[SOLVED] Hello everyone. I need help about UPS

Jun 30, 2019
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I wanna buy an UPS for my maximum 500 wat pc. Normally it only draw about 400 wat.
I see that the APC 1100va line interactive is quite good but im wondering if it can handle my pc during switching power progress ( maybe 10 ms ) in case of blackout occur? I use my pc for gaming, mean it most case my pc draw about 400- 450 wat. I just want to be sure that my pc never shutdow while the UPS switching from main power to battery power during gamin time. I have hear that some UPS cant handle pc while gaming. Thank you everyone. My Psu is seasonic 520 wat.
 
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Solution
No, no, no lol.

A rail is just a term for a circuit. Some psus have multi 12v rails in parallel, so only need small transformers, so like a 60amp load can get split into 2x 30amp rails etc.

In a group regulated, the power for the 5v rail comes from the same transformer as the 12v rail, 1 big transformer is shared. When the gpu hits hard, it puts a massive draw on that transformer. So the psu bumps up output, but that also bumps up 5v circuit. Because it's shared and there's such a large draw on the 12v rail, the 5v can only go so low, so runs into issues in low power Haswell c-states.

In a DC psu, each rail has its own transformer, so nothing one does affects the others.
APC 1100VA is a nice unit.
I live in a country where the electric isn't stable and 97% of the time no problem.
Not going to say 100% because there have been times when it just fails for some unkown reason
Are you using it for gaming or other high power comsumption task ?. Does your pc still on while gaming when blackout occur ?[/QUOTE]
 
Are you using it for gaming or other high power comsumption task ?. Does your pc still on while gaming when blackout occur ?
[/QUOTE]
1100VA would give me maybe 3 minutes if I was gaming. I actually use an 800VA and as soon as there is a power problem, I WILL shutdown the computer. Closing game first of course, then shutdown. Without gaming, maybe I have 5 minutes.
I mainly game, and I know my power consumption is between 500-550W when gaming.
 
1100VA would give me maybe 3 minutes if I was gaming. I actually use an 800VA and as soon as there is a power problem, I WILL shutdown the computer. Closing game first of course, then shutdown. Without gaming, maybe I have 5 minutes.
I mainly game, and I know my power consumption is between 500-550W when gaming.
thank you so much. Could you please tell me your ups name . is it the apc 1100 one ?

And your psu name ? Does it support A.PFC ?
 
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You have a group regulated 520w Seasonic psu. You don't have to worry about active pfc. That's only a concern with DC-DC switching power supplies. Your psu will be fine with any wave, square, simulated, pure sinewave.

Most of even the cheaper type of UPS at 1100va will give you closer to 20mins at half power, 7mins at full power loads. You'd have to check the load specs per unit.


UPS: APC - BR1000G UPS ($134.99 @ Dell Small Business)

UPS: CyberPower - CP1000PFCLCD UPS ($129.95 @ B&H)

The first is an older design, modified square wave, the second is pure sinewave, line interactive
 
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You have a group regulated 520w Seasonic psu. You don't have to worry about active pfc. That's only a concern with DC-DC switching power supplies. Your psu will be fine with any wave, square, simulated, pure sinewave.

Most of even the cheaper type of UPS at 1100va will give you closer to 20mins at half power, 7mins at full power loads. You'd have to check the load specs per unit.


UPS: APC - BR1000G UPS ($134.99 @ Dell Small Business)

UPS: CyberPower - CP1000PFCLCD UPS ($129.95 @ B&H)

The first is an older design, modified square wave, the second is pure sinewave, line interactive
Thank you. I dont really care how long my ups can last because im not going to use my pc with ups after blackout occurs. I only need 20 - 30 sec to shutdown my pc. And i really worry about the compability between non pure sin wave ups and A.PFC psu. Some clams their a pfc psu work well with non sine wave ups. But Others say it may cause issue..
Your 2 advised unit unfortunately aren't available in my county -vietnam. And if they are, they would be too overpriced like 180-200$.. Thats why apc 1100 va bx1100 li- ms is my currently selection. How do u think about this unit ?
And sorry but i dont get this. What do u meant by DC- DC Switching power? All ups are basically a DC to AC converter right ?
 
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I have 2 pc's. One has Seasonic M12-II 520w. It's an older design. The other is a DC-DC Evga 550w G2. That's an important difference since the old UPS I have is a modified square wave, and when that wave hits a 0 voltage state, the APFC in the Evga trips and the pc shuts off instantly. The older group regulated supplies aren't that touchy, so skips over that, allowing the pc to remain on during battery usage.

Group regulated power supplies regulate +12V and +5V as a group. One regulator is connected to a transformer which has 2 outputs (where one output is 2.25x the other). The average voltage is sensed and compensated. So, if you suddenly put a big load on +12V causing it to drop, the compensation will result in partial correction of the 12V drop, and a slight overvoltage of the 5V.
The 3.3v is seperately regulated.

In DC-DC psus each rail is regulated separately, so what affects one load doesn't affect others. As a consequence, DC-DC designs can get much lower power modes, what they call Haswell compliant for modern Intel cpu's sleep states (C-states). But they are very touchy when it comes to UPS outputs.
As to how touchy, that's entirely dependent on the actual psu. Some are stupidly touchy, like my Evga, some are much less, so work on the square/modified UPS. It can go either way, the results being unknown until tested. My UPS works great on my Seasonic, it's 15 years old now, had a couple of battery changes, but still good. Does not work with the Evga, if power cuts out, the Evga shuts down, even if the UPS is active or not. Stupid wave pattern isn't pure sinewave.

Waveform type
Stepped approximation to a sinewave

That's the APC you linked, modified square wave. It'll work (never seen one not work) on your older design psu, but if you need (ever) to upgrade psu, it might not work with a modern DC-DC design. It'll work perfectly for the line interactive part, your voltages will be totally regulated and good, since it's still AC voltage with a battery compensater, but if power cuts totally, that new psu might shut down instantly, or any time before you want it to manually.
 
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I have 2 pc's. One has Seasonic M12-II 520w. It's an older design. The other is a DC-DC Evga 550w G2. That's an important difference since the old UPS I have is a modified square wave, and when that wave hits a 0 voltage state, the APFC in the Evga trips and the pc shuts off instantly. The older group regulated supplies aren't that touchy, so skips over that, allowing the pc to remain on during battery usage.

Group regulated power supplies regulate +12V and +5V as a group. One regulator is connected to a transformer which has 2 outputs (where one output is 2.25x the other). The average voltage is sensed and compensated. So, if you suddenly put a big load on +12V causing it to drop, the compensation will result in partial correction of the 12V drop, and a slight overvoltage of the 5V.
The 3.3v is seperately regulated.

In DC-DC psus each rail is regulated separately, so what affects one load doesn't affect others. As a consequence, DC-DC designs can get much lower power modes, what they call Haswell compliant for modern Intel cpu's sleep states (C-states). But they are very touchy when it comes to UPS outputs.
As to how touchy, that's entirely dependent on the actual psu. Some are stupidly touchy, like my Evga, some are much less, so work on the square/modified UPS. It can go either way, the results being unknown until tested. My UPS works great on my Seasonic, it's 15 years old now, had a couple of battery changes, but still good. Does not work with the Evga, if power cuts out, the Evga shuts down, even if the UPS is active or not. Stupid wave pattern isn't pure sinewave.

Waveform type
Stepped approximation to a sinewave

That's the APC you linked, modified square wave. It'll work (never seen one not work) on your older design psu, but if you need (ever) to upgrade psu, it might not work with a modern DC-DC design. It'll work perfectly for the line interactive part, your voltages will be totally regulated and good, since it's still AC voltage with a battery compensater, but if power cuts totally, that new psu might shut down instantly, or any time before you want it to manually.
ohi see. "In DC-DC psus each rail is regulated separately" it sounds like multi rail/ dual rail psu, right? i always want to have a single rail psu thats why i choose s12ii 😀
Thank you so much for your time and information. i appreciated it.
 
No, no, no lol.

A rail is just a term for a circuit. Some psus have multi 12v rails in parallel, so only need small transformers, so like a 60amp load can get split into 2x 30amp rails etc.

In a group regulated, the power for the 5v rail comes from the same transformer as the 12v rail, 1 big transformer is shared. When the gpu hits hard, it puts a massive draw on that transformer. So the psu bumps up output, but that also bumps up 5v circuit. Because it's shared and there's such a large draw on the 12v rail, the 5v can only go so low, so runs into issues in low power Haswell c-states.

In a DC psu, each rail has its own transformer, so nothing one does affects the others.
 
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Reactions: Katori142
Solution