Question Bottleneck query: i3-8100 and RTX 4070 ?

[letsrock53]

Hi, currently gaming on a Dell 22 inch monitor with 1680 X 1050 resolution (i3-8100, GTX 1060 6GB ,32GB RAM, Corsair CX550M PSU).
I am thinking of taking things a notch up by upgrading to a 27 inch 1440p monitor and consequently, an RTX 4070. How much of a bottleneck I will be looking at?

The games I like to play are graphically intensive (The Witcher 3, Red Dead Redemption 2...), but not very fast paced FPSes.

 

[zx128k]

Think of it like this.
If you have a Ferrari with old wheels, the engine will still be the same.
The engine is not being 'bottlenecked'. The engine will perform the same no matter the wheels. The engine being your GPU and the CPU being your wheels.
Yes, getting a better CPU will maximize performance on the road. But the wheels on your Ferrari are not bottlenecking your engine.

Know the cpu controls the number of frames being sent to the GPU. The GPU just renders the frames the cpu sends. So a slow i3 CPU wont give maximum performance with say a 4090. The other issue is the game does more than render frames. This also reduces the amount of frames the cpu can send to the gpu. This caps maximum fps. Memory bandwidth and latency also matter. You can get almost 800 points more in time spy cpu by just having 4xdimms or DS memory.

 

[zx128k]

I lack technical knowledge to give high quality answer.
I just know I have seen it people talk about it over the years.
Plus zx128 answered you.
What he said sounds very familiar.
Probably what I was hearing about throughout the years.

Both points of view are valid. Its just a matter of ideology. How you see the benefits of the upgrade, thus this is just an arguement and desn't help the OP in anyway.

Basically anyone that builds a PC wont pair a 8100 with a 4070 because there is lost value. This with poor RAM speed and likely a hard disk. Will defeat the whole benefit of a faster GPU.

He will just not get full benefits from the gpu upgrade. In economics this would be stupid because return is not maximised. Also costs are increased. He has possible profit there untapped.

 

[USAFRet]

I just know I have seen it people talk about it over the years.

And often, people talk a lot of junk.

 

[kizo]

And often, people talk a lot of

And often, people talk a lot of junk.

True I guess.
But I have experienced it myself in Fallout New Vegas that lacks modern features like RT and whatnot to lower the massive bottleneck.

 

[USAFRet]

True I guess.
But I have experienced it myself in Fallout New Vegas that lacks modern features like RT and whatnot to lower the massive bottleneck.

And chasing a lower "bottleneck" is not the proper metric.
Instead, you want to be chasing better performance.

It is entirely possible, even likely, to have a higher "bottleneck" (however you measure that) and higher performance at the same time.


Good luck ...

 

[kizo]

Both points of view are valid. Its just a matter of ideology. How you see the benefits of the upgrade, thus this is just an arguement and desn't help the OP in anyway.

Basically anyone that builds a PC wont pair a 8100 with a 4070 because there is lost value. This with poor RAM speed and likely a hard disk. Will defeat the whole benefit of a faster GPU.

He will just not get full benefits from the gpu upgrade. In economics this would be stupid because return is not maximised. Also costs are increased. He has possible profit there untapped.

True.
Ok places to be

 

[zx128k]

True I guess.
But I have experienced it myself in Fallout New Vegas that lacks modern features like RT and whatnot to lower the massive bottleneck.

With Witcher 3 its not as much of a problem because of the system requirements.

System Requirements​

• Minimum:
  • OS: 64-bit Windows 7, 64-bit Windows 8 (8.1)
  • Processor: Intel CPU Core i5-2500K 3.3GHz / AMD A10-5800K APU (3.8GHz)
  • Memory: 6 GB RAM
  • Graphics: Nvidia GPU GeForce GTX 660 / AMD GPU Radeon HD 7870
  • DirectX: Version 11
  • Storage: 50 GB available space
• Recommended:
• OS: 64-bit Windows 10/11
• Processor: Intel Core i5-7400 / Ryzen 5 1600
• Memory: 8 GB RAM
• Graphics: Nvidia GTX 1070 / Radeon RX 480
• DirectX: Version 12
• Storage: 50 GB available space

 

[zx128k]

And chasing a lower "bottleneck" is not the proper metric.
Instead, you want to be chasing better performance.

It is entirely possible, even likely, to have a higher "bottleneck" (however you measure that) and higher performance at the same time.


Good luck ...

Same performance with a 4060 because of the bottleneck. Both are higher but the 4060 provides more of its value for less cost. This would be the more cost effective gpu. The bottleneck for a 4070 will be extreme and you know it.

Without upgrading in future its not cost effective to get a 4070 gpu and pairing it with a 8100. You knows this as well. Its just a waste of money, you dont get the benefits of the 4070 in higher performance over say a 4060.

This is why a 4070 makes sense only if you upgrade later. Any other reason is playing as disingenuous.

 

[USAFRet]

Same performance with a 4060 because of the bottleneck. Both are higher but the 4060 provides more of its value for less cost. This would be the more cost effective gpu. The bottleneck for a 4070 will be extreme and you know it.

Without upgrading in future its not cost effective to get a 4070 gpu and pairing it with a 8100. You knows this as well. Its just a waste of money, you dont get the benefits of the 4070 in higher performance over say a 4060.

Sigh....

Is a 4060 a better buy, regarding compatibility vs a 4070?
Yes.
The 4070 will simply not be allowed to reach its full potential.

Will the 4070 result in the mythical bottleneck worse performance?
No.


Are we done?

 

[zx128k]

Will the 4070 result in the mythical bottleneck worse performance?
No.

Prove that. Run World of Warcraft for example at 1440p full settings, a 8100 and a 4070. I know whats going to happen. Hell a 4070 is a 4k card, lets run 4k with Ray tracing. It will be unplayable, 20 player raids and 40 player battlegrounds the FPS will just die.

 

[USAFRet]

Prove that. Run World of Warcraft for example at 1440p full settings, a 8100 and a 4070. I know whats going to happen. Hell a 4070 is a 4k card, lets run 4k with Ray tracing. It will be unplayable, raids and battlegrounds the FPS will just die.

As said earlier.....

Changing ONE thing, the better GPU.
Keeping ALL other settings the same.

But, you can keep tossing in other changes, hoping that will prove your point.

 

[zx128k]

As said earlier.....

Changing ONE thing, the better GPU.
Keeping ALL other settings the same.

But, you can keep tossing in other changes, hoping that will prove your point.

But other things do change with a better GPU. If he has a 1050 and just whats a better fps at the same settings. Whats the point of getting a 4070, to run at 1050 graphics settings and game settings? Does this give him the real benefit of getting a 4070. Hell no. Just get a 4060, thanks for totalling agreeing me and showing you are in total agreement.

We are just arguing ideology and I dont want to antagonize you.

 

[USAFRet]

But other things do change with a better GPU. If he has a 1050 and just whats a better fps at the same settings. Whats the point of getting a 4070, to run at 1050 graphics settings and game settings? Does this give him the real benefit of getting a 4070. Hell no. Just get a 4060, thanks for totalling agreeing me and showing you are in total agreement.

Not being a good purchase is very different than "...the FPS will just die".

 

[zx128k]

Not being a good purchase is very different than "...the FPS will just die".

It will in world of warcraft because the game needs a decent cpu. Once you start upping the setting it hits the rest of the system. I dont want to antagonize you, just let this die. We both agree, we just see things in a slightly different way. Its pointless, we will just go round and round.

We see each others point of view, at the core we agree. Its just how we see the benefit of the upgrade. Our ideology or world view.

So long as the OP stays to games that are not heavy on the CPU he should get decent performance. If a game is heavy of physics or other cpu mechanics. Well he will have issues but not all games are the same.

So in FFIV he gets less than 56 fps but on a 5950x he gets above 100 fps. Dropping below 60fps means the game desnt run well. The same things happen in world of warcraft. This gets worse when you raid, with more thing on screen. The FPS will go up and down a lot. The game wont feel smooth. You are force to keep reducing the setting untill the game can run at a constant say 60 fps. Then the game is playable and smooth feeling.

So you lose 4k and 1440p and drop to 1080p. Then you can keep the eye candy on.

What does Intel say about their newest GPUs?

GPU performance is hit hard by no resizable bar or SAM.

AMD Ryzen Gets 35% Performance Increase in WoW's Latest Patch

tomshardware forums.

CPU and GPU performance in World of Warcraft question

I've a quite newbie question about my gpu performance in WoW Legion. I'd like to know why the fps drastically drops around 20 even at very low details ( level1). despite gpu load is like 35% in 25man raids and cpu load (fx6300@4,5ghz) it's just 70% on 1 core. It's WoW engine fault? It's...

forums.tomshardware.com

Thank you for the informations provided. Yes I'm planning to upgrade my rig as you can see I've already got a new gpu so I would go for am4 platforms and ryzen 5- 1600 and hope to fix this very low fps situation in wow!

https://forums.tomshardware.com/thr...single-core-performance.3809392/post-23018524

Metal Messiah.​

The game is more CPU-bound than GPU from what I've heard. It also requires a decent amount of system RAM as well. But it sill requires a decent GPU as well.

https://forums.tomshardware.com/threads/will-a-11900k-bottleneck-a-4080.3809571/post-23019908

USAFRet​

I think "bottleneck" doesn't mean what you think it means.

The CPU is in control of the framerate, the GPU...the eyecandy.

Here, the CPU will be running at 100%, giving whatever FPS is can.
The GPU may be simply at 60%.

That is the 'bottleneck.
It does not make things run 'slower', but rather it is just that the GPU won't reach its full potential.

Question - Is my Cpu Bottlenecking my GPU?

i9 10900k, 3080 ti, 32 gb 3600mhz ram, z490 dark, 850w psu. I have two monitors 2560x1440p 240hz and 3440x1440p 120hz, I prefer playing on my 240hz monitor. So the issue I'm having is that my gpu is severely underperforming when playing at 2560x1440, not in all games though. The example I will...

forums.tomshardware.com

USAFRet​

It simply means that some part is not able to reach its full potential.

Adding in a better part (the new GPU) does not reduce overall performance. It increases it.

Question - Rx 6600 Bottleneck?

I am about to get a rx 6600 (upgrade from rx 570 4 gb and am wondering if it will bottleneck with my ryzen 5 2400g

forums.tomshardware.com

The CPU gives the framerate, the GPU applies eyecandy to those frames.

Given the same CPU and all the same settings, you should be getting the same FPS.
But given a better GPU, you can turn the graphics settings up.

Question - Will I have a bottle neck if I'll upgrade to rtx 3080 and up?

Hello, I have rtx 2080 and i7 8700. I want to upgrade to 3080 or more but I'm afraid that my cpu is too weak for that graphics card and might encounter cpu bottleneck. Or will I not? Thanks for answering.

forums.tomshardware.com

Hello, I have rtx 2080 and i7 8700. I want to upgrade to 3080 or more but I'm afraid that my cpu is too weak for that graphics card and might encounter cpu bottleneck. Or will I not? Thanks for answering.

Yes.
You also have a "bottleneck" with your current components.
Or if you get a weaker GPU.
Or a weaker CPU.

There is always a "bottleneck".

[SOLVED] - RTX 3070's low usage and determining cause of bottleneck ?

Good day to you all, For some time I've been struggling with the fact that my RTX 3070 does not seem to be giving me the performance I was expecting. I play a lot of different games like Elden Ring, Spiderman Remastered, Apex Legends, Valheim. And in most games I have experienced the GPU usage...

forums.tomshardware.com

Numbers seem pretty accurate to me, where is your proof? anyways i dont need bottleneck calculator to tell him that cpu is far too weak for a 3070. "abit" is underselling it lol.

'proof' that the bottleneck calculator is junk?

It gives no context.
In Game A, that combination might be fine.
In Game B, not so fine.

Some games are more CPU, others more GPU.

Question - Core 2 quad causing bottleneck to my GPU?

I have a core 2 quad system in my room, Yesterday i upgraded the Sytem from q6600 to q9400 and I also upgraded the GPU to Radeon 6600 XT. After installed all of the components i noticed a huge FPS increase in older games but on newer games e.g Far Cry 6, The game is barely playable, FPS can go...

forums.tomshardware.com

USAFRet​

So you're assuming that my CPU bottlenecks my GPU? If so what CPU should i buy for my system? The board is Gigabyte EP43-UD3L with 8 gigs of ram

Forget the word "bottleneck".

That CPU is simply not capable.

Question - Maybe this has been asked before, but Im doing a new build and just got a Msi 3090ti Suprim and wanted to know a good cpu to avoid bottlenecking....

Also, it will be awhile before I get all the parts and I wanted to check my current setup with this new gpu. I just want to make sure its working properly. It will be past the return window by the time I get all my new parts. I currently have a Ryzen 7 3800xt and wanted to see if that would...

forums.tomshardware.com

Every system has a "bottleneck".
One of the most misunderstood and misused terms around.

All it means is that some part is not letting some other part reach its full potential.

In the gaming world...
The CPU provides the framerate, the GPU provides the eyecandy.

A certain CPU will give XX FPS.
The GPU will then take that and make it look pretty.

A slower CPU will be doings its best, and paired with a hotrod GPU...the GPU will be just idling along. Waiting on the CPU.

It does not break anything.

 

[kizo]

Converting to USD, 950 - 1250. But hardware prices are inflated here, and that money would fetch far less when compared to US.

Looking at prices at Amazon India,cheapest 4070 from Inno3D is 59657 India Ruppies which is 750USD.
Remaining 500$ should be enough for a full upgrade.
cpu,motherboard,RAM and GPU.
Though I admit I do not know how good are thermals.

I will make you couple of recommendations if not today then tomorrow

 

[kizo]

With Witcher 3 its not as much of a problem because of the system requirements.

System Requirements​

• Minimum:
  • OS: 64-bit Windows 7, 64-bit Windows 8 (8.1)
  • Processor: Intel CPU Core i5-2500K 3.3GHz / AMD A10-5800K APU (3.8GHz)
  • Memory: 6 GB RAM
  • Graphics: Nvidia GPU GeForce GTX 660 / AMD GPU Radeon HD 7870
  • DirectX: Version 11
  • Storage: 50 GB available space
• Recommended:
• OS: 64-bit Windows 10/11
• Processor: Intel Core i5-7400 / Ryzen 5 1600
• Memory: 8 GB RAM
• Graphics: Nvidia GTX 1070 / Radeon RX 480
• DirectX: Version 12
• Storage: 50 GB available space

Witcher 3 received numerous graphical upgrades over the years.
?
RX480 is supposed to be AMD alternative to GTX1070?🤣

 

[kizo]

Inno 3D 4070 Twin X2 60000Rupies or 725USD

Amazon.in

5600X 16000Rupies or 195USD

Amazon.in

MSI B550M Pro VDH WiFi 11340rupies or 137$

Amazon.in

Patriot Viper Steal RGB 2x8 3200CL16 4300Rupies or 52$

Amazon.in

Corsair RM750e 2023 10000Rupies or 120$

Amazon.in

1229$

You will need more than 550W.
Just in case.
Plus it could be useful should you decide to add more power-hungry CPU.
I HOPE everything shall fit in whatever case you have and that it has decent airflow.

...I forgot CPU Cooler 😄

Amazon.in

Most if not all of these Components are currently discounted.
May change soon.
OR they might go out of stock

 

[zx128k]

Witcher 3 received numerous graphical upgrades over the years.
?
RX480 is supposed to be AMD alternative to GTX1070?🤣

From The Witcher® 3: Wild Hunt on Steam specs information, so from the developers of the game I guess. The game has a release date of 18 May, 2015. This is why older CPUs have few issues with this game.

 

[kizo]

From The Witcher® 3: Wild Hunt on Steam specs information, so from the developers of the game I guess. The game has a release date of 18 May, 2015. This is why older CPUs have few issues with this game.

So,no complaints about my recommendations?
Would you change something?
Go with cheaper B450/A520/B550 perhaps and PSU and throw in 5700X or perhaps even 5800X?
With 5600X, the bottleneck shouldn't be more than 10%-15% .
Though if RT is used it may drop to zero.
Or close enough.

 

[Zerk2012]

From The Witcher® 3: Wild Hunt on Steam specs information, so from the developers of the game I guess. The game has a release date of 18 May, 2015. This is why older CPUs have few issues with this game.

LOL the never ending thread give us a break PLEASE. Your trying so hard you look like your just a troll.
Nothing wrong with what he is buying!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[kizo]

LOL the never ending thread give us a break PLEASE. Your trying so hard you look like your just a troll.
Nothing wrong with what he is buying!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Any thoughts about my recommendations?
It's directly above the post you quoted

 

[zx128k]

LOL the never ending thread give us a break PLEASE. Your trying so hard you look like your just a troll.
Nothing wrong with what he is buying!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Wow a new low. Why dont you stop pretending Im wrong and posting replies trying to make me look wrong. I'm not wrong but the OP can buy what he wants. Why dont you accept I dont agree with you. Or get it over and ban me for nothing. You don't have to post and no forum rules are being broken by me.

 

[USAFRet]

OK...this thread has run its course.

@letsrock53 - Have you gotten everything you need from this?