Doonesbury

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"Kurt Albershardt" <kurt@nv.net> wrote in message
news:38surfF5rg8qeU1@individual.net...
> Hev wrote:
> >
> > Think of a business that locked its vendors into contracts where
> > making money was an uphill battle. Does that seem just to you?
>
> Seems to me a lot like selling to Trader Joe's or Costco.
>
or Wal-Mart, or Disney...

--
Dave Martin
DMA, Inc
Nashville, TN

 

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>
>
> I don't agree that p2p gives artists nothing. It exposes artist's music to
> millions of people (potential customers).


no NOT potential customers
potential freeloaders
are these people going to insist on paying for what they can take for free?

 

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"George Gleason" <g.p.gleason@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:_rdWd.102937$Th1.76753@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>
>>
>>
>> I don't agree that p2p gives artists nothing. It exposes artist's music
>> to millions of people (potential customers).
>
>
> no NOT potential customers
> potential freeloaders
> are these people going to insist on paying for what they can take for
> free?


Unless they are uploading themselves into venues you are wrong....

--

-Hev
remove your opinion to find me here:
www.michaelYOURspringerOPINION.com

 

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In article <M9bWd.1251$gJ3.556@clgrps13> Lorin@DAMNSPAM!v5v.ca writes:

> Let's assume your opinion of the current system is valid. Explain to me
> how it justifies stealing music. At least record companies give artists
> *something*. P2P gives 'em nada.

Would this discussion go differently if we didn't use the phrase
"stealing music" but rather said "The artists have nothing to sell."?
Would we go after a solution differently? Would we come up with
constructive ways to assure some source of income for music creators
and performers? Or would we still say "adapt or starve"?

Creative musicians will always create music. But if they can't sell it
in recorded form, they'll just have to start selling it in performance
form - maybe you'll have to get your music fix by attending concerts,
or sitting around a campfire listening to a few people pass a guitar
around.

--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

 

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David Morgan (MAMS) wrote:

> The "Computer Generation".... Ha! ;-)
>
> Anybody else besides Scott D., Mike R., Kurt A., and a couple of others,
> start out on a TRS-80 with a cassette tape drive ?? From like, before
> brother Hev was conceived?

No, mine was an IBM 7094 with punched card reader and 9
track tapes. I was designing mainframes by 1967 and coding
8 bit microprocessor systems by 1975.

If he'd said the "bandwidth generation" he would have been
closer to the mark.


Bob
--

"Things should be described as simply as possible, but no
simpler."

A. Einstein

 

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"Troy" <alternate-root@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:BXgWd.577416$8l.367357@pd7tw1no...
> Walmart does this.


Are you defending a chain that damn near treats its employees like slaves? I
asked if it was just, not who was doing it.


--

-Hev
remove your opinion to find me here:
www.michaelYOURspringerOPINION.com

 

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"Troy" <alternate-root@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:93lWd.579040$6l.316231@pd7tw2no...
> Welcome to the world of business.Walmart actually treat their employees
> pretty good compaired to some big businesses.I am not defending Walmart
> just
> stating the truth.
>
> Maybe when you grow up and learn how to run a business for yourself you
> will
> see whats involved in keeping profits up.


I am currently running two. A retail store and an online store. I make a
living and still provide health insurance for my employees via a group plan.

--

-Hev
remove your opinion to find me here:
www.michaelYOURspringerOPINION.com

 

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"Troy" <alternate-root@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:SBlWd.579081$6l.361090@pd7tw2no...
> From all your comments on the music industry and online theft
> You would never know it.
>
> So is it ok that I come into your "retail store" and take things off you
> shelf and walk out with out paying for them because I think you are
> charging
> to much for them???.What if the rest of the group joins me and we tell all
> our friends to come to?????.Maybe we will post online that you charge to
> much so everyone just walk in and take what you want???.
>
> This is what you do every time you download.
>
> It woulden't belong before you would be out of business as product is
> moving
> but no cash is coming in for the products going out.
>
> Think about that


Theoretically if the products in my store could be downloaded, and that was
the new way my customers wanted to receive my products.... I would ADAPT a
service that allowed them to do so. The recording industry has not adapted
and p2p is the side-effect of this.



--

-Hev
remove your opinion to find me here:
www.michaelYOURspringerOPINION.com

 

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Hev wrote:

> Theoretically if the products in my store could be downloaded, and that was
> the new way my customers wanted to receive my products.... I would ADAPT a
> service that allowed them to do so. The recording industry has not adapted
> and p2p is the side-effect of this.

Empty words without a workable proposal for this so called
adaption. You've offered nothing of substance and are
blinded by the smoke you're blowing up your own ass to make
it ok to steal.

The only adaption that works without a revolution in
protection technology is removing money from all but live
performance and I think you are going to be _very_
disappointed with what remains. The cacaphony and bandwidth
of the internet provides no effective means of selection,
promotion or artist development. You'll get what you can
see and that's about it.

You totally disregard the value value added by the current
industry configuration and I think I can safely guess that
you see none. You will in its absence. It really pisses me
off that your theieving generation may well steal it from
those of us who value it. If that is the nature of your
generation's ethics, god help you.


Bob
--

"Things should be described as simply as possible, but no
simpler."

A. Einstein

 

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On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 07:44:58 GMT, George Gleason
<g.p.gleason@worldnet.att.net> wrote:

>
>>
>>
>> I don't agree that p2p gives artists nothing. It exposes artist's music to
>> millions of people (potential customers).
>
>
>no NOT potential customers
>potential freeloaders
>are these people going to insist on paying for what they can take for free?

Yes, potential customers, who will attend shows and who will want the
better-sounding CDs. Music fans still support their favorite acts.

Al

 

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"David Morgan (MAMS)" <mams@NOSPAm-a-m-s.com> wrote in message news:byeWd.58810$uc.9922@trnddc08...
<snip>
> The "Computer Generation".... Ha! ;-)
>
> Anybody else besides Scott D., Mike R., Kurt A., and a couple
> of others, start out on a TRS-80 with a cassette tape drive ??
> From like, before brother Hev was conceived?
>
> DM
>
IBM 1130 systems at Ohio U. and Marietta College in the late '60s
using Fortran and assembly language.

 

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"Troy" <alternate-root@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:m%lWd.578151$8l.519466@pd7tw1no...
> How could you adapt if people are just taking your items and there is no
> way
> of charging them for taking them?.You would be out of business in no
> time.The only thing you would be able to adapt to is the unemployment
> line.
>
> You still don't get it.....there is no way to collect money from P2P that
> is
> the problem.The music industry can't adapt because there is no technology
> yet to "adapt" to.They are willing and able to adapt but there is no
> software on the market to track downloading on P2P and charge for the
> download.Money going out but no money coming in = out of business....as a
> manager I'm sure even you can understand this simple term.


There are so many draw-backs to p2p. I would attack these weaknesses and
draw the p2p users to my site that offered speed and reliability, where I
could promote concerts, CD's, merch, and sell advertising space. Embrace the
youth culture.

We see a form of this model working with the new music services. $10 a month
for access to 800,000 songs... now that's fair! $18.99 for 11 songs with
maybe 2 good songs on the disc is not. Technology (and lack of artist
development) has made this transition happen and it is that technology we
need to adapt to.

--

-Hev
remove your opinion to find me here:
www.michaelYOURspringerOPINION.com

 

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"Troy" <alternate-root@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:X7mWd.578163$8l.414893@pd7tw1no...
> If customers wanted to download your products then it is available then
> what
> about all the people who want to download yourproducts and share them with
> the rest of the dowload comunity so they don't have to go buy it from
> you.Looks like you are out of business.


P2P has so many draw-backs. I would offer speed and convenience to lure my
customers back to the source.

--

-Hev
remove your opinion to find me here:
www.michaelYOURspringerOPINION.com

 

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"Bob Cain" <arcane@arcanemethods.com> wrote in message
news:d0ctg402uvd@enews4.newsguy.com...
>
>
> David Morgan (MAMS) wrote:
>
>> The "Computer Generation".... Ha! ;-)
>>
>> Anybody else besides Scott D., Mike R., Kurt A., and a couple of others,
>> start out on a TRS-80 with a cassette tape drive ?? From like, before
>> brother Hev was conceived?
>
> No, mine was an IBM 7094 with punched card reader and 9 track tapes. I
> was designing mainframes by 1967 and coding 8 bit microprocessor systems
> by 1975.
>
> If he'd said the "bandwidth generation" he would have been closer to the
> mark.


P2P generation then. I still remember the floppy disks (that were actually
floppy) that were the size of my head.



--

-Hev
remove your opinion to find me here:
www.michaelYOURspringerOPINION.com

 

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"David Morgan (MAMS)" <mams@NOSPAm-a-m-s.com> wrote in message
news:byeWd.58810$uc.9922@trnddc08...

> The "Computer Generation".... Ha! ;-)
>
> Anybody else besides Scott D., Mike R., Kurt A., and a couple of others,
> start out on a TRS-80 with a cassette tape drive ?? From like, before
> brother Hev was conceived?
>

Model I, Level II. I had the tape drive and the little gray amplifier for
sound effects. I couldn't use the cassette and the amplifier at the same
time.

jb

 

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Hev wrote:
> "George Gleason" <g.p.gleason@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
> news:_rdWd.102937$Th1.76753@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>
>>>
>>>I don't agree that p2p gives artists nothing. It exposes artist's music
>>>to millions of people (potential customers).
>>
>>
>>no NOT potential customers
>>potential freeloaders
>>are these people going to insist on paying for what they can take for
>>free?
>
>
>
> Unless they are uploading themselves into venues you are wrong....
>

I geuss if you want to enjoy a famous novel you need the author come
recite it for you
or if you want to enjoy Jim Carey's "Mask" he needs to act it live for you

artists can and do make clips available as previews
that is not what we are talking about
we are talking about you who take what is not yours to take and make
avaialble what is not yours to give away

by your logic, if I had a friend who stole a pile of concert tickets I
have a right to obtain them, distribute them and use them
that is the single weakest argument I have heard here yet
you are a real piece of "work" buddy
George

 

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"George Gleason" <g.p.gleason@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:55jWd.329839$w62.286579@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> Hev wrote:
>> "George Gleason" <g.p.gleason@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
>> news:_rdWd.102937$Th1.76753@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>>
>>>>
>>>>I don't agree that p2p gives artists nothing. It exposes artist's music
>>>>to millions of people (potential customers).
>>>
>>>
>>>no NOT potential customers
>>>potential freeloaders
>>>are these people going to insist on paying for what they can take for
>>>free?
>>
>>
>>
>> Unless they are uploading themselves into venues you are wrong....
>>
>
> I geuss if you want to enjoy a famous novel you need the author come
> recite it for you
> or if you want to enjoy Jim Carey's "Mask" he needs to act it live for
> you


Have you heard of Netflix? Even though I could make an exact digital copy of
every movie I rent the movie industry somehow survives. Just as the music
industry would survive if they offered a service that gave me access to any
music album to listen to.

--

-Hev
remove your opinion to find me here:
www.michaelYOURspringerOPINION.com

 

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In article <55jWd.329839$w62.286579@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net> g.p.gleason@att.net writes:

> by your logic, if I had a friend who stole a pile of concert tickets I
> have a right to obtain them, distribute them and use them

Yeah, how come nobody has given the world free downloadable copies of
concert tickets? Perhaps because we all don't yet have the capability
of easily printing on the correct color and stock of cardboard?

What do you think would happen if the promoted knew he sold 6,000
tickets and there were 18,000 people standing in line waiting to get
in, all of whom had tickets that they got free just by downloading and
"burning" them?


--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

 

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"play on" <playonAT@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:m66k21tn0qpcc9k33j06hqbddkolfgh1k7@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 07:44:58 GMT, George Gleason
> <g.p.gleason@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I don't agree that p2p gives artists nothing. It exposes artist's music
>>> to
>>> millions of people (potential customers).
>>
>>
>>no NOT potential customers
>>potential freeloaders
>>are these people going to insist on paying for what they can take for
>>free?
>
> Yes, potential customers, who will attend shows and who will want the
> better-sounding CDs. Music fans still support their favorite acts.
>
> Al


A big thank you Al.

--

-Hev
remove your opinion to find me here:
www.michaelYOURspringerOPINION.com

 

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"David Morgan (MAMS)" <mams@NOSPAm-a-m-s.com> wrote in message
news:byeWd.58810$uc.9922@trnddc08...

> The "Computer Generation".... Ha! ;-)
>
> Anybody else besides Scott D., Mike R., Kurt A., and a couple of others,
> start out on a TRS-80 with a cassette tape drive ?? From like, before
> brother Hev was conceived?
>
Me, me, me!!! Trash 80 Model III and Model IV for databases, word
processing, etc. TI 99 for games (such as they were). But my first sequencer
(Oberheim RMX) also loaded via cassette tape. Ignoring DSP based effects
boxes (which could be considered computers), I have currently have three
computers in the control room - console automation, PT HD3 rig and the one
I'm typing on. That doesn't count the computers at home.

'Computer Generation', indeed.

--
Dave Martin
DMA, Inc
Nashville, TN

 

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Bob Cain wrote:

> No, mine was an IBM 7094 with punched card reader and 9 track tapes. I
> was designing mainframes by 1967 and coding 8 bit microprocessor systems
> by 1975.

1st interactive use: Illiac II in 1965. Bet I could still program an
IBM 029 drum card.

 

[Troy]

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Bob this guy is just a retarded dumb ass.He dosen't even know what he is
trying to say anymore.



Bob Cain <arcane@arcanemethods.com> wrote in message
news:d0cvpt01ekh@enews3.newsguy.com...
>
>
> Hev wrote:
>
> > Theoretically if the products in my store could be downloaded, and that
was
> > the new way my customers wanted to receive my products.... I would ADAPT
a
> > service that allowed them to do so. The recording industry has not
adapted
> > and p2p is the side-effect of this.
>
> Empty words without a workable proposal for this so called
> adaption. You've offered nothing of substance and are
> blinded by the smoke you're blowing up your own ass to make
> it ok to steal.
>
> The only adaption that works without a revolution in
> protection technology is removing money from all but live
> performance and I think you are going to be _very_
> disappointed with what remains. The cacaphony and bandwidth
> of the internet provides no effective means of selection,
> promotion or artist development. You'll get what you can
> see and that's about it.
>
> You totally disregard the value value added by the current
> industry configuration and I think I can safely guess that
> you see none. You will in its absence. It really pisses me
> off that your theieving generation may well steal it from
> those of us who value it. If that is the nature of your
> generation's ethics, god help you.
>
>
> Bob
> --
>
> "Things should be described as simply as possible, but no
> simpler."
>
> A. Einstein

 

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Troy wrote:

> It woulden't belong before you would be out of business as product is moving
> but no cash is coming in for the products going out.

Yeah, but lots of folks would be talking about his store! A lot of
people would really like his store!

--
ha

 

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Hev wrote:

> Have you heard of Netflix?

Yep, and as you type there is a group of dedicated computeristos working
to get 25K of Netflix's inventory processed for free downloading. When
the braodband action gets most everywhere you can kiss Netflix goodbye,
thanks to people like who will steal the material, just because they
can.

The problem with your model is you.

--
ha

 

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Hev wrote:
> "George Gleason" <g.p.gleason@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
> news:55jWd.329839$w62.286579@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>
>>Hev wrote:
>>
>>>"George Gleason" <g.p.gleason@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
>>>news:_rdWd.102937$Th1.76753@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>>>
>>>
>>>>>I don't agree that p2p gives artists nothing. It exposes artist's music
>>>>>to millions of people (potential customers).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>no NOT potential customers
>>>>potential freeloaders
>>>>are these people going to insist on paying for what they can take for
>>>>free?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Unless they are uploading themselves into venues you are wrong....
>>>
>>
>>I geuss if you want to enjoy a famous novel you need the author come
>>recite it for you
>>or if you want to enjoy Jim Carey's "Mask" he needs to act it live for
>>you
>
>
>
> Have you heard of Netflix? Even though I could make an exact digital copy of
> every movie I rent the movie industry somehow survives. Just as the music
> industry would survive if they offered a service that gave me access to any
> music album to listen to.
>

Have you ever heard of The Beatles?
they didn't tour after 1966
Nobody how ever much they wanted to spend would have ever heard Sgt
Peppers beacuse it was NEVER done live
some artists , even great artists choose to SELL their art
you choose to steal it
'you should have your balls cut off
George