News Even upscalers can't resuscitate a $10 GPU—13-year-old GTX 660 is so slow that FSR can't give it a boost

[Admin]

Nvidia's ancient GTX 660 was tested in a few modern titles to see whether or not FSR/XeSS upscaling could make the GPU output playable frame rates. Unfortunately, the GPU is so old that upscaling provided no FPS improvements at all in games that are still capable of running on the Kepler GPU.

Even upscalers can't resuscitate a $10 GPU—13-year-old GTX 660 is so slow that FSR can't give it a boost : Read more

 

[Notton]

I think this signifies there is a huge void left where the GTX1030/1050 used to exist in.
Cheap (<$80), AV1 encode/decode, 4x video ports, single slot, low profile, 75W (no additional power connector).

 

[Alex/AT]

Actually I'd favor $10-$20 GPU that can draw desktops and consoles well. Good for Windows-based machines that do not need any fancy GPU stuff.

 

[Li Ken-un]

I think this signifies there is a huge void left where the GTX1030/1050 used to exist in.
Cheap (<$80), AV1 encode/decode, 4x video ports, single slot, low profile, 75W (no additional power connector).

Everything but cheap and single slot: NVIDIA RTX 4000 SFF Ada Generation

• AV1 Encode/decode
• 4 × Mini DisplayPort
• Low-profile
• 70 W, no additional power connector
• ~$1,500
• Two slots

I struggled with the last option the most. To check off everything, one would have to give up on NVIDIA and look to low-end Intel Arc-based solutions―and I mean low-end amongst even the options within the Intel Arc lineup. Alternatively, some modders are offering their services to turn what should be a two-slot NVIDIA RTX 4000 SFF Ada Generation graphics card into a single-slot card.

In any case, the “< $80” criterion is no longer attainable.

 

[TCA_ChinChin]

Everything but cheap and single slot: NVIDIA RTX 4000 SFF Ada Generation

• AV1 Encode/decode
• 4 × Mini DisplayPort
• Low-profile
• 70 W, no additional power connector
• ~$1,500
• Two slots

I struggled with the last option the most. To check off everything, one would have to give up on NVIDIA and look to low-end Intel Arc-based solutions―and I mean low-end amongst even the options within the Intel Arc lineup. Alternatively, some modders are offering their services to turn what should be a two-slot NVIDIA RTX 4000 SFF Ada Generation graphics card into a single-slot card.

In any case, the “< $80” criterion is no longer attainable.

I'd say those last two are complete deal breakers for many looking for a GTX1030/1050 replacement. I think the MSRP is something thats impossible to reach nowadays, but something that is:

• AV1 Encode/Decode
• low-profile
• 75W, no additional power connector
• sub 200$
• single slot

Would be great. You mention it youself, but I say for a lot of people who bought 1030/1050s, the low end Intel Arcs would be perfect replacements. Also, if the RTX5050 was lower power and didn't require additional PCIe power, it would've been a good replacement, even if the MSRP is high. More people would accept a 2x or 3x increase in price for a modern Nvidia replacement but more than 10x the price? Thats not even in the same ballpark.

 

[jlake3]

Actually I'd favor $10-$20 GPU that can draw desktops and consoles well. Good for Windows-based machines that do not need any fancy GPU stuff.

The problems with this are:

1. Even the weakest, smallest die still needs to be paired with a board and cooler and 2-4gb of VRAM, then put into a box and shipped, and still have some margin left by the time it makes it to the shelf for the retailer to make a profit. Used hardware more-or-less bottoms out around here due to platform fees and shipping and the time it takes to manage the selling, even when the cost of the goods is basically free.
2. Intel's UHD Graphics 770 iGPU can do four displays if the motherboard has the ports to support it, and a lot of Windows boxes for basic office use from the likes of Dell and HP can be configured with three ports. The OEM demand for these kind of cards isn't there anymore.

 

[Notton]

At $200, the RTX 3050 6GB and RTX A400 4GB become an option
Both do not require a power connector, both have LP, but the A400 also has LP+single slot.
However, they're both a 100% jump in price from a 1030, and both don't support AV1 encode, only decode.

Good luck finding an Arc A310/A350.
AMD has nothing to offer in this price range, very disappointing, seeing as they're the main company selling CPUs without an iGPU with their AM4 lineup.

 

[Jadesphynx]

But I bet geforce now would work on it. Fooling around with an i5-4570 + rx550 build in my garage right now and cyberpunk is very playable with geforce now.

 

[jeremyj_83]

I think this signifies there is a huge void left where the GTX1030/1050 used to exist in.
Cheap (<$80), AV1 encode/decode, 4x video ports, single slot, low profile, 75W (no additional power connector).

Modern iGPUs can already do that and at lower power draw. Then it all depends on the number of video ports your motherboard has. Sadly most are only 3 so you would need to use something like DisplayLink for a 4th monitor.

 

[Notton]

Modern iGPUs can already do that and at lower power draw. Then it all depends on the number of video ports your motherboard has. Sadly most are only 3 so you would need to use something like DisplayLink for a 4th monitor.

Unless you're like me and bought a 5800X3D with no such luxury as an iGPU.
Seeing as AMD is the primary seller of iGPU-less desktop CPUs, maybe they should pick up the slack?
AMD just released the 5500X3D, also an iGPU-less solution, so they're still creating the source of the problem.

 

[usertests]

The funny part is that the performance level may be acceptable, low as it is, but it could really use 4 GB of VRAM.

 

[Li Ken-un]

Modern iGPUs can already do that and at lower power draw.

I want to say that discrete GPUs even at 75 W are much more capable than those integrated into the CPU, but there’s Strix Halo and its successors to close that gap already. My comment wouldn’t age very well.

The integrated GPUs pretty much meet this requirement today already if not more:

GTX1030/1050 replacement

AMD's beastly 'Strix Halo' Ryzen AI Max+ matches the RTX 4060 laptop in leaked 3DMark tests

 

[jeremyj_83]

Unless you're like me and bought a 5800X3D with no such luxury as an iGPU.
Seeing as AMD is the primary seller of iGPU-less desktop CPUs, maybe they should pick up the slack?
AMD just released the 5500X3D, also an iGPU-less solution, so they're still creating the source of the problem.

Well the Zen 3 chips were released almost 5 years ago now. Zen 4 and Zen 5 all come with a iGPU, except for the F series, that is good enough for desktop and most HTPC applications. If you need more iGPU than that you can get a G series which existed all the way back to the 2400G (Zen 1 uArc) in 2018. Overall the 8700G's iGPU is probably between a 1050Ti and and 1650 as the 5700G was already faster than the 1030. Sadly there aren't any reviews that puts it up against older dGPUs.

 

[Notton]

Well the Zen 3 chips were released almost 5 years ago now. Zen 4 and Zen 5 all come with a iGPU, except for the F series, that is good enough for desktop and most HTPC applications. If you need more iGPU than that you can get a G series which existed all the way back to the 2400G (Zen 1 uArc) in 2018. Overall the 8700G's iGPU is probably between a 1050Ti and and 1650 as the 5700G was already faster than the 1030. Sadly there aren't any reviews that puts it up against older dGPUs.

Yeah, but why would I swap out a perfectly usable 5800X3D for a 5700G?
I use programs that benefit from that X3D performance too.
Again, this can be solved by a cheap dGPU which AMD refuses to make.
The last time they attempted that, we got the manufactured e-waste, RX6400/6500, which were bashed to no end for lack of any video decode/encode and lackluster everything.

 

[sfjuocekr]

Do people even realize or understand why this doesn't work?

Upscaling a 1080p image to 4K already uses upwards of a gigabyte of RAM for absolutely zero meaningful gains.

But, I guess people these days love looking at processed images... you know you can also crank up the contrast and sharpness on most monitors? It looks just as bad to me and might just look great for everyone else...

 

[jlake3]

Yeah, but why would I swap out a perfectly usable 5800X3D for a 5700G?
I use programs that benefit from that X3D performance too.
Again, this can be solved by a cheap dGPU which AMD refuses to make.
The last time they attempted that, we got the manufactured e-waste, RX6400/6500, which were bashed to no end for lack of any video decode/encode and lackluster everything.

With all due respect, your use case sounds extremely niche. Your workflow benefits from X3D performance, but also requires AV1 hardware encode, but doesn't require a strong GPU? And I didn't have that much trouble finding an A310 or A380 on eBay or Amazon for around $140-150 and locally for $120, but this use case doesn't warrant spending that much, but it's definitely worth developing a new dGPU die that basically allows people to add a newer iGPU to an old CPU, but without the shared memory?

 

[Notton]

With all due respect, your use case sounds extremely niche. Your workflow benefits from X3D performance, but also requires AV1 hardware encode, but doesn't require a strong GPU? And I didn't have that much trouble finding an A310 or A380 on eBay or Amazon for around $140-150 and locally for $120, but this use case doesn't warrant spending that much, but it's definitely worth developing a new dGPU die that basically allows people to add a newer iGPU to an old CPU, but without the shared memory?

Yeah, I might have a niche use case.
It's a former gaming PC with a 5800X3D and 1070Ti. I no longer need it for gaming, but thought of using it as a GP file server, and I would prefer having AV1 encode on it. AV1 Encode is not a must, but decode is a must, which the 1070Ti, nor 5800X3D feature.

Compressing/decompressing zip files, resizing images, and search in explorer works so much faster with a fast CPU.

 

[SkyBill40]

Still have my ol' 660Ti in the box. Great card for the time but clearly nowhere near even minimum help now.