Has the RSPCA, etc. shot itself in the foot?

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Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

I was reading a site this morning which described the ban on fox
hunting campaign as the biggest mistake the RSPCA ever joined
in.

The point the writer made was that it has alienated the
countryside by going after fox hunting and in the countryside
information is spread by word of mouth. Prosecutions against
illegal "sports" such as cock fighting, dog fighting, badger
bating, etc. were easier prior to the hunting ban because
country people who knew what was going on were sympathetic to
the RSPCA and tipped them off.

The writer claimed that this co-operation would be less likely
in the future. Is there any truth in this?

I must say, I view the SSPCA (in Scotland) with growing
suspicion. They have had a conducted tour of my farm just once -
- when I insisted that they see absolutely everything. After
that visit, they voluntarily handed me a copy of the letter of
complaint they had received, because it was such an outrageous
lie, so that I could pass it to my solicitor! That alone must be
unprecedented but is a reflection on what they saw here.

But now my door is closed to the SSPCA unless they can produce
documentary evidence of a genuine complaint which my solicitor
to sue on for defamation (in Scotland).

What do other members of the group think? Do you still let them
in? And would you inform them if you suspected your neighbour
was in breach of the cruelty laws?

Derry
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

I think you were absolutely right to let them in, and if I were you I would
continue to do so - only people with things to hide would refuse them
entry - whether or not they backed fox hunting bans or not is completely
irrelevant , and as for withholding information re the despicable so called
'sports' you mentioned, i sincerely hope that this does not happen - it is
precisely the sort of behaviour that gets us all a bad name, i am sure
people who supported hunting do not really want to associate themselves with
such vermin.
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

Derry Argue <derry(delete)@adviegundogs.co.uk> wrote in
news:Xns95AD580491595derryadviegundogscou@130.133.1.4:

> What do other members of the group think? Do you still let them
> in? And would you inform them if you suspected your neighbour
> was in breach of the cruelty laws?

I have no time what so ever for the RSPCA.
They have openly admitted that they are against shooting sports and they
will support a total ban.
That’s not the reason I have no time for them, the RSPCA are the biggest
rip off come charity organisation I have ever had the misfortune to
encounter.
A few years back, one of my ferrets escaped. The poor little chap had
the right idea and found his way to the village police station (now
gone). Okay, the police had no idea what to do, so they called the
RSPCA, the chap came out, pick up my ferret, walked back to the van
(less than 10 yds) and killed my ferret down. Less than 4 hours after he
had escaped!!
The reason was because the chap was on his way home and there were no
shelters open.
After publicising this, I was contacted by ex-RSPCA employees and was
told many bad things about this so called charity.
For example, one ex-employee told how they used to breed kittens and
puppies behind closed doors. What happened to these youngsters? They
were destroyed as a training exercise for the new recruits, I mean
practice equals perfect right?
I was even given a confidential copy of one areas end of year accounts.
Put it this way, I know how much they spend on staff refreshments and
how it compares to the cost of animal housing.
The atrocities this charity carries out is frankly sickening.
One old woman who used to look after stray cats (given to her by the
RSPCA) woke one morning to them knocking her door. They came in, took
all the cats and put them down. Why? Just because.
I would SERIOUSLY recommend any supporter of this organisation to do
some research and find out how your money is spent.
As for country folk helping the RSPCA, well there isn’t any farmers in
this neck of the woods that will give them the time of day.
I have also been told it is common practice to destroy all working
animals and not try to re-home, with the exception of a token few.


John
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"ad e nuff" <tony.warrington@ntlworld.com> wrote in
news:l_Epd.50$9%4.7@newsfe3-gui.ntli.net:

> I think you were absolutely right to let them in, and if I were you I
> would continue to do so - only people with things to hide would
> refuse them entry –

How long before the youth army arrives then?

>whether or not they backed fox hunting bans or
> not is completely irrelevant ,

Hunting has nothing to do with it, civil rights, privacy and bloody
mindedness is the name of the game.


>and as for withholding information re
> the despicable so called 'sports' you mentioned, i sincerely hope
> that this does not happen –

It will.

> it is precisely the sort of behaviour
> that gets us all a bad name, i am sure people who supported hunting
> do not really want to associate themselves with such vermin.

People who support hunting are just about as sick to the stomach as they
can get.
These idiots, who have voted for the ban, know nothing. It really pi$$es
me off.
The ban will mean that foxes will be shot to kingdom come, the ban has
not helped the foxes one little bit and to top it all off the country
folk and the country minded folk who support blood sports are now
alienated and that’s that.

John
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

>Subject: Re: Has the RSPCA, etc. shot itself in the foot?
>From: "ad e nuff" tony.warrington@ntlworld.com
>Date: 26/11/2004 12:05 GMT

<Snip> only people with things to hide would refuse them entry<snip>

Oh yes, we might as well all carry ID cards and identity chips as well then.

Steve. Suffolk.
remove 'knujon' to e-mail
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

I would'nt give the rspca a penny. The person that runs it apparently earns
nearly £100,000 a year, not bad for a charity worker.


"John" <zero_one34@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns95CB8F57D5AB3OEcopyremovedheaders@130.133.1.4...
> Derry Argue <derry(delete)@adviegundogs.co.uk> wrote in
> news:Xns95AD580491595derryadviegundogscou@130.133.1.4:
>
>> What do other members of the group think? Do you still let them
>> in? And would you inform them if you suspected your neighbour
>> was in breach of the cruelty laws?
>
> I have no time what so ever for the RSPCA.
> They have openly admitted that they are against shooting sports and they
> will support a total ban.
> That's not the reason I have no time for them, the RSPCA are the biggest
> rip off come charity organisation I have ever had the misfortune to
> encounter.
> A few years back, one of my ferrets escaped. The poor little chap had
> the right idea and found his way to the village police station (now
> gone). Okay, the police had no idea what to do, so they called the
> RSPCA, the chap came out, pick up my ferret, walked back to the van
> (less than 10 yds) and killed my ferret down. Less than 4 hours after he
> had escaped!!
> The reason was because the chap was on his way home and there were no
> shelters open.
> After publicising this, I was contacted by ex-RSPCA employees and was
> told many bad things about this so called charity.
> For example, one ex-employee told how they used to breed kittens and
> puppies behind closed doors. What happened to these youngsters? They
> were destroyed as a training exercise for the new recruits, I mean
> practice equals perfect right?
> I was even given a confidential copy of one areas end of year accounts.
> Put it this way, I know how much they spend on staff refreshments and
> how it compares to the cost of animal housing.
> The atrocities this charity carries out is frankly sickening.
> One old woman who used to look after stray cats (given to her by the
> RSPCA) woke one morning to them knocking her door. They came in, took
> all the cats and put them down. Why? Just because.
> I would SERIOUSLY recommend any supporter of this organisation to do
> some research and find out how your money is spent.
> As for country folk helping the RSPCA, well there isn't any farmers in
> this neck of the woods that will give them the time of day.
> I have also been told it is common practice to destroy all working
> animals and not try to re-home, with the exception of a token few.
>
>
> John
>
>
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

On 26 Nov 2004 15:31:51 GMT, an6530@aol.comknujon
(AN6530) wrote:

>>Subject: Re: Has the RSPCA, etc. shot itself in the foot?
>>From: "ad e nuff" tony.warrington@ntlworld.com
>>Date: 26/11/2004 12:05 GMT
>
><Snip> only people with things to hide would refuse them entry<snip>
>
>Oh yes, we might as well all carry ID cards and identity chips as well then.
>
>Steve. Suffolk.

Obviously we're on the same wavelength, Steve.
Sadly the 'only those with something to hide...'
brigade will never understand the difference between a
natural desire for privacy and a guilty cover-up.

Gyppo

John Craggs - Writer - Adult Tutor - Storyteller
and All-Round Rogue
Need a laugh? Then subscribe to the free Monday Silly Digest:
mail to: gyppo1@ntlworld.com With 'MSD SUB' as subject.
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"John" <zero_one34@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns95CB8F57D5AB3OEcopyremovedheaders@130.133.1.4...
> Derry Argue <derry(delete)@adviegundogs.co.uk> wrote in
> news:Xns95AD580491595derryadviegundogscou@130.133.1.4:
>
> > What do other members of the group think? Do you still let them
> > in? And would you inform them if you suspected your neighbour
> > was in breach of the cruelty laws?
>
> I have no time what so ever for the RSPCA.
> They have openly admitted that they are against shooting sports and they
> will support a total ban.

You are right that the RSPCA is eventually going to campaign on game
shooting, despite their present denials. Just happens that Jackie Ballard
their new chief executive used to be my MP. I had raised my previous
problems with a local shoot with her when my MP. Because of a letter of mine
that had been printed in the Guardian, about hunting, she thought I was an
out-and-out anti, congratulated me for being so brave to write such a letter
when I lived next door to a stag hunt. Problem, it was not a letter from an
anti .... it was edited for brevity, and the last sentence in the
sub-editing made me look like one.

You heard it here first!

But, yes, _of course_ the RSPCA will campaign on shooting, or more
specifically, shooting that involves a bred animal, as is 90% plus of
pheasants. What do you expect them to do? That's their job, after all.


Can you tell why they should not try to get game shooting stopped?


Theo H
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"pete" <peter.@virgin.net> wrote in message
news:F4Ipd.109$sK4.66@newsfe3-win.ntli.net...
> I would'nt give the rspca a penny. The person that runs it apparently
earns
> nearly £100,000 a year, not bad for a charity worker.
>
>

What does the cheif executive of the Countryside Alliance get?

Theo H
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"Theo Hopkins" <theo@theohopkins.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in
news:co82c6$q7r$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk:

> Can you tell why they should not try to get game shooting stopped?

Can you tell me if they are going to try to stop all live stock farming?

John
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

>Subject: Re: Has the RSPCA, etc. shot itself in the foot?
>From: "Theo Hopkins" theo@theohopkins.wanadoo.co.uk
>Date: 26/11/2004 20:06 GMT

>But, yes, _of course_ the RSPCA will campaign on shooting, or more
>specifically, shooting that involves a bred animal, as is 90% plus of
>pheasants. What do you expect them to do? That's their job, after all.

Presumably after that they will be campaigning against livestock production
and associated industries.



Steve. Suffolk.
remove 'knujon' to e-mail
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

>Subject: Re: Has the RSPCA, etc. shot itself in the foot?
>From: an6530@aol.comknujon (AN6530)
>Date: 26/11/2004 20:27 GMT

>
>Presumably after that they will be campaigning against livestock production
>and associated industries.

Then it will be time to play saviour to all the terrible things that happen to
wheat, barley, cabbages, cucumbers, carrots etc etc. What about all the grass
that gets beheaded in the summer?

Steve. Suffolk.
remove 'knujon' to e-mail
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"John" <zero_one34@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns95CBCEDF7E146OEcopyremovedheaders@130.133.1.4...
> "Theo Hopkins" <theo@theohopkins.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in
> news:co82c6$q7r$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk:
>
> > Can you tell why they should not try to get game shooting stopped?
>
> Can you tell me if they are going to try to stop all live stock farming?
>
> John

No in my lifetime - and I reckon I have thirty years to go.

There are already groups who would wish to stop livestock farming, though,
such as Animal Aid. But they don't expect to, it's a dream.

Theo H
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"Derry Argue" <derry(delete)@adviegundogs.co.uk> wrote in message
news:Xns95AD580491595derryadviegundogscou@130.133.1.4...
> I was reading a site this morning which described the ban on fox
> hunting campaign as the biggest mistake the RSPCA ever joined
> in.
>
> The point the writer made was that it has alienated the
> countryside by going after fox hunting and in the countryside
> information is spread by word of mouth. Prosecutions against
> illegal "sports" such as cock fighting, dog fighting, badger
> bating, etc. were easier prior to the hunting ban because
> country people who knew what was going on were sympathetic to
> the RSPCA and tipped them off.
>
> The writer claimed that this co-operation would be less likely
> in the future. Is there any truth in this?
>
> I must say, I view the SSPCA (in Scotland) with growing
> suspicion. They have had a conducted tour of my farm just once -
> - when I insisted that they see absolutely everything. After
> that visit, they voluntarily handed me a copy of the letter of
> complaint they had received, because it was such an outrageous
> lie, so that I could pass it to my solicitor! That alone must be
> unprecedented but is a reflection on what they saw here.
>
> But now my door is closed to the SSPCA unless they can produce
> documentary evidence of a genuine complaint which my solicitor
> to sue on for defamation (in Scotland).
>
> What do other members of the group think? Do you still let them
> in? And would you inform them if you suspected your neighbour
> was in breach of the cruelty laws?
>
> Derry

I must say I am always worried the way the RSPCA seem to have a
quasi-police way of doing things. They will have specials rights under the
new Animal Welfare Bill, rights I would only like my police (finally
answerable to electorate) to have.
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"Theo Hopkins" <theo@theohopkins.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in
news:co88ud$kdh$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk:

>> > Can you tell why they should not try to get game shooting stopped?
>>
>> Can you tell me if they are going to try to stop all live stock
>> farming?
>>
>> John
>
> No in my lifetime - and I reckon I have thirty years to go.

Perhaps they should realise the parallels then?

John
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"John" <zero_one34@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns95CBE600C46ACOEcopyremovedheaders@130.133.1.4...
> "Theo Hopkins" <theo@theohopkins.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in
> news:co88ud$kdh$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk:
>
> >> > Can you tell why they should not try to get game shooting stopped?
> >>
> >> Can you tell me if they are going to try to stop all live stock
> >> farming?
> >>
> >> John
> >
> > No in my lifetime - and I reckon I have thirty years to go.
>
> Perhaps they should realise the parallels then?
>
> John

Not quite sure what you mean here. In fact no idea.

Parallels whith what?

Theo H
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

I run a ferret rescue (3.5 miles from our local RSPCA branch).
About a fortnight ago, I had 3 people contact me saying that the RSPCA had 2
ferrets in need of a home.
All 3 had given my details, including my rescue URL www.nhfr.co.uk
The RSPCA refused to contact me to rehome the ferrets, because I go
ferreting.
I work my ferrets, not the rescues we take in,
but I don't condone people who rehome from us & want to work their adoptee
ferret.

Ferrets were brought here approx. 2,000 years ago,
as the tool to farm rabbits for meat (which were also brought at the same
time)
If it weren't for working ferrets, there would be no "pet" ferrets.

There's probably only a small majority that don't look after their working
ferrets
Can the RSPCA state that more people abuse ferrets than cats/dogs ?
I doubt it.
A well cared for ferret will work much better than a 1/2 starved, dirty,
smelly, poor example of an animal.
It's like a 3rd World unfortunate, trying to run a 3 minute mile, compared
to a fit athlete.

I have had small-minded neighbours call the RSPCA to my house in the past, I
allowed them to look around, and stroke my dogs, which were reported back as
in good condition.
Now I stand by my rights, and don't allow them through my door, as they have
no powers to gain access unless the officer's name is stated on a warrant.
So STUFF 'EM! 🙂
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"ad e nuff" <tony.warrington@ntlworld.com> wrote in
news:l_Epd.50$9%4.7@newsfe3-gui.ntli.net:

> I think you were absolutely right to let them in, and if I
> were you I would continue to do so - only people with
> things to hide would refuse them entry - whether or not
> they backed fox hunting bans or not is completely
> irrelevant , and as for withholding information re the
> despicable so called 'sports' you mentioned, i sincerely
> hope that this does not happen - it is precisely the sort
> of behaviour that gets us all a bad name, i am sure people
> who supported hunting do not really want to associate
> themselves with such vermin.

My reply will be that I would like to look through their
personal computers, the ones in their homes, to reassure myself
that they are not paedophiles. After all, if they have nothing
to hide, I'm sure they won't object.

Derry
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

John <zero_one34@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:Xns95CB906952E43OEcopyremovedheaders@130.133.1.4:

> The ban will mean that foxes will be shot to kingdom come,
> the ban has not helped the foxes one little bit and to top
> it all off the country folk and the country minded folk who
> support blood sports are now alienated and that’s that.

I agree, but I suspect it won't be shooting but poison as there
will no longer be any danger to hounds.

Derry
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"Derry Argue" <derry(delete)@adviegundogs.co.uk> wrote in message
news:Xns95ADEB7FFA4F9derryadviegundogscou@130.133.1.4...
> John <zero_one34@hotmail.com> wrote in
> news:Xns95CB906952E43OEcopyremovedheaders@130.133.1.4:
>
> > The ban will mean that foxes will be shot to kingdom come,
> > the ban has not helped the foxes one little bit and to top
> > it all off the country folk and the country minded folk who
> > support blood sports are now alienated and that's that.
>
> I agree, but I suspect it won't be shooting but poison as there
> will no longer be any danger to hounds.
>
> Derry

I do realy not think "not a fox will be saved".

There will probably be some increase in foxes shot/piosoned/trapped but not
the same number as have 'got away'.

Can you convince me otherwise?

Theo H
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

>Parallels whith what?

Many Antis use the fact that 'according to them' many pheasants reared for
shooting are raised in factory farming conditions. One would assume the same
conditions are applied to the chickens raised so that said anti can enjoy a
meal at McDonalds with his sprogs.

This would be my view on a parallel

Kyle
"Theo Hopkins" <theo@theohopkins.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:co8ch9$mgl$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "John" <zero_one34@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:Xns95CBE600C46ACOEcopyremovedheaders@130.133.1.4...
>> "Theo Hopkins" <theo@theohopkins.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in
>> news:co88ud$kdh$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk:
>>
>> >> > Can you tell why they should not try to get game shooting stopped?
>> >>
>> >> Can you tell me if they are going to try to stop all live stock
>> >> farming?
>> >>
>> >> John
>> >
>> > No in my lifetime - and I reckon I have thirty years to go.
>>
>> Perhaps they should realise the parallels then?
>>
>> John
>
> Not quite sure what you mean here. In fact no idea.
>
> Parallels whith what?
>
> Theo H
>
>
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"Theo Hopkins" <theo@theohopkins.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in
news:co8dvr$3s5$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk:

> I do realy not think "not a fox will be saved".
>
> There will probably be some increase in foxes shot/piosoned/trapped
> but not the same number as have 'got away'.
>
> Can you convince me otherwise?


I’m not quite sure what you mean but if you mean that more foxes will
“get” away then you’re in for a big shock.
Theo, by now I hope you know me well enough to know that I disagree with
plain wanton killing. I can tell you right now that foxes will be
completely persecuted in my area.
Let’s look at just one example. I shoot over a farm which is owned by
good friends, his ex-wife was the hunt master / mistress (?). He asked
me to shoot the foxes, she told me not to shoot the foxes. He came up
with a compromise and told me to thin the foxes. The surround four farms
wanted the foxes left alone (they are all hunt supporters).
I am not the only person who shoots these farms. The adjacent woodland
is full of fox earths and a healthy population always emerges.
Take away the hunts and the orders will be simple, shoot the foxes and I
can tell your right now, I know some very amateur fox shooters, they
will be very happy. The result? Well up until now the foxes have enjoyed
the protection of the hunts and their followers, come February and that
will be lost. The replacement? Well what do you think Theo?
As for getting away, well the hunts caught what, three – six foxes per
season?
I personally know half a dozen places foxes will be right now and if I
decided to go and persecute the poor beasties then I’ll get myself six
foxes in the morning.
My area is full of serious lampers, these chaps not only get paid per
tail but they live for lamping. Not so long ago I was chatting to one of
them and in his words “Roll on the ban!”
People, who have supported this ban, do not fully understand what goes
on or the alternatives, I am sure they sit back now and think “Hey we
have saved the foxes” but alas they have committed the foxes to the life
of the late wolf.


John
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

In article <F4Ipd.109$sK4.66@newsfe3-win.ntli.net>, pete
<peter.?@virgin.net.invalid> writes
>I would'nt give the rspca a penny. The person that runs it apparently earns
>nearly £100,000 a year, not bad for a charity worker.
>
But pretty low for running an organisation employing c.500 people and
spending c.£80 million/annum.

--
Malcolm
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"Kyle Kensett" <kyle@rarms.nospam.co.uk> wrote in
news:41a83a34$0$33596$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader02.plus.net:

>>Parallels whith what?
>
> Many Antis use the fact that 'according to them' many pheasants
> reared for shooting are raised in factory farming conditions. One
> would assume the same conditions are applied to the chickens raised
> so that said anti can enjoy a meal at McDonalds with his sprogs.
>
> This would be my view on a parallel
>
> Kyle


It’s not hard to draw parallels.
As Kyle has pointed out, right from the rearing stages and to the end
product as I will point out.

I can not see much of a difference between a Shepard and a Keeper
(although I would love to hear some). Give that their motives are the
same, the end product is rearing a crop of meat.

John
 
Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

Malcolm <Malcolm@indaal.demon.co.uk> wrote in
news:2Odc1yQY8DqBFwYj@indaal.demon.co.uk:

>
> In article <F4Ipd.109$sK4.66@newsfe3-win.ntli.net>, pete
> <peter.?@virgin.net.invalid> writes
>>I would'nt give the rspca a penny. The person that runs it apparently
>>earns nearly £100,000 a year, not bad for a charity worker.
>>
> But pretty low for running an organisation employing c.500 people and
> spending c.£80 million/annum.

And how much of that £80,000,000 goes on animal homing then?

John
 
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