FX 83, i5 4670k,or i7 4770k for next gen gaming?

Sackboy

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May 26, 2013
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I don't how many times this has been posted but I was just wondering what would be the best processor for next gen gaming. I know there is hardly any games right now that use more than 4 cores or hyperthreading but it's hard to ignore the fact that future games will probably start utilizing more cores especially with the upcoming release of the XBox One and Ps4 which both have 8 core cpus. I'm planning to build a gaming PC in the next few months,most likely by winter so I'm in no rush, and I'm wondering on which cpu to get. Besides gaming I'll also be doing video and sound editing so from the 8350,i5 4670k and i7 4770k which would be the best to get?If games do start using more cores would hyperthreading in the 4770k give less,better,or similar performance to an 8350 since the 8350 has 8 real cores and the 4770k just has 4 cores and 8 threads in total?
 
Solution
the 4770k tears apart anything in gaming world
it has 4 physical and 4 logical cores

so it is good for u

amd 8350 is having very weak single core performance


Here is some really arbitary math. The IPC of a Jaguar is about half that of an i5. Th total perf of the console CPU's assuming perfect scaling is 12GHZ. I'll even double it to account for console voodoo magic and no windows overhead to 24ghz. Then here we have the 4ghz 4670k with 4 cores to 16. I'll double it to account for the IPC to 32ghz. We then arrive at the conclusion that any of the above CPU's you have picked should trash the console CPUs.

Of course all my math is just arbitary numbers and assumptions I am throwing out there but seriously, any of those 3 cpus will be fine. I would go for the 4670k or the 8350 since the 4770k HT isn't all that useful IMO, maybe 12% more perf thant he i5 if you full utilize the HT threads. The 8350 and the 4770k would age better than the i5. It really depends if games makers will porrt over the highly multithreaded nature of the console cpus to pc games since that will benefit the 8350.
 
Any of those three are great and are the best available right now!

However, I am curious to see how the 8350 will do for next gen games now that consoles are going to use 8 core amd's with x86 architecture. Developers will hopefully start taking advantage of the fx architecture.
 

If it's 8 cores wouldn't the 8 cores of the FX 8350 perform better than the hyperthreading of the 4770k?
 


It's not a true at core. It has four cores that have two threads each.
And games are optimized to run a single-threads. And Intel processors have much better single threaded performance than they're AMD counterparts.
 


AMD could win out with it's weaker cores if the load is integer based since it would be 8 real cores vs 4 fast cores + HT. It also only holds true if the game actually uses the 8 threads. If it dosen't then Intel still wins. If there is any FPU math being done, then the 4 FPU cores would lose out to the 4 faster Intel ones. So it is highly dependent on your workload. AMD gambled on HSA which is why they have less FPU resources.

I would actually say that the HT of the 4770k isn't worth all that much for gaming over the 4670k since they don't truly function as real cores and just help make sure that the 4 real cores are full utilized. HT is mainly an extra instruction pipeline so if another pipeline has a branch prediction error/needs to be flushed/stalls, the HT thread can step in and keep work going.
 
Honestly, we are just beginning the transition from dual core to quad core optimized games. So this future proofing by going with 4+ cores isn't the most necessary at the moment.

Even if you were to go with an 8350 or i7, by the time games get to the point to utilize all of their cores effectively and efficiently there will be much better processors out there.

Additionally, didn't the xbox 360 only have a tri-core processor? If so, it seems that didn't really influence pc gaming. Most games stayed dual core optimized.

If you have the money, by all means go with the i7. That will by far be the most future proof. I would recommend the xeon processor over the i5. It's an i7 at an i5 price (minus the integrated graphics, but who needs that.)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116910
Me personally I'm currently upgrading from an i3 to an 8320. There was a promo on newegg bringing it down to $145. At that price it was a much better value than the i5 and allowed me to allocate funds to other parts of my computer.

If any information I'm spilling out of my mouth is complete bs than please call me out on it. I've only been in pc gaming for about the past 2 years.

Edit: Spaced out the paragraphs to make it read easier
 
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Check this
 


Yeah the i5 or the i7 is best here. But what's different about consoles now is that not only are they going to use 8 cores. They're going to be based off of x86 PC architecture, so ports are probably going to be way better!
 


Please no, no Passmark stuff. Its a black box benchmark that we have no idea how it is weighted.

Here are some recent gaming benchmarks. Most games don't use 4 cores fully yet, still in the middle of the transition. The i5 will still do fine for quite a while since its got great per core performance. I would expect that anyhting that isn't playable on the 4670k to not be playable on the 4770k. HT really only gives 12% more perf if you load up all 8 threads.

http://www.techspot.com/review/586-amd-fx-8350-fx-6300/page6.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/fx-8350-8320-6300-4300.html
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6396/the-vishera-review-amd-fx8350-fx8320-fx6300-and-fx4300-tested/5
http://www.techspot.com/review/689-company-of-heroes-2-performance/page4.html
http://www.techspot.com/review/670-metro-last-light-performance/page6.html
http://www.techspot.com/review/648-simcity-performance/page4.html
http://www.techspot.com/review/645-tomb-raider-performance/page5.html
http://www.techspot.com/review/642-crysis-3-performance/page6.html
http://www.techspot.com/review/615-far-cry-3-performance/page6.html
http://www.techspot.com/review/601-black-ops-2-performance/page5.html




It was PowerPC

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenon_(processor)
 
i7 = 4cores/8threads

FX 8350 = 4Modules/8cores = 8threads

1 module is 2 cores that share a pool of cache. Each core has a thread in it.

i7 has cores with 2 threads in it.

IMO, you can't go wrong with an i7 or a FX 8350. Just depends on how much money you're willing to spend.
 

How can you really say that? He said NEXT gen gaming. The next gen consoles have 8 cores. Don't you think BF4, a game that sells extremely well on consoles for example, would utilize all 8 cores? Having 4 cores could only be worse than better. I would probably agree that it wouldn't be necessary to upgrade to an 8 core seeing as GPUs will probably continue to do all the heavy lifting.
 


Battlefield 4 will probably still work better on an intel. Even once the new consoles come out it will probably be around a year until developers take advantage of the new architecture.
 


The 4770k is better, not arguably not worth the extra price. Even though the next gen consoles will have 8 cores, I recall someone saying that only 6 cores will be used at once with the other 2 to run OS and background services.
The massive IPC and clock speed difference between the FX/Intel and the Jaguar cores cannot be overcome by going down to the wire or any voodoo console optimizations imo.
 


But there's games right now that utilize more than 4 cores like Crysis 3. BF4 is also rumored to use more than 4 cores possibly 6 cores
 


The i5 is still the safer bet though if you ask me. Even with the optimizations it's impossible to predict the future, and by the time 8 cores get fully optimized they'll be way better CPU's on the market anyways.
 
For the near term future (through 2017) I would stick with Intel's higher IPC CPUs with only 4 cores rather than AMD's lower IPC CPUs with 6 or 8 cores when it comes to games. Long term future (2017+) it is difficult to say. The gaming industry has really only just begun to take advantage of 4 cores in a CPU, however, I don't believe the usage is efficient yet. For example, I have not seen any indication of any games capable of 90%+ usage for every core in a quad core CPU. It is typically lower than that; much lower especially when looking at the 3rd and 4th core.

As for designing games capable of using 8 cores, it will take time. The easy part (all things considering) is to design a game to use all 8 cores. The much harder part is to design them to make use of them efficiently. In a very simplistic example, what is the difference between an AMD 4.0GHz CPU running 100% loads on 4 cores and 0% with the other 4 cores compared to the same CPU with 50% load on all 8 cores? In terms of total IPC the two scenarios are basically the same. Of course you can say 50% load on all 8 cores is better because more threads can be prioritized, but just sticking with total IPC, the two should the same. It will take some time for developers to design games to efficiently use all (or most) of the cores in a 8 core CPU. By then, whatever CPU you buy now may no longer suit your needs and you want a new CPU for more performance. I am guessing that most gamers who buys a CPU now will want to upgrade to a new CPU in 2017 which is probably when games will finally start to be designed to somewhat efficiently use all 8 cores in an AMD CPU.

Battlefield 3 is a popular multiplayer game based on the Frostbite 3.0 engine; Battlefield 4 will use the same engine, but I am sure it will be tweaked a little bit. In multiplayer mode the game can definitely use more 4 cores and it is an example of an exception in current games, not the norm. Despite being capable of using more than 4 cores, the 8 core FX-8350 does not provide better performance than Intel's quad core i5 and i7 CPUs. The below chart shows the performance in BF3 with multiplayer which shows that the FX-8350 lagging behind Intel's quad core Ivy Bridge CPUs. This is a case where higher IPC trumps more physical cores (every 2 cores sharing the same FPU).

Note that this is a CPU performance comparison which is why the resolution is only 1280x720. Using higher resolution means the GPU's performance masks the CPU's actual performance. When comparing the FX-8350 vs the i5-3570k, the i5-3570k provides about 17FPS better performance. That's with a 4 core and 500MHz disadvantage.

When comparing the FX-4300 / FX-6300 / FX-8320 / FX-8350 performances you can see that there is an increase in performance so having more cores can help. The biggest jump is going from the quad core FX-4300 to the 6 core FX-6300 which is a 6FPS increase in performance. However, FX-4300 is running at 3.8GHz, not 3.5GHz that FX-6300 runs at. That means if both of those CPUs were running at the same clockspeed, the increase in performance due to the 2 extra core would be higher. But look at the FX-8320 which is an 8 core CPU and runs at the same speed as the 6 core FX-6300; there is virtually no difference in performance. That means BF3 (i.e. the Frostbite 3.0 engine) cannot make use of more than 6 cores. The 8 core FX-8350 provides better performance than the FX-8250 and FX-6300 only because of the additional 500MHz.

Source: http://www.pcgameshardware.de/Battlefield-3-PC-221396/Specials/Battlefield-3-Multiplayer-Tipps-CPU-Benchmark-1039293/

BF3-Test-Multiplayer-CPU-Benches-720p.png


Looking back at the comparison of the FX-4300 and FX-6300, the FX-6300 represents an increase of 50% in the number of cores; 4 cores --> 6 cores. However, the difference is only about a 11% increase in performance. That means the 5th and 6th cores are not being utilized very efficiently. I will note that since the FX-4300 is clocked 300MHz higher than the FX-6300, the increase in performance should be a little better than 11%, but not much.

Let's switch focus and look at the Intel CPUs specifically the 4 core i7-3770k (Ivy Bridge) and 6 core i7-3930k (Sandy Bridge). The i7-3930k provides better performance than the i7-3770k so clearly having more core for Intel CPUs provides better performance. What's interesting is that despite the fact that the i7-3930k is running 300MHz slower than the i7-3770k and the fact that it is an older architecture; the i7-3930k provides close to a 14% increase in performance. If they both had the same clockspeed and were based on the same CPU architecture, the increase in performance would be a bit higher than 14%. This means that CPU scaling favors Intel CPUs rather than AMD CPUs; at least in Battlefield 3. However,the average gamer is not about to spend around $575 for a CPU (i7-3930k).

The take away from this post is that despite the fact that AMD's CPU have more cores, Intel's increased IPC trumps more (MOAR) cores. I would expect Intel's current Haswell generation CPUs to provide slightly higher performance than the Ivy Bridge generation of CPUs. But the article was written back in Oct 2011. For the time being I would prefer Intel's higher IPC to AMD's greater number of cores. In 2017, when I think developers will really start to take advantage more cores, the advantage in games may finally flip to AMD's favor, or at least both AMD and Intel will offer very similar performance.

If you have the money, buy Intel now for better overall performance (pre-2017). If you prefer not to spend the additional money on Intel, then just buy an AMD FX-6300 / FX-6350 / FX-8250 / FX-8350, and accept a little less performance compared to Intel CPUs.