Question Front USB ports on newly available cases ?

[Wraythe]

Asus is example for this question. I'm seeing USB 3.2 gen 2x2 front panel connectors on newly available Asus z790 motherboards.

When I look for an Asus case, even the new ones like GT502 do not have the gen 2 x2 speed doubling: ie they have only a listed USB 3.2 gen 2 which is 10gbps, not 3.2 gen2x2 like the motherboards they release now.

This forces everyone to buy 2 cases to purchase a new system to get the potential of the motherboard. Once at the present time to obtain a usable computer system, and once all over again to get a gen 2x2 on the front.

Is this correct, or does gen 2 on the case also include upscaling to gen2x2 (20 gbps)?

This is a worse situation than you think because if I'm correct, you would have to buy a second case, undo and drain all the water cooling etc and uncable all parts and place them in a new case, simply to get the gen2x2 20gbps on front panel, since manufacturers don't seem to be releasing cases with it.

 

[Colif]

So far only cases I can see that support that feature are made by MSI.
Its not that they aren't making them, it might just be a new thing to add.
Demand wasn't there as its only the Z790 and similar new boards that have that option. so its a brand new feature from this year... I would expect all case makers will add them.
Until recently the USB 3.2gen 2x2 slots were on back of motherboards only

So Asus not having them is hardly a surprise really. They so big that the people who work on motherboards unlikely to know the ones who make the cases. I would expect companies that only make cases will release adapters for their cases. I know Silverstone have one.

Why would you need to buy 2 cases? It is possible you can get PCI adapters that act as them or another bracket that adds the function.
Its not perfect but cheaper than a new case. Buy a USB Hub and run off that.

Next people will want USB 4 slots. I am not sure if they backwards compatible but they might just jump 2x2

 

[Wraythe]

You're ignoring the consumer options and experience. You defend Asus but ignore what they did. They have released motherboards with gen2x2 for over a month at least, but their "new" case gt502 doesn't have it. There's no excuse for that since they know their motherboards have it.

So what is the consumer to do? They have to wait months to get a PC again, or buy two cases. One for the present and one to get gen2x2 later. But in that case, unscrewing all pieces and reloading is an egregious imposition.

By the way, dongles hanging out are stupid and no cases have front panel slots anymore. Seems like the case designers don't care about usability. Front slots are very important.

 

[Colif]

That new case was probably being designed a year or so ago. It takes time to make them.

No cases exist apart from a few MSI ones with that type of USB slot.

I wasn't defending them, I was being realistic

Really the only example you could show of someone doing the right thing is MSI. But I know that will change, the case makers will release newer variants of the cases with the new USB.

I expect this happens whenever something new is released and needs to be added to cases. Simple dust filters took years to be added, and I see those as essential.

 

[Darkbreeze]

Case manufacturers aren't going to implement technologies that are so new that 98% of users either don't have motherboards that can support them or devices that can utilize them, just to make the 2% happy. And I assure you, 98% of users do NOT have builds with USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 capability. The 2% of enthusiasts and gamers who build their own systems or have just recently purchased prebuilt systems with USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 capability have not yet been enough for case manufacturers to make that change as the hardware is more expensive, it costs money to refit or release new models and none of that is going to make them money when most users are still using older standards.

Besides which, aside from a very few niche devices and some pretty expensive hubs, there isn't a lot of hardware that can even utilize the benefits of 2x2 yet.

And as Colif said, it takes time for manufacturers to implement stuff but more importantly they are not going to implement things that aren't going to be attractive to the largest amount of people because then it's going to raise the cost of the case, cause them to redesign or come up with new designs, for something that most don't want or need and unlike some past USB standards USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 uses a completely different internal header so it's not even cross compatible with several versions like USB 3.0, 3.1, 3.1 Gen 1 was.

 

[Wraythe]

That new case was probably being designed a year or so ago. It takes time to make them.

No cases exist apart from a few MSI ones with that type of USB slot.

I wasn't defending them, I was being realistic

Really the only example you could show of someone doing the right thing is MSI. But I know that will change, the case makers will release newer variants of the cases with the new USB.

I expect this happens whenever something new is released and needs to be added to cases. Simple dust filters took years to be added, and I see those as essential.

These people are bigger morons than everyone thinks. I am kind of pissed none of us are contracted in to overcome these fools.

 

[Wraythe]

Case manufacturers aren't going to implement technologies that are so new that 98% of users either don't have motherboards that can support them or devices that can utilize them, just to make the 2% happy. And I assure you, 98% of users do NOT have builds with USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 capability. The 2% of enthusiasts and gamers who build their own systems or have just recently purchased prebuilt systems with USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 capability have not yet been enough for case manufacturers to make that change as the hardware is more expensive, it costs money to refit or release new models and none of that is going to make them money when most users are still using older standards.

Besides which, aside from a very few niche devices and some pretty expensive hubs, there isn't a lot of hardware that can even utilize the benefits of 2x2 yet.

And as Colif said, it takes time for manufacturers to implement stuff but more importantly they are not going to implement things that aren't going to be attractive to the largest amount of people because then it's going to raise the cost of the case, cause them to redesign or come up with new designs, for something that most don't want or need and unlike some past USB standards USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 uses a completely different internal header so it's not even cross compatible with several versions like USB 3.0, 3.1, 3.1 Gen 1 was.

Except the case is essential to buying anything new on the motherboard side. All hardware on z790 is gen2x2. A case ruins any new purchase and they must wait or buy 2 cases. Except in the msi case, who have decent people.

And yes pulling a usb port on the front should be easy for manufacturers as the case can then be kept. which is economical.

 

[Darkbreeze]

All hardware on z790 is gen2x2.

Well, the only devices I can think of that anybody would connect to the front of a case with a 2x2 port that makes any sense at all would be a PCIe 4.0 NVME drive in a 2x2 enclosure, and then only if they are also transferring to or from an internal NVME drive as well, and ONLY if they are transferring a huge single file. Otherwise, a hub is about the only other thing with any value in that use case.

And no, not all hardware on Z790 is 2x2. In fact, not even all Z790 boards HAVE it at all.

For example, doesn't have it: https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16813162084

Doesn't have it: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1728884-REG/msi_pro_z790_p_wifi_motherboard.html/specs

There are several others that don't have it as well but it's needlessly redundant to post them all here.


Has it, but only on the back I/O, does not have an internal header for 2x2: https://www.newegg.com/asus-tuf-gaming-z790-plus-wifi-d4/p/N82E16813119602

Same here: https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16813145419

And here: https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16813144567

And so on. And pretty much ALL of these boards ONLY have a single 2x2 header, whether back panel with no front panel internal header, or front panel internal header with no back I/O 2x2, as well as having USB 3.2 Gen 2, USB 3.2 Gen 1 (Which is the same as USB 3.0, 3.1, 3.1 Gen 1) and USB 2.0 headers both internal and back panel, so the idea that ALL hardware on Z790 is "gen2x2" is not even remotely accurate. The standard only came out in it's final revision like two years ago, and it usually take about that long for manufacturers to start adopting a new standard into their hardware but they aren't going to do it really early if they know there is not a reasonable amount of hardware at least coming down the pipe that can take advantage of that standard if they include it.

It's like making 30 inch wheels for cars if there are no tire manufacturers making 30 inch tires or only one very niche manufacturer that makes them for a specific vehicle only.

 

[Wraythe]

But there are 30" tires. Without the MSI suggestion I was stumped getting a case that wasn't obsolete.

Very well,😔 no obviously absolutist statements can be made for emphasis acknowledged.

 

[Colif]

A case not having a feature that has only been on some motherboards for a few months is hardly obsolete. What people want in cases varies, I bought a 5 year old case for my last PC as it had features I wanted, it lacked others people take for granted now.

I would expect a number of cases will be released in the coming year that do include the ports. Or brackets or replacement ports for their cases. Lian LI & Silverstone & Fractal probably have them, or are making the option. High end cases will get them pretty quickly. Surprised MSI got there so fast.

Its called cutting edge for a reason, it cuts both ways. Some times you get benefit, sometimes you too far ahead of field and have to wait for support to arrive.

 

[Wraythe]

You have to think about people buying a new system. Without MSI being good people, once they put the parts in, they will have to pull them all out in future because the manfacturers did what they did.

Manufacturers knew the gen2x2 on front was coming out, in fact they do it for the back plate already.

 

[Darkbreeze]

There is no redesign required to support a higher USB C standard on the rear I/O and I/O shield, it's the same physical shape.

There is a total redesign of the front panel mini board required in order to support USB 3.2 Gen 2x2, as well as different wiring, and it's much more expensive. Not to mention, once they do that, then the other 98% of users who DO NOT have USB 3.2 2x2 internal headers on their motherboard will not be able to use whatever internal headers they DO have for USB C connections since there are no other USB internal headers that are compatible.


They are always, ALWAYS going to opt for supporting the greater number of people for 99% of products. This is why there are SOME niche products that are usually limited in availability AND really expensive, because they figure that 2% wants what they want and will pay for it but that is not a good business model for the bulk of their offerings.

Besides which, the majority of people, IF they NEED or insist on having USB 3.2 Gen 2x2, will simply use it out the back I/O if that's where it's at on the board OR they will get an add in expansion card that can utilize that internal header rather than requiring the case to have it.

 

[Colif]

Manufacturers knew the gen2x2 on front was coming out, in fact they do it for the back plate already.

The backplate is on motherboard. It doesn't come with the shell/case/box you put the Motherboard in.

So that only applies to the motherboards that have the feature now

 

[Darkbreeze]

The backplate is on motherboard. It doesn't come with the shell/case/box you put the Motherboard in.

So that only applies to the motherboards that have the feature now

Right, but even if it did, it wouldn't matter. The physical shape of the USB C would be unchanged regardless of what standard it was using. Not so for the front of the case where the front I/O board and wiring have to be compatible, and therefore different, from existing models.

 

[Colif]

i was answering him, not you

 

[Darkbreeze]

I know. And I 100% agree with you.

 

[Colif]

When Fractal Design released the case before my current one, the USB C part was an add on. On mine, it was included. So I don't see one now but I expect that all their cases will get adapters for the new USB 3 connections. And future cases will likely have them by default.