Question Capacitator fell off motherboard (Pc still running, should i be concerned)

[dayosaiyajin]

I think i knocked it off somehow above cpu while changing cooler, the first capacitator out of 4,
Pc is running (idk?) but cpu temps right now are 58-70 with google chrome on twitch, haven't tried games
because i'm afraid if it would be a problem that the capacitor is gone.
My questions are if anyone can answer, what is the capacitor for, should i be concerned,
Should i search for a new motheboard, (the legs of the capacitor are still on the motherboard) (the capacitor is small)

Motheboard: Z270-Gaming k3
Capacitator:
FP5K
67ch
5 6 1
6.3

 

[Lutfij]

Welcome to the forums, newcomer!

if you've knocked out capacitors that are around the CPU's power delivery, you should replace them or see if you can reseat them. Might want to pass on iamges of the afflicted area for good measure.

 

[dayosaiyajin]

Welcome to the forums, newcomer!

if you've knocked out capacitors that are around the CPU's power delivery, you should replace them or see if you can reseat them. Might want to pass on iamges of the afflicted area for good measure.

Image Hope it helps. (I don't think i'll be able to reseat/replace them myself)

 

[artk2219]

I think i knocked it off somehow above cpu while changing cooler, the first capacitator out of 4,
Pc is running (idk?) but cpu temps right now are 58-70 with google chrome on twitch, haven't tried games
because i'm afraid if it would be a problem that the capacitor is gone.
My questions are if anyone can answer, what is the capacitor for, should i be concerned,
Should i search for a new motheboard, (the legs of the capacitor are still on the motherboard) (the capacitor is small)

Motheboard: Z270-Gaming k3
Capacitator:
FP5K
67ch
5 6 1
6.3

You haven't pushed the system hard since you cause the damage? It shouldn't blow up or anything, if it were going to it would have when you first powered it back on, but It may lead to stability issues.

 

[Grobe]

Image Hope it helps. (I don't think i'll be able to reseat/replace them myself)

I cannot see from your image if the legs still peaks up from the pcb. If the legs of the runaway capacitor happens to still stay there, there is the risk of a short circuit.

Otherwise, one capacitor gone will cause more stress to the remaining caps and thereby probably reduce the life span to the motherboard.

Other from that, the motherboard should continue to work, at least as long as not too much work on the PSU.

 

[dayosaiyajin]

I cannot see from your image if the legs still peaks up from the pcb. If the legs of the runaway capacitor happens to still stay there, there is the risk of a short circuit.

Otherwise, one capacitor gone will cause more stress to the remaining caps and thereby probably reduce the life span to the motherboard.

Other from that, the motherboard should continue to work, at least as long as not too much work on the PSU.

I see, thank you for the information, the legs are still there yes, is there a way to remove them to remove the risk of a short circuit?

 

[dayosaiyajin]

You haven't pushed the system hard since you cause the damage? It shouldn't blow up or anything, if it were going to it would have when you first powered it back on, but It may lead to stability issues.

I tried playing some games, other than 90-99C-ish temperatures everything is fine,
"It shouldn't blow up or anything, if it were going to it would have when you first powered it back on"
Good to know
Edit: it reaches 100/102C on some occasions
Edit2: Information with HWinfo (using speedfan as well, on speedfan i don't get above 90)

 

[artk2219]

I see, thank you for the information, the legs are still there yes, is there a way to remove them to remove the risk of a short circuit?

Turn it off, unplug the power cable, hit the power button for 10 seconds to clear any residual charge, then see if you can grab the remaining post with tweezers. If you wiggle it back and forth several times, the post should snap off.

 

[RaidHobbit]

I think i knocked it off somehow above cpu while changing cooler, the first capacitator out of 4,
Pc is running (idk?) but cpu temps right now are 58-70 with google chrome on twitch, haven't tried games
because i'm afraid if it would be a problem that the capacitor is gone.
My questions are if anyone can answer, what is the capacitor for, should i be concerned,
Should i search for a new motheboard, (the legs of the capacitor are still on the motherboard) (the capacitor is small)

Motheboard: Z270-Gaming k3
Capacitator:
FP5K
67ch
5 6 1
6.3

As an engineering graduate, if this is a capacitor involved in power regulation its just to ensure the efficient use of electricity. I wouldn`t worry about it.

If it is critical to the functioning of something, its not something you`re using or you would know about it.

If you are concerned (and I don`t think you need to be) then a soldering iron, some solder, and ordering the same capacitor of the internet will sort you out.

It should be for the efficient use of power, loosing it won`t put anything else under additional stress. It will just mean your motherboard power efficiency dropped a bit. CPUs don`t use high wattages, its not going to add that much to your electricity bill, don`t worry about it.

 

[Grobe]

As an engineering graduate, if this is a capacitor involved in power regulation its just to ensure the efficient use of electricity.

The purpose of the capacitors isn't to - per say - ensure efficient use (can't see how a SMPS power supply would work properly without capacitors (there may exist some patents, but those wouldn't be within a price range suited for consumer marked, but rather for space/military use)) but to smooth the voltage output.

If you are concerned (and I don`t think you need to be) then a soldering iron, some solder, and ordering the same capacitor of the internet will sort you out.

Yes, but only if OP have prior experience using a solder iron, or OP can effort using this motherboard as a exercise project for improving soldering skills and accept the risk of brick the mobo.

It should be for the efficient use of power, loosing it won`t put anything else under additional stress. It will just mean your motherboard power efficiency dropped a bit. CPUs don`t use high wattages, its not going to add that much to your electricity bill, don`t worry about it.

Some of this is factually untrue, and some must be guesswork. The remaining capacitors will share the extra load for the missing one. CPU's for gaming often exceed 65 watts - however how much of that flowing through the SMPS that is on the motherbard is hard to say without studying the schematic for the motherboard in detail.

If you by "efficiency dropped a bit" means in measurable wattages, this isn't true - unless (only unless, I only say this to be very nice guy) those capacitors are of extremely bad quality and have a parasitic resistance that made them develop heat when loaded - but this doesn't happens because it would have defeated the purpose of a SMPS supply. If that was true, it must also implies that the ripple voltage (noise / very unstable voltage) would cause other components on the motherboard to become unstable.

 

[RaidHobbit]

The purpose of the capacitors isn't to - per say - ensure efficient use (can't see how a SMPS power supply would work properly without capacitors (there may exist some patents, but those wouldn't be within a price range suited for consumer marked, but rather for space/military use)) but to smooth the voltage output.

Yes, but only if OP have prior experience using a solder iron, or OP can effort using this motherboard as a exercise project for improving soldering skills and accept the risk of brick the mobo.

Some of this is factually untrue, and some must be guesswork. The remaining capacitors will share the extra load for the missing one. CPU's for gaming often exceed 65 watts - however how much of that flowing through the SMPS that is on the motherbard is hard to say without studying the schematic for the motherboard in detail.

If you by "efficiency dropped a bit" means in measurable wattages, this isn't true - unless (only unless, I only say this to be very nice guy) those capacitors are of extremely bad quality and have a parasitic resistance that made them develop heat when loaded - but this doesn't happens because it would have defeated the purpose of a SMPS supply. If that was true, it must also implies that the ripple voltage (noise / very unstable voltage) would cause other components on the motherboard to become unstable.

This is wrong on so many levels.

To begin with capacitors are used to provide voltage and current regulation, or as you call it `smoothing`. But those are the ones in the PSU, not the ones of the motherboard. Essentially they remove spikes and dips in the current and voltage supplied to the motherboard.

Capacitors on the motherboard are used for two reasons:

1. The timed activation of a component, components, or area of a circuit. These capacitors are critical and loosing one will often result in a non-functional computer. The OPs motherboard works, so if it is a critical one then he isn`t using the area of the motherboard which it controls.

2. To ensure power efficiency by maintaining a Q value of 80% to 85%. In simple terms, they keep the voltage 80% to 85% aligned with the current so there isn`t a wastage of power. The more out of phase they become, the worse the wastage. All components impact that alignment. So when electrical engineers are designing a motherboard they do a load of calculations, and put in some extra components (capacitors with resistors) to ensure the alignment. The worst case scenario is the OPs motherboard became a little less power efficient, the best case scenario is it went the other way and its now slightly more power efficient. A single lost capacitor is pretty much irrelevant when it comes to electricity bills.

There is no such thing as capacitors taking on extra load when one is lost. They do not take on extra work. They all are set in the rate they charge and discharge, they are all fed off the same voltage rail, and the current available to each doesn`t change.

 

[Grobe]

This is wrong on so many levels.

This isn't a very polite way of starting a discussing, is it?

There is no such thing as capacitors taking on extra load when one is lost.

No ?

They do not take on extra work. They all are set in the rate they charge and discharge

Ok - so you actually meant to say that I worded myself incorrectly? I should probably have used the term reactive effect - but what I wrote is meant for somebody not familiar with electrical terms. Meaning if I remove the term "load" and replace with "reactive effect" or "RMS current" my statement is correct! That's for nit picking on the terms.

they are all fed off the same voltage rail, and the current available to each doesn`t change.

So - here you admit you understand that the caps must be connected in parallel to each other. Seem to me you still holding strong on the wrong idea. If you're adamant I'm wrong, then please do a proper attempt to show this, instead of an half hearten attempt to insult me for pointing out the wrongs and wording your explanations in such a way to obscure any meaning for a person that hasn't an electrical background...

This is a forum where the majority of user doesn't have a background as electrical engineers, so please have that in mind when explaining the hows and why. You are in your full right to point out factual fault, but it's also good to be open minded because perhaps you can learn a thing or two yourself when discussing things.

Ok - me first - Open minded : I haven't actually had a look on the particular schematic for OP's motherboard and I assume I wouldn't get access to it either, even if I asked the manufacturer politely. So I give you this : You may be correct when you claims there is no SMPS on the motherboard.
But - this is nit picking in my opinion and doesn't applies any changes to the underlying physic rules for electrical circuits.

Ok - I'm a nice guy so I give you one more. Lack of capacitance on output stage on SMPS power supplies may actually cause the voltage to rise and thus cause some components to inadvertly draw more power. But then again, that is not the main problem, because the high frequensy noise on the dc voltage is most probably the main part on causing unstability on those components that is being feeded by the supply. This depends on the design for each components.

 

[RaidHobbit]

This isn't a very polite way of starting a discussing, is it?


No ?


Ok - so you actually meant to say that I worded myself incorrectly? I should probably have used the term reactive effect - but what I wrote is meant for somebody not familiar with electrical terms. Meaning if I remove the term "load" and replace with "reactive effect" or "RMS current" my statement is correct! That's for nit picking on the terms.


So - here you admit you understand that the caps must be connected in parallel to each other. Seem to me you still holding strong on the wrong idea. If you're adamant I'm wrong, then please do a proper attempt to show this, instead of an half hearten attempt to insult me for pointing out the wrongs and wording your explanations in such a way to obscure any meaning for a person that hasn't an electrical background...

This is a forum where the majority of user doesn't have a background as electrical engineers, so please have that in mind when explaining the hows and why. You are in your full right to point out factual fault, but it's also good to be open minded because perhaps you can learn a thing or two yourself when discussing things.

Ok - me first - Open minded : I haven't actually had a look on the particular schematic for OP's motherboard and I assume I wouldn't get access to it either, even if I asked the manufacturer politely. So I give you this : You may be correct when you claims there is no SMPS on the motherboard.
But - this is nit picking in my opinion and doesn't applies any changes to the underlying physic rules for electrical circuits.

Ok - I'm a nice guy so I give you one more. Lack of capacitance on output stage on SMPS power supplies may actually cause the voltage to rise and thus cause some components to inadvertly draw more power. But then again, that is not the main problem, because the high frequensy noise on the dc voltage is most probably the main part on causing unstability on those components that is being feeded by the supply. This depends on the design for each components.

Well it is equally rude telling someone they don`t know what they`re talking about when you have never learned about the topic.

The voltage and current do not change in perfect sync with each other. That would be 100% alignment and its illegal because it causes what many would see as EMP waves. Not enough to have a widespread effect, but certainly enough to damage nearby electronics and give someone electric shocks whenever they touch something metal a few metres away. Super power efficient washing machines are the usual guilty party causing people to get shocks when they touch their sinks, etc.

The voltage either leads or lags behind the current, with the alignment for consumer electronics being required to fall within the range of 80% to 85%. As each component in the circuit changes the alignment the electrical engineers calculate the alignment for the circuit as a whole, and then add in some extra components to place the alignment back in the range of 80% to 85%. Capacitors cause the current to lag by 90 degrees, inductors to lead by 90 degrees, and all the other components like resisters to lead but by an amount determined by the rating of the component.

So by combining capacitors and resisters you can get the realignment needed. One missing capacitor isn`t going to have much impact in the grand scheme of things to the electric bills.

 

[Moonstick2]

Using capacitors to change the phase (lead/lag) between voltage and current for improved efficiency is an AC thing. Computer chips rely on DC so this isn't what they're used for. Also, resistors cannot introduce any kind of lead or lag.

Everything I can find points towards these being decoupling capacitors, which are there to ensure a clean regular voltage to the IC (CPU in this case) as the input voltage fluctuates in response to the output of the PSU and the changing demands around the rest of the system. This paper provides plenty of reading (emphasis mine):

"Individual ICs will not see the purely constant voltage they need for proper operation; noise in the voltage supply can cause false logic triggering or insufficient potential to drive signals on or off the chip. The current changes demanded by the IC will not be supplied because of the series inductance.

The solution to this problem is to put capacitors, called decoupling or bypass capacitors, across the power and ground distribution conductors, physically close to the ICs that are demanding the varying current...Viewed as decoupling capacitors, they act as batteries to run the IC for one clock cycle. In between periods of high current demand, the power supply acts as a battery charger to recharge the capacitor..."

Multiple capacitors (see section with Figures 5 and 6) appear to be about shaping the frequency/impedance response. I don't see how the remaining capacitors could 'work harder' to make up for the loss of one, so the effect of the loss of a capacitor is a change in the response rather than any extra stress on the others.

The designers will balance saving costs by avoiding unnecessary components against erring on the side of caution, components always having some variation.

@dayosaiyajin, the loss of this capacitor means one/some of voltage inputs to your CPU may not be as smooth as they should be, which could impact performance, even to the extent of the processor misbehaving and making mistakes. It's impossible for us to know which parts of the processor might be affected: maybe it'll work fine no matter what; maybe it'll crash in certain situations; maybe it'll silently corrupt data or files. You could ask Gigabyte to see if they can advise you on what the likely impact might be. In the meantime what you do depends on how much you rely on the computer and how critical is the stuff you store on it.