News China's president says it doesn't need ASML — tells Dutch PM it will continue with advanced technological progress regardless

[Admin]

China's President Xi Jinping still wants the Netherlands to stop following American export restrictions, but he also said that continuing to do so would not stop the nation's progress.

China's president says it doesn't need ASML — tells Dutch PM it will continue with advanced technological progress regardless : Read more

 

[peachpuff]

That's called a bluff.

 

[Notton]

I don't understand that paragraph with the "WMD" randomly inserted into it.
Can you elaborate?

 

[parkerthon]

Good luck to them. I’m sure the global market would welcome the competition long term, but there’s a reason they are a natural monopoly.

There’s no reason to believe a word China or Russia says. Not least because they have no accountability to their people to be honest or factually semi-correct in the least. This trickles down to everything including overstating their plans and capabilities. ASML certainly knows this.

 

[parkerthon]

That's called a bluff.

Thats called domestic propaganda. Nobody believes them. Especially given the huge headwinds they are facing with their own demographics and heavy handed economic development policies. We should only focus on China militarily at present and western countries ability to decouple our technology supply chains if their dictator decides to finally “reunify China” and invade Taiwan.

 

[bit_user]

It's a negotiating tactic, nothing more.

If Xi Jinping didn't care about ASML, why would he even bother meeting with the Prime Minister of a small European country? I mean, how often does that even happen??

 

[endocine]

China absolutely has the right to develop and chart their own technological progress, independent of any other nation. The problem is that, ok, so just go do it and beat ASML at their own game. Today, that isn't happening, certainly not without a lot of industrial espionage.

 

[ivan_vy]

China absolutely has the right to develop and chart their own technological progress, independent of any other nation. The problem is that, ok, so just go do it and beat ASML at their own game. Today, that isn't happening, certainly not without a lot of industrial espionage.

many problems are solved throwing money at it, they eventually catch up, the coffers are filling up
https://www.tomshardware.com/tech-i...r-chinese-pc-sales-dell-loses-44-market-share

 

[ivan_vy]

Thats called domestic propaganda. Nobody believes them. Especially given the huge headwinds they are facing with their own demographics and heavy handed economic development policies. We should only focus on China militarily at present and western countries ability to decouple our technology supply chains if their dictator decides to finally “reunify China” and invade Taiwan.

looks like sanctions-happy lawmakers want this, war in Europe has just benefited war industry and gas industry, I don't think a semiconductor motivated war would benefit the world.

 

[derekullo]

I don't understand that paragraph with the "WMD" randomly inserted into it.
Can you elaborate?

Nuclear physics is infamously complex and requires a lot of complex computer modeling to get right.

 

[Pierce2623]

looks like sanctions-happy lawmakers want this, war in Europe has just benefited war industry and gas industry, I don't think a semiconductor motivated war would benefit the world.

The guy didn’t endorse a semiconductor motivated war. He simply said the Western economy should be prepared to completely decouple from east Asia if necessary.

 

[umeng2002_2]

I hope China succeeds in this. Competition is always good.

 

[nookoool]

It's a negotiating tactic, nothing more.

If Xi Jinping didn't care about ASML, why would he even bother meeting with the Prime Minister of a small European country? I mean, how often does that even happen??

Well, he meets with PM/Presidents from some of the poorest countries in the world as well ... if you bother to follow Chinese news

 

[Amdlova]

They already ctrl+c ctrl+v the machine

 

[ThomasKinsley]

It sounds like President Xi Jinping is fairly confident that his country has the technological capabilities needed to continue development. Given that China's industry has managed to poached industry leaders who clearly know how to reach 3nm and smaller, I consider these sanctions materially meaningless. They serve to slow China down, but I do not see any evidence that the West is truly attempting to stop China from obtaining this technology.

 

[redgarl]

That's called a bluff.

More like DENIAL...

 

[watzupken]

Ultimately, all these sanctions are just going to hurt consumers and businesses. While it seems like ASML is doing ok without Chinese clients, but the reality is that if AI fad did not happen, it’s highly likely chip demand may slump. But fad being a fad will eventually die down. Not that it will go away, but the hype around it will cool. The mad rush for AI hardware will taper off at some point and settle down. ASML is losing a significant market, and that lost will impact demand. And if China do catch up over time, they don’t just lost a big chunk of sale, they will also have a competitor when ASML is pretty much a monopoly now. With less revenue, cost will go up that will be passed on to the fabs, and consumers will eventually foot that bill.

 

[watzupken]

That's called a bluff.

Bluff or not, time will tell. While they cannot acquire the machinery required at this point, it doesn’t mean they cannot hire the people to build the technology in house. And I believe this may be happening. If the entire nation is backing this, I guess investment $$ is not a big problem.

 

[bit_user]

Well, he meets with PM/Presidents from some of the poorest countries in the world as well ... if you bother to follow Chinese news

I misread/misremembered the article saying Xi visited Rutte. In fact, the Toms article doesn't say where the meeting happened, but the linked AP article says they met in Beijing.

That is not surprising to me, nor that heads of many poorer countries make the journey so they can prostrate themselves and kiss the ring (figuratively speaking).

 

[Notton]

Nuclear physics is infamously complex and requires a lot of complex computer modeling to get right.

Wow, I didn't know they had a RTX 4090 way back in 1964.

 

[bolweval]

Well, he meets with PM/Presidents from some of the poorest countries in the world as well ... if you bother to follow Chinese news

Only if they have resources he needs…

 

[NinoPino]

That's called a bluff.

Xi Jinping said: "...continuing to do so would not stop the nation's progress."
Do you really consider this a bluff ?

 

[Pierce2623]

It sounds like President Xi Jinping is fairly confident that his country has the technological capabilities needed to continue development. Given that China's industry has managed to poached industry leaders who clearly know how to reach 3nm and smaller, I consider these sanctions materially meaningless. They serve to slow China down, but I do not see any evidence that the West is truly attempting to stop China from obtaining this technology.

Of course it’s to slow them down. Nobody cares about “ 7nm” when it performs worse than 10nm. They care when China starts selling things so cheaply that any nation with a minimum wage can’t compete.

 

[COLGeek]

We are done here, folks. Thank you to those who stayed on topic.