Bogus ESA notices, anyone?

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Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

The ESA (some entertainment software group) just sent me a hilariously stupid
email threatening me over the existence of a file named "Doom3.zip" on an
ifarchive mirror.

Nevermind that it's a DOS game from the dawn of time. They're worried that
it may infringe on someone's copyrights. (I don't think they even said
whose!)

Anyone else get these?

Anyone have any useful clues, or contacts either at iD (I assume they think
it's the recent Doom 3 release) or at the ESA?

-s
--
Copyright 2004, all wrongs reversed. Peter Seebach / seebs@plethora.net
http://www.seebs.net/log/ - YA blog. http://www.seebs.net/ - homepage.
C/Unix wizard, pro-commerce radical, spam fighter. Boycott Spamazon!
Consulting, computers, web hosting, and shell access: http://www.plethora.net/
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

In article <4136bcbd$0$430$3c090ad1@news.plethora.net>, Seebs wrote:
> The ESA (some entertainment software group) just sent me a hilariously stupid
> email threatening me over the existence of a file named "Doom3.zip" on an
> ifarchive mirror.

Ouch, got by a perl script with a law degree?

> Nevermind that it's a DOS game from the dawn of time. They're worried that
> it may infringe on someone's copyrights. (I don't think they even said
> whose!)

The games in question were originally commercial and were rewritten in
Inform by the same author. It looks likely that the email address given
is still valid: the author, Peter Killworth, still has a webpage at
Southampton University:

<http://www.soc.soton.ac.uk/JRD/PROC/people/pki/index.php> is his webpage,
and <http://www.soc.soton.ac.uk/JRD/PROC/people/pki/soft.html> has the
same games available for download.

The games were originally released by Topologika: they still exist at
<http://www.topologika.co.uk>, but I strongly doubt that they would be
still interested in them.

HTH,
Andrew.
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

In rec.arts.int-fiction, Seebs <seebs@plethora.net> wrote:
> The ESA (some entertainment software group) just sent me a hilariously stupid
> email threatening me over the existence of a file named "Doom3.zip" on an
> ifarchive mirror.
>
> Nevermind that it's a DOS game from the dawn of time. They're worried that
> it may infringe on someone's copyrights. (I don't think they even said
> whose!)
>
> Anyone else get these?

Interestingly, not me.

Feel free to ignore such notices. If they can't figure out how to send
them to me, they're not submitting a meaningful Archive complaint.

--Z

"And Aholibamah bare Jeush, and Jaalam, and Korah: these were the borogoves..."
*
* Make your vote count. Get your vote counted.
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

In article <ch77vq$is6$1@reader1.panix.com>,
Andrew Plotkin <erkyrath@eblong.com> wrote:
>Feel free to ignore such notices. If they can't figure out how to send
>them to me, they're not submitting a meaningful Archive complaint.

Ironically, their "confidentiality" agreement would actually PROHIBIT you from
removing them from the archive based on the complaint sent to me. I've called
these people, and written about this in my blog.

So far, no luck. When you ask for the guy who supposedly sent the email, you
get transferred to some other guy's voicemail. First time through, it
wouldn't take a message over about 5 seconds. Second time, I did successfully
leave a message, I think. No response. I also prodded the voicemail system,
and discovered that the guy who supposedly sent the email DOES have an entry
in the company directory. So, if I don't hear back tomorrow morning, I'm
gonna call, bounce around the voice mail system, and leave him a voicemail.

These people are wasting my time with their incompetence, and I want to find
out what they're smoking.

-s
--
Copyright 2004, all wrongs reversed. Peter Seebach / seebs@plethora.net
http://www.seebs.net/log/ - YA blog. http://www.seebs.net/ - homepage.
C/Unix wizard, pro-commerce radical, spam fighter. Boycott Spamazon!
Consulting, computers, web hosting, and shell access: http://www.plethora.net/
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

In rec.arts.int-fiction Seebs <seebs@plethora.net> wrote:

> These people are wasting my time with their incompetence, and I want to find
> out what they're smoking.

I'm a fan of charging wankers like this hefty consulting fees.

--
David Griffith
dgriffi@cs.csbuak.edu <-- Switch the 'b' and 'u'
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

On vendredi 3 Septembre 2004 03:16, Seebs wrote:
>
> These people are wasting my time with their incompetence, and I
> want to find out what they're smoking.

Oh, by the way, on your blog you wrote: "Impressive, this modern
technology, that manages to crunch a modern game down to 114k
(...)"

Be impressed 🙂
http://www.theprodukkt.com/kkrieger.html

--
spam.bucket@free.fr
You have my name and my hostname: you can mail me.
(Put a period between my first and last names).
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

On jeudi 2 Septembre 2004 08:25, Seebs wrote:
>
> The ESA (some entertainment software group) just sent me a
> hilariously stupid email threatening me over the existence of a
> file named "Doom3.zip" on an ifarchive mirror.

It's on Slashdot, now.
http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/09/03/1730232

(I hope you'll survive the raise in hosting fees.)

--
spam.bucket@free.fr
You have my name and my hostname: you can mail me.
(Put a period between my first and last names).
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

Andrew Hunter wrote:
>>The ESA (some entertainment software group) just sent me a hilariously stupid
>>email threatening me over the existence of a file named "Doom3.zip" on an
>>ifarchive mirror.
>
>>Nevermind that it's a DOS game from the dawn of time. They're worried that
>>it may infringe on someone's copyrights. (I don't think they even said
>>whose!)
>
>
> The games in question were originally commercial and were rewritten in
> Inform by the same author. It looks likely that the email address given
> is still valid: the author, Peter Killworth, still has a webpage at
> Southampton University:
[ahem, Southampton Oceanography Centre actually. I'm not a member of the
University...]

>
> <http://www.soc.soton.ac.uk/JRD/PROC/people/pki/index.php> is his webpage,
> and <http://www.soc.soton.ac.uk/JRD/PROC/people/pki/soft.html> has the
> same games available for download.
>

And, more interestingly, they didn't contact me - the author!
Anyway, the inform versions are MUCH better than the old ones. And I
hold the copyright, which reverted from Topologika. So there.

Cheers,
Peter K.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Prof. Peter D. Killworth, James Rennell Division for Ocean Circulation
and Climate, Southampton Oceanography Centre, Empress Dock, Southampton
SO14 3ZH, England.
Tel: +44 (0)23-80596202 Fax: +44 (0)23-80596204
Email: P.Killworth@soc.soton.ac.uk
Web: http://www.soc.soton.ac.uk/JRD/PROC/people/pki/
Editor, Ocean Modelling: http://www.elsevier.com/locate/ocemod/
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

In article <414183B5.2020507@soc.soton.ac.uk>,
Peter Killworth <P.Killworth@soc.soton.ac.uk> wrote:
>And, more interestingly, they didn't contact me - the author!
>Anyway, the inform versions are MUCH better than the old ones. And I
>hold the copyright, which reverted from Topologika. So there.

Well, the assumption is that this is just a very stupid script which found
the name "Doom3.zip".

Anyway, I'm going to be trying to contact them again next week. On Tuesday,
I was told that Jason Allen (the guy who actually does the phone calls) was
out of the office sick; "Robert L. Hunter IV", the guy whose name is on the
letters, is the head of the department, but doesn't take calls. So... Mr.
Allen hasn't bothered to return my call. I'll try again Monday.

-s
--
Copyright 2004, all wrongs reversed. Peter Seebach / seebs@plethora.net
http://www.seebs.net/log/ - YA blog. http://www.seebs.net/ - homepage.
C/Unix wizard, pro-commerce radical, spam fighter. Boycott Spamazon!
Consulting, computers, web hosting, and shell access: http://www.plethora.net/
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

seebs@plethora.net (Seebs), you wrote on 02 Sep 2004 06:25:01 GMT:

>The ESA (some entertainment software group) just sent me a hilariously stupid
>email threatening me over the existence of a file named "Doom3.zip" on an
>ifarchive mirror.
>
>Nevermind that it's a DOS game from the dawn of time. They're worried that
>it may infringe on someone's copyrights. (I don't think they even said
>whose!)
>
>Anyone else get these?

The Entertainment Software Association (formerly IDSA) is an
organisation representing computer game publishers. (Feel represented
yet?) They are well-known for sending both founded and unfounded
take-down notices. For instance, they will send a (DMCA) take-down
notice to the ISP of a site that carries games they cannot possibly
believe to be legal. The owner of the site will then have to start
negotiations with the ESA (which, according to
<http://www.back2roots.org/News/News/238/>, they will not enter into),
or hope to have an ISP with rock hard balls.

ESA is clearly leveraging the force of what is, IMHO, a Very Bad Law,
but it is the law nonetheless. The DMCA seems to have made barratry
legal in the digital domain of the US.

From their Members page: "The ESA acts as the spokesperson for the
industry as a whole, working proactively to communicate positive
messages about the industry, while at the same time aggressively
working to correct the myths and falsehoods that are sometimes
perpetuated about the industry."

Ah well.

--
Real Men Don't Need Anaesthetics
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

seebs@plethora.net (Seebs) wrote:

> In article <414183B5.2020507@soc.soton.ac.uk>,
> Peter Killworth <P.Killworth@soc.soton.ac.uk> wrote:
> >And, more interestingly, they didn't contact me - the author!
> >Anyway, the inform versions are MUCH better than the old ones. And I
> >hold the copyright, which reverted from Topologika. So there.
>
> Well, the assumption is that this is just a very stupid script which found
> the name "Doom3.zip".
>
> Anyway, I'm going to be trying to contact them again next week. On Tuesday,
> I was told that Jason Allen (the guy who actually does the phone calls) was
> out of the office sick; "Robert L. Hunter IV", the guy whose name is on the
> letters, is the head of the department, but doesn't take calls. So... Mr.
> Allen hasn't bothered to return my call. I'll try again Monday.

Surely such frivolous claims count as harassment, or even libel, in your
country? They can't seriously think that that file is the real Doom 3;
they're just being litigious bastards for no better reason than that
they can't be arsed to think before they threaten. Not wise, methinks.
Especially not from a publicity POV...

Richard
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

rlb@hoekstra-uitgeverij.nl (Richard Bos), you wrote on Mon, 13 Sep
2004 23:26:00 GMT:

>Surely such frivolous claims count as harassment, or even libel, in your
>country? They can't seriously think that that file is the real Doom 3;
>they're just being litigious bastards for no better reason than that
>they can't be arsed to think before they threaten. Not wise, methinks.
>Especially not from a publicity POV...

IANAL, but I think for libel the ESA need to publish their accusation,
and for harassment (barratry) they need to file charges. That is why I
said that with the DMCA, harassment has become legal in the US digital
domain: you now don't need to start a law suit to get the same effect.
(Even more: if they'd start a lawsuit, you could countersue--since
they don't, the DMCA reaches even further than it could as a strictly
legal instrument.)

--
Real Men Don't Need Anaesthetics
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

In article <41462bb6.20096203@news.individual.net>,
Richard Bos <rlb@hoekstra-uitgeverij.nl> wrote:
>Surely such frivolous claims count as harassment, or even libel, in your
>country? They can't seriously think that that file is the real Doom 3;
>they're just being litigious bastards for no better reason than that
>they can't be arsed to think before they threaten. Not wise, methinks.
>Especially not from a publicity POV...

According to the guy I talked to, every claim is reviewed, but he also says
they make hundreds of thousands of claims a month. Conclusion: They are not
reviewed CAREFULLY.

-s
--
Copyright 2004, all wrongs reversed. Peter Seebach / seebs@plethora.net
http://www.seebs.net/log/ - YA blog. http://www.seebs.net/ - homepage.
C/Unix wizard, pro-commerce radical, spam fighter. Boycott Spamazon!
Consulting, computers, web hosting, and shell access: http://www.plethora.net/
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

"Peter Killworth" <P.Killworth@soc.soton.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:414183B5.2020507@soc.soton.ac.uk...
> And, more interestingly, they didn't contact me - the author!

Correct me if I'm missing something here, but doesn't that make it illegal?
I mean, the notice claims, and I quote here, that "under penalty of purgery
we reprisent the copyright holder..." Unlike half the users of Slashdot, I
understand that this means the holder of the copyright that is supposedly
being infringed as opposed to the copyright of the "infringing" program. But
if they never even contacted the creator of the games before sending the
notice out, taht can hardly be called representing the copyright holder, can
it? So isn't that procicutable under purgery? What am I missing, here?



--
Why settle for the lesser evil? Cthulhu for president!
 
Archived from groups: rec.arts.int-fiction,rec.games.int-fiction (More info?)

In article <10kjue1n7kqhr31@corp.supernews.com>,
James Bond <wildblinker007@hotmail.com> wrote:
>"Peter Killworth" <P.Killworth@soc.soton.ac.uk> wrote in message
>news:414183B5.2020507@soc.soton.ac.uk...
>> And, more interestingly, they didn't contact me - the author!
>
>Correct me if I'm missing something here, but doesn't that make it illegal?
>I mean, the notice claims, and I quote here, that "under penalty of purgery
>we reprisent the copyright holder..." Unlike half the users of Slashdot, I
>understand that this means the holder of the copyright that is supposedly
>being infringed as opposed to the copyright of the "infringing" program. But
>if they never even contacted the creator of the games before sending the
>notice out, taht can hardly be called representing the copyright holder, can
>it? So isn't that procicutable under purgery? What am I missing, here?

They represent iD software, whose works they *believe* to be infringed.

The claim made under penalty of perjury is that they represent "the holder of
copyright in the work we claim has been infringed".

-s
--
Copyright 2004, all wrongs reversed. Peter Seebach / seebs@plethora.net
http://www.seebs.net/log/ - YA blog. http://www.seebs.net/ - homepage.
C/Unix wizard, pro-commerce radical, spam fighter. Boycott Spamazon!
Consulting, computers, web hosting, and shell access: http://www.plethora.net/
 
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