Question General build-up of heat in system causes immediate shutdown ?

Oct 3, 2021
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My PC has recently started to shutdown unexpectedly. Today I discovered this is because of an overall overheating issue within the system. By shutdown I mean total loss of power. My guess is that one of the components is triggering an overheat, causing the system to shut itself off. The weird thing is that there is really no need for it to do that.


After doing days and days of debugging, I can state the following facts:

  • There is an overheating issue. I know this because I sometimes restart the pc immediately after the shutdown, and it will shutdown again when loading windows. It will keep doing this unless I give it a few minutes to cool down, after which the pc works fine again.
  • It's not the major components that are overheating. I run OCCT's "Power" stress test, and I can see that all the temps are within bounds of the component's max temps. See the table below
  • Windows Event Viewer reports a critical event after each shutdown. The event ID is 41, and there are no BugcheckParameters.
  • Even after cleaning the PC of dust, the same issue occurs.
  • Resetting the BIOS doesn't help.

Component
ModelGeneral max temp in C
CPURyzen 5 260085
GPUGTX 1660 super75 (Hot spot 85)
RAMCorsair Vengeance 2x8GB @ 3000mhz?
SSDSamsung 860 EVO 1TBTBA
HDDSome old Hitachi 1TB drive?
PSUCooler Master MWE Gold 750w?
MotherboardAsRock B450M Pro441

None of the above temperatures seem too high.


Special dates and events:

12 september
:
- I reinstalled windows 10, and I'm now on version 20H2.

24 september:
  • I decided to remove 1 of the monitors of my setup.
  • Immediately after this, the shutdowns started.
How the removal of a monitor can start causing these overheating issues, I don't know.
I am at my wits end. My knowledge of PC's is vast, but this problem really goes over my head. I think there's a small chip on the motherboard overheating, causing this shutdown, but I wouldn't know how to detect that.

Thank you to anyone who wishes to help me out!
 
Oct 3, 2021
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CPURyzen 5 260085

Although 85°C may not seem as bad as 91°C it is still hot.

What are you using to cool the CPU? Is this the stock cololer?

How long has this setup been runing?
This is the stock cooler, but it only gets this hot during the OCCT test. Something like Discord and Hearthstone at the same time will also kill my pc.

The setup has been running without any hiccups for the past 2 years. All the components are about that old, and were bought new.
 
Oct 3, 2021
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Run with the side panel removed and a desk fan pointing at the PC. If it is an overheating issue, this should prevent it. If the problem continues, it is probably NOT an overheating issue.
This works, so I can confirm something is overheating. I just doubt it can be any of the main components.
 

Karadjgne

Titan
Ambassador
No, it generally means a severe lack of airflow in the case and it's one of the Essential components that's having an issue. Like VRM's, Sata controller chipset, PCH chipset, i/o chipset etc.

Run HWInfo (sensors only) and look for anomalies in temps.
 
Reactions: helper800
Oct 3, 2021
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No, it generally means a severe lack of airflow in the case and it's one of the Essential components that's having an issue. Like VRM's, Sata controller chipset, PCH chipset, i/o chipset etc.

Run HWInfo (sensors only) and look for anomalies in temps.

HW seems to be reporting normal temps under OCCT load. Perhaps some of the motherboard temperatures are weird? In any case, I am sure I have been running temps like this before in the past 2 years.

Here is a screenshot of the temperatures
 
Oct 3, 2021
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Do what Karadjgne wrote about hwinfo and check the temps.

Whats you case brand and model?

And if you have the spare time, Can you upload some pictures of it to imgur? pictures where we can see the internal components layout and case fans installation (here is how: https://forums.tomshardware.com/threads/mega-info-thread.3574396/#post-21579248).
I'll get back to you on that when I get home from work. What I do know is there are 2 intake fans and one extraction fan, going from front to back. The system has been running this warm on very hot days without any issues.
 
I'll get back to you on that when I get home from work. What I do know is there are 2 intake fans and one extraction fan, going from front to back. The system has been running this warm on very hot days without any issues.
OK, I'll wait.

Also it was hwinfo, you can download the portable version, no need to install, and just run the sensors only option (https://www.hwinfo.com/download/)

Cheers!
 
Oct 3, 2021
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OK, I'll wait.

Also it was hwinfo, you can download the portable version, no need to install, and just run the sensors only option (https://www.hwinfo.com/download/)

Cheers!
So after crashing and rebooting several times, the system is now extremely unstable. Sometimes I'm able to start and browse the internet a bit, but then it dies. Other times it shuts off almost instantly when I turn it on.

When it worked HWinfo's temps were normal. I'm trying to showcase the placements of the fans, but it's hard when my pc keeps crashing.

I'm starting to think my PSU is bad. Today I ordered a new B450M Pro4 board, to see if it might be the motherboard. It's not a bad idea if I order a new PSU as well. I can just return the components if they aren't faulty.
 
Reactions: helper800
Thanks for the videos. So you have two intake fans one on the front and one on right side panel, 1 exhaust at the back + the PSU fan thats working as exhaust aswell. Plus you have the left panel hole.

So besides any component failing, what I can tell you is that theres no clear airflow path, you have many fans on several places but kinda not really working togheter.

Lets take the intake fans, both are a bit obstructed by the hdd/ssd/fdd long metal cages and all the cable mess (sorry not trying to be mean here). But thats not all both fans are forcing air in again each other, in a cross pathern.

I would love to read Karadjgne opinion on this but (airflow wise) I would try this:

If you can try to do some cable management on the front part of the case.

Leave 1 fan in the front panel as intake it wont hurt.

Then move the biggest fan to the left panel "hole" as intake, that will send direct air not only to the GPU but also to the CPU (not sure if the front fan or the right-front panel fan are the same size, or one of them is bigger)

Try like that.


One question, are those 85°C on the CPU while stressing, with or without the left panel ?

Just wondering, did you ever repaste and remount the CPU?, Perhaps the thermal paste was not enough, or the screws are tight enough.....

Didi you tried with only 1 sitck of RAM?
 
Oct 3, 2021
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Thanks for the videos. So you have two intake fans one on the front and one on right side panel, 1 exhaust at the back + the PSU fan thats working as exhaust aswell. Plus you have the left panel hole.

So besides any component failing, what I can tell you is that theres no clear airflow path, you have many fans on several places but kinda not really working togheter.

Lets take the intake fans, both are a bit obstructed by the hdd/ssd/fdd long metal cages and all the cable mess (sorry not trying to be mean here). But thats not all both fans are forcing air in again each other, in a cross pathern.

I would love to read Karadjgne opinion on this but (airflow wise) I would try this:

If you can try to do some cable management on the front part of the case.

Leave 1 fan in the front panel as intake it wont hurt.

Then move the biggest fan to the left panel "hole" as intake, that will send direct air not only to the GPU but also to the CPU (not sure if the front fan or the right-front panel fan are the same size, or one of them is bigger)

Try like that.


One question, are those 85°C on the CPU while stressing, with or without the left panel ?

Just wondering, did you ever repaste and remount the CPU?, Perhaps the thermal paste was not enough, or the screws are tight enough.....

Didi you tried with only 1 sitck of RAM?
I'm gonna try a better airflow setup today (like you said) and fix the cable management.

I've just measured temperatures with and without panel. The system lasts noticeably longer without panel.

With:
CPU: 84C
GPU: 73C

Without:
CPU: 81C
GPU: 70C

Note: Last night I replaced my GTX 1660 S with a GTS 450, and the same crashes occurred.

I did reseat the CPU cooler a couple of times, but that was many months ago. I got new cooling paste coming in, which I will first test on the current board. if that doesn't work, I'm swapping motherboards, to see if that's the issue.

It shouldn't be the RAM, as I memtest86'd it last night and there were no errors. I will however, try with alternating sticks to make sure it's not the RAM.

I will keep you updated on my progress. Thank you for all the help you and @Karadjgne have already given me. I truly appreciate it.
 
Reactions: RodroX
Oct 3, 2021
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I'm noticing that if I use only 1 of the 2 RAM sticks I have, the CPU goes up to 89C and the system lasts a bit longer than normal. I'm sure this is just a coincidence, but that's what I found out. I alternated the sticks and nothing changed.
 
I'm gonna try a better airflow setup today (like you said) and fix the cable management.

I've just measured temperatures with and without panel. The system lasts noticeably longer without panel.

With:
CPU: 84C
GPU: 73C

Without:
CPU: 81C
GPU: 70C

Note: Last night I replaced my GTX 1660 S with a GTS 450, and the same crashes occurred.

I did reseat the CPU cooler a couple of times, but that was many months ago. I got new cooling paste coming in, which I will first test on the current board. if that doesn't work, I'm swapping motherboards, to see if that's the issue.

It shouldn't be the RAM, as I memtest86'd it last night and there were no errors. I will however, try with alternating sticks to make sure it's not the RAM.

I will keep you updated on my progress. Thank you for all the help you and @Karadjgne have already given me. I truly appreciate it.
I'm noticing that if I use only 1 of the 2 RAM sticks I have, the CPU goes up to 89C and the system lasts a bit longer than normal. I'm sure this is just a coincidence, but that's what I found out. I alternated the sticks and nothing changed.
When you said you remounted the CPU cooler a few times in the past, Did you applied new thermal paste those times ?

Also let say you turn ON the PC, and just let it do nothing (idle) on windows desktop.... Whats the MAX CPU temp after 30 hour? (and please do tell if this is with or without the left panel)

Cheers!
 
Oct 3, 2021
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When you said you remounted the CPU cooler a few times in the past, Did you applied new thermal paste those times ?

Also let say you turn ON the PC, and just let it do nothing (idle) on windows desktop.... Whats the MAX CPU temp after 30 hour? (and please do tell if this is with or without the left panel)

Cheers!
I did not apply new thermal paste, because the old stuff wasn't dried up.

I just let it sit on desktop for 45 minutes. The average temperature is 34C.
 
Reactions: RodroX

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