Confirmed: ASRock Says Intel's Coffee Lake CPUs Will Require New Motherboards

[hannibal]

Six core version may reguire more capable power delivery than 4 core at least when owervolted at least. So the mb-should be upgraded in anyway.

 

[ZRace]

To all those that say "Who's gonna buy a new CPU without getting a new motherboard anyway?":

There are people that buy Pentium G4560s on B250 boards today, and who may have hoped to be able to fit a Coffee Lake i5 or i7 in that very same motherboard a few years later. It's really not like everyone always buys a new motherboard for their new CPU.

 

[kotkotowski]

I will buy i7 8700K!!!

 

[zippyzion]

All I know is that Intel should probably get their heat issue licked before they start adding more cores to their mainstream CPUs. Although, adding cores would allow them to drop core speeds to manage heat, and give us that 10% incremental increase they think we all deserve.

 

[TeeNudnik]

I am using z170 platform. When I heard coffee lake cpu is also LGA1151, I was pretty happy. But now, intel just said "NO" to the people who want to keep their old motherboards. My next chip is definitely AMD Ryzen or Threadripper.

 

[lun471k]

To think that I'm still on my Sandy Bridge (2600K). My next move might be on AMD side.

 

[AcesB]

HOW LONG will the tech press realize that Intel is performing a sort of "tied selling", where they force consumer to shop a new MOBO - with chipset made by intel also - every time he/she have to update their PCs ?
That sort of bad behavior destroys the market, and that's why we need competition !
I'm not AMD fanboy, actually I use Intel since Pentium 100, but what they are doing is ugly and wrong !

 

[Guest]

A new Intel 8300 is 4/8 CPU with 4.0Ghz clock speed (not sure base or turbo) for $140, so there you go. I can't wait to see this $140 beats all AMD Ryzen offering in gaming, quite funny.

 

[Rookie_MIB]

I don't get all this outrage over Intel just continuing their 2-generation cadence of socket changes.

Perhaps what you're really upset about is that we're getting yet another 14 nm CPU - their 4th, if you count Broadwell?

BTW, do we know for sure there will be no additional PCIe lanes? It'd be nice for M.2 NVMe...

That's what I was going to point out. Looking at what is attached to the CPU direct vs chipset via DMI/PCIe x4 links:

Intel LGA1151 CPU: PCIe x 16 graphics, DDR4
AMD CPU: PCIe x 16 graphics, DDR4, AND PCIe x 4 (M.2 storage/SATA storage), 4x USB 3.1

Intel Z270: USB 3.1/3.0/2.0, PCIe x 24 for I/O, Gigabit Ethernet
AMD X370: USB 3.1/3.0/2.0, PCIe x 8 for I/O.

It may not seem like it, but there are some crucial differences - namely the addition of direct-to-cpu storage and USB connections. Intel does NOT offer that, thus ALL I/O has to go through the DMI.

It's very likely that Coffee Lake might well add some of those connections direct to the CPU, in fact, looking up some Coffee Lake block diagrams, there appear to be some connections labeled DP1.2 (DisplayPort 1.2) which can be routed to either M.2 storage and/or USB3.1. That would naturally have to be accounted for differently on the socket pinout, which of course is why they have to have a socket change from the current LGA 1151.

What IS going to be a problem is people thinking that any LGA 1151 processor is going to fit into the new LGA 1151 socket. You're going to get some confusion going on. As for this being a pure 'money play' by Intel, I don't think it is. From the looks of it, this is a necessity from the response to AMD. They can't have AMD offering something that they don't, especially when it could become very advantageous.

With a properly connected storage system, processing video could be much quicker on an AMD system as the M.2 storage as input and USB 3.1 as output could be much faster on AMD vs Intel because it bypasses the chipset and runs direct through the CPU. USB3.1 Drive -> CPU -> M.2 with each device having FULL bandwidth.

Meanwhile on Intel USB3.1 Drive -> Chipset -> DMI -> CPU -> DMI -> Chipset -> M.2 with the limit being the DMI interface which has to handle input and output.

 

[gggplaya]

So glad I went with a Ryzen 1600. All I have to do to upgrade is buy a new CPU when it comes out, a quick and painless swap. Might even get an 8 core next time around.

Intel burned me when I bought the i7 920, they then quickly changed sockets shortly after.

 

[cinergy]

Epic Fail. I go with AMD anyways.

 

[InvalidError]

Those who have a use for the best of the gimmicks and the vast majority who don't. Very few need native NVMe support on board, very few have a use for usb-c etc. But if you are one of the few who do buy newest tech, bragging rights, need etc,

Everyone will want native NVMe when NVMe SSDs get closer to price parity with SATA SSDs. Same thing with Type-C as more devices adopt it. The average person may not need it immediately but probably will want it 2-3 years after the early adopters.

 

[bloodroses]

To all those that say "Who's gonna buy a new CPU without getting a new motherboard anyway?":

There are people that buy Pentium G4560s on B250 boards today, and who may have hoped to be able to fit a Coffee Lake i5 or i7 in that very same motherboard a few years later. It's really not like everyone always buys a new motherboard for their new CPU.

Or just do what I do. When I go to upgrade the CPU, I end up replacing the board as well. That way you have a second system that can be re-purposed for various other tasks (NAS, streamer, Linux play box, hand me down to parents, etc). It's what most people I know do.

 

[captaincharisma]

so much for intel right now getting back at AMD. although i its hard to t trust anything said from a cheap Chinese mobo maker

 

[bloodroses]

so much for intel right now getting back at AMD. although i its hard to t trust anything said from a cheap Chinese mobo maker

They're Taiwanese, just like most of the other motherboard makers. They're also a high quality brand; originally a spinoff from Asus...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASRock

 

[Brian_R170]

Are there figures available for how many users actually upgrade to a brand new vs. used CPU in an existing motherboard? My gut says upgrading of CPUs is rare and upgrading to a brand new CPU (the scenario that benefits the CPU manufacturer the most) is a very tiny fraction of the market. It's just not worth making significant engineering changes or trade-offs for the sake of socket compatibility.

 

[Karadjgne]

Invalid, that's a good point, but, with most gamers keeping cpu/mobo for 3-5 years, only upgrading gpu in between, by the time NVMe and Type-C etc become common place in your 2-3 years, the socket in question is also no longer new, it's 2-3 years old, just like lga1151 is already a couple years old in a month. So 2 years from now puts lga1151 at 4yrs old, right in prime time cpu/mobo upgrade dates. It's only the pushy, early adopters that have any beef, but that's totally normal behavior, always have dissenters with a new platform, even amd isn't immune to that, ppl still quibbling about AM4 memory issues at high speeds.

 

[riseer11585]

My next Cpu looks like Ryzen atm my 6700k will do but i figure in a year or so i will bite maybe a better version of Ryzen with PCIE 4.0 will do it for me.

 

[riseer11585]

AMD is pro consumer,Intel needed their ass kicked and it seems AMD is doing just that. The FX lineup was garbage the Ryzen lineup is a complete 180 compared.

 

[InvalidError]

It's only the pushy, early adopters that have any beef

The budget shopper who gets a Pentium or i3 thinking he'll be able to get a cheap i7 3-4 years later is also going to get sore: i7-4790k still trade for $200-400. With so little depreciation over three years, better off buying new with warranty and the benefits of a new platform.

 

[bit_user]

like anyone has ever upgraded a processor without a new motherboard.

If you think about it, a good upgrade path would be from a Pentium of one generation -> i5 or i7 of the next generation. This would be a good way for a budget-constrained user to get their foot in the door, and then level-up their system as they get more funds.

 

[kinggremlin]

Hmm, maybe. But then again, maybe not. I'm gonna assume most users are like me. Cpu, gpu, ssd, hdd. Not really much else is needed for most. There's nothing I need that requires anything more than what my Z77 mobo can supply. So it really boils down to 2 types of ppl. Those who have a use for the best of the gimmicks and the vast majority who don't. Very few need native NVMe support on board, very few have a use for usb-c etc. But if you are one of the few who do buy newest tech, bragging rights, need etc, then changing sockets to fit changing cpu really doesn't amount to much as you'll not be trying to fit a coffee-lake cpu on a older gen mobo anyways as you'll not have the connections or support available anyways.

RGB lighting is a gimmick. The next USB/RAM/storage interfaces are not. They're not required today, but for anyone buying a Coffee Lake CPU later this year, by the time they are ready to replace that CPU they are going to wish they had them if they didn't. Based on the trend of decreasing single threaded performance improvements every new Intel generation, a 6 core Coffee Lake should last almost all users a good 4 to 5 years (if not longer the way things are going) before a decent replacement is released. Also, I picked those simply because they are the most recent examples of platform advancements. For users still on an older Sandy Bridge board or any non-Ryzen AMD board, there are certainly older technologies that are now common place on motherboards that they are missing out on.

 

[SockPuppet]

Always amuses me seeing AMD fanbots playing this particular angle. Why would you even buy a brand new CPU then turn around and immediately castrate its performance across the board by shoehorning it into some old and obsolete motherboard? That's stupid.

 

[InvalidError]

Why would you even buy a brand new CPU then turn around and immediately castrate its performance across the board by shoehorning it into some old and obsolete motherboard? That's stupid.

All of the performance-critical circuitry is inside the CPU, there isn't anything left on the motherboard that significantly affects the performance aside from the DMI or PCIe link between the chipset and CPU for IO. That's why motherboard reviews produce nearly identical results, give or take a few points due to overclocking results, reference clock deviation, minor BIOS differences, etc.

 

[Karadjgne]

Got my 3770k/Z77 fall of 2013, so I'm looking at 4yrs on this pc now. Having to buy a new mobo with new ram, new cpu and new gpu isn't something I'm gonna quibble about. I'm due some upgrades, I'd like native m.2 onboard support, native USB3.1, etc etc. Even being top of the line cpu, it's still a good 30+% behind anything currently top line, so having to change sockets to get what most already have isn't any sort of issue. Software controlled led would be nice, built into mobo headers instead of adding a hub which takes manual controls.