Can I ground myself with a copper wire running into the dirt?

[Fenvara]

Touching the ground itself is supposed to be the surest way to be grounded when building/fixing a pc, but obviously building your computer outside is not much of option. I know there are static bracelets ect. but I’m curious.

What do you guys think would happen if you took a copper wire, buried one end in the dirt outside a window and wrapped the other end around your ankle? (Obviously you would NOT plug your power supply in/ turn on or fiddle with any plugged in electronic devices while doing this)

Would you be safely grounded?

Would you need to run another wire out of the dirt to your case too?

Could you get electrocuted using your (not plugged in smart phone??)

Not saying this what I am planning to do when I build a pc, just wondered why no else seems to have tried it yet. I know it sounds a bit in convenient but it does seem the most simple and surefire way to keep yourself grounded.

So would this work do you think?

 

[Someone Somewhere]

Being grounded is not the issue.

Everything must be near in electrical potential, which is achieved by bonding them together. Ground just happens to be an easy way to do this.

As long as you're connected electrically to the case and touch the metal shields of components first, you are very likely to be OK.

As for whether it's safe, remember that almost every metal framed appliance in your house is electrically connected to a grounding rod somewhere on the property.

 

[avarice]

Being grounded is not the issue.
As for whether it's safe, remember that almost every metal framed appliance in your house is electrically connected to a grounding rod somewhere on the property.

Just for clarity - most grounding in a house (US Building standards as well as others) is connected to the plumbing near the water intake. As such standard electrical grounding is not a wire stuck in dirt - but rather a wire connected to metal pipes connected to your cities water supply (and beyond). As such, if a short occurs or the ground is actually used then there is a huge potential in which to absorb the current. Additionally with this huge potential, the current allowed will (in most cases) blow the circuit breaker or fuse during the instant of grounding.

To the point of the question - 'Someone Somewhere' was spot on.

 

[Karadjgne]

No, actually you would not be SAFELY grounded, in fact just the opposite. Electricity will only travel if it has a path. It's where the path is that's important. By tying around an ankle, you have made the path from hand, up your arm, down your body then out your ankle. The nerves supplying the electrical signal that makes your heart beat originate at your right shoulder. This is why grounding straps are on your wrist, so any electricity, static or line, travels no further than your wrist. Not across your heart. It takes just 1/8th of an amp to disrupt a heartbeat, potentially lethal to some. Grounding your ankle is probably the worst thing you can do.

There some things you can do to minimise static, such as wearing cotton not rayon or nylon based clothing, touching the pc metal frame before touching any component, staying off carpet, wearing shoes, just being sensible.

 

[Someone Somewhere]

We have ground electrodes here in NZ; grounding via water pipes is pretty rare and no longer legal. I guess it varies by location.

However, the ground fault path back to the ground electrode at the transformer is usually too high-impedance to trip the fuse/breaker. Hence why neutral and ground are tied together in your switchboard; the fault current returns to the transformer by the normal neutral path.

 

[Karadjgne]

Just to clarify, most residential is no longer subject to water bonds, unless you specify copper piping in the house. Most houses built in the last 10+ years use PEX or CPVC piping. Houses are bonded 3 ways for slab, grounding rod, rebar in slab, neutral buss. Non slab homes only get grounding rod (sometimes 2x) and neutral buss.

Water bonds have been proven to be detrimental to copper (electrolysis creating pinholes) as well as dangerous if not done properly (ppl electrocuted in the shower etc.

 

[Someone Somewhere]

Static is almost certainly not going to be present in quantities high enough to harm you. You've probably seen the time/current graphs for shock damage; that 1/8A current would need to be sustained for more than 50ms to even cause involuntary muscle action.

Static grounding straps already have a 1MΩ resistor in them; there's going to be no dangerous current flowing through them. Note that it's not unusual in semiconductor & PCB manufacturing/assembly facilities to have your ankles bonded to your shoes; they wouldn't do this if there was a significant damage of personal injury. Anti-static bonding is only to prevent equipment damage and flammable vapour ignition.

Also worth noting that if what you're saying was true, it would be easy to get a shock passing from one arm to the band on the other, through your chest.

 

[PsyKhiqZero]

In theory running a wire outside would ground you. I can't comment on how safe it would be, but it would work. However there are easier ways. Some wrist straps will actually plug into the ground of a 3 prong power outlet. You could use that in combination with a extension cord to make it easier. Personally I always just wrap my leg around the stem of my office chair.

 

[maddogfargo]

Grounding yourself against ESD (Electro-static discharge) is different from being grounded as in in a power circuit. Think of Static like a surface build up of excess electrons. As long as you touch the case first you should be fine, they will transfer and dissipate.

It's when you touch an electrical trace on a component first that you can damage something. And you don't even need to hear or feel the static pop. Damaging voltages can be created and transferred well below the threshold needed for static to arc or make that 'pop' sound.

The electrical potential for static build up is worst in cold weather when the heat is running because of the lower humidity. This makes it more difficult for ambient electron build up to transfer off you naturally through the air via the moisture content and microscopic particulates.

It is also more likely to happen between certain materials, like your hair and a rubber balloon, fabrics and glass or plastic, like wool sox on the floor. So it even helps to dress properly. 😉

 

[Karadjgne]

About 15 yrs ago, me and my lead were working on some lighting in a school. 277v. Grid ceilings. He was just tying the hots back together when the maintenance dude walked in, ignored the red tape covering the switch, said "oh, you boys need some light?" That 277v traveled up his right arm and grounded out his left elbow which was leaned up against the grid. He got lucky. At the time I was also an EMT/firefighter. He was dead for about 2.5 minutes.

Some ppl get foolish ideas about plugging the psu to the wall, just so it's for sure grounded. Good ideas and common sense are not necessarily the same thing.

 

[maddogfargo]

About 15 yrs ago, me and my lead were working on some lighting in a school. 277v. Grid ceilings. He was just tying the hots back together when the maintenance dude walked in, ignored the red tape covering the switch, said "oh, you boys need some light?" That 277v traveled up his right arm and grounded out his left elbow which was leaned up against the grid. He got lucky. At the time I was also an EMT/firefighter. He was dead for about 2.5 minutes.

Some ppl get foolish ideas about plugging the psu to the wall, just so it's for sure grounded. Good ideas and common sense are not necessarily the same thing.

Oh and it should be a given...but you NEVER EVER work on a PC with it still plugged in. Turning it off or turning the PSU switch on the back off IS NOT SAFE. Drop one screw into the PSU and it can close a circuit and fry stuff.

Now, the power output from a computer PSU will be all DC and not enough amperage to kill you. But it can hurt and burn you and will definitely destroy your components if you short something.

 

[Someone Somewhere]

Yeah, 12V isn't going to be dangerous to people unless you've got conductive jewellery or really sweaty hands or something; skin impedance is too low.

Definitely enough to damage stuff.

 

[Karadjgne]

Not so. Current is current. Doesn't matter if it's DC voltage or AC voltage. 100 milli amps can be lethal. The amperage output on 12v rails can be as low as 12A or higher than 70A. All it takes is grabbing a nicked pcie wire, or plugging one in and touching the 12v pin with 1 hand and touching the frame with the other and you will put that current directly across your chest. More people die each year in the US from electrocution in their homes on a 15A circuit than do in electric chair executions.

Unplug the psu, hold power button for 10 seconds to drain the caps, then work on the pc. It's not rocket science.

 

[Someone Somewhere]

But you'd be hard-pressed to get 100mA because the skin impedance of your body is too high. Even the internal resistance is high enough that you're certainly never going to see 70A, though you might get enough to cause trouble if you've managed to make your skin very conductive.

V=IZ, remember.

I'm sure you've touched both ends of a car battery at the same time, and not died.

 

[Karadjgne]

True, with DC voltage it usually takes at least 40v to be lethal, depends on skin moisture, hydration etc. But you will generally burn the hell out of yourself if you place a forearm across the terminals, body resistance not being high enough to prevent much voltage transmission and therefore current.