Gaming at 800x600 in 2015

[Sorade]

Hi, my name is Julien and I'm new to the forum,

I've been working on a multi-touch table project recently but my computer is not able to cope with the finger tracking software (CCV1.5) and videos and game at the same time.

I've decided to build my own PC in order to suit my needs.

I'm an occasional gamer and I tend to play old games such as EU3, M&B Warband or Skyrim.
The finger tracking software doesn't handle hyperthreading.

I've been going for the following build since I don't think my GPU needs to be too powerful since I'm playing old stuff and on top of that at 800x600.

I was thinking of going for:
CPU Intel Core i5-4590 £156,00
GPU Sapphire Radeon R7 250 1GB GDDR5 Graphics Card with Boost £60,00
Mobo MSI Z97 PC Mate Intel LGA1150 Z97 ATX Motherboard £65,00
RAM HyperX FURY Series 4GB DDR3 1600MHz CL10 DIMM Memory Module £25,00
HDD Seagate ST1000DM003 Barracuda 1TB 3.5 inch Hard Drive £45,00
SSD SanDisk SDSSDHP-64G-G25 Ultra PLUS SSD Notebook Sata III 2.5 Inch Internal SSD, up to 530 MB/s Read - 128 GB £35,00

Thank you for your comments !

 

[James Mason]

If you're having trouble "multi-tasking" your problem is likely a lack of RAM, how much ram does you current computer have?
What does task manager show you maxing it out when you're using all your programs?

 

[Sorade]

Thanks James,

My current PC is:

- DELL Inspiron 3520
- OS: Windows 8.1 x64
- Processor: Intel(R) Core(TM) i3-2370M CPU @ 2.40GHz, 2400 MHz, 2 cores, 4 logic processors
- RAM 4Gb installed, given at 1.9 Gb usable
- Intel HD Graphics 3000 with a memory of 1.75Gb (will this be enough ?)

When I have everything running, my CPU is 90% and Disk around 80%

 

[James Mason]

The problem is your current computer doesn't have a graphics card.
Intel HD graphics is meant for browsing the web and word processors, not gaming. It's also using like half of your ram to provide video memory, so you're probably running closer to like only 2GBs of actual ram.

Get a GTX 750ti in there and you shouldn't have any issues. And maybe get 8Gbs of RAM as well.

 

[Sorade]

Can I upgrade my laptop directly or are laptops hard to upgrade ?

 

[James Mason]

Oh it's a laptop, nevermind then, you would need a new PC.

Yeah, basically this should be all you need for 800x600:
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i3-4170 3.7GHz Dual-Core Processor (£93.00 @ Scan.co.uk)
Motherboard: MSI H97M-E35 Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard (£59.96 @ Scan.co.uk)
Memory: Mushkin Blackline 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (£47.94 @ Aria PC)
Storage: Samsung 850 EVO-Series 120GB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£52.99 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (£42.92 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: XFX Radeon R7 250 2GB Core Edition Video Card (£57.90 @ Scan.co.uk)
Case: Zalman ZM-T4 MicroATX Mini Tower Case (£12.75 @ Ebuyer)
Power Supply: XFX ProSeries 450W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply (£36.64 @ More Computers)
Optical Drive: Lite-On iHAS124-14 DVD/CD Writer (£9.59 @ Scan.co.uk)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 (OEM) (64-bit) (£76.50 @ Amazon UK)
Total: £490.19
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-05-05 00:15 BST+0100

 

[Sorade]

Thanks for your advice James.

I am now a bit more clear about which dedicated GPU should suit my needs.

I have just two questions to further my, almost non-existent PC building knowledge:

Why an i3 rather than an i5 ?
Why 8GB of RAM rather than 4GB ?

The reason I ask that is because I saw this on another forum: "4 logic processors - this is Intels “Hyperthreading” technology, which creates .. well logical processor cores. For some tasks this is said to speed up the processing, but for CCV I have doubts. You already noticed how much processing the tracker requires - that’s why I would recommend a faster dual core CPU (and switching off Hyperthreading in the BIOS). Something like a 3.x GHz Core i5. But you can do this in the end - when your touch-hardware is ready." Would you say it is then worth going for a i5 CPU in the middle of the range say Intel® Core™ i5-4460 Processor (6M Cache, up to 3.20 GHz). The clock is slightly lower but since the tracking software will work in the background it might be better to have more cores since most of my softwares will not be able to benefit from hyperthreading ? However, I might end up being limited with a clock of 3.2 rather than 3.7, maybe this is why you suggested the i3.

For the RAM I have heard that 4GB should be enough for basic gaming, especially with a dedicated GPU, shouldn't that free some of the RAM for other tasks ?

Thanks again for your help !

 

[James Mason]

The build I posted was mostly just trying to keep costs down.

that’s why I would recommend a faster dual core CPU (and switching off Hyperthreading in the BIOS). Something like a 3.x GHz Core i5. But you can do this in the end - when your touch-hardware is ready."

If they're recommending a fast dual core, that's not an i5. An i5 is a quad core, and it's a bit slower in single core operations, which it sounds like mostly what you're doing.

A i3-4170 is about 6% faster than a i5-4460 in single core tasks (i.e. most computing, and Skyrim specifically is single core game), and is like 63% faster than your laptop's current CPU, so that's going to be a huge improvement over what you already have. Since you're not really doing multithreaded processing, like say video rendering/editing, the extra cores won't help that much.

The GPU will take a great deal of the work off the processor that it was doing before, so that will still be another huge increase to the performance you were getting from the integrated graphics you were using before.

4GBs is "Enough for gaming" but you're doing more than just gaming, and the 8GBs will give you extra room.

And since 800x600 is such a tiny resolution you really don't need much of a graphics card at all.

 

[Sorade]

Thanks for the explanation. I hope I'm not bothering too much with basic questions.

So, just so that I'm clear, the i3-4170 is faster than the i5-4590 for task using a single core because it has a higher clock per core right ? And since when I'm gaming using multi-touch the CPU will handle the tracking software and the GPU the game itself (or just it's graphics??) then a dual core should be enough to handle both the game/video and the tracking software ? Did I get all of this right ?

Thanks,

Julien

PS: If interested that's what I'm building, the screen will be a bit smaller though : http://www.instructables.com/id/DIY-MT-50-Multitouch-Table/

 

[Pc6777]

I would go for a 2 gig gtx 750 ti just in case you ever want to play a newer game like gta v. Also skyrim supports normal resolutions, much higher than 800x600. The skyrim ultra hd texture pack uses about 1.5 gigs of video ram and a decent amount of video processing power. and mods will just add to that. so a gpu like a gtx 750 ti would help in some games that you have, and maybe some games you might eventually get. I think something like this would suite you well. http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/p/qgh3XL, my build is around the same price and will preform MUCH better because mine has an i5 and a gtx 750 ti. the i3 and i5 should be about even in single core performance if they both have the same clock speed and are from the same generation, but with multithreaded stuff and or running programs in the background the i5 will crush the i3. imo choose my build, mine will preform much better for around the same price. also the i5 in my build will handle your video tracking software much better. if you want to make it even cheaper you could dump the ssd and it would be in the low-mid 400's!

 

[Sorade]

Thanks for your advice gianni69.

One question I have about your build is why is your motherboard so much cheaper than the MSI H97M-E35 Micro ATX LGA1150 ? Is that likely to have an impact on the performance ? Also, for some reason the prices for the case and PSU and HDD didn't show... when I added them your build went up to £560.

Also, I initially had a look at a better graphics card, it looked like the R9 270 had better reviews for performance ... but I guess it must have drawbacks as well. Any thoughts ?

If I was to choose between the i5 and the GTX 750ti which do you think I should go for ? I would be tempted to say i5 but not sure.

 

[James Mason]

I would go for a 2 gig gtx 750 ti just in case you ever want to play a newer game like gta v. Also skyrim supports normal resolutions, much higher than 800x600. The skyrim ultra hd texture pack uses about 1.5 gigs of video ram and a decent amount of video processing power. and mods will just add to that. so a gpu like a gtx 750 ti would help in some games that you have, and maybe some games you might eventually get. I think something like this would suite you well. http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/p/qgh3XL, my build is around the same price and will preform MUCH better because mine has an i5 and a gtx 750 ti. the i3 and i5 should be about even in single core performance if they both have the same clock speed and are from the same generation, but with multithreaded stuff and or running programs in the background the i5 will crush the i3. imo choose my build, mine will preform much better for around the same price. also the i5 in my build will handle your video tracking software much better. if you want to make it even cheaper you could dump the ssd and it would be in the low-mid 400's!

1. The HDD you chose is more expensive than the one I chose, and is specifically designed for Raid arrays, not general computing.
2. There's a chance that motherboard won't support the CPU without a BIOS update first which is hard to get without an already compatible CPU.
3. I thought about the 750ti, but found it unnecessary simply because he's gaming at such a tiny resolution.
4. Your case and powersupply don't have any prices.
5. He's not really looking for a proper gaming computer.

 

[Pc6777]

sorry about that, I corrected the build, now it is 550. the mobo will work, in the reviews I found some guy said something about a haswell i5 running in it. here's my updated version- http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/p/N7t7Bm, my build is a little more expensive and has much more performance.

 

[Pc6777]

Thanks for your advice gianni69.

One question I have about your build is why is your motherboard so much cheaper than the MSI H97M-E35 Micro ATX LGA1150 ? Is that likely to have an impact on the performance ? Also, for some reason the prices for the case and PSU and HDD didn't show... when I added them your build went up to £560.

Also, I initially had a look at a better graphics card, it looked like the R9 270 had better reviews for performance ... but I guess it must have drawbacks as well. Any thoughts ?

If I was to choose between the i5 and the GTX 750ti which do you think I should go for ? I would be tempted to say i5 but not sure.

I found reviews of it, it is supposed to be fine with haswell i5's. It may impact performance with a top tier 8 core i7 or if you want to overclock. if you use an i5 at stock speeds it will work pretty much as good as better ones if you don't utilize features of better ones. also, here's my updated build- http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/p/N7t7Bm some of the prices would not work, sorry about that, It is actually 550 now, which is still only 50 dollars more for a lot more performance.

 

[Sorade]

Thank you all. I have found a free OS through my University network so I might have some spare £ to invest in a better GPU... or just save the money and go for a build around £450.

 

[Sorade]

I was also wondering if the fact that games might not support 800x600 as a minimum resolution, but a higher minimum resolution (say 1280×720 or a bit higher) might reduce the performance.

I guess what I'm saying is if the computer does the maths for a 1280×720 resolution but my monitor/projector only allows me to enjoy 800x600 will that cost me performance ? or will the computer just work it out to output 720x576 to maintain the proportions ?

 

[James Mason]

If the monitor doesn't support the resolution, it won't display anything. It will say things like "Out of Range"
You can use some program edits to force 800x600 though likely.
And you may be able to "force" a custom resolution of 800x600 in AMD Catalyst Control Center.
https://steamcommunity.com/app/32380/discussions/0/540731691520810496/

 

[Pc6777]

I was also wondering if the fact that games might not support 800x600 as a minimum resolution, but a higher minimum resolution (say 1280×720 or a bit higher) might reduce the performance.

I guess what I'm saying is if the computer does the maths for a 1280×720 resolution but my monitor/projector only allows me to enjoy 800x600 will that cost me performance ? or will the computer just work it out to output 720x576 to maintain the proportions ?

First of all I would never game on 800x600 even if the game supported it, not enough pixels. Also a 2 gig gtx 750 ti will be fine at 720p or 1080p. If you wanted you could even get a gtx 960 which is a great 1080p or 1440p and for lesser demanding titles maybe even 4k! 800x600 is a resolution from the past, 720p is the minimum for a decent experience in newer games and 1080p is standard imo. so a 130 dollar graphics card(gtx 750 ti) is all you need for 720/1080 gaming. no point in 800x600 when a cheap card can run games at 720/1080. also if your monitor is 800x600, I would invest in a new monitor. You can find cheaper 1080p monitors for about 100 new or refurbished if you look hard enough.

 

[James Mason]

I was also wondering if the fact that games might not support 800x600 as a minimum resolution, but a higher minimum resolution (say 1280×720 or a bit higher) might reduce the performance.

I guess what I'm saying is if the computer does the maths for a 1280×720 resolution but my monitor/projector only allows me to enjoy 800x600 will that cost me performance ? or will the computer just work it out to output 720x576 to maintain the proportions ?

First of all I would never game on 800x600 even if the game supported it, not enough pixels. Also a 2 gig gtx 750 ti will be fine at 720p or 1080p. If you wanted you could even get a gtx 960 which is a great 1080p or 1440p and for lesser demanding titles maybe even 4k! 800x600 is a resolution from the past, 720p is the minimum for a decent experience in newer games and 1080p is standard imo. so a 130 dollar graphics card(gtx 750 ti) is all you need for 720/1080 gaming. no point in 800x600 when a cheap card can run games at 720/1080. also if your monitor is 800x600, I would invest in a new monitor. You can find cheaper 1080p monitors for about 100 new or refurbished if you look hard enough.

Did you read how in his original post he's using a multi touch table, and that's what's running at 800x600, it's not an actual monitor.

 

[Sorade]

Thanks all for your help. As James said, I'm using a projector, hence why the resolution is so low. I don't think I'll upgrade any time soon and if I do it will most likely not be for an HD projector since they are still very expensive.