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How the hell does everybody seem to get within finishing?
No matter how I about it I am still in the middle ages when I reach
2050AD
Never have I got to a modern era.
I concentrate on shields, I build many cities but stll takes forever to
advance.
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

trade
sell and buy techs. Sometimes i get modern armour by the 1700's

--
From Adam Webb, Overlag
www.tacticalgamer.com
CS:SOURCE server now active 😀

"Persifor" <persifor@pyramid.com> wrote in message
news:1go6klz.j86so1p7e60lN%persifor@pyramid.com...
> How the hell does everybody seem to get within finishing?
> No matter how I about it I am still in the middle ages when I reach
> 2050AD
> Never have I got to a modern era.
> I concentrate on shields, I build many cities but stll takes forever to
> advance.


---
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"Persifor" <persifor@pyramid.com> wrote in message
news:1go6klz.j86so1p7e60lN%persifor@pyramid.com...
> How the hell does everybody seem to get within finishing?
> No matter how I about it I am still in the middle ages when I reach
> 2050AD
> Never have I got to a modern era.
> I concentrate on shields, I build many cities but stll takes forever to
> advance.

Besides the trading often tip, the higher the difficulty level, the faster
the AI will research, thus speeding the whole thing up.
 
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In article <1go6klz.j86so1p7e60lN%persifor@pyramid.com>, persifor@pyramid.com (Persifor) wrote:
>How the hell does everybody seem to get within finishing?
>No matter how I about it I am still in the middle ages when I reach
>2050AD

Pop every goodie hut you can. Free techs are nice.

Did you know that the first civ to research Philosophy gets a free tech? Pick
an expensive one. The kick butt way is to research Code of Law then Philosophy
and take Republic as the free tech.

Build roads every where. At a minimum, each tile that is being worked should
be have a road. It would be better if the next tile to be worked already had
its road before the city's population increases. This requires a lot of
workers, roughly 1 per city (some what less if you are playing and Industrious
civ.

Go out and find the other civs. Explore your home continent. Walk though one
civ's land to see what is on the other side. Build ships and explore th coast
line. Make suicide runs across open water along sea lans (not ocean) to
reach civs on the other side.

Trade techs with the other civs. Here is a completely unrealistic example
that shows why this really helps. Suppose 10 civs are each researching a
different tech at the minimum rate of 40 turns per. When the research is
complete suppose they trade with each other so they all end up with all 10 of
the new techs. On average each new tech took 4 turns. Any tech you can
obtain through trade is one less that you will have to research your self.

As part of the trading strategy build Harbors so you can trade resources with
the other civs even if there is no road connecting you.

Trading techs with the other civs also tends toward a more peaceful game. The
other civs will be building infra structure, not military units, so the number
and duration of the wars will be reduced.

Don't let the governor pick what gets produced. I flag both "produce last
item" and "ask what to produce next" in the preferences. Also pause at the
end of your turn and eye ball your civ. Your F1 screen is your friend.
Periodically sort it by production (blue shields) and research (beakers) to get
a sense of how you are doing. You can also sort it by what is being produced.

Build commerce enhancing buildings. A Marketplace is more valuable than a
Library so I build the Marketplaces first. The additional commerce then
becomes both beakers (research) and gold. The Colossus is the wonder that
produces a huge amount of extra commerce. Once the Marketplaces have been
built then you can build Libraries and Universities.

Reduce corruption. Build Courthouses. Build the Forbidden Palace. It is
possible to have your empire be too large. There is a number called OCN
(optimum city number) associated with each map size. When you are first told
that you can build the Forbidden Palace you have reached _half_ the OCN. Once
you go over OCN each additional city starts to drain your economy, not add to
it.

As soon as you have Marketplaces in your core cities switch to Republic. This
will increase your productivity. Virtually any other government is better
than Despotism.

Grab as many Luxuries as you can. This allows you to not use Entertainers.
This increases all of your cities' production. Trade with the other civs for
their luxuries.

On the F1 screen play with the sliders. Move the Luxury slider up (or
down) to just eliminate the Entertainers in your core cities. Move the
science rate up (or down) to increase research and reduce the gold per turn.
Gold in and of itself is of no use but huge stacks of it can buy techs from
other civs (which you can then sell). If you are selling techs to other civs
on a gold per turn basis (very yummy!) then _you_ will be doing most of the
research.

A risky point is that your military can be too large. The smaller your
military the less you have to pay in maintenance and the more you have for
research. The risk is that if your military is too small the other civs will
declare war on you. If you are thinking about doing this check the F3 screen
frequently. If your military is weak compared to a civ that shares a land
border, you are in danger and will need to increase your military. Offensive
units count for more than defensive units in this case.

If you run out of things to build, don't _just_ build military units.
Consider building wealth instead.

The tech rate is faster at the higher difficulty levels.

>Never have I got to a modern era.
>I concentrate on shields, I build many cities but stll takes forever to
>advance.

Good Luck!


Mike G
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 19:00:38 +1000, persifor@pyramid.com (Persifor)
wrote:

>How the hell does everybody seem to get within finishing?
>No matter how I about it I am still in the middle ages when I reach
>2050AD
>Never have I got to a modern era.
>I concentrate on shields, I build many cities but stll takes forever to
>advance.

The #1 absolute requirement is trading with the AI. Both trading
techs, and trading to make gold income. If you don't do it, you can't
get enough research done.

#2 is having a strong economy. That means roads in every square in
use around your cities, marketplaces once you get them, lots of
luxuries (it is hard to get many without trading), and libraries and
universities to enhance your science. You want to be able to use the
maximum science rate if you can manage it (90-100% should do, less if
you have a really great economy and tons of outside gold income).

The AI's research rate is faster at higher difficulty levels, so by
trading well, you can get tech *very* fast. The optimum balance is
around Regent or Monarch levels, where the AI doesn't outproduce you
much, but still trades well. At higher levels, the AI not only gets
tech faster than you, it favors other AIs over you in deals, which
makes it more expensive to trade with them. At lower levels, the AI
can't keep up in tech with a good human player, due to lower
productivity. However, at all levels, even the easiest, you can do
well by selling your techs to the AI. They often have lots of gold,
and you can take advantage of that in trading.

Even if no single AI will give you much, you're still better off
selling the tech for a bit of gold from each. But often, one of your
competitors will give you a great deal for the tech -- best is a gold
per turn payment, sometimes they'll trade a couple techs for the tech,
or extra gold and a tech, or resources, etc.

The trading game is tricky. Different AI personalities like
different things. Some won't give you much at all for an item that
another will pay a fortune for. You need to shop around, talk to every
AI, see what they'll offer. It is always best to start out asking the
"what will you give me for" question, then alter that if it isn't to
your liking.
--
*-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*
** Muskego WI Access Channel 14/25 <http://www.execpc.com/~jeffsj/mach7/>
*Starfire Design Studio* <http://www.starfiredesign.com/>
 
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On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 19:00:38 +1000, Persifor <persifor@pyramid.com> wrote:
> How the hell does everybody seem to get within finishing?
> No matter how I about it I am still in the middle ages when I reach
> 2050AD
> Never have I got to a modern era.
> I concentrate on shields, I build many cities but stll takes forever to
> advance.

What do you have your science research rate set to? How much gold do you
normally have? (simplistically, the answer should be "as high as I
can to keep from running out of gold). If you've got more than a
couple hundred gold on hand, you're sacrificing research for something
that you'll rarely need that much of (gold).

Dave Hinz
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Can be a multiple of problems:

1. Playing Civ III Vanilla [no addons] from the original CD release
[1.0x] on Chieftain. (That is when human cost to reserach was constant
and the AI varied, swamped around in an early patch to give the AI
constant reserach time and the human a bonus/penalty.)

Note that last Vanilla patch was 1.29.

2. Excessive use of the luxary slider, especally on low difficulty
levels.

3. Insufficent road networks, especally on low difficulty levels.

4. Insufficent trading of techs, especaly on moderate to high
difficulty levels.

5. Insufficent exploring to make contacts, especally with the
Conquests add on.

6. Insufficent cities founded, especally on moderate difficulty
levels.

7. Insufficent corruption fighting structures, particularly on
moderate difficulty levels.

8. Insufficent micromanging of science slider, especally on high
difficulty levels.

persifor@pyramid.com (Persifor) wrote in message news:<1go6klz.j86so1p7e60lN%persifor@pyramid.com>...
> How the hell does everybody seem to get within finishing?
> No matter how I about it I am still in the middle ages when I reach
> 2050AD
> Never have I got to a modern era.
> I concentrate on shields, I build many cities but stll takes forever to
> advance.
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 11:32:56 -0000, Adam Webb <adam@ajmysecondname.eclipse.co.uk> wrote:
> trade
> sell and buy techs. Sometimes i get modern armour by the 1700's

I'm in a big war right now, I have modern armor and it's 1510. Not sure
how I did that, or if I can do it again. Damn India kept attacking me,
for reasons I neither understand or appreciate. I'm toying with 'em
now; took over all their critical resource squares, and all they can
produce now is archers of some sort. Starving 'em out and wearing 'em
down; they still have mech. infantry units, but not for long.
 
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On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 19:00:38 +1000, persifor@pyramid.com (Persifor)
wrote:

>How the hell does everybody seem to get within finishing?
>No matter how I about it I am still in the middle ages when I reach
>2050AD
>Never have I got to a modern era.
>I concentrate on shields, I build many cities but stll takes forever to
>advance.

At what level and what game are you playing?


Buck
--
For what it's worth.
 
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persifor@pyramid.com (Persifor) wrote in news:1go6klz.j86so1p7e60lN%
persifor@pyramid.com:

> How the hell does everybody seem to get within finishing?
> No matter how I about it I am still in the middle ages when I reach
> 2050AD
> Never have I got to a modern era.
> I concentrate on shields, I build many cities but stll takes forever to
> advance.

A lot depends on the size of the map and type of the map.

eg: Having a large map on Pangea means lots of AI civs that trade often. This
speeds up Tech research immensely. If all the civs are on different islands,
then it takes a while for the trading to take off and initial research is
slow.

data64
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:

> On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 19:00:38 +1000, Persifor <persifor@pyramid.com> wrote:
> > How the hell does everybody seem to get within finishing?
> > No matter how I about it I am still in the middle ages when I reach
> > 2050AD
> > Never have I got to a modern era.
> > I concentrate on shields, I build many cities but stll takes forever to
> > advance.
>
> What do you have your science research rate set to? How much gold do you
> normally have? (simplistically, the answer should be "as high as I
> can to keep from running out of gold). If you've got more than a
> couple hundred gold on hand, you're sacrificing research for something
> that you'll rarely need that much of (gold).
>
> Dave Hinz
so how do i use gold to speed research? the government only allows so
much percentage. Can i allocate spare gold to research?
 
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Buck <Buck@your.guess> wrote:

> On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 19:00:38 +1000, persifor@pyramid.com (Persifor)
> wrote:
>
> >How the hell does everybody seem to get within finishing?
> >No matter how I about it I am still in the middle ages when I reach
> >2050AD
> >Never have I got to a modern era.
> >I concentrate on shields, I build many cities but stll takes forever to
> >advance.
>
> At what level and what game are you playing?
>
>
> Buck
The minimum.
Chieftan
 
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On Sat, 4 Dec 2004 23:17:04 +1000, Persifor <persifor@pyramid.com> wrote:
> Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
>
>> What do you have your science research rate set to? How much gold do you
>> normally have?

> so how do i use gold to speed research? the government only allows so
> much percentage. Can i allocate spare gold to research?

If you're in a government type that doesn't let you increase your
research percentage beyond spending all your income, you need to have a
revolution and get into anything more sophisticated for a government type.
Does this mean you're running in despotism?
 
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Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:

> On Sat, 4 Dec 2004 23:17:04 +1000, Persifor <persifor@pyramid.com> wrote:
> > Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
> >
> >> What do you have your science research rate set to? How much gold do you
> >> normally have?
>
> > so how do i use gold to speed research? the government only allows so
> > much percentage. Can i allocate spare gold to research?
>
> If you're in a government type that doesn't let you increase your
> research percentage beyond spending all your income, you need to have a
> revolution and get into anything more sophisticated for a government type.
> Does this mean you're running in despotism?
Monarchy
 
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"Persifor" <persifor@pyramid.com> wrote in message
news:1goat49.17e1seb1d4reieN%persifor@pyramid.com...
> Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 4 Dec 2004 23:17:04 +1000, Persifor <persifor@pyramid.com>
wrote:
> > > Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
> > >
> > >> What do you have your science research rate set to? How much gold do
you
> > >> normally have?
> >
> > > so how do i use gold to speed research? the government only allows so
> > > much percentage. Can i allocate spare gold to research?
> >
> > If you're in a government type that doesn't let you increase your
> > research percentage beyond spending all your income, you need to have a
> > revolution and get into anything more sophisticated for a government
type.
> > Does this mean you're running in despotism?
> Monarchy

If you're getting extra gold in Monarchy try saving some of it until you've
got over 1000 then try to buy a tech.
 
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"Tzar Sasha" <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote in
news:1Jpsd.28664$Rf1.11347@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com:

>
> "Persifor" <persifor@pyramid.com> wrote in message
> news:1goat49.17e1seb1d4reieN%persifor@pyramid.com...
>> Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
>>
>> > On Sat, 4 Dec 2004 23:17:04 +1000, Persifor
>> > <persifor@pyramid.com>
> wrote:
>> > > Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> What do you have your science research rate set to? How
>> > >> much gold do
> you
>> > >> normally have?
>> >
>> > > so how do i use gold to speed research? the government only
>> > > allows so much percentage. Can i allocate spare gold to
>> > > research?
>> >
>> > If you're in a government type that doesn't let you increase
>> > your research percentage beyond spending all your income, you
>> > need to have a revolution and get into anything more
>> > sophisticated for a government
> type.
>> > Does this mean you're running in despotism?
>> Monarchy
>
> If you're getting extra gold in Monarchy try saving some of it
> until you've got over 1000 then try to buy a tech.

I think buying tech with cash is a bad idea. I know that I power up
my research by selling techs for cash. So doing the opposite is only
allowing the AI to power up his tech.


--
ICQ: 8105495
AIM: KeeperGFA
EMail: thekeeper@canada.com
"If we did the things we are capable of,
we would astound ourselves." - Edison
 
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On 5 Dec 2004 01:31:15 GMT, "Kevin 'Keeper' Foster"
<thekeeper@canada.com> wrote:

>"Tzar Sasha" <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote in
>news:1Jpsd.28664$Rf1.11347@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com:
>
>>
>> "Persifor" <persifor@pyramid.com> wrote in message
>> news:1goat49.17e1seb1d4reieN%persifor@pyramid.com...
>>> Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> > On Sat, 4 Dec 2004 23:17:04 +1000, Persifor
>>> > <persifor@pyramid.com>
>> wrote:
>>> > > Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
>>> > >
>>> > >> What do you have your science research rate set to? How
>>> > >> much gold do
>> you
>>> > >> normally have?
>>> >
>>> > > so how do i use gold to speed research? the government only
>>> > > allows so much percentage. Can i allocate spare gold to
>>> > > research?
>>> >
>>> > If you're in a government type that doesn't let you increase
>>> > your research percentage beyond spending all your income, you
>>> > need to have a revolution and get into anything more
>>> > sophisticated for a government
>> type.
>>> > Does this mean you're running in despotism?
>>> Monarchy
>>
>> If you're getting extra gold in Monarchy try saving some of it
>> until you've got over 1000 then try to buy a tech.
>
> I think buying tech with cash is a bad idea. I know that I power up
>my research by selling techs for cash. So doing the opposite is only
>allowing the AI to power up his tech.

If you need the tech, how else are you going to get it? If you can
get some tech the AI doesn't have, that's a fair trade. But it is a
gamble to research anything that way, because you can't know that some
other AI won't get it first, then trade it away for what you wanted.

There isn't much else which is likely to be worth enough to trade
for a tech. Resources alone sometimes can make it, but not always.
Gold is the only thing which the AI is certain to consider trading for
tech.

You are always better off trading techs for techs, plus maps,
luxuries, even resources if you have them, than trading gold. But you
need to consider what that gold is worth to you.

A pile of cash isn't worth much in itself. Tech is effectively
bought using gold -- it just comes out of money you could have spent
for taxes. The AI's price in gold is often fair, compared to what it
would cost you to complete the research on your own.

Techs which advance your economy, or which are militarily necessary
immediately (in a war, not having the best units you could have is a
way to waste a lot of production), pay for themselves. Often,
extremely well.

Techs which aren't critical to you now aren't worth paying a lot
for. But it is still worthwhile to pay the AI gold for them. Just
wait until most of the other AI's have it, and buy it then. The price
decreases as more players know a tech.


--
*-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*
** Muskego WI Access Channel 14/25 <http://www.execpc.com/~jeffsj/mach7/>
*Starfire Design Studio* <http://www.starfiredesign.com/>
 
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On Sat, 04 Dec 2004 22:03:35 -0600 Jeffery S. Jones <jeffsj@execpc.com>
wrote in message <pn15r0hqcrj0aj7rke18o4ad174i1tpktp@4ax.com>...

> A pile of cash isn't worth much in itself...

Neither is a pile of tech.

Tech is only of value if you are using what it makes available. It doesn't
matter how you obtained banking, whether your bought or researched it; if
you don't have any marketplaces then it's useless to you. It's often better
to save the cash, and use it to rushbuild what you can get from your
existing tech, and only acquire new tech when you've nothing to build. This
is particularly the case, given that the cost of a tech (both to buy and to
research) comes down over time.

[...]

> Techs which advance your economy, or which are militarily necessary
> immediately (in a war, not having the best units you could have is a
> way to waste a lot of production), pay for themselves. Often,
> extremely well.

This is especially true if you pay for the tech by turn. Instead of paying
900 for currency, say, you could pay 60/turn, and rushbuild four or five
marketplaces from your 900 gold. These would cover the bulk of your
payments instantly. Build a few more, and the payments could be completely
covered. Then in 20 turns, when they payments stop, the additional revenue
continues.

> --
> *-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*

--
Daran

The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that
English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words;
on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them
unconscious and riffle their pockets for new vocabulary. -- James D. Nicoll
 
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Persifor wrote:
> Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 4 Dec 2004 23:17:04 +1000, Persifor <persifor@pyramid.com>
wrote:
> > > Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
> > >
> > >> What do you have your science research rate set to? How much
gold do you
> > >> normally have?
> >
> > > so how do i use gold to speed research? the government only
allows so
> > > much percentage. Can i allocate spare gold to research?
> >
> > If you're in a government type that doesn't let you increase your
> > research percentage beyond spending all your income, you need to
have a
> > revolution and get into anything more sophisticated for a
government type.
> > Does this mean you're running in despotism?
> Monarchy
 
Archived from groups: alt.games.civ3 (More info?)

Tzar Sasha <tzar_sasha@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> "Persifor" <persifor@pyramid.com> wrote in message
> news:1goat49.17e1seb1d4reieN%persifor@pyramid.com...
> > Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
> >
> > > On Sat, 4 Dec 2004 23:17:04 +1000, Persifor <persifor@pyramid.com>
> wrote:
> > > > Dave Hinz <DaveHinz@spamcop.net> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> What do you have your science research rate set to? How much gold do
> you
> > > >> normally have?
> > >
> > > > so how do i use gold to speed research? the government only allows so
> > > > much percentage. Can i allocate spare gold to research?
> > >
> > > If you're in a government type that doesn't let you increase your
> > > research percentage beyond spending all your income, you need to have a
> > > revolution and get into anything more sophisticated for a government
> type.
> > > Does this mean you're running in despotism?
> > Monarchy
>
> If you're getting extra gold in Monarchy try saving some of it until you've
> got over 1000 then try to buy a tech.
How to buy a tech??