Fair and Flexible pricing

Eric

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I just saw one of the new Fair and Flexible pricing brochures today, and
I have to say... MAN! Its a tad on the expensive side.

700 minutes on the regular fixed pricing plan is $50, but on Fair and
Flexible, its like $75! F&F does help out I guess for people who
occasionally go over their minutes, but it doesn't help out the high-end
user at all, IMO.

Also, the brochure was very confusing to understand.

Eric
 
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Eric <caperenewal@webtv.net> wrote:
> 700 minutes on the regular fixed pricing plan is $50, but on Fair and
> Flexible, its like $75! F&F does help out I guess for people who
> occasionally go over their minutes, but it doesn't help out the high-end
> user at all, IMO.

Of course not - that's not who it was designed for.

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Eric

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(Steven J Sobol) wrote:
<<Of course not - that's not who it was designed for. >>

I know it is designed for a low-end user... but the wording and how the
brochure is laid out looks really poor. If a store has none of the
regular brochures in stock, the F&F ones make Sprint look extremely
expensive on all levels.

Eric
 
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"Eric" <caperenewal@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:6875-40AA6247-681@storefull-3232.bay.webtv.net...
> I just saw one of the new Fair and Flexible pricing brochures today, and
> I have to say... MAN! Its a tad on the expensive side.
>
> 700 minutes on the regular fixed pricing plan is $50, but on Fair and
> Flexible, its like $75! F&F does help out I guess for people who
> occasionally go over their minutes, but it doesn't help out the high-end
> user at all, IMO.

Why would it? It's for the low end user who finds a need for more minutes on
occasion.

Bob
 
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In article <6875-40AA6247-681@storefull-3232.bay.webtv.net>,
caperenewal@webtv.net (Eric) wrote:

> I just saw one of the new Fair and Flexible pricing brochures today, and
> I have to say... MAN! Its a tad on the expensive side.
>
> 700 minutes on the regular fixed pricing plan is $50, but on Fair and
> Flexible, its like $75! F&F does help out I guess for people who
> occasionally go over their minutes, but it doesn't help out the high-end
> user at all, IMO.
>
> Also, the brochure was very confusing to understand.

SprintPCS apparently agrees its confusing as they doubled their
advertising Budget (to $100 Million) to roll it out.

http://www.americasnetwork.com/americasnetwork/article/articleDetail.jsp?
id=95079

"A lot of people aren't going to be familiar with this, so you have to
heavy-up on advertising"
 
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Eric <caperenewal@webtv.net> wrote:
> I just saw one of the new Fair and Flexible pricing brochures today, and
> I have to say... MAN! Its a tad on the expensive side.
>
> 700 minutes on the regular fixed pricing plan is $50, but on Fair and
> Flexible, its like $75! F&F does help out I guess for people who
> occasionally go over their minutes, but it doesn't help out the high-end
> user at all, IMO.

$5 for flexibility, if you need it, seems like a fair deal to me.

>
> Also, the brochure was very confusing to understand.

Perhaps I am not a "normal" user, but I found the published material to
be very simple and straight forward. But that is just me, everybody
views these things differently.

- --

Thomas T. Veldhouse
Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1

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Eric

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(Thomas T. Veldhouse) wrote:
<<$5 for flexibility, if you need it, seems like a fair deal to me. >>

Hi Tom,

No, don't get me wrong... I think that $5 for "blocks" of minutes is
better than .40/per minute in overage charges.

But my point is being that the F&F brochures make no reference to the
fact that Sprint still has regular "fixed" minute plans. Therefore, to
the uninformed eye, it makes it seem like a higher-end minute user would
be paying $75-85 for 700 minutes.. when it is available for $50 on a
regular plan. The Radio Shack I was at today to pick up a F&F brochure
didn't have any of the "regular" brochures in plain sight as they did
with the F&F ones... perhaps that is because F&F is a newer program...
but to a new customer who is browsing cellular services, it just makes
Sprint seem way above and beyond expensive.

Eric
 
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Phillip <Phillip@gte.net> wrote:
>
> SprintPCS apparently agrees its confusing as they doubled their
> advertising Budget (to $100 Million) to roll it out.
>
> http://www.americasnetwork.com/americasnetwork/article/articleDetail.jsp?
> id=95079
>
> "A lot of people aren't going to be familiar with this, so you have to
> heavy-up on advertising"

You have a remarkable way of way of making defective inferences.
Stepping up advertising because of unfamiliarity is far different than
stepping up advertising because they think it is confusing. It is far
more confusing to somebody not familiar to figure out which identity
posting here is actually Phillip.

BTW ... a better link:
http://www.americasnetwork.com/americasnetwork/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=95079

or

http://tinyurl.com/38z2u

- --

Thomas T. Veldhouse
Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1

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caperenewal@webtv.net (Eric) wrote in news:769-40AA9FD9-70@storefull-
3233.bay.webtv.net:

>
> Hi Tom,
>
> No, don't get me wrong... I think that $5 for "blocks" of minutes is
> better than .40/per minute in overage charges.
>
> But my point is being that the F&F brochures make no reference to the
> fact that Sprint still has regular "fixed" minute plans. Therefore, to
> the uninformed eye, it makes it seem like a higher-end minute user would
> be paying $75-85 for 700 minutes.. when it is available for $50 on a
> regular plan. The Radio Shack I was at today to pick up a F&F brochure
> didn't have any of the "regular" brochures in plain sight as they did
> with the F&F ones... perhaps that is because F&F is a newer program...
> but to a new customer who is browsing cellular services, it just makes
> Sprint seem way above and beyond expensive.
>
> Eric
>
>

Of course not, the brochure is for the F&F plans. Most carriers don't list
all of their plans in the same brochure. One reason of course is so that
when they change a plan offering, they only have to release a new brochure
for that plan and not for all plans. Look at Verizon Wireless for
instance. They have separate brochures for local plans, America's Choice
plans, Single Rate plans, Mobile to Mobile, Data, etc. None of these refer
to other plans. It is unfair to characterize Sprint PCS in the manner to
which you did, in my opinion.

- --
Thomas T. Veldhouse
Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1

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--
Thomas T. Veldhouse
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Eric <caperenewal@webtv.net> wrote:
> (Steven J Sobol) wrote:
> <<Of course not - that's not who it was designed for. >>
>
> I know it is designed for a low-end user... but the wording and how the
> brochure is laid out looks really poor. If a store has none of the
> regular brochures in stock, the F&F ones make Sprint look extremely
> expensive on all levels.
>
> Eric

Ifs, hypotheticals ... the problem in that case isn't the F&F brochure,
the problem is that the other brochures are strangely absent. That is
another problem altogether, and unless you believe this to be a regular
occurance, seems like quite a stretch, if not, then it is an insinuation
that needs followup documentation for the rest of us to review.

- --

Thomas T. Veldhouse
Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1

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In article <rmarkoff-0D3122.14530418052004
@news06.east.earthlink.net>, rmarkoff@yahoo.com says...
> SprintPCS apparently agrees its confusing as they doubled their
> advertising Budget (to $100 Million) to roll it out.
>

The sequence of events is fine, but I think your conclusion is off
just a bit. I don't know if F&F is going to work, but I would argue
that it's a fairly radical departure from normal plans, and as such,
is bound to require a large effort to make it understandable.

I'd presume that, if we've had to radically alter the marketing
budget on it, then we underestimated how much it would take to do so.

--
RØß
O/Siris
I work for Sprint PCS
I *don't* speak for them
 

Eric

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(Thomas T. Veldhouse) wrote:
<<Look at Verizon Wireless for instance. They have separate brochures
for local plans, America's Choice plans, Single Rate plans, Mobile to
Mobile, Data, etc. None of these refer to other plans. It is unfair to
characterize Sprint PCS in the manner to which you did, in my opinion.>>

But Verizon Wireless also makes sure that most (if not all) of their
different pricing brochures are available and easy to find. In three
places I was at last night (Radio Shack, Best Buy and Wal-Mart), the
*only* Sprint PCS brochures that were in easy-to-view plain sight was
the F&F ones. With the absence of the regular fixed pricing plans, it
does indeed make Sprint look highly expensive... as evidenced by the
Wal-Mart rep whom I overheard talking to a customer about Sprint's new
plans, and how they are so expensive, thus directing the customer to
sign up with T-Mobile instead.

You could say that the rep was mistrained (as probably was the case),
and that the customer was whitewashed without doing appropriate
research. But the net result was a customer lost by Sprint PCS because
the new F&F brochures are taking front and center stage, and taking
space away from the regular plans that are more competitive to the
average joe. If this does become widespread, Sprint will lose potential
customers more often than not.

Eric
 

Eric

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(Thomas T. Veldhouse) wrote:
<<Ifs, hypotheticals ... the problem in that case isn't the F&F
brochure, the problem is that the other brochures are strangely absent.
That is another problem altogether, and unless you believe this to be a
regular occurance, seems like quite a stretch, if not, then it is an
insinuation that needs followup documentation for the rest of us to
review. >>

Here is what Rob had to say about the subject:

Group: alt.cellular.sprintpcs Date: Wed, May 19, 2004, 4:55am (EST+5)
From: (O/Siris)
Unfortunately, that's exactly the strategy. Free&Clear will now be
emphasized as a business/corporate plan, and Fair&Flexible will be the
primary consumer/individual offering.
And I don't like it.
--
RØß
O/Siris
I work for Sprint PCS
I *don't* speak for them
 
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On Tue, 18 May 2004 14:21:43 -0500, caperenewal@webtv.net (Eric)
wrote:

>Also, the brochure was very confusing to understand.

Of course. They had focus groups to fine tune that. "It's not obscure
enough, we have to make it more confusing or they will catch on"

On Tue, 18 May 2004 17:13:04 -0500, caperenewal@webtv.net (Eric)
wrote:
>(Steven J Sobol) wrote:
>
>I know it is designed for a low-end user... but the wording and how the
>brochure is laid out looks really poor. If a store has none of the
>regular brochures in stock, the F&F ones make Sprint look extremely
>expensive on all levels.

Sprint IS extremely expensive. When they started they were low priced,
but you can beat the come-on deals in their plans with hardly any
effort today. They are very high priced now.
 

Mike

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Eric wrote:
> (Thomas T. Veldhouse) wrote:
> <<Look at Verizon Wireless for instance. They have separate brochures
> for local plans, America's Choice plans, Single Rate plans, Mobile to
> Mobile, Data, etc. None of these refer to other plans. It is unfair to
> characterize Sprint PCS in the manner to which you did, in my opinion.>>
>
> But Verizon Wireless also makes sure that most (if not all) of their
> different pricing brochures are available and easy to find. In three
> places I was at last night (Radio Shack, Best Buy and Wal-Mart), the
> *only* Sprint PCS brochures that were in easy-to-view plain sight was
> the F&F ones. With the absence of the regular fixed pricing plans, it
> does indeed make Sprint look highly expensive... as evidenced by the
> Wal-Mart rep whom I overheard talking to a customer about Sprint's new
> plans, and how they are so expensive, thus directing the customer to
> sign up with T-Mobile instead.
>
> You could say that the rep was mistrained (as probably was the case),
> and that the customer was whitewashed without doing appropriate
> research. But the net result was a customer lost by Sprint PCS because
> the new F&F brochures are taking front and center stage, and taking
> space away from the regular plans that are more competitive to the
> average joe. If this does become widespread, Sprint will lose potential
> customers more often than not.
>
> Eric
>

I agree, somewhat. These days, training is an expensive luxury for many
businesses. It's hard for most laypersons to realize the breadth of
information needed by a person that sells wireless. In a week, I might
get asked a number of questions, and many times, I'll be asked questions
that don't make sense.

CUST: "I had Sprint before. The coverage was good, but it didn't work at
the Home Depot in Dothan, AL. Anywhere in the store, or even standing in
front of the store, the phone was just dead. Now, if you walk fifty feet
into the parking lot, it would work fine. Did Sprint fix that?"
ME: "Dothan, AL is probably five hundred miles from here. I've never been."
CUST: "Is there anyone here that would know?"
ME: "No."

or:

CUST: "Do you have a case for a Sprint phone?"
ME: "What kind of Sprint phone?"
CUST: "A SPRINT phone!"
ME: "What model?"
CUST: "Hell, I don't know! What's the difference?!"
ME: "I think you should bring me your cell phone so we can make sure it
fits."

or:

CUST: "Do you have a wire to hook my cell phone to my satellite dish?"
ME: "What?"
CUST: Do you have a wire to hook my cell phone to my Dish Network
satellite dish?"
ME: "Why would you do that?"
CUST: "Look, I don't want to sound rude here, but I'm just trying to
find out, do you have that wire or not?"
ME: "No."
CUST: "Alright."

And in each of these situations, the customers left thinking I didn't
know anything about my products. Still want to know what the guy with
the tv dish wanted to achieve.

Some bigger retailers have taken the stance that training can be done by
building a training team guided in part by the marketing department and
in part by the buyers. This results in a person that knows the wording
in the advertising brochures and how to use the register. Because
wireless is more complicated than most of the products sold in these
stores, retailers have taken a "throw it on the shelf, put out shiny
brochures, see what sells" approach to wireless. I doubt anyone out
there has enough knowledge of their job to answer any question about it
in the sort of time constraints needed when dealing with the public.

I'm getting the feeling, between ReadyLink (Nextel) and Fair and
Flexible (Cingular) that Sprint allowing themselves to be driven by
their competition, rather than innovate like they did with Vision.

The retailer I work for had a regular conference call two weeks ago
where it was announced that we weren't going to promote Fair and
Flexible to our customers. It results in lower average plans
(companywide, our average plan cost hovers a little over $70) and
doesn't match with our customer. Same goes for area-wide plans. I'll
write one if it is a match, but it'd be crazy for me to do that to my
customers.

-mike
 
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In article <jfLqc.2347$be.1614@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
Mike <spamtrap@zbuffer.com> wrote:

> CUST: "Do you have a wire to hook my cell phone to my satellite dish?"
> ME: "What?"
> CUST: Do you have a wire to hook my cell phone to my Dish Network
> satellite dish?"
> ME: "Why would you do that?"
> CUST: "Look, I don't want to sound rude here, but I'm just trying to
> find out, do you have that wire or not?"
> ME: "No."
> CUST: "Alright."
>
> And in each of these situations, the customers left thinking I didn't
> know anything about my products. Still want to know what the guy with
> the tv dish wanted to achieve.

Maybe he thought it could get him better indoor reception.
 
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Phillip <Phillip@gte.net> wrote:
>
> Maybe he thought it could get him better indoor reception.

ET is modernizing his equipment.

- --

Thomas T. Veldhouse
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Steevo@my-deja.com <steevo@my-deja.com> wrote:

> Sprint IS extremely expensive. When they started they were low priced,
> but you can beat the come-on deals in their plans with hardly any
> effort today. They are very high priced now.

You obviously don't use Verizon.

I use both. At least until this summer. (I'm not leaving Verizon based on
price, FYI...)

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Domain Names, $9.95/yr, 24x7 service: http://DomainNames.JustThe.net/
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On Wed, 19 May 2004 18:29:34 -0500, Steven J Sobol
<sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote:

>> Sprint IS extremely expensive. When they started they were low priced,
>> but you can beat the come-on deals in their plans with hardly any
>> effort today. They are very high priced now.
>
>You obviously don't use Verizon.
No, I have Sprint, on a retention plan that is quite a bit cheaper
than T-mobile. T-mobile seems cheapest now. But not cheaper than my
Sprint plan. Not by much though.

If I had to get a new Sprint published plan now I'd say "you guys are
NUTS!"

>
>I use both. At least until this summer. (I'm not leaving Verizon based on
>price, FYI...)
If you haven't called them up at the end of the contract and
negotiated a better deal, you should. Sprint is the king of
negotiation. Or they were. If you don't get good results, hang up
and call back. Get a better rep. Trust me, it's like night and
day.....

Why can't they give you a fair shake without all these conniptions? I
sure don't like all the scams and come-ons. Cellular is full of it.
Crooks.
 
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I visited a Radio Shack today (Potrero Center, SF, CA) which had both
the F&F brochure (LIT66138 MAY04) and a brand new Free & Clear Service
Plans brochure (LIT66372 MAY04). The latter does not seem to be aimed
at a business market. Rather, it includes "Plans for You and Your Family"

Eric wrote:

> Hi Tom,
> <snip> The Radio Shack I was at today to pick up a F&F brochure
> didn't have any of the "regular" brochures in plain sight as they did
> with the F&F ones... perhaps that is because F&F is a newer program...
> but to a new customer who is browsing cellular services, it just makes
> Sprint seem way above and beyond expensive.
>
> Eric
>

--
Frank Harris in San Francisco with an A620
 
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Eric wrote:

Therefore, to
> the uninformed eye

Anyone who signs a two year contract for a phone and service without
shopping around or asking any questions deserves what they get.
A coworker got his ATT phone cancelled for non payment. After lunch
that same day, he came back with two brand new T-Mobile phones (The
T-Mobile store was on the opposite street corner from our office). I
asked him about his plan and he really had no idea, all he cared about
was that he had two working phones. He told me the next day that some
of the phone functions like web browsing did not work at his house, we
pulled up the map and he lives no where near a native T-Mobile coverage
zone. He kept the phones anyway and I believe his first bill was over
$250 for his $50 plan. He does not work there anymore and I doubt he
still has two active T-Mobile phones.
 
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Mike <spamtrap@zbuffer.com> wrote in message news:<jfLqc.2347$be.1614@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net>...

> CUST: "Do you have a wire to hook my cell phone to my satellite dish?"
>
> Still want to know what the guy with
> the tv dish wanted to achieve.

He meant satellite receiver- not the dish. DISH Network has recently
come out with a new satellite rental plan that gives customers a small
monthly discount if they hook their receiver to their phone line.
Your customer was probably one of the many who got rid of his landline
and went wireless-only. He wanted a cord that allowed regular RJ-11
devices (modems, fax machines, etc.) to interface to a cellphone. So,
you gave him the right answer! ;-)
 
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On Wed, 19 May 2004 15:42:07 +0000, Mike wrote:

> Eric wrote:
> And in each of these situations, the customers left thinking I didn't
> know anything about my products. Still want to know what the guy with
> the tv dish wanted to achieve.
>

Thats pretty simple question. The guy with the dish was probably asking for
a way to connect the sprint cellphone to the rj11 phone jack in the back
of his sat recv which is used for pay for view programs. Along with some
other carrier specific features.
 
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Steevo@my-deja.com <steevo@my-deja.com> wrote:

>>I use both. At least until this summer. (I'm not leaving Verizon based on
>>price, FYI...)
> If you haven't called them up at the end of the contract and
> negotiated a better deal, you should. Sprint is the king of
> negotiation. Or they were. If you don't get good results, hang up
> and call back. Get a better rep. Trust me, it's like night and
> day.....

Heh. :)

I'm dumping VERIZON. I'm already out of contract with Sprint, but Sprint
works out here in the sticks where, amazingly, Verizon -- the company that
contracts with the state to provide service to CalTrans emergency call boxes
everywhere, including the rural areas - doesn't. I'm just on the edge of
Verizon's Victorville coverage here, and have a lot of trouble making calls.

That's not the major reason I'm dropping them - it's taken months and
several calls about a dropped call problem in a busy area of Victorville
(Hesperia Road at Bear Valley Road - ironically, the location of the
Victorville VZW corporate store) and it's still not fixed.

I just got a credit for an entire month of service, and I suppose if they
want to continue giving me free service until the problem is fixed I might
stick with them, but...

Verizon is a great carrier in most of the areas they serve. They are, however,
having problems here in the Victor Valley.

Besides, with a bunch of friends and family members on Sprint and with PCS-
to-PCS calling only $5/month for unlimited calls, it makes sense for me to
switch. I already have an account with Sprint because that's the carrier my
wife uses, so...

And, yes, cellular companies are a bunch of greedy bastards - although
their landline counterparts are much, much worse. (Don't even get me started
about SBC.)

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Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Thu, 20 May 2004 13:10:36 -0500, Steven J Sobol
<sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote:
>
>Besides, with a bunch of friends and family members on Sprint and with PCS-
>to-PCS calling only $5/month for unlimited calls, it makes sense for me to
>switch. I already have an account with Sprint because that's the carrier my
>wife uses, so...

I just added my wife with a $30/300
Unlimited Night and Weekend Minutes
Nights: M-Th 8PM-7AM Wknd: F 8PM-M 7AM
Free and Clear Plan.

That is sure not in the brochures. And you can't do it with the new
admin system. But in order to get it I had to go to the store, find an
employee who knew how to use the *old* admin system. Went in on the
business side and added that to my acct.

Heh. Did I tell you I have done social engineering for a living?