Can I not use Windows ME on my new DIMENSION 3000????

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Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"Bob Levine" <robjlevin.nospan@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:xq3ke.501$nb.480@trndny03...
> Krisztina Susza wrote:
>
>> You all are kinda sorta, erhh, smart and intelligent.
>> BUT the question was:
>> Is it possible to run Win ME on a Dell Dimension 3000 System. I haven't
>> till now heard any intelligent insight on this from anyone of you.
>> So if you want to go on kidding and laughing you should start yourself a
>> new thread- or you are going to help..
>>
>>
>
> Go ahead and try it. The machine was not designed to run ME. There may or
> may not be drivers available for the hardware.
>
> Bob



The above answer from Bob is the bottom line. Virtually no one will
recommend that you go backwards from WinXP to WinMe, and with good
reason(s).

You're simply going to have to try it and feel any pain firsthand to know if
it works.

I know I wouldn't attempt this install for any of my customers. In fact,
short of ridiculous amounts of money to do so, I'd flatly refuse.

Good luck. If you attempt it and care to add your experience with it to the
group, I'd be interested - but only slightly.


Stew
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

S.Lewis wrote:

> <ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
> news:42907ab7.5493602@nntp.charter.net...
>
>>Yes, but Windows 95 is/was more stable than Windows ME !!! ... Ben Myers
>
> True, but the Yugo was probably infinitely more safe than the Ford Pinto as
> well. 😱)

You have any links to substantiate this?
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"Sparky Spartacus" <Sparky@universalexports.org> wrote in message
news:9z9ke.24529$NZ1.19793@fe09.lga...
> S.Lewis wrote:
>
>> <ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
>> news:42907ab7.5493602@nntp.charter.net...
>>
>>>Yes, but Windows 95 is/was more stable than Windows ME !!! ... Ben Myers
>>
>> True, but the Yugo was probably infinitely more safe than the Ford Pinto
>> as well. 😱)
>
> You have any links to substantiate this?



Quote: "Generic lemon versus safety lemon".

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4063790/

:)
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

| > Go ahead and try it. The machine was not designed to run ME.
There may or
| > may not be drivers available for the hardware.
| >
| > Bob

It was not originally my post, but and I realized, that my system
is for sure not working with ME. But only because of the graphics
driver. If have some games which refuse to run on XP nor on w2k.
Also some other mathematical software also not running on XP.
The system would run much faster if it is installed on ME. And
that although it has not even optimized or the best chipset
drivers. So ME might not better than XP but it is definitely
faster and smaller.
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

So is DOS 5.0!

"Krisztina Susza" <krisztina.sz@gmx.net> wrote in message
news:4290e416$1@news.uni-rostock.de...
>So ME might not better than XP but it is definitely faster and smaller.
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

And DOS 2.11 !!! Definitely leaner and meaner... Ben Myers

On Sun, 22 May 2005 20:25:21 GMT, "WSZsr" <nospam@hotmail.com> wrote:

>So is DOS 5.0!
>
>"Krisztina Susza" <krisztina.sz@gmx.net> wrote in message
>news:4290e416$1@news.uni-rostock.de...
>>So ME might not better than XP but it is definitely faster and smaller.
>
>
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

On Sun, 22 May 2005 19:06:32 +0200, "Krisztina Susza"
<krisztina.sz@gmx.net> wrote:

>You all are kinda sorta, erhh, smart and intelligent.
>BUT the question was:
>Is it possible to run Win ME on a Dell Dimension 3000 System. I haven't till
>now heard any intelligent insight on this from anyone of you.
>So if you want to go on kidding and laughing you should start yourself a new
>thread- or you are going to help..


>
What everyone is trying to tell you in a kind way is that Installing
windows ME on a PC that already has XP installed on it, is like
dropping the engine out of your new Corvette, and hooking up a couple
of glue horses to the front bumper. :)
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Which part? The Yugo vs. Pinto or Windows 95 vs Windows ME? ... Ben Myers

On Sun, 22 May 2005 20:35:18 -0400, Sparky Spartacus
<Sparky@universalexports.org> wrote:

>S.Lewis wrote:
>
>> <ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
>> news:42907ab7.5493602@nntp.charter.net...
>>
>>>Yes, but Windows 95 is/was more stable than Windows ME !!! ... Ben Myers
>>
>> True, but the Yugo was probably infinitely more safe than the Ford Pinto as
>> well. 😱)
>
>You have any links to substantiate this?
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Yes. The opposite of what a friend of mine did many years ago. He dropped a
Porsche 356 engine into a VW beetle. When he got stopped on the Ryan Expressway
in Chi for doing 120mph, he opened up the lid in back of the beetle and pointed
to the engine. The engine looked like any other VW engine, and the cop walked
away mumbling about the malfunctioning radar... Ben

On Mon, 23 May 2005 00:11:07 GMT, Capt Bob <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:

>On Sun, 22 May 2005 19:06:32 +0200, "Krisztina Susza"
><krisztina.sz@gmx.net> wrote:
>
>>You all are kinda sorta, erhh, smart and intelligent.
>>BUT the question was:
>>Is it possible to run Win ME on a Dell Dimension 3000 System. I haven't till
>>now heard any intelligent insight on this from anyone of you.
>>So if you want to go on kidding and laughing you should start yourself a new
>>thread- or you are going to help..
>
>
>>
>What everyone is trying to tell you in a kind way is that Installing
>windows ME on a PC that already has XP installed on it, is like
>dropping the engine out of your new Corvette, and hooking up a couple
>of glue horses to the front bumper. :)
>
>
>
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Ben Myers wrote:

> Yes. The opposite of what a friend of mine did many years ago. He dropped a
> Porsche 356 engine into a VW beetle. When he got stopped on the Ryan Expressway
> in Chi for doing 120mph, he opened up the lid in back of the beetle and pointed
> to the engine. The engine looked like any other VW engine, and the cop walked
> away mumbling about the malfunctioning radar... Ben

Cool - love it!

Like the classic:

Cop: "Your car's been parked here for hours, the hood's ice cold"

Owner: "But officer, the engine's in the rear".
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"Krisztina Susza" <krisztina.sz@gmx.net> wrote:
>Is it possible to run Win ME on a Dell Dimension 3000 System. I haven't till
>now heard any intelligent insight on this from anyone of you.

What happened when you used the Intel chipset identifier to determine
the chipset and then looked on the Intel site for drivers for that
chipset?

[Won't machines without chipset drivers _work_ in some kind of default
mode, by treating the hardware as though it were just a PC?]
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"Krisztina Susza" <krisztina.sz@gmx.net> wrote:
>It was not originally my post, but and I realized, that my system
>is for sure not working with ME. But only because of the graphics
>driver.

OK, so drop in a video card that _has_ WinME (*) drivers and see how
that does.

From the ATI driver page for WinME:

/*
Note:As of January 1, 2004, Microsoft no longer accepts certification
submissions for the Microsoft® Windows® Millennium Edition operating
system. For more information refer to the following Microsoft®
website:
http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/hwtest/search/details.aspx?ID=800. ATI
Customer Care however is committed to all its customers and is now
providing non certified WHQL software drivers for users of the Windows
Millennium Edition operating system. These drivers will provide
enhanced stability and focuses on fixing known issues associated with
previous versions of the Windows Millennium Edition software driver.

Windows 98SE is supported through the Windows Millennium Edition
driver.

For users that require a WHQL certified driver that is supported under
Windows 98/98SE and Windows ME, ATI recommends using the CATALYST 4.3
drivers (Supports RADEON 7000 through RADEON 9800 Series only).
*/

(*) We always called it LoseME, but that's the rathole you don't want
to hear.
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

As previously stated, if the Dell Dimension 3000 has an Intel 900-series
chipset, support for the chipset and on-board graphics only goes back as far as
Windows 2000. Intel provides 98/SE support for boards with an 800-series
chipset, including the 865 and 875.

The OP and any other interested party should keep in mind that Windows ME is
limited to 512MB system memory, unless one takes heroic and extreme action.

.... Ben Myers

On Mon, 23 May 2005 09:39:58 -0400, William P. N. Smith wrote:

>"Krisztina Susza" <krisztina.sz@gmx.net> wrote:
>>Is it possible to run Win ME on a Dell Dimension 3000 System. I haven't till
>>now heard any intelligent insight on this from anyone of you.
>
>What happened when you used the Intel chipset identifier to determine
>the chipset and then looked on the Intel site for drivers for that
>chipset?
>
>[Won't machines without chipset drivers _work_ in some kind of default
>mode, by treating the hardware as though it were just a PC?]
>
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers) wrote:
>As previously stated, if the Dell Dimension 3000 has an Intel 900-series
>chipset, support for the chipset and on-board graphics only goes back as far as
>Windows 2000. Intel provides 98/SE support for boards with an 800-series
>chipset, including the 865 and 875.

Ah, I missed that part, sorry.

>William P. N. Smith wrote:
>>[Won't machines without chipset drivers _work_ in some kind of default
>>mode, by treating the hardware as though it were just a PC?]

My second question still stands, isn't everything backwards compatable
to the original IBM PC at the end of the day?
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

| The OP and any other interested party should keep in mind that
Windows ME is
| limited to 512MB system memory, unless one takes heroic and
extreme action.

That means it will use the swap partition if you more RAM
installed? Or do you mean it will not run on such a system?

Oh, and thanks for the ATI suggestion. Wouldhave been an option if
it wasn't an integrated Intel 855GME graphics in a Dell Latitude.
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

It has been a while since I worried about this one, and I do not recall all the
details. Micro$oft has a Knowledgebase article about the limitation. There are
ways to use more than 512MB, but some serious modification of either the
registry or windows.ini is required. Better not to encounter the combination.

.... Ben Myers

On Mon, 23 May 2005 19:53:23 +0200, "Krisztina Susza" <krisztina.sz@gmx.net>
wrote:

>| The OP and any other interested party should keep in mind that
>Windows ME is
>| limited to 512MB system memory, unless one takes heroic and
>extreme action.
>
>That means it will use the swap partition if you more RAM
>installed? Or do you mean it will not run on such a system?
>
>Oh, and thanks for the ATI suggestion. Wouldhave been an option if
>it wasn't an integrated Intel 855GME graphics in a Dell Latitude.
>
>
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

On Mon, 23 May 2005 19:53:23 +0200, in alt.sys.pc-clone.dell, "Krisztina
Susza" <krisztina.sz@gmx.net> wrote:

>>| The OP and any other interested party should keep in mind that
>>Windows ME is
>>| limited to 512MB system memory, unless one takes heroic and
>>extreme action.
>
>That means it will use the swap partition if you more RAM
>installed? Or do you mean it will not run on such a system?

It means that, if you have more than 512MB of memory with WinMe, you may get
'Out of memory' errors when you actually have more than enough memory
installed for what you're trying to do.

If I remember right, you can avoid the error messages by changing the
'VCache' setting in one of the .ini files, but even with that changed WinMe
still doesn't use large amounts of memory very efficiently.

As Ben mentioned, this is covered by an article in Microsoft's Knowledge
Base: try searching for 'vcache' to see if that finds the article.
--
Nick <mailto:tanstaafl@pobox.com>

"Natural laws have no pity." R.A.H.
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"Krisztina Susza" <krisztina.sz@gmx.net> wrote:
>Oh, and thanks for the ATI suggestion. Wouldhave been an option if
>it wasn't an integrated Intel 855GME graphics in a Dell Latitude.

Oh, the subject headers referring to the Dimension 3000 had me
confused.
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"Krisztina Susza" <krisztina.sz@gmx.net> wrote:
>Oh, and thanks for the ATI suggestion. Wouldhave been an option if
>it wasn't an integrated Intel 855GME graphics in a Dell Latitude.

Now I'm really confused, Intel has the:

/*
Multi language: win9x1361.exe Download

Ver:13.6.1 Date:12/31/2003 Size:7254 (KB) Time @56Kbps:16.79 min
OS:Windows* 98 SE, Windows* Me
*/

Drivers on their WWWebsite. Just goto drivers, type in the part
number, and pick WinME.
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

On Mon, 23 May 2005 18:58:35 GMT, in alt.sys.pc-clone.dell, Nick
<tanstaafl@pobox.com> wrote:

>If I remember right, you can avoid the error messages by changing the
>'VCache' setting in one of the .ini files, but even with that changed WinMe
>still doesn't use large amounts of memory very efficiently.
>
>As Ben mentioned, this is covered by an article in Microsoft's Knowledge
>Base: try searching for 'vcache' to see if that finds the article.

This web page has info on the memory management problems, including the
Vcache issues and fixes, in the section on 'THREE EXCEPTIONS...' part way
down the page: <http://www.aumha.org/win4/a/memmgmt.htm>

Personally, I'd recommend upgrading to WinXP if you're going to put more
than 512MB of memory into a WinMe computer. WinXP doesn't have the memory
management problems with large amounts of memory that WinMe has.


Actually, I'd recommend upgrading to WinXP regardless: it's a lot more
stable than WinMe ever was.

--
Nick <mailto:tanstaafl@pobox.com>

Nick's two rules of spammer talk:

1. Spammers lie.
2. If a spammer ever appears to be telling
the truth, please refer to rule number 1.
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Yes, computers will probably work in a somewhat degraded mode with Windows XP if
the proper drivers are not installed. It's a little ugly though. Some devices
may not work at all. Other devices will sort of limp along, a lot like safe
mode.

And, YES! Newer computers probably are backward compatible to the original IBM
AT, but only in DOS mode. I bet they could run DOS 3.0 very nicely. Windows
3.1 would be pretty ugly, especially with its pre-95 64MB memory limit. As for
the end of the day, it ends here in the EDT time zone in about 47 minutes. :)

.... Ben Myers

On Mon, 23 May 2005 19:03:01 -0400, William P. N. Smith wrote:

>ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers) wrote:
>>As previously stated, if the Dell Dimension 3000 has an Intel 900-series
>>chipset, support for the chipset and on-board graphics only goes back as far as
>>Windows 2000. Intel provides 98/SE support for boards with an 800-series
>>chipset, including the 865 and 875.
>
>Ah, I missed that part, sorry.
>
>>William P. N. Smith wrote:
>>>[Won't machines without chipset drivers _work_ in some kind of default
>>>mode, by treating the hardware as though it were just a PC?]
>
>My second question still stands, isn't everything backwards compatable
>to the original IBM PC at the end of the day?
>
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers) wrote:
>Yes, computers will probably work in a somewhat degraded mode with Windows XP if
>the proper drivers are not installed. It's a little ugly though. Some devices
>may not work at all. Other devices will sort of limp along, a lot like safe
>mode.

But the OP wanted WinME, which ought to work, yes?

>And, YES! Newer computers probably are backward compatible to the original IBM
>AT, but only in DOS mode. I bet they could run DOS 3.0 very nicely. Windows
>3.1 would be pretty ugly, especially with its pre-95 64MB memory limit.

Isn't WinME mostly DOS-based like it's predecesor OSen?
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

| Now I'm really confused, Intel has the:
|
| /*
| Multi language: win9x1361.exe Download
|
| Ver:13.6.1 Date:12/31/2003 Size:7254 (KB) Time @56Kbps:16.79 min
| OS:Windows* 98 SE, Windows* Me
| */
|
| Drivers on their WWWebsite. Just goto drivers, type in the part
| number, and pick WinME.

Now I am confused as well. I already tried installing but my
system woud refuse to wokr. I remeber having problems with the
display limited to 256 colors and not recognising the DVD-ROM
drive. Maybe it was the chipset driver which made problems. I
ended up installing XP and W2k. W2k supports part of my software
which is better than nothing compared to XP. Oh and I know that
there is a compatibility switch, but ist doesn't work.
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

When installing an operating system, do the following to avoid software
problems:

1. Install the operating system, then take note as to which devices are marked
with yellow or red marks in Device Manager.

2. Install the chipset drivers for the main chipset on the motherboard. In this
case, the Intel-900 series chipset drivers would seem to be required. If the
chipset drivers are not installed IMMEDIATELY after the operating system, there
is likely to be trouble.

3. Install the graphics drivers needed by the motherboard or graphics card.
Again, Intel 900-series extreme graphics in the case of a Dimension 3000.

4. See which devices remain with yellow or red marks in Device Manager, then
determine the chipset manufacturers for the devices, and download and install
the appropriate drivers.

5. DVD devices need DVD player software, like WinDVD, to function correctly.
This software is not part of the operating system. Some DVD devices are combo
devices with the ability to read and/or write CDs. Others are DVD readers
(DVD-ROM), plain and simple.

If the required drivers are not built into the operating system CD, the above
recipe works whether upgrading to a newer operating system or downgrading to an
older operating system. Of course, the required drivers must be available
somewhere, or one will never succeed in having a fully operational system.

.... Ben Myers

On Tue, 24 May 2005 12:37:13 +0200, "Krisztina Susza" <krisztina.sz@gmx.net>
wrote:

>| Now I'm really confused, Intel has the:
>|
>| /*
>| Multi language: win9x1361.exe Download
>|
>| Ver:13.6.1 Date:12/31/2003 Size:7254 (KB) Time @56Kbps:16.79 min
>| OS:Windows* 98 SE, Windows* Me
>| */
>|
>| Drivers on their WWWebsite. Just goto drivers, type in the part
>| number, and pick WinME.
>
>Now I am confused as well. I already tried installing but my
>system woud refuse to wokr. I remeber having problems with the
>display limited to 256 colors and not recognising the DVD-ROM
>drive. Maybe it was the chipset driver which made problems. I
>ended up installing XP and W2k. W2k supports part of my software
>which is better than nothing compared to XP. Oh and I know that
>there is a compatibility switch, but ist doesn't work.
>
>
 
Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

With ANY version of Windows, if the chipset manufacturer does not provide the
drivers required by that version, the system will simply not function at 100%.
This is true for Windows ME or any other version of Windows. And for Linux, for
that matter.

Windows ME is either an aardvark or a platypus, depending on ones grasp of
biology. It cannot be booted to the DOS command prompt like 95/98, IIRC. It
introduces more 32-bit NT-ish stuff than Win 98, but still retains a lot of the
DOS-based artifacts including inferior memory management, both program memory
and the restricted Windows'-own memory (user, GDI).

Of course, since I have not pried into Windows ME very much lately, my own
memory management may be a little inferior and I can't recall all the
differences between 98 and ME. I just know enough to avoid ME, a short-lived
aberration, as even some Micro$ofties will attest... Ben Myers

On Tue, 24 May 2005 08:25:17 -0400, William P. N. Smith wrote:

>ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers) wrote:
>>Yes, computers will probably work in a somewhat degraded mode with Windows XP if
>>the proper drivers are not installed. It's a little ugly though. Some devices
>>may not work at all. Other devices will sort of limp along, a lot like safe
>>mode.
>
>But the OP wanted WinME, which ought to work, yes?
>
>>And, YES! Newer computers probably are backward compatible to the original IBM
>>AT, but only in DOS mode. I bet they could run DOS 3.0 very nicely. Windows
>>3.1 would be pretty ugly, especially with its pre-95 64MB memory limit.
>
>Isn't WinME mostly DOS-based like it's predecesor OSen?
>
 
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