Can i do this ?

[mactronix]

Hi I have a E4600 which is running at stock 2.4 at the moment. I have been using the motherboards software overclocking utility to give it some more speed on the odd ocasion it has been required.
Now i am looking to make the OC perminant in the bios and after reading various online threads/guides, i have a question that i cant seem to find the answer to.
Whats the differance between overclocking the CPU by upping the FSB and just changing the jumpers ?
I will explain. My CPU runs at 800 fsb or 200x12=2.4. Now 250x12 =3.0 but in order to do that on my motherboard i will haev to set the jumpers to 1:1 ratio.
What i want to know is can i just change the jumpers to the 1066 setting instead. Or would the chip be read as a 800 fsb chip and it not work. If it did work this would give me a speed of roughly 3.2. now i know this would probably need more Voltage but assuming it works and boots i would then down clock it a bit to be around the 3.0 mark which then shouldnt need the volts.
At the end of the day this would just make life easier when i update the CPU later.

Thanks
Mactronix

 

[jeanluclariviere]

Few things - Which motherboard are you using and I highly doubt you will need to to touch any jumpers.

Why ?
From what I believe, if you're using a motherboard new enough to have it's own OC software than I can't imagine its only other method of OC is by using jumpers.

The difference in using jumpers or bios is the lack of control. Jumpers have minimum/maximum increments used when OC where as you usually have alot more freedom using the BIOS.

That being said - your best option for a permanent OC is by using said BIOS.

So, I'm not quite sure what it is you're talking about when you mention setting a 1:1 ratio on your motherboard - because that ratio is making reference to the CPU:RAM ratio which is changed in the BIOS.

From what I gather, you cannot just change your "chip from 800mhz to 1066" with the flick of a switch. What you need to do is read a proper OC guide on Tom's or elsewhere that makes reference to using the BIOS and follow it step by step.

My recomendation would be these:

10 (Multi) x 320 (FSB) = 3.2Ghz with a 1:1.2 ratio
9 (Multi) x 333 (FSB) = 3.0Ghz with a 1:1.2 ratio
8

 

[dechy]

An e4600 is locked at 12x, unless there's something I don't understand by your recommendation (10/9/8 multi you're referring to).

To get 1:1 with 1066MHz FSB (meaning 266MHz quad pumped), you'd need at a minimum 533MHz RAM running at full speed and that would give you 3.2GHz

That's a fairly big overclock and will surely mean high-end heatsink+fan and playing with the core voltage.

And yeah, stay away from the jumpers! As was mentionned, if you can software OC, then your motherboard is probably new enough that jumpers are only for looks (or at least most should).

 

[jeanluclariviere]

From my experience using "locked" multipliers, i'm almost certain that it simply means you cannot increase the multiplier - you can however decrease it. I have done this on my E2200.

Also:

I'm not quite following this

To get 1:1 with 1066MHz FSB (meaning 266MHz quad pumped), you'd need at a minimum 533MHz RAM running at full speed and that would give you 3.2GHz

At first glance it seems to make sense, but, and correct me if im wrong, but from my understanding you only need to double pump the 266mhz (Double Data Rate), and would need to increase the FSB to 533mhz to have it push the RAM to 1066mhz.

 

[dechy]

Ah yes, true, you can lower the multiplier, completely forgot about that (how else would speedstep work? heh)

CPU FSB = Quad pumped
RAM = Dual pumped (for DDR anyways)

Example, E8400 is a 1333MHz FSB rated CPU. when you go in BIOS for stock settings, it will show FSB @ 333MHz meaning 4x 333MHz for CPU total FSB & 667MHz minimum DDR speed needed for 1:1 ratio.

Wanna hit 3.6GHz that everybody can hit on stock cooler? Pump the BIOS setting to 400MHz for a total rated FSB of 1600MHz and the 1:1 ratio of the RAM will become 800MHz, so PC-6400 needed minimum to support that without OC'ing it.

This only applies to P4/Core/Core2 architectures if I'm correct... i7 does away with FSB and pre-P4 wasn't quad pumped at all.

 

[mactronix]

Ok so a few thing sto reply to then.
The MOBO is a ASRock 1600Twins-P35. I have seen a couple of overclocking reviews concerning this board and infact it was one of these reviews that lead ASRock to issue the 1:1 settings on its help page as it was missing both in the manual and the help pages. The software OC Tuner will take the chip to 2.8 ish but im shooting for 3.0 which is said to be usually very possable with this chip, i am aware though that its not a gimme.
I thought at first my lack of sucess was down to something i was doing so it was quite a comfort to find that even the Pro's couldnt get a decent OC from this board with out the 1:1 jumper settings. So it will overclock but i do need to change the jumpers if i want to get it to 3.0 or 0ver 2.8 ish.
What would the affect on the memory be of using your recomendations, would it be more stable than trying to run at 250x12 ?
My Ram is this stuff http://www.aria.co.uk/Products/Components/Memory/DDR2/DDR2+800+%28PC6400%29/Patriot+2GB+PC2-6400+C4+Extreme+Performance+%282x1GB%29+?productId=26802

Mactronix

 

[jeanluclariviere]

Wanna hit 3.6GHz that everybody can hit on stock cooler? Pump the BIOS setting to 400MHz for a total rated FSB of 1600MHz and the 1:1 ratio of the RAM will become 800MHz, so PC-6400 needed minimum to support that without OC'ing it.

You forgot to mention that he would need a multiplier of 9 ? 😛

After re-reading what you posted Dechy, I realised we were talking about the CPU FSB lol I hadn't quite picked up on it from all that was being typed.

 

[dechy]

I was still referring to the E8400 definitely not his E4600! lol, oups! So yeah 9x all the way for the example!

 

[mactronix]

So what are we saying then guys will the 800 FSB CPU actually work if i set the jumpers to 1066 or will i have to set the jumpers to the 800 but 1:1 settings ond overclock it ?
As i said its really only that if it will work then i wont have to change the jumpers again when the need for a Quad actually gets here.

Mactronix

 

[jeanluclariviere]

do not touch the jumers is what im saying.

 

[mactronix]

But if i dont at least change the jumpers so that the memory ratio is set at 1:1 instead of 5:4 as it is now then it wont reach 3.0, (not that its guaranteed anyway).
So what about the settings you posted is it better to lower the multi and upp the FSB as far as stability goes?

Mactronix

 

[cjl]

Jumpers are not needed. All settings, including the memory ratio, should be in the BIOS.

 

[jeanluclariviere]

^+1 - Memory ratios are changed in the BIOS.

Yes - your best bet is to lower the multi and increase the fsb.

Best case scenario is probably
8 (multi) x 400 (FSB) = 3.2ghz
9 (multi) x 333 (FSB) = 3.0ghz

 

[m_silkstone]

Stop talkking about jumpers, lol. your motherboard is jumperless as far as your concerned.
Just go into bios. up the FSB you should be able to get a 300 fsb no problem.

Set the fsb-Ram multiplier to 1:1 to start- it will post. so then go to the next highest setting. depending on your ram it should post. keep it at that for now and do some more research on how to tweak your bios setings.

 

[mactronix]

Did any of you actually read my posts or did you just scan them ? I thought i made it clear enough that the jumper issue is a fact. So i really am at a loss as to why people keep telling me its not an issue. It is. Reviews of the board i have read say its something that needs doing as do ASRock themselves.
So if we leave the whole jumper thing to one side, can i run a 800FSB chip on a chipset thats running at 1066 ?
I realise the voltage would need to be upped, and the FSB would probably be best started lower than stock but basically can i run a 800 chip on a 1066 chipset ?

Mactronix