News Chinese AI company says breakthroughs enabled creating a leading-edge AI model with 11X less compute — DeepSeek's optimizations highlight limits of...

[Admin]

DeepSeek trains DeepSeek-V3 model with 671 billion parameters on a cluster of 2048 GPUs.

Chinese AI company says breakthroughs enabled creating a leading-edge AI model with 11X less compute — DeepSeek's optimizations highlight limits of... : Read more

 

[Pierce2623]

Software optimizations will make it around the world in 5 minutes. What does this story have to do with US sanctions? If the sanctions force China into novel solutions that are actually good, rather than just announcements like most turn out, then maybe the IP theft shoe will be on the other foot and the sanctions will benefit the whole world.

 

[bit_user]

Some of these optimizations sound so obvious that I'm surprised if the other big players aren't doing comparable things. Others, like their techniques for reducing the precision and total amount of communication, seem like where the more unique IP might be.

using customized PTX (Parallel Thread Execution) instructions, which means writing low-level, specialized code that is meant to interface with Nvidia CUDA GPUs and optimize their operations.

PTX is basically the equivalent of programming Nvidia GPUs in assembly language. I think there's actually a lower-level language, but PTX is about as low as most people go.

https://docs.nvidia.com/cuda/parallel-thread-execution/index.html
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[DalaiLamar]

Software optimizations will make it around the world in 5 minutes. What does this story have to do with US sanctions? If the sanctions force China into novel solutions that are actually good, rather than just announcements like most turn out, then maybe the IP theft shoe will be on the other foot and the sanctions will benefit the whole world.

You answered your own question well.

 

[phead128]

Software optimizations will make it around the world in 5 minutes. What does this story have to do with US sanctions?

US thought if it prevent access to the latest Nvidia APUs, then China will always lag.

Ironically, it forced China to innovate, and it produced a better model than even ChatGPT 4 and Claude Sonnet, at a tiny fraction of the compute cost, so access to the latest Nvidia APU isn't even an issue.

Basically, this innovation really renders US sanctions moot, because you don't need hundred thousand clusters and tens of millions to produce a world-class model.

The whole notion of stopping a country's development is so patronizing and infantalizing.... that's not possible. Better just invest in innovation at home than trying to stop others.

 

[Pierce2623]

US thought if it prevent access to the latest Nvidia APUs, then China will always lag.

Ironically, it forced China to innovate, and it produced a better model than even ChatGPT 4 and Claude Sonnet, at a tiny fraction of the compute cost, so access to the latest Nvidia APU isn't even an issue.

Basically, this innovation really renders US sanctions moot, because you don't need hundred thousand clusters and tens of millions to produce a world-class model.

The whole notion of stopping a country's development is so patronizing and infantalizing.... that's not possible. Better just invest in innovation at home than trying to stop others.

The US didn’t think China would fall decades behind. They’re just forcing China to actually develop something on their own from scratch for once, instead of just shortcutting all R&D the expenses with IP theft.

 

[phead128]

The US didn’t think China would fall decades behind. They’re just forcing China to actually develop something on their own from scratch for once, instead of just shortcutting all R&D the expenses with IP theft.

No, it was based on "national security" grounds. US didn't go through all this effort merely to avenge IP theft, it's way more than that.