Question Expectations vs. Reality

Feb 21, 2019
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Basically, as the title says, unsure of whether I am getting the most out of my PC or not as I am for all intent and purpose - a newbie, barely above a beginner and just competent enough to cobble together my own rig.

So here are my specs before we get started:
OS: Windows 10
CPU: Ryzen 5 2600x (boosted to 4.0ghz)
Motherboard: B450 Gaming Plus (MSI)
RAM: 4x8GB of Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 2933mhz (this is two dual channel kits)
GPU: 1080GTX
Monitor: 1080p ASUS 60hz
HDD: Western Digital 1TB HDD
PSU: EVGA 750w 80 Plus Gold Certified
Cooling: Wraith Cooler fan for the CPU, 3x Arctics 120mm fans at the front, 1x at the back, 2x Arctics 200mm at the top.

And for a bit more information, I'm pasting my results from my userbenchmark - lot of redundant information and maybe not so redundant. :p

UserBenchmarks: Game 107%, Desk 72%, Work 80%
CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X - 97.7%
GPU: Nvidia GTX 1080 - 128.1%
HDD: WD Black 1TB (2013) - 81.9%
RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3000 C15 4x8GB - 92.5%
MBD: MSI B450 GAMING PLUS (MS-7B86)

Right now, all I'm seeing that is putting up a red flag is my HDD. Even for an HDD it's not so hot. Considering getting a Samsung EVO 970 and just blowing it out of the water.

That being said, to the point of this thread, I'm feeling as if my computer is floundering somewhere and unnecessarily so. I find that most games can't run at ultra/max and keep a consistent 60fps which I feel simply shouldn't be true at my current hardware/resolution. Even titles like Apex, which are not immensely hoggish, can struggle. What makes it weirder though is I can have a match or two that runs pretty damn good and then another that has to constantly throttle down the resolution below 1080p just to manage.

Anthem meanwhile just isn't playable (or barely) on low-to-medium settings.

I did however get Witcher 3 to max out (with a largely 50-60fps range) with hairworks off. A mildly enthusiastic yay.

So, am I expecting too much from the hardware or is there a problem? I'm almost 100% it's not overheating (the chassis blows cool air even after several hours of gaming which I find a bit odd) and I haven't OC'd any of my hardware beyond what presets are already in place except for the boost with the processor.
 

13thmonkey

Titan
Moderator
What makes it weirder though is I can have a match or two that runs pretty damn good and then another that has to constantly throttle down the resolution below 1080p just to manage.
What does this mean?

And yes it doesn't sound right.

Are all drivers installed, mobo and GPU?
The HDD is a red herring, one of the best HDDs and shouldn't impact performance.
Is this a fresh install of windows?
Airflow in at the front, out at the back?
What are the actual temps for the CPU and GPU?
What are the clockspeeds for the CPU and GPU at load (actual not what you think they should be)?
 
Feb 21, 2019
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What does this mean?

And yes it doesn't sound right.

Are all drivers installed, mobo and GPU?
The HDD is a red herring, one of the best HDDs and shouldn't impact performance.
Is this a fresh install of windows?
Airflow in at the front, out at the back?
What are the actual temps for the CPU and GPU?
What are the clockspeeds for the CPU and GPU at load (actual not what you think they should be)?
You know, now that I think about it, I didn't install my mobo drivers. Doubt it'll make a difference but you never know. Should I use my CD or go online for a more up-to-date set?

My HDD is writing/reading below 200Mb/S. Figured it was just junk. So that's interesting.

The install is fairly fresh? It's not even a year old but that said, if I was to get a SSD, I was planning on a 1TB and starting with a fresh install. No carrying over.

Airflow goes in the front, yes, through the three 120mms and then there is the 120mm going out the back with two 200mms going out of the top.

I can't give you actual temps but if you aim me in the direction of the best (in your opinion) program to check into it I'd happily give you that information after some further testing. I usually don't worry about these things unless I'm seeing artifacts or my PC is turning into an extremely expensive space-heater. Being eerily cool as it is, it hasn't been a concern.

Again, for the actual speeds (when stressed) you'd have to point me in the direction of a program. I'm not terribly familiar with them and can't even recall in the past what I've used. It's been a long time since I've ventured into PC gaming. I tend to stick to my Playstations, much easier to deal with. Hahah.
 

13thmonkey

Titan
Moderator
Mobo drivers are a must do.

The Black HDD is top of the line, BUT an SSD is playing a different game never mind being in a different league.

Is the install specific to this build, or did you move the disk across and not reinstall?

AMD ryzen master software is best for CPU, afterburner/precision x is good for GPU (a second screen helps), these will do temps and core speeds.

Is windows set to high performance mode in power settings?
 
Feb 21, 2019
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Mobo drivers are a must do.

The Black HDD is top of the line, BUT an SSD is playing a different game never mind being in a different league.

Is the install specific to this build, or did you move the disk across and not reinstall?

AMD ryzen master software is best for CPU, afterburner/precision x is good for GPU (a second screen helps), these will do temps and core speeds.

Is windows set to high performance mode in power settings?
I'll see if I can't pull the latest drivers for my motherboard from the MSI site. That's easy enough.

The install was moved with the disk. In fact, the only original component from my prior build is the HDD. Well, that and the tower.

Okay, think I already grabbed Afterburner. I'll pick up Master Software as well.

I recently discovered the WPM and changed it over to high performance mode but didn't notice any shift when doing Userbenchmark in my scores.
 
Feb 21, 2019
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If that's an old installation of windows from another machine that you have just moved, then i'm 99% certain that'll be the problem.
How do you come to that conclusion?

Not questioning your knowledge nor judgment, genuinely curious. If this is going to become a real hobby for me I need to understand its innermost workings.
 

13thmonkey

Titan
Moderator
When installing windows 100's of settings and drivers get installed, unless you are moving between identical chipsets (the mobo core) then frankly you are lucky if it even boots. Win 10 is better, but really before moving you need to uninstall anything mobo/cpu related from the device manager and then let windows find it all again, but did you get everything? Moving from intel to AMD for instance used to be impossible, and AMD's FX vs Ryzen are so different that it shouldn't work. This is the HAL (hardware abstraction layer) and it holds all of the complexity that allows windows to just ask hardware to do something and it can ask in the same way for any set of hardware.

For instance is your GPU actually running at PCI-E 3.0? or is it using software settings that relate to 2.0 on 3.0. It might stumble along and 'work' but not work properly.

Personally what i'd do, as you really want an SSD whether you know it or not, is get an SSD, install win 10 on it from scratch, with no other HDD's plugged in, see what happens. If there is no change then move your current installation from the HDD to the SSD, then at least we'll have discounted it, or solved it, and you'll have an SSD.
 
Reactions: Mandark
Feb 21, 2019
11
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When installing windows 100's of settings and drivers get installed, unless you are moving between identical chipsets (the mobo core) then frankly you are lucky if it even boots. Win 10 is better, but really before moving you need to uninstall anything mobo/cpu related from the device manager and then let windows find it all again, but did you get everything? Moving from intel to AMD for instance used to be impossible, and AMD's FX vs Ryzen are so different that it shouldn't work. This is the HAL (hardware abstraction layer) and it holds all of the complexity that allows windows to just ask hardware to do something and it can ask in the same way for any set of hardware.

For instance is your GPU actually running at PCI-E 3.0? or is it using software settings that relate to 2.0 on 3.0. It might stumble along and 'work' but not work properly.

Personally what i'd do, as you really want an SSD whether you know it or not, is get an SSD, install win 10 on it from scratch, with no other HDD's plugged in, see what happens. If there is no change then move your current installation from the HDD to the SSD, then at least we'll have discounted it, or solved it, and you'll have an SSD.
I can't get the SSD until Friday and I'm not partial towards my current setup, so I can go ahead and experiment now. Simply won't go crazy reinstalling all of my games and the likes, just what I need to see how it does post a clean installation.

Btw, looking at:
https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-970-EVO-500GB-MZ-V7E500BW/dp/B07BN217QG?SubscriptionId=AKIAI3VLI6HITR26KCBQ&tag=userbenchmark-20&linkCode=sp1&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B07BN4NJ2J&th=1

Won't even need an HDD partnered with it if I pick up the 1TB variant.

Thanks for the explanation. It makes sense and I've considered as much when initially building it again but blew off the thought when I shouldn't have. For the record; the B450 replaced a Z77. Nice board but dated enough that DDR4 isn't at all compatible and it was an Intel board no less. :p
 
Feb 21, 2019
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So, wiped everything and started fresh.

HDD is reading 100% on Userbenchmark instead of 81%.

Anthem is no better really. Still runs terribly even on lowered settings and indoors no less. Have no idea what's going on there.

BFV on the other hand, despite being the same engine, runs at max settings with little to no deviation from 60fps. Even on the map Devastation which is probably the busiest of them all. This is before bothering to switch to DX12 which would likely improve performance.

Now, I don't have time to do any further testing but when I get home tonight I'll run some diagnostic tools and get an exact detailing of what my CPU and GPU are running at and what temps.
 
Feb 21, 2019
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I still think that temps and core speeds are interesting
So I played a round of BFV after getting home with Ryzen Master and Afterburner running. Here are the results!

CPU: Ran at 4.050Ghz, got up to a temperature of 55C
GPU: Ran at 1936MHz Core, 5005 MHz Memory, and reached 53C

Not sure if that's terribly helpful but do tell if there is more I can tell you that might be useful. I'm beginning to think the system is fine considering I can run BFV at max settings with only a dip in frames here and there. Just bad luck with certain games. Still bizarre Anthem would be one of them due to the engine but it wasn't DICE building the game so...
 
Feb 21, 2019
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OK, so that proves that you are not throttling, and that you are reaching the clocks you should be.

Stability on BFV is great, my just be bad network code on anthem?
Maybe. Wouldn't think a network code would cause massive losses to framerate. As I said earlier, I can even by and large max out Witcher 3 if you don't count hairworks.

FFXIV. ESO. WoW. All good. Only MMO I can't max is GW2 but from what I hear it's seems to be unanimously considered a terribly optimized game so that figures. Guess like with Anthem, you lose some no matter how hard you try unless you want to brute force your way.

Anyway, looking at picking up an EVO 970 now that my check is in. That should be fun to see how much of a difference it does for me going from an HDD straight into a PCI solid state. I imagine it's like going from a bicycle to jet.

...Might grab Metro Exodus while I'm at it.
 
Feb 21, 2019
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Hate to say it, but install from scratch on the M.2 too, it's using a different technique to access the disk, worth getting it right from the 1st hour.
Did so.

UserBenchmarks: Game 120%, Desk 140%, Work 123%
CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600X - 97.8%
GPU: Nvidia GTX 1080 - 129.7%
SSD: Samsung 970 Evo NVMe PCIe M.2 1TB - 320.9%
RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3000 C15 4x8GB - 95.6%
MBD: MSI B450 GAMING PLUS (MS-7B86)

Those are my newest scores. All is going well. Think my next upgrade will be getting something besides this 27" 32-bit monitor. Might go for a 2k, 144hz, 32" curved from MSI. We'll see. I find 4k overrated unless you're playing on a large television.
 

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