[SOLVED] Building a new PC for music production

[ozzi3]

Hi,

I have a limited budget since I have to alocate some of the money for music equipments, meaning I try the best possible way minimizing the cost to not replacing the some of the PC components that is still usable.

One thing I need to replace is that holds the PC from booting (blank screen after bios or welcome logo). Sometimes I need to restart 3 to 4 times before everything back to normal.

I'm not sure what causes it. I'll give the spec info of my PC below. It's a dang old PC. Hope you guys would help me suggesting the best budget PC for the purpose.

The current RAM is 16 Gb. I'm planning to upgrade it to 32 Gb. But not sure if my mobo (given that old) is running well with that. But the most important thing is I need to figure out the culprit.

The thing that gets suspicious is the VGA card since is easily overheaten.

Download (.txt)

 

[mrpete2]

Wow, this is not a pretty situation. Your CPU & vid card are 10/12 years old and your current system only boots 1/2 the time (or less).

I'm not sure what we can save here. If we keep your RAM you can't move to a mobo with a Ryzen because they all take DDR4. That might mean we cannot reuse your CPU heatsink/fan. Maybe you could move that RAM to an old-ish motherboard that takes an Intel Core i3/i5 CPU. I sounds like you cannot afford more than a system with an old-ish motherboard (but quite a bit newer than 10 or 12 years).

Questions

What is your case?
What is you power supply?
Does the system have a CD or DVD drive (burner or reader)?
Do you have any spare thumb drives? (to put bootable software on)
What country are you in?
Do you have access to another PC/laptop? Are you posting to this forum from your mobile phone?

I see from another of your posts that you are using Win 7.

First things first ...

Let's see if we can't get your current system to boot up every time.

Reseat your RAM = take both DIMMs out and then put them both back in. We are trying here to make sure there is good electrical contact between the DIMMs and your motherboard.

Reseat your video card = take the card out and put it back in. Again, this is about good electrical contact.

When you boot the machine only "boot to BIOS." As the machine is coming up press the <Delete> key to enter BIOS / Setup. After you are in BIOS / Setup hold in the power button for a few (4 / 8 / 10) seconds and the power supply will "pull the plug" on the system and it will be powered down.

Repeat the above procedure 10 times and you will have proved (at least somewhat) that the hardware in your computer can boot. The software / OS is a different matter.

One step at a time. Start with the procedure above and then come back here and tell everybody what happened.

 

[ozzi3]

Wow, this is not a pretty situation. Your CPU & vid card are 10/12 years old and your current system only boots 1/2 the time (or less).

I'm not sure what we can save here. If we keep your RAM you can't move to a mobo with a Ryzen because they all take DDR4. That might mean we cannot reuse your CPU heatsink/fan. Maybe you could move that RAM to an old-ish motherboard that takes an Intel Core i3/i5 CPU. I sounds like you cannot afford more than a system with an old-ish motherboard (but quite a bit newer than 10 or 12 years).

Questions

What is your case?
What is you power supply?
Does the system have a CD or DVD drive (burner or reader)?
Do you have any spare thumb drives? (to put bootable software on)
What country are you in?
Do you have access to another PC/laptop? Are you posting to this forum from your mobile phone?

I see from another of your posts that you are using Win 7.

First things first ...

Let's see if we can't get your current system to boot up every time.

Reseat your RAM = take both DIMMs out and then put them both back in. We are trying here to make sure there is good electrical contact between the DIMMs and your motherboard.

Reseat your video card = take the card out and put it back in. Again, this is about good electrical contact.

When you boot the machine only "boot to BIOS." As the machine is coming up press the <Delete> key to enter BIOS / Setup. After you are in BIOS / Setup hold in the power button for a few (4 / 8 / 10) seconds and the power supply will "pull the plug" on the system and it will be powered down.

Repeat the above procedure 10 times and you will have proved (at least somewhat) that the hardware in your computer can boot. The software / OS is a different matter.

One step at a time. Start with the procedure above and then come back here and tell everybody what happened.

Hi, thanks.

First things first.

Everything seems normal for now. It happened before that I don't get the black screen for awhile. Let's see if it already gets solved in the next days.

But there's also another thing worth to mention. When this booting issue started to happen I got my playback device setting automatically changed to HDMI. I use an external audio interface. I keep changing it back every time after recovering from the black screen. Maybe my monitor contributes?

As for the questions:

1. I use Fractal Design Define R4 case.
2. Power supply: corsair cx 500.
3. I have an external DVD reader.
4. I have an external drive/storage.
5. I live in Indonesia.
6. I can reply from another computer or from my smartphone.

 

[mrpete2]

OK. You are getting BLACK screen shutdowns, not blue screen (“blue screen of death”). Could you please confirm that?

In this case black screen crashes might be worse than blue screen because a black screen crash could be caused by the power supply/PSU. There are other things outside of the PSU that could be making the PSU to do that. The picture is less clear than we would like.

Is there any possibility that you could swap PSUs with a friend or into some other machine? If the problems follow the PSU then it is some or all of the problem.

It would be REALLY nice if we could know that your PSU is OK. If we build another system and use as our “starting ingredients” your case, PSU and RAM then we will be in a bad position if that PSU gives problems.

On the other hand we could try changing your video card and see if the problems go away. That would tend to show that the PSU is OK. I understand that you suspect the video card.

You said “When this booting issue started to happen I got my playback device setting automatically changed to HDMI.” I am not sure what that means. Is that an application software setting? You have just 1 monitor, right? It has both VGA (DSUB) and HDMI connectors. Which connection do you use?

I doubt that your monitor is the cause of your problems.

You said “I use an external audio interface.” Does that mean you have a sound card or are you saying that you have speakers plugged into the green audio out plug on the back of your motherboard?

Did you try the RAM and video card reseating that I suggested? If you have a sound card then also reseat that card.

Your “external DVD reader” … does it also write CDs (and maybe DVDs)? This is a music computer. I’m thinking you can make playable CDs, right?

Below this is a recap (for me) of your attached file. The computer contains:
Gigabyte 970A-D3P motherboard
AMD FX-6300 CPU, 6 cores, 6 threads
RAM = 16 GB DDR3
GPU = ATI Radeon HD 5400 Series
Samsung S24R35xFZ monitor, the # could be a bit different, VGA + HDMI

 

[ozzi3]

OK. You are getting BLACK screen shutdowns, not blue screen (“blue screen of death”). Could you please confirm that?

In this case black screen crashes might be worse than blue screen because a black screen crash could be caused by the power supply/PSU. There are other things outside of the PSU that could be making the PSU to do that. The picture is less clear than we would like.

Is there any possibility that you could swap PSUs with a friend or into some other machine? If the problems follow the PSU then it is some or all of the problem.

It would be REALLY nice if we could know that your PSU is OK. If we build another system and use as our “starting ingredients” your case, PSU and RAM then we will be in a bad position if that PSU gives problems.

On the other hand we could try changing your video card and see if the problems go away. That would tend to show that the PSU is OK. I understand that you suspect the video card.

You said “When this booting issue started to happen I got my playback device setting automatically changed to HDMI.” I am not sure what that means. Is that an application software setting? You have just 1 monitor, right? It has both VGA (DSUB) and HDMI connectors. Which connection do you use?

I doubt that your monitor is the cause of your problems.

You said “I use an external audio interface.” Does that mean you have a sound card or are you saying that you have speakers plugged into the green audio out plug on the back of your motherboard?

Did you try the RAM and video card reseating that I suggested? If you have a sound card then also reseat that card.

Your “external DVD reader” … does it also write CDs (and maybe DVDs)? This is a music computer. I’m thinking you can make playable CDs, right?

Below this is a recap (for me) of your attached file. The computer contains:
Gigabyte 970A-D3P motherboard
AMD FX-6300 CPU, 6 cores, 6 threads
RAM = 16 GB DDR3
GPU = ATI Radeon HD 5400 Series
Samsung S24R35xFZ monitor, the # could be a bit different, VGA + HDMI

it's not possible to swap psu.

i use hdmi. i think hdmi monitor has its own source of audio playback. if changed to that, i can't use my audio interface i.e. a soundcard built for music production.

after reseating the cards the problem seems go away. so far so good. if this is solved, i think i'm gonna keep everything except the psu and the graphic card and the cpu. but i still can't find best gpu suit for the mobo. everything they sell are ddr5 cards. isn't it a bummer. or could i use a ddr5 gpu instead?

 

[mrpete2]

That all sounds pretty good.

You want to upgrade the following components: PSU, GPU, CPU.

The current PSU capacity of 500 watts is enough for the type of computer you have. The most important thing about getting a PSU (after wattage) is to get one that is good quality.

For the GPU you do not need a powerful one. You are not playing video games that need “high FPS.” Low power/price, but good quality should be fine for you. Your computer uses DDR3 for its main memory. The type of DDR on the GPU has nothing to do with your main memory. The new GPU could have DDR3, 4 or 5. It does not matter. That RAM is internal to the GPU.

About the CPU upgrade, l am not sure you would really “feel” that. It would not hurt, but I am not sure that it is really going to help all that much. And, by the way, you don’t need more RAM.

If you don’t already boot from an SSD (even a small one) then that is an upgrade that you would notice. It just makes everything more responsive. Good, small SSDs can be had for not very much money. With SSDs, used is perfectly OK.

Another thing I would recommend is an OS reinstall (onto the SSD). You’re using Win 7. I can probably point you to good resources that would help with that. A fresh OS install can frequently solve a surprisingly large number of problems.

And finally, the crowning action would be to upgrade to Win 10 (free upgrade). You are probably surfing the web from Win 7. That is a really bad thing to do. It is just not secure.

I get that the OS installs/upgrades are a pain in the butt. On the other hand doing that work could pay high dividends.

One more thing, every single one of the upgrades I have just mentioned are computer components that you can later move to a more powerful/newer computer. None of this money will be wasted. These are all long term investments.

 

[mrpete2]

How about this for your PSU?

Cooler Master MWE Elite V4 White 500Watt PSU Rp605.000

https://shopee.co.id/Cooler-Master-...U-Power-Supply-500W-80--i.15607053.3745679217

Of course, there are tons of other options.

Brand selection seems a bit limited in Indonesia. There are lots of not so great options, but fewer good options than some other places.

 

[mrpete2]

Because you do not have high demand video needs and you want to spend a moderate amount of money I am going to recommend a Geforce GT 710 GPU. It is “not much of a GPU,” but your needs are very low. It is somewhat cheap and will do the job. The brands on Shopee that I see (of this card) and know are good are MSI, ASUS, Gigabyte and PNY. I use a Geforce GT 710 GPU in one of my computers (Ryzen 5600X).

This not a video card for gamers.

The reason I am recommending this specific type of GPU is that I had problems getting getting video cards older that the Geforce GT 7XX line to work (to boot) in that new Ryzen machine of mine. If you get a Geforce GT 7XX or newer it should work with the motherboard you buy in 2 or 3 years.

I am sorry, but I cannot remember what the “cut off point” for similar Radeon/AMD GPUs is. I believe there is one.

On Shopee I see a lot of used Geforce GT 710 GPUs. I am not sure how you feel about used equipment. Of the links below, I think one is used and the others are new.

https://shopee.co.id/VGA-MSI-GT-710-2GB-DDR-3-Low-Profile-i.236650885.19902544867

https://shopee.co.id/GT-710-1GD3H-LP-i.238466450.4638824064

https://shopee.co.id/VGA-MSI-GT-710-1GB-DDR3-i.60878963.4614004633

Some cards have 1GB video RAM, others have 2GB. I doubt that more video RAM will make any difference for you (or me). Some cards have a fan, but others are cooled passively by a large heat sink. That decision is up to you.

Of course you can get whatever GPU you want, but I recommend something from the Geforce GT 7XX line OR NEWER.

 

[ozzi3]

The current PSU capacity of 500 watts is enough for the type of computer you have. The most important thing about getting a PSU (after wattage) is to get one that is good quality.

I feel llike I need to replace it after a decade of using it. Don't you think? I was thinking to get a Corsair CSX550M. But Cooler Master MWE Elite V4 you mentioned is a good call since it's much cheaper.

For the GPU you do not need a powerful one. You are not playing video games that need “high FPS.” Low power/price, but good quality should be fine for you. Your computer uses DDR3 for its main memory. The type of DDR on the GPU has nothing to do with your main memory. The new GPU could have DDR3, 4 or 5. It does not matter. That RAM is internal to the GPU.

So, my current mobo can use any newest DDR5 type GPU? At least I need it above 1Gb. Just to make it smoother.

About the CPU upgrade, l am not sure you would really “feel” that. It would not hurt, but I am not sure that it is really going to help all that much. And, by the way, you don’t need more RAM.

Actually I need more RAM, the latest music project I worked on easily cracked or glitched running on a software. But I'm not sure if my current CPU can handle a 32 Gb RAM. I'm thinking to upgrade to FX 8350 or 8370.

If you don’t already boot from an SSD (even a small one) then that is an upgrade that you would notice. It just makes everything more responsive. Good, small SSDs can be had for not very much money. With SSDs, used is perfectly OK.

I have an SSD. Planning on getting one more Adata SP900.

 

[mrpete2]

BIG OOPS HERE …

I said:
How about this for your PSU?
Cooler Master MWE Elite V4 White 500Watt PSU Rp605.000

OOPS! I made a mistake with that one. On the Shopee web page for that offer the title says “Cooler Master MWE Elite V4,” but if you look closely at one of the pictures the model number is “MPE-5001-ACABN.” That’s not an MWE model at all. That is a Cooler Master Elite V4. Do not buy that one … sorry.

The place I begin with PSUs is the PSU Tier List.

PSU Tier List rev. 17.0g - Cultists Network

PSU Tier List will help you to choose the best PSU out of hundreds of models on the market. From budget to the highest end Power Supplies.

cultists.network

Take that list with a grain of salt = just use it as a starting point. Then look for reviews of the exact model that you are thinking of buying.

When I search just for MWE in computers on Shopee I only see V2 white or bronze models. The Tier List mentions that those V2 models have high ripple issues on very low load that results in coil whine.

That means that when the PC is “running idle” (not doing much) it makes strange noises. Not a desirable feature.

I’m looking on the Shopee / shopee.co.id website. What other Indonesian computer equipment (for sale) websites exist?

The eBay website for Indonesia seems to be a joke. The links do not work for me. Does Amazon operate there? Do you have a favorite computer part retailer website that you use?

 

[mrpete2]

The website that the PSU Tier List is on seems to be down or having some difficulties right at this moment.

A copy of that web page can be reached by the link below.

https://web.archive.org/web/20220607215317/https://cultists.network/140/psu-tier-list/

[EDIT: Oh, now the web page is back up again … whatever … ]

 

[DSzymborski]

Yeah, the CX 550 is way better than that Cooler Master that was accidentally linked.

 

[mrpete2]

Yeah, your PSU choice seems to be the most cost effective.

Of the “mid-range” PSUs that are listed on Shopee the Corsair CX550M looks to be the most reasonably priced. There are 2 new/non-used offers there for Rp805.000. There are more offers at higher prices.

Up to Rp999.999 the CX550M is the best PSU on Shopee.

 

[ozzi3]

Yeah, your PSU choice seems to be the most cost effective.

Of the “mid-range” PSUs that are listed on Shopee the Corsair CX550M looks to be the most reasonably priced. There are 2 new/non-used offers there for Rp805.000. There are more offers at higher prices.

Up to Rp999.999 the CX550M is the best PSU on Shopee.

OK. Thanks.