900 one with everything same inside and outside but maximum speed lets say 300 km/h in 12900 while 12700 is capped at 250 km/h. So its like paying premium for a sign on the back and possibility of driving with higher speed even though i wont ever reach more than 220km/h.

So i can afford it, but from what i understand i will never get any benefit from having it.
 

geofelt

Titan
There are i7-12700 and i9-12900 processors made; they may not be sold as much.
The main distinction is that the K suffix processors can be overclocked, and they natively have slightly higher maximum turbo limits.
For example, the i7-12700 has a max turbo of 4.9 while the I7-12700K has a max of 5.0

I very much agree that a non F suffix is the way to go.
The small price premium is cheap insurance so you can keep running if you have a discrete gpu issue.

There is a graded spectrum of single thread performance along the entire 12th gen line.
Even the I3-12100 with a turbo of 4.3 would likely do the job for you.
Pick your price point.

I have found that when deciding between two products that I have fewer regrets paying more for the better option. When I buy the lesser option, I tend to second guess myself longer.
 
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nate12

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Can you guys tell me a little bit more about cooling? I know Fuma 2 and Dark Rock Pro 4 are both great ones whatever pick here is but to be fair before i heard about it i was willing to go with water cooling SilentiumPC Navis F240 ARGB because i think it looks better but also i heard that when it comes to perfomance/cooling/silence it beats both Fuma 2 and Dak Rock Pro4. The only difference would be with how long it will last as such Dark Rock Pro would probably be fine for many many years while water cooling might have to be replaced after few.

Can you give me some thoughts here please? All 3, Fuma 2, Dark Rock Pro 4 and this water cooling SIlentium Pc Navis F240 are priced exactly same. No difference.
 

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