Getting Fully Immersed With Pimax's 8K VR Headset (Hands On)

Status
Not open for further replies.
The biggest problem I see with this headset is that it is being marketed as "8K", but the actual resolution isn't anywhere close to that. Standard 8K resolution is equivalent to four 4K screens, or over 33 megapixels. But even if we add together the resolution of both 4K screens here, it only works out to half that. Then, it sounds like the actual signal coming into the headset is only 1440p per screen, which when added together only works out to less than 7.4 megapixels total, less than the resolution of even a single 4K display, or under one fourth the resolution of 8K. Sure, the headset might offer higher resolution than any of the big-name headsets currently out, but calling it "The World's First 8K VR Headset" is pure marketing fluff, and involves stretching the definition of "8K" in multiple ways.
 

jossrik

Distinguished
Sep 26, 2002
1,547
0
20,460
330
Calling these 8k is no different than naming your tower cooler "Ice" or "Chill". Marketing does it's job in nearly all aspects of computing, it's fine. I understand, cause I have the same problems listening to people talk about pyramids being made by aliens... Yet I digress. 7200RPM HDDs as fast!
 

burkhartmj

Honorable
Aug 31, 2012
111
0
10,680
0


That's because it's literally just for the headset, not even the sensors. They specifically state in the reward box to get the cheaper tiers only if you already have a Vive so you can use its tracking sensors. For controllers and tracking sensors to be included you're looking at $799.
 

Heliosurge

Reputable
Mar 4, 2016
16
0
4,520
1
Yes Starbreeze shouldn't have called there StarVR 5k panoramic (2x1440p). Lol

Most are using the combined veetical lines as a showcase value. Vr headsets need to be seen as special purpose monitors & as such have a different standard spec reporting than conventional monitors. As for upscaling? While it is dual qhd input, the panels native resolution remains valid as its pixel/subpixel value is present vs 2.5k display which has less.

One of the key point problems is no real standardized spec reporting with VR headset manufacturers which makes it challenging to compare headsets by specs.

Overall Resolution: Panel's Native + input
-important for gpu requirement

Panel Type: CLPL/OLED/LCD
Sub Pixel Layout: RGB/PENTILE
-This affects quality of SDE (rgb is better)

Brightness/Contrast
-Lux, Nits (one or botg)
-not dynamic contrast real contrast

Latency & Frequency

FoV
-Vertical/horizontal
-Diagonal
 

bernardcozier

Prominent
Oct 23, 2017
1
0
510
0
I actually like the fact it is doing upscaling from 1440p. 1440 is more than good enough....the main advantage you get here is the absence of Screen Door Effect...that's where each 4K per eye display really shines and it's not necessary for the game to render native 4K per eye which would bring the games to a crawl anyway.
 

Heliosurge

Reputable
Mar 4, 2016
16
0
4,520
1
Agreed @bernardcozier. As an owner of tge PiMax 4k i can say the upscaler works well. Having been at Immersed i can assure you the 8k is like night & day to the 4k model!
 

olli.honkasalo

Prominent
Oct 23, 2017
6
0
510
0
@HELIOSURGE, isn't Pimax 8K just two higher refresh rate Pimax 4Ks strapped next to one another with Vive tracking? I mean, it's not a bad thing, but the resolution is the same, scaling is the same and they both use LCD-panels.
 

Heliosurge

Reputable
Mar 4, 2016
16
0
4,520
1
Truthfully no. The 8k is using new CLPL screens with considerable improvements over the 4k lcd 60hz panel. The optics are freshnel v2.0 vs PiMax 4k Aspherical. & of course the Valve tracking & expandability through moduls. The 8k also will be DP 1.4 vs hdmi 1.4.

The first proof of concept prototype revealed Jan 2017 could maybe be described as 2 PiMax 4k blended. But not the prototype at Immersed. Now as mentioned the new prototype is set to be revealed next week in the US. I am looking forward to reading reviews as it is reported to feature new improved screens & optics with ipd working.
 

bit_user

Splendid
Ambassador
The PC drives two 2560x1440 outputs, and the scaler brings the perceived resolution up to 4K per eye.
lame

We expected incredible clarity in the menu systems and the 2D desktop window, but we were somewhat let down.
Unless you didn't yet know about the scaler, why on earth would you expect "incredible clarity"?

If these guys wanted to impress people, they should've driven them, at native resolution, with a couple 1080 Ti's. DisplayPort 1.4 can supposedly handle 4k at up to 120 Hz, so a pair of connections should've been able to manage 75 Hz.
 

Heliosurge

Reputable
Mar 4, 2016
16
0
4,520
1
With the proper ipd set there is no reason upscaled 1440p can have crisp sharp text. Without ipd adjustment convergence will be off. Now 1 could close 1 eye to see potential of text quality.

Showcasing on a 1080ti would not be a good representation to folks without 1080ti.

As for dual dp 1.4 that is a feature in the 8k-X model.
 

bit_user

Splendid
Ambassador

When scaling to a resolution < 2x, you always have a roll-off of higher frequencies and/or more aliasing. In fact, the fewer annoying aliasing artifacts you want, the more the high frequencies must be attenuated. It's not impossible that their "Brain Warp" technology uses super-resolution to mitigate this, but that's severely limited by the number of frames it can realistically use.

In short, expect a smoother image (i.e. less screen door), but with less clarity than a HMD employing 2.5k panels and rendered at native res.
 

olli.honkasalo

Prominent
Oct 23, 2017
6
0
510
0
@HELIOSURGE, thanks for the clarification.

@BIT_USER, I personally prefer upscaled 5120x1440, since even that is tough on even your usual gamer-grade i7 + GTX 1070 hardware. Point of having 4K resolution as I see it is to prevent SDE, which it should do.

If resolution was that matters, one could just as well get the Pimax 5K with native QHD OLED screens without upscaling. Even that should have SDE that's less than CV1 / Vive.
 

Gregory_3

Reputable
Oct 2, 2015
9
0
4,510
0
The problem with VR hardware in general is lack of imaginative game software. It's just as it's always been. If or until there is general imaginative software to run on the thing, these items are just expensive paperweights.
 

bit_user

Splendid
Ambassador

Um, no. They increased the FoV, so they should increase the rendered resolution to retain at least the same detail per degree. Plus, by advertising this as high-resolution, the general public (including, it would seem, even the authors of this article) assume more detail.

I understand the SDE benefit, but I still think the scaling is not an issue that should be taken lightly. Again, it can pretty much only reduce clarity.

It might be nice to have an option to scale on lower-end GPUs, but it should also have the capability to display native resolution. It seems like dual-DisplayPort 1.4 would be up to the task.
 

olli.honkasalo

Prominent
Oct 23, 2017
6
0
510
0
@BIT_USER, they kinda did increase the resolution to fit the new FoV. Pimax 4K had 1920x2160 per eye for their roughly 100 degree FoV, when 8K has literally twice that (3840x2160) for the 200 degree FoV. So rendered resolution is identical. And as HELIOSURGE kindly pointed out, they've also improved the lenses and the panels, so it should actually be even better looking overall than the Pimax 4K.

If you really want the 2x 4K without scaling, you need to pay a bit extra for their 8K X HMD that will be a bit more expensive and requires a lot more from your setup. So it is an option, but everyone doesn't have to pay for it, which is nice. Details can be found from their Kickstarter page.

(Also for clarification, I personally haven't backed them and may never own any Pimax HMD. My VR experiences are limited to my Rift CV1 + Bobo VR Z5 Daydream with Mate 9 Pro.)
 

Heliosurge

Reputable
Mar 4, 2016
16
0
4,520
1
@olli.honkasalo indeed the 8k-X is not coming with the upscaler. If they only released it then interest would be restricted to a select small group who could afford 1080ti or the upcoming release of Volta.

The real trouble with upscaling one really shouldn't judge the potential quality without experiencing it. In the original 60gig ps3 with ps2 hardware(not soft emulation) ps2 games look better on the ps3 tgen ps2. Only when sony switched to software emulated hardware did the games look not as good.

I can assure that my 4k model with 1440p upscaled to 2160p looks better than a 1440p native headset.

The 8k upscaler is far superior than the 4k version. And while i can find sde on the 4k with concentration the 8k i coulldn't see it.

While I will agree 1440p/eye upscaled to 2160p/eye will not have the same fidelity as native 2160p. Versus native 1440p panel to upscaled 1440p to native 2160p. You need to experience it to judge the quality of the upscaler to appreciate how good or not good it is.
 

bit_user

Splendid
Ambassador

Did you read the article? It says the input signal is 2560x1440 - not 3840x2160.
 

bit_user

Splendid
Ambassador

This is not an issue resolvable by analogy.


Scaling cannot add information, and will almost always look more blurry and/or have more aliasing artifacts than native resolution - especially when not rendered with FSAA to fully maximize the channel bandwidth. This is signal processing 101.

If you prefer the look of a more blurry image, I can't argue with that. Enjoy your HMD. I'm just saying there's no way that detail doesn't suffer from the scaling, and there's no way it doesn't suffer from the extra FoV (vs. Vive, Rift, and the Windows lot). You can argue all you want, but anyone who tried a side-by-side comparison would have to agree.

Man, they need a VR eye chart app. Then we could just say what line # you can read down to and that would be that.
 

computerguy72

Distinguished
Sep 22, 2011
183
0
18,690
1
I tried it as well and bigscreen text was pretty readable to me. I think their new prototype on the 26th has the hardware ipd adjustment so anyone should be able to get sharper text. It is indeed a large step better than my vive.
 

olli.honkasalo

Prominent
Oct 23, 2017
6
0
510
0
@BIT_USER, Pimax 4K also had 2560x1440 upscaled to 3840x2160. So yes, they did literally double it with the doubling of FoV.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

ASK THE COMMUNITY

TRENDING THREADS

Latest posts