Foley...I'm worried

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Hi all

After the whole Foley fiasco broke recently, I was shocked by what was
happening. Since the initial breaking news, not much has been discussed,
(actually I have hardly found any discussion). The only news I see is from
the excellent work of Kevin Steele (maybe because I haven't looked around
enough), who seems to have similar views to myself. I would like all who
care about mame to read his site regarding this matter.
http://retroblast.com/

My greatest fears for mame have not yet been banished. Foley seems very
intent on taking all for himself (there has been no news or information to
contradict this).

Lovers of mame have to realise that the threat to mame is still very real
and unresolved as far as I know. Will mame have to undergo a name change?
What are the implications of Foley succeeding? How many legitimate
companies (in competition with Ultracade or any other Foley run, owned
companies) will go down? What Will Happen To The Mame And Community We
Love???

I crave for some up-to-date news regarding this issue. All seems to quite
for something so BIG as this issue.


--
Ian
The Pinny Parlour
http://www.thepinnyparlour.com

Clone: http://www.geocites.com/thepinnyparlour
IPM Invader (coffee break invaders) http://www.geocities.com/ipminvader

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

The Pinny Parlour wrote:
> Hi all
>
> After the whole Foley fiasco broke recently, I was shocked by what was
> happening. Since the initial breaking news, not much has been
> discussed, (actually I have hardly found any discussion). The only
> news I see is from the excellent work of Kevin Steele (maybe because
> I haven't looked around enough), who seems to have similar views to
> myself. I would like all who care about mame to read his site
> regarding this matter. http://retroblast.com/
>
> My greatest fears for mame have not yet been banished. Foley seems
> very intent on taking all for himself (there has been no news or
> information to contradict this).
>
> Lovers of mame have to realise that the threat to mame is still very
> real and unresolved as far as I know. Will mame have to undergo a
> name change? What are the implications of Foley succeeding? How many
> legitimate companies (in competition with Ultracade or any other
> Foley run, owned companies) will go down? What Will Happen To The
> Mame And Community We Love???
>
> I crave for some up-to-date news regarding this issue. All seems to
> quite for something so BIG as this issue.

Eeeeewww!
I'd not heard anything about this , but it doesn't sound good at all.
What a Dick!
--
Alex

Hermes: "We can't afford that! Especially not Zoidberg!"
Zoidberg: "They took away my credit cards!"

www.drzoidberg.co.uk
www.sffh.co.uk
www.ebayfaq.co.uk

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

"The Pinny Parlour" <thepinnyparlour@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote in
news:XQVWd.187319$K7.179340@news-server.bigpond.net.au:

> After the whole Foley fiasco broke recently, I was shocked by what was
> happening. Since the initial breaking news, not much has been
> discussed, (actually I have hardly found any discussion). The only

Aaron Giles has stated that such may be detrimental to their cause.
However, there is a thread @ http://forum.arcadecontrols.com in the
'Everything Else' forum.

--
Do you want a free Gaming Console?
http://consoles.prizecube.com/?ref=12216

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Quote:" Will mame have to undergo a name change? "


Well, how about these:

S.A.M.E. (Supreme Arcade Machine(s) Emulator)
G.A.M.E. (Giant Arcade Machines Emulator)
T.U.F.A.M.E. (The utmost flexible Arcade Machines Emulator)
P.A.M.E. (Professional Arcade Machines Emulator)
M.A.A.M.E. (Most accurate Arcade Machine Emulator)

Oh, and these are free to use, if you like them

Greetz

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

your_worst_nightmare's last words before the Sword of Azrial plunged
through his body were:
> Quote:" Will mame have to undergo a name change? "
> Well, how about these:
> S.A.M.E. (Supreme Arcade Machine(s) Emulator)
> G.A.M.E. (Giant Arcade Machines Emulator)
> T.U.F.A.M.E. (The utmost flexible Arcade Machines Emulator)
> P.A.M.E. (Professional Arcade Machines Emulator)
> M.A.A.M.E. (Most accurate Arcade Machine Emulator)

MAIM - Most Arguably Isn't MAME

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

lob <lob30REMOVE@yahoo.com> wrote in news:Xns96133FF46567Alob30yahoocom@
203.26.24.228:

> AYGBTU - All your Game Belong To Us
>

AYGABTU - All Your Game Are Belong To Us

CUTME - Cade Ultra Technologies Machine Emulator

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

The Pinny Parlour wrote:
> Hi all
>
> After the whole Foley fiasco broke recently, I was shocked by what was
> happening. Since the initial breaking news, not much has been discussed,
> (actually I have hardly found any discussion). The only news I see is from
> the excellent work of Kevin Steele (maybe because I haven't looked around
> enough), who seems to have similar views to myself. I would like all who
> care about mame to read his site regarding this matter.
> http://retroblast.com/
>
> My greatest fears for mame have not yet been banished. Foley seems very
> intent on taking all for himself (there has been no news or information to
> contradict this).
>
> Lovers of mame have to realise that the threat to mame is still very real
> and unresolved as far as I know. Will mame have to undergo a name change?
> What are the implications of Foley succeeding? How many legitimate
> companies (in competition with Ultracade or any other Foley run, owned
> companies) will go down? What Will Happen To The Mame And Community We
> Love???
>
> I crave for some up-to-date news regarding this issue. All seems to quite
> for something so BIG as this issue.
>
>


T.E.F.K.A.M. - The Emulator Formerly Known As MAME

Damn near cracked myself up with that one...

Jeff-B.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Jeff-B wrote:
> The Pinny Parlour wrote:
>
>> Hi all
>>
>> After the whole Foley fiasco broke recently, I was shocked by what was
>> happening. Since the initial breaking news, not much has been
>> discussed, (actually I have hardly found any discussion). The only
>> news I see is from the excellent work of Kevin Steele (maybe because I
>> haven't looked around enough), who seems to have similar views to
>> myself. I would like all who care about mame to read his site
>> regarding this matter. http://retroblast.com/
>>
>> My greatest fears for mame have not yet been banished. Foley seems
>> very intent on taking all for himself (there has been no news or
>> information to contradict this).
>>
>> Lovers of mame have to realise that the threat to mame is still very
>> real and unresolved as far as I know. Will mame have to undergo a
>> name change? What are the implications of Foley succeeding? How many
>> legitimate companies (in competition with Ultracade or any other Foley
>> run, owned companies) will go down? What Will Happen To The Mame And
>> Community We Love???
>>
>> I crave for some up-to-date news regarding this issue. All seems to
>> quite for something so BIG as this issue.
>>
>>
>
>
> T.E.F.K.A.M. - The Emulator Formerly Known As MAME
>
> Damn near cracked myself up with that one...
>
> Jeff-B.


NONONONONONO!!! The /proper/ one would be WERPITYRANOUMPLABAPh,
pronounced "maim".

--
Thnik about it!
Dead_Dad

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 20:56:39 -0800, "Matt" <gamefixer@gmail.com>
wrote:

>All he is trying to do is

>copywrite

/chuckle

>the name MAME (in the original owners
>name BTW) so that it cant be used on eBay anylonger. Dave is not trying to
>claim that MAME is his property.

Yeah, right. And I bet you'd have drunk Jim Jones' Kool Aid if you
believe that.

>His sales are being killed by MAMAE
>machines on eBay.

Awww, poor guy.... Let's take up a collection for him. The poor guy
is being forced to innovate rather than leech off of other's hard
labor. Yeah, he's a saint, and we need to reward him.

>Matt

Somehow I think you're either DF himself or a co-conspiritor (sp?) of
his.

I'm not buying your load of dung..... and I don't think many others
are either.


--
Rick

I'd like to say "Thank you" on behalf of the group
and ourselves and I hope we passed the audition!
(John Lennon)

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Matt's last words before the Sword of Azrial plunged through his body
were:
> All he is trying to do is copywrite the name MAME (in the original owners
> name BTW) so that it cant be used on eBay anylonger. Dave is not trying to
> claim that MAME is his property. His sales are being killed by MAMAE
> machines on eBay.

However, there is no evidence that he's trying to put it in Nicola's name,
and he didnt talk to the MAMEdev's about it till afterwards. Also, what he
did wasnt legal since he wasnt the rightful holder, and so he falsified
documents.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Hi,

> All he is trying to do is copywrite the name MAME (in the original owners
> name BTW)

I thought this was a trademark issue and not about copyright.

Ciao, MM
--
Marian Aldenhövel, Rosenhain 23, 53123 Bonn. +49 228 624013.
http://www.marian-aldenhoevel.de
"Ich hoffe Sie können mir helfen. Ein Freund hat mir einen tollen
Bildschirmschoner aufgespielt, aber jedesmal wenn ich die Maus bewege
ist er weg."

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Marian Aldenhövel's last words before the Sword of Azrial plunged through
his body were:
>> All he is trying to do is copywrite the name MAME (in the original owners
>> name BTW)
> I thought this was a trademark issue and not about copyright.

It is, most people don't realize that. Also, they dont realize that
legally you have to have proper legal claim to something before filing for
proper trademark ownership. Foley never has had a proper claim to the logo
or the phrase Multiple Arcade Machine Emulator or the acronym MAME. In
order to file a claim with the trademark office, you have to sign a
statement to the effect that you are the creator of the marks, or
authority over its usage. By claiming he did, David Foley actually broke
the law. Most of the fools supporting Foley can't seem to grasp that
concept.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Hi,

> Also, they dont realize that legally you have to have proper legal
> claim to something before filing for proper trademark ownership.

Not in germany and I believe not even in the EU.

The first to file for a trademark gets it, regardless of who is to credit
for the artwork, made up the name or developed the product (if there is
any such product).

In the software arena a few open source projects have run afoul of this
but it never has been a problem at all. The worst that can happen is a
change of name. Other than products that sell themselves through a trademark
for free software a name is just a name. One may care because one got
attached to that name and curse the money-minded people that force the
change but that does not affect the user-base or development of the software
at all.

So what these people end up with is rights to a dead name or logo and a
whole lot of bad karma.

There is no way of stopping an open source project. This is the one shining
merit of the development model. Not better code, nor better people, but no
open source project ever dies as long there is one single person who has any
interest in it staying alive.

So in reply to the subject line I would say "no worries".

Copyright would be a very different issue.

Ciao, MM
--
Marian Aldenhövel, Rosenhain 23, 53123 Bonn. +49 228 624013.
http://www.marian-aldenhoevel.de
"Ich hoffe Sie können mir helfen. Ein Freund hat mir einen tollen
Bildschirmschoner aufgespielt, aber jedesmal wenn ich die Maus bewege
ist er weg."

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Marian Aldenhövel's last words before the Sword of Azrial plunged through
his body were:
> > Also, they dont realize that legally you have to have proper legal
> > claim to something before filing for proper trademark ownership.
> Not in germany and I believe not even in the EU.
> The first to file for a trademark gets it, regardless of who is to credit
> for the artwork, made up the name or developed the product (if there is
> any such product).

Well, its a bit different in the US (where the claim was filed)

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Hellmark thought about it a bit, then said...
> Marian Aldenhövel's last words before the Sword of Azrial plunged through
> his body were:
> > > Also, they dont realize that legally you have to have proper legal
> > > claim to something before filing for proper trademark ownership.
> > Not in germany and I believe not even in the EU.
> > The first to file for a trademark gets it, regardless of who is to credit
> > for the artwork, made up the name or developed the product (if there is
> > any such product).
>
> Well, its a bit different in the US (where the claim was filed)

As far as I can tell, Foley could conceivably grab the phrase "MAME" for
his own commercial use - in this case, since there was no commercial
enterprise using that phrase, it theoretically was up for grabs.

Now taking the MAME logo, on the other hand, I believe was illegal
(IANAL). US law grants an automatic copyright when an artist, musician,
or writer creates a work. Registering your copyright helps, but is not
required - it's your work, and cannot be taken and trademarked by
someone else.

Now what this all means legally, I don't know. We'll see...

--
Kevin Steele
RetroBlast! Retrogaming News and Reviews
www.retroblast.com

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Kevin Steele <net-replyDEL@DELadelphia.net> who was caught
burning roms on vinyl record, immediately had this to say...

> As far as I can tell, Foley could conceivably grab the
> phrase "MAME" for his own commercial use - in this case,
> since there was no commercial enterprise using that phrase,
> it theoretically was up for grabs.

Actually Kev, Ztnet (mame.net's host) was commercially selling
mame t-shirts long before the whole fiasco. So there was in fact
prior commercial use of the logo. Imo Foley has/had no
legitimate claim to it whatsoever.

http://tinyurl.com/67czg

--
twist

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Hi,

> Well, its a bit different in the US (where the claim was filed)

That is absolutely clear, I just wanted to broaden the perspective a
bit .

Ciao, MM
--
Marian Aldenhövel, Rosenhain 23, 53123 Bonn. +49 228 624013.
http://www.marian-aldenhoevel.de
"Ich hoffe Sie können mir helfen. Ein Freund hat mir einen tollen
Bildschirmschoner aufgespielt, aber jedesmal wenn ich die Maus bewege
ist er weg."

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Hi,

> US law grants an automatic copyright when an artist, musician,
> or writer creates a work. Registering your copyright helps, but is not
> required - it's your work, and cannot be taken and trademarked by
> someone else.

This is the same here. It is called "Urheberrecht" (Creators Right) and
you get it by making something. There is no way to take it from you and
you cannot even give it up willingly[1].

In what ways being the creator of a work gives you control over where
when by whom and what for the work is used is (generation after generation
of lawyers later) so completely muddled up that no one really understands
it anymore.

Ciao, MM

[1] OK, you can. By Death. It still takes 50 years, though.
--
Marian Aldenhövel, Rosenhain 23, 53123 Bonn. +49 228 624013.
http://www.marian-aldenhoevel.de
"Ich hoffe Sie können mir helfen. Ein Freund hat mir einen tollen
Bildschirmschoner aufgespielt, aber jedesmal wenn ich die Maus bewege
ist er weg."

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

twisty thought about it a bit, then said...
> Kevin Steele <net-replyDEL@DELadelphia.net> who was caught
> burning roms on vinyl record, immediately had this to say...
>
> > As far as I can tell, Foley could conceivably grab the
> > phrase "MAME" for his own commercial use - in this case,
> > since there was no commercial enterprise using that phrase,
> > it theoretically was up for grabs.
>
> Actually Kev, Ztnet (mame.net's host) was commercially selling
> mame t-shirts long before the whole fiasco. So there was in fact
> prior commercial use of the logo. Imo Foley has/had no
> legitimate claim to it whatsoever.
>
> http://tinyurl.com/67czg

Thanks for pointing that out - so there _is_ a prior commercial use!
That's good to know, as it further erodes even the one tenuous claim
Foley might have had.

I just wish he'd go ahead and drop his application (as he promised he
would). The silence on the situation, especially from the MAMEdevs, is
getting me nervous...

--
Kevin Steele
RetroBlast! Retrogaming News and Reviews
www.retroblast.com

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 12:02:09 -0800, "matt" <gamefixer@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Oh, BTW. If anyone here is leeching its those of us that fire up MAME and
>play games that we dont own. Me included.

There's a huge difference. You (presumably) and I aren't trying to
make money off others' work. I suspect that DF is.

Of course I could be wrong, but I'd have to see the source code
running on the Ultracade to know for sure, but we all know that ain't
gonna happen.


--
Rick

I'd like to say "Thank you" on behalf of the group
and ourselves and I hope we passed the audition!
(John Lennon)

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 09:55:11 -0800, "matt" <gamefixer@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Way off base dude. While I'm not DF I am a customer of his. I work in the
>coin-op field and have for over 20 years. When you say he leeching off of
>others... Do you realize he had to PAY the license fee's on those games?

It appears he didn't pay Namco, and, given his suspicious business
activities, and the general lack of enforcement by other companies for
these older games, I wonder if he's truly paid anything to anyone.
How do we know that it's not just a case of Namco being the only IP
owner to get ticked off enough to tell him to stop distributing their
ROMs?

Couple that with Ultracade resellers openly advertising that they can
add additional ROMs to their customers (for a fee!) to the point where
the machine will play 100's of games, and I'm more than suspicious.

>If I'm wrong I'll say so. But as far as I can tell from conversations I've
>had with him he doesn't want to have the name MAME he just wants to keep it
>off of eBay.

Well, I hope you're right, but until I see the trademarks assigned to
Nicola and the artist who created the logo, I'm sure you'll understand
my doubts.


--
Rick

I'd like to say "Thank you" on behalf of the group
and ourselves and I hope we passed the audition!
(John Lennon)

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Kevin Steele <net-replyDEL@DELadelphia.net> who was caught
burning roms on vinyl record, immediately had this to say...

> I just wish he'd go ahead and drop his application (as he
> promised he would). The silence on the situation,
> especially from the MAMEdevs, is getting me nervous...

Apparently it's quietly being taken care of behind the scene.

*shrug*

--
twist

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

twisty thought about it a bit, then said...
> Kevin Steele <net-replyDEL@DELadelphia.net> who was caught
> burning roms on vinyl record, immediately had this to say...
>
> > I just wish he'd go ahead and drop his application (as he
> > promised he would). The silence on the situation,
> > especially from the MAMEdevs, is getting me nervous...
>
> Apparently it's quietly being taken care of behind the scene.
>
> *shrug*

I know, but until I see some actual progress (i.e., a withdrawn
application from Foley and a new application by Aaron Giles) I'm going
to be a bit uneasy about the situation.

It ain't over 'till it's over, and even then sometimes it ain't over.
;-)

--
Kevin Steele
RetroBlast! Retrogaming News and Reviews
www.retroblast.com

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

Kevin Steele <net-replyDEL@DELadelphia.net> who was caught
burning roms on vinyl record, immediately had this to say...

You can always do a less than flattering review of his products
if worse comes to worst lol ;-)

--
twist

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.mame (More info?)

twisty thought about it a bit, then said...
> Kevin Steele <net-replyDEL@DELadelphia.net> who was caught
> burning roms on vinyl record, immediately had this to say...
>
> You can always do a less than flattering review of his products
> if worse comes to worst lol ;-)

I realize that you're joking, but I've already decided I won't review
his service for a couple of reasons:

1. If I do review it, I can't give it an objective opinion since I'm
pissed at what he's done. And if I do end up praising it, it looks like
I've been bought off. If I criticize it, I'll be accused of having a
vendetta. A no-win scenario.

2. I don't want to give him any more publicity, good or bad.

--
Kevin Steele
RetroBlast! Retrogaming News and Reviews
www.retroblast.com