Core E4300 or a X2 3600?

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epsilon84

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Hi,

My game res is at 1024x768, but also a small step higher than 1024x768 since I'm using a plain CRT monitor only. Details? All high, AA 4x, AF 8x. I can always tune down to AA 2x, AF 4x but they look the same to me cause the FPS didn't drop at all. Strange as it seems. :D
Well if the FPS doesn't drop then you are indeed CPU bottlenecked. The 7300GT handles HL2 better than I thought. 8)

Anyhow, a rough rule of thumb is that C2D is about twice as fast clock for clock compared to Netburst. So an E4300 @ 1.8GHz is roughly equivalent to a P4 (or more accurately, a PD) @ 3.6GHz.

Like I already said, it really won't be a huge boost over your current P4 unless you overclock. You should really look into it, even a very modest overclock to 266FSB 2.4GHz would make it significantly faster than your P4.

Oh, my apologies again for derailing your thread, got a little carried away. :lol:
 

The_YongGrand

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I really love the cool idea of overclocking, but I don't have much apparatus to start with. I know - changing multipliers, FSB and RAM speeds are all fun, but I'm not really interested in it, really sorry to say that. I overclocked my Celeron D 347 once, and the FPS change is 25% better only FYI. And if I accidently destroy my precious C2D when overclocking, Intel hasn't got a feeling for warranties at all.

So maybe I'll take the cheaper pick, or the C2D. I'm flippin' the coin. As you might see, I do some little recording on PC (i'm also a guitar guy). :D
 

epsilon84

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I can assure you that overclocking an E4300 to 2.4GHz is totally effortless and pain free, :lol: all it takes is for you to change the FSB from 200 to 266MHz in BIOS, NOTHING else needs to be changed at all, but hey, if you are not big on the idea then I won't force it on you. :wink:

Personally, I see running the E4300 @ stock as similar to being stuck in 2nd gear in a high performance car. :lol:
 
Just odd to buy a top mobo leaving about ~40fsb by cripply it with under achieving memory. Im sure their are cheaper mobos what would fit that spec maybe in the $70 range. At 667 even cheap memory may fry as most mobos dont run the memory to spec. My mobos auto setup run my ddr2-800 memory at 773. When my memory hits 784 or higher it fails in prime95. Some OCers have problems as low as 2.45 with E4300 so many of which use 667 memory.
WTF now you are just blabbing out random thoughts...

As I already said, I got a $50 discount on the P5B Deluxe, I essentially paid the price of a mid range P965 and got a high end board instead, what is not to like? I could sell it today on Ebay and not make a loss on it, but I'd rather keep it. :D

Yeah there are cheaper mobos around, like I said if the P5B Deluxe wasn't on special I would've opted for a cheaper mobo. ;)

" At 667 even cheap memory may fry as most mobos dont run the memory to spec."

WTF?! Err... I don't know about your board, but the P5B Deluxe runs the RAM @ EXACTLY the clockspeed/timings/voltage that you set in BIOS.

Like I said, I would only be exceeding DDR2-667 speeds when I exceed 3GHz, and most E4300s I've seen average around 3.2GHz - 3.3GHz, which would equate to DDR2-710 - DDR2-732 speeds. Unless I have incredibly bad luck, I will have no problem hitting these speeds with DDR2-667, in fact I believe I don't even have to raise VDIMM for such mild memory overclocking, but we'll see anyway.

I find it rather funny you trying to poke holes in my purchase plans, but believe me, this has been months in the planning, I'm a long time overclocker and I know what I'm doing. :wink:

Finally, I'm sorry your DDR2-800 can't even run at stock speeds, did you ever think about RMAing it? It definitely should NOT fail Prime95 below stock speeds. :!:
Dont get cocky Epsilon84 as things dont always work they way they are intended. For the money I spent the system is truly the best ive ever built. As i stated 667 memory is linked to low OC's but I guess we all live and learn. By the way $50 off a $200 mobo isnt a good deal at this point and time as p35 is comming. Maybe you took to long to plan. :wink:
 
Cool lock yourself to only a 3GHz OC as your 667 will limit. Guess what when your memory is set to DDR2-400 and you hit about an increase of 90FSB. Your almost at your memorys limit and your OCing will stop at that point. I have a 9.5 multiplyer and my limit hits around 50fsb before i have to change down to a lower spec. I'm guessing here that your lowest memory setting is DDR2-400? If so your looking at under a 100MHz increase in FSB and that would be shame seeing as how your mobo should do 150MHz increase.
LOL you really have no clue do you. Do you really expect my DDR2-667 to not go ONE SINGLE MHz above stock speeds, even with raised VDIMM?! LOL

There is a thing called RAM overclocking too, in case you forgot. ;)

I ain't gonna spend an extra $AU50 on DDR2-800 by the off chance that I can run the RAM at stock speeds by getting a 100% 3.6GHz overclock on the E4300... it's possible but unlikely.

Saving $50 whilst expecting to get a 'modest' 3.2GHz overclock, whilst slightly overclocking the RAM, makes a lot more financial sense to me.

Edit - Anyway, it's getting late here, I'm off to bed. Thanks for the debate, I'll be up for another round in the morning should you feel inclined. LOL :wink:
LOL I was counting a OCed memory if it doesnt you want hit 3GHz.

Just FYI:

9 x 333 = 3GHz. 333MHz FSB = DDR2-667 @ stock using 1:1 ratio. Thus 3GHz on an E4300 would have DDR2-667 running at stock speeds. 8)

Gnite. :wink:
Just odd to buy a top mobo leaving about ~40fsb by cripply it with under achieving memory. Im sure their are cheaper mobos what would fit that spec maybe in the $70 range. At 667 even cheap memory may fry as most mobos dont run the memory to spec. My mobos auto setup run my ddr2-800 memory at 773. When my memory hits 784 or higher it fails in prime95. Some OCers have problems as low as 2.45 with E4300 so many of which use 667 memory.Go back and read....he said he bought the P5B, because it was on sale for $50 off. :roll:
Where is your pompoms? LOL with P35's comming $150 for a mobo even on sale is over priced.
 

epsilon84

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Just odd to buy a top mobo leaving about ~40fsb by cripply it with under achieving memory. Im sure their are cheaper mobos what would fit that spec maybe in the $70 range. At 667 even cheap memory may fry as most mobos dont run the memory to spec. My mobos auto setup run my ddr2-800 memory at 773. When my memory hits 784 or higher it fails in prime95. Some OCers have problems as low as 2.45 with E4300 so many of which use 667 memory.
WTF now you are just blabbing out random thoughts...

As I already said, I got a $50 discount on the P5B Deluxe, I essentially paid the price of a mid range P965 and got a high end board instead, what is not to like? I could sell it today on Ebay and not make a loss on it, but I'd rather keep it. :D

Yeah there are cheaper mobos around, like I said if the P5B Deluxe wasn't on special I would've opted for a cheaper mobo. ;)

" At 667 even cheap memory may fry as most mobos dont run the memory to spec."

WTF?! Err... I don't know about your board, but the P5B Deluxe runs the RAM @ EXACTLY the clockspeed/timings/voltage that you set in BIOS.

Like I said, I would only be exceeding DDR2-667 speeds when I exceed 3GHz, and most E4300s I've seen average around 3.2GHz - 3.3GHz, which would equate to DDR2-710 - DDR2-732 speeds. Unless I have incredibly bad luck, I will have no problem hitting these speeds with DDR2-667, in fact I believe I don't even have to raise VDIMM for such mild memory overclocking, but we'll see anyway.

I find it rather funny you trying to poke holes in my purchase plans, but believe me, this has been months in the planning, I'm a long time overclocker and I know what I'm doing. :wink:

Finally, I'm sorry your DDR2-800 can't even run at stock speeds, did you ever think about RMAing it? It definitely should NOT fail Prime95 below stock speeds. :!:
Dont get cocky Epsilon84 as things dont always work they way they are intended. For the money I spent the system is truly the best ive ever built. As i stated 667 memory is linked to low OC's but I guess we all live and learn. By the way $50 off a $200 mobo isnt a good deal at this point and time as p35 is comming. Maybe you took to long to plan. :wink:

Oh, I ain't being cocky, if anything I'm a realist so I don't expect to be getting 3.6GHz on the E4300, therefore DDR2-667 is enough for my needs.

$50 was just an estimate in $US since it was like $AU75 off the price, which is about a 25% discount on the RRP.

P35 means nothing to me as I can't wait that long... I've endured long enough already on my antiquated XP-M @ 2.6GHz. :lol: 8O
 
Just odd to buy a top mobo leaving about ~40fsb by cripply it with under achieving memory. Im sure their are cheaper mobos what would fit that spec maybe in the $70 range. At 667 even cheap memory may fry as most mobos dont run the memory to spec. My mobos auto setup run my ddr2-800 memory at 773. When my memory hits 784 or higher it fails in prime95. Some OCers have problems as low as 2.45 with E4300 so many of which use 667 memory.
WTF now you are just blabbing out random thoughts...

As I already said, I got a $50 discount on the P5B Deluxe, I essentially paid the price of a mid range P965 and got a high end board instead, what is not to like? I could sell it today on Ebay and not make a loss on it, but I'd rather keep it. :D

Yeah there are cheaper mobos around, like I said if the P5B Deluxe wasn't on special I would've opted for a cheaper mobo. ;)

" At 667 even cheap memory may fry as most mobos dont run the memory to spec."

WTF?! Err... I don't know about your board, but the P5B Deluxe runs the RAM @ EXACTLY the clockspeed/timings/voltage that you set in BIOS.

Like I said, I would only be exceeding DDR2-667 speeds when I exceed 3GHz, and most E4300s I've seen average around 3.2GHz - 3.3GHz, which would equate to DDR2-710 - DDR2-732 speeds. Unless I have incredibly bad luck, I will have no problem hitting these speeds with DDR2-667, in fact I believe I don't even have to raise VDIMM for such mild memory overclocking, but we'll see anyway.

I find it rather funny you trying to poke holes in my purchase plans, but believe me, this has been months in the planning, I'm a long time overclocker and I know what I'm doing. :wink:

Finally, I'm sorry your DDR2-800 can't even run at stock speeds, did you ever think about RMAing it? It definitely should NOT fail Prime95 below stock speeds. :!:
Dont get cocky Epsilon84 as things dont always work they way they are intended. For the money I spent the system is truly the best ive ever built. As i stated 667 memory is linked to low OC's but I guess we all live and learn. By the way $50 off a $200 mobo isnt a good deal at this point and time as p35 is comming. Maybe you took to long to plan. :wink:

Oh, I ain't being cocky, if anything I'm a realist so I don't expect to be getting 3.6GHz on the E4300, therefore DDR2-667 is enough for my needs.

$50 was just an estimate in $US since it was like $AU75 off the price, which is about a 25% discount on the RRP.

P35 means nothing to me as I can't wait that long... I've endured long enough already on my antiquated XP-M @ 2.6GHz. :lol: 8O
Shame to the P35 is comming next month. :lol:
 

epsilon84

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Shame to the P35 is comming next month. :lol:
Next month is too far away... LOL

I've deliberately not installed Oblivion yet because running it on my current system would not do justice to it. I believe I have suffered enough already. :oops: :lol:

It hardly makes a difference in my current situation, P35 just adds official 1333FSB support which all P965 boards can do anyway (unofficially of course).
 

The_YongGrand

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I can assure you that overclocking an E4300 to 2.4GHz is totally effortless and pain free, :lol: all it takes is for you to change the FSB from 200 to 266MHz in BIOS, NOTHING else needs to be changed at all, but hey, if you are not big on the idea then I won't force it on you. :wink:

Personally, I see running the E4300 @ stock as similar to being stuck in 2nd gear in a high performance car. :lol:
Yeah I know it's pain free - I did change the FSB before in my Celeron D rig. But doing so can cause my board's caps to pop, or the parts to fail or the files in my HDD corrupt. It's the when overclocking gets ugly.

But there's a slight difference between E4300 and E6300, so overall it will look like E6300 but only a wee bit slower. I'm sure it's the 4th gear of the car compared to my P4? :D
 

epsilon84

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Yeah I know it's pain free - I did change the FSB before in my Celeron D rig. But doing so can cause my board's caps to pop, or the parts to fail or the files in my HDD corrupt. It's the when overclocking gets ugly.

But there's a slight difference between E4300 and E6300, so overall it will look like E6300 but only a wee bit slower. I'm sure it's the 4th gear of the car compared to my P4? :D
Lock your PCI bus, no more HDD corruption. ;)

Bulging caps @ 266FSB? LOL i highly doubt it since 266FSB is the STOCK FSB of the E6xxx series CPUs. So unless current mobos start having caps exploding @ stock speeds on E6xxx chips (which would be a HUGE problem and PR disaster for Intel and relevant mobo makers :wink: :wink: ) I wouldn't worry about it too much. Heh. :lol:

As for the E4300 vs E6300, yeah, there is like 2 - 3% difference between them... not much at all.
 

The_YongGrand

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That means I'm having a good Ferrari on 3rd or 4th gear, not 2nd gear. :lol:

Let me decide further on this processor, as I'm checking myself for what's the main use... :D
 
Shame to the P35 is comming next month. :lol:
Next month is too far away... LOL

I've deliberately not installed Oblivion yet because running it on my current system would not do justice to it. I believe I have suffered enough already. :oops: :lol:

It hardly makes a difference in my current situation, P35 just adds official 1333FSB support which all P965 boards can do anyway (unofficially of course).
True but also guaranteed Penyrn support. I've read that 965 may not support Penyrn.
 

The_YongGrand

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Boys,

Sorry for the delay in my posts - pretty busy with all my exams.

Also, I've bought myself a simple AM2 motherboard w/ PCI-E 16x and a X2 3800+ after some more discounts. 8)

To honestly tell the truth, dual-core is much more responsive. Quake 4 loads faster. Antivirus scanning can be done while doing other stuff (I don't always do scanning, just for kicks!) and Java didn't freeze while a number of browser windows are open.

My Pentium 4 3.0GHz with HT couldn't really cope up with that, especially the Java thingy. But I admit my spare rig is still amazing when come to most tasks. 8)
 
Cool lock yourself to only a 3GHz OC as your 667 will limit. Guess what when your memory is set to DDR2-400 and you hit about an increase of 90FSB. Your almost at your memorys limit and your OCing will stop at that point. I have a 9.5 multiplyer and my limit hits around 50fsb before i have to change down to a lower spec. I'm guessing here that your lowest memory setting is DDR2-400? If so your looking at under a 100MHz increase in FSB and that would be shame seeing as how your mobo should do 150MHz increase.
LOL you really have no clue do you. Do you really expect my DDR2-667 to not go ONE SINGLE MHz above stock speeds, even with raised VDIMM?! LOL

There is a thing called RAM overclocking too, in case you forgot. ;)

I ain't gonna spend an extra $AU50 on DDR2-800 by the off chance that I can run the RAM at stock speeds by getting a 100% 3.6GHz overclock on the E4300... it's possible but unlikely.

Saving $50 whilst expecting to get a 'modest' 3.2GHz overclock, whilst slightly overclocking the RAM, makes a lot more financial sense to me.

Edit - Anyway, it's getting late here, I'm off to bed. Thanks for the debate, I'll be up for another round in the morning should you feel inclined. LOL :wink:
LOL I was counting a OCed memory if it doesnt you want hit 3GHz.

Just FYI:

9 x 333 = 3GHz. 333MHz FSB = DDR2-667 @ stock using 1:1 ratio. Thus 3GHz on an E4300 would have DDR2-667 running at stock speeds. 8)

Gnite. :wink:
Just odd to buy a top mobo leaving about ~40fsb by cripply it with under achieving memory. Im sure their are cheaper mobos what would fit that spec maybe in the $70 range. At 667 even cheap memory may fry as most mobos dont run the memory to spec. My mobos auto setup run my ddr2-800 memory at 773. When my memory hits 784 or higher it fails in prime95. Some OCers have problems as low as 2.45 with E4300 so many of which use 667 memory.

You do know that the reason why your ram is not running @ ddr2 800 is because of the memory controller on your cpu and not your motherboard right? If you are having trouble with going over 784 then you have some issues since my ram w/ overclock is running @ full ddr2 800 speed.
Na its the mobo as it only does 1.8volts and thus my g.skill needs 1.9volts for full ddr800.
 
That may be part of the problem but it is the on die memory controller with the cpu multiplier that determines ram speed. The very first reviews of AM2 discussed this quite a bit how certain chips with certain multipliers would run @ ddr2 800 and others would not because of it.
True but if that was the only problem my OC could put the memory upto 800 say at FSB 210. My RAM set to 667 and my FSB to 244 runs fine but at FSB 246 i get memory errors. CPUz says at 244 my memory is 779 which should allow me up to 248 FSB. I then switch down to 533 and can go upto 279 with no problems. If the multiplyer was at fault a small OC could fix that but I get memory errors. I thinks its the G.Skills requiring 1.9v for full ddr2 800. Many reviews state this problem and suggest that A-data's 1.8v only memory works at full ddr2 800.
 

mationman

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Oblivion is really the only 1 ive seen that needs the better CPU.
Hmm i'm running oblivion on a amd64 3200 754 and its fine the only time I had any probs was when I ran around hitting random people and ran into a really crowded area.
 
Oblivion is really the only 1 ive seen that needs the better CPU.
Hmm i'm running oblivion on a amd64 3200 754 and its fine the only time I had any probs was when I ran around hitting random people and ran into a really crowded area.
Yes my point was it takes the most demanding game to show CPU bottle necking at a reasonable resolution. Thats 1280X1024 and higher and oblivion only start showing bottlenecking a little at this resolution. With the 8800gts even a 1600MHz CPU can hand most any game. Your CPU is fine for the game and even the older amd64 2800 would due.
 

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