Help asked with ultra slow new video card!

[TNT2]

Hello friends;

My second pc is a rather old K6-3+-550 with a Geforce 2MX video card from hercules.
This video card is okay, but I would like to use this system for DVD-playback.
For DVD-playback, a GF4MX or GF MX 4000would be a lot better, as they have a built-in MPEG-2 decoder.

Now, in order to find out if a cheap GF4MX would be a wise upgrade, I have been able to borrow a GF 4MX 440 from a friend and installed it in this pc.
Just to see if all is ok, I decided to do some benchmarking.

What a nightmare!
The GF 4MX 440 is SLOWER in all benchmarks than my old GF2MX!
For info, the benchmark results are:
1) 3DMark 2001SE
- GF 2MX: 3348
- new GF4 MX 440: 2049 !!!!
2) Quake 3 Arena
- GF2MX: 52FPS
- GF4 MX440: 29FPS !!!!

This does not seem right, does it?
The new GF4MX 440 is at least 30% SLOWER than my current GF2MX.

I DID uninstall the GF2MX drivers first, before intalling that GF4MX 440, so I don't think that this can be the problem.

The GF4MX 440 is from Sparkle.
It has 64Mb of DDR-memory, rated at 5ns.
So that makes 400Mhz DDR. But when I look at the speeds with Powerstrip, i see the following:
- core speed: 250Mhz
- Memory speed: 332Mhz (should be 400Mhz, right?)
So the memory speed is too low, right?
I increased the memory speed to 400Mhz in Powerstrip, but this does not seem to enhance the speed in any way.

So, my questions are:

1) What could be wrong? Is there a way to make sure that you uninstall old drivers COMPLETELY?
2) Is it possible that this Sparkle video card uses 64-bit DDR-memory? Its memory modules state:
"Elixir N2D512H16BT-5T". The 5 means 200Mhz DDR, but is it 128-bit or 64-bit?
3) Can anyone tell me with 100% CERTAINTY which GF4MX or G4MX 4000 video card really uses 128-bit memory?
4) Or should I try a cheap Radeon 9200? At least they guarantee a 128-bit memory interface. But don't forget that this is a Super-7 socket motherboard, so AGP 1x only! Could this be a problem for a Radeon 9200?
5) This Powerstrip software does not seem to really change anything. How can I turn on clockspeed control in the NVidia drivers?
6)How is it possible that a GF4MX 440 is SLOWER than a GF2MX (standard model, not even the GF2MX-400!)

Thank you in advance for any help!
Is Sparkle worthless? Maybe Hercules is a more honest and reliable manufacturer?
Thanks;
Carl

 

[coolsquirtle]

!!! you uncovered nVidia's SCAM! People shall not know the truth! You will not live longer than tonight!

anyways.... ya... GeForce 4 MX are the biggest POS in the history of POSs. GeForce 4 Ti4200 are like 80$ nowadays... just go pick one of those up

RIP Block Heater....HELLO P4~~~~~
120% nVidia Fanboy+119% Money Fanboy
GeForce 6800 Ultra--> The Way we thought FX 5800Ultra is meant to be played
THGC's resident Asian and nVboy

 

[pauldh]

Yes the GF4 MX blows compared to GF4Ti. BUT, it should still easily outperform the GF2MX. 3dmark01 should be almost double with the GF4. Anyway, I wonder if he is using the same drivers, settings, etc. Although the CPu is probably limiting the GF4 some, something isn't right. Tom's VGA charts 2 shows the GF4MX crushing the GF2MX.

<A HREF="http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20030120/vgacharts-04.html" target="_new">http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20030120/vgacharts-04.html</A>


ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 1GB Corsair XMS 4000 Pro Series, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt

 

[pauldh]

3348 is a very, very high 3dmark01 score for a GF2MX, especially on a K6-3. I would at expect at least 1000 less on that rig. Are you running default benchmarks? Is it 3dmark2001se or 3dmark2000? Is it a GF2 GTS and not an MX? Something seems terribly wrong for a GF2MX to get 3300 3dmarks on a K63-550. Tom's got 2750 on a TBird 1.0GHz. 3dmark is cpu dependent, and his was an MX400, which is a little faster than an original GF2-MX. I remember on a system I worked on for someone, testing 3dmark2001 and not breaking 2000 3dmarks on a K6-2 400MHz with an original Gainward GF2MX.

Anyway, I agreee your GF4 scores seems very low, but the GF2 scores seem way too high.






ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 1GB Corsair XMS 4000 Pro Series, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt

 

[TNT2]

You are correct, I wrote the wrong 3DMark version: the scores are for 3DMark 2000, not for 2001.

Still, the score for the GF4MX 440 is WAY too low.
- I hope that there is a way to uninstall a driver completetly, without having to format my harddrive.
- And how do I turn on clock frequency control in those new NVidia drivers? Until now, I always used old drivers for my GF2MX in which there is a clock control tab, but these new NVidia drivers don't seem to have that...

I'm gonna test the GF4MX in an Athlon 1700+ today (which has a GF2MX-400), and see if it performs any better there.

And I still would like to find out if that GF4MX uses 64-bit or 128-bit memory. Anyone knows about a website specialised in this?

 

[TeeTewl]

I was told on the forum not to buy any NVidia card with the term "MX" as they were not what they were advertised to be...

If it's true that guns kill people, then it's my keyboard's fault when I misspell wurds...

 

[TheGreatGrapeApe]

I think you may have a GF4MX 440<b>SE</b>.

That would explain alot. The SE is 64bit memory, and makes an already crummy card worse. Still the GF2MXs were also 64bit IIRC, so the difference shouldn't be too striking. But if it isn't an SE, the there's definitely something going on.

I think <A HREF="http://www.guru3d.com/index.php?page=rivatuner&menu=8" target="_new">RIVATuner</A> or something similar may be able to tell. Try running something like that and see if either can identify the card/type or at least tell you the memory bandwidth (anything around 3GB/s is 64bit and 6GB/s is 128bit). I know of a few for ATI, but I haven't seen much for the GF, as usually the latest cards are identified by the drivers and windows.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK

 

[Nights_L]

I have a GF2MX with 128bit memory..SDR

 

[hogfather]

AIDA32 should tell you - just google it.

I have a gf4 mx, and it whips my girlfriends gf2 mx400 (i have a xp2000, she a 1700) in games particularly. So it should be noticeable better.

XP2000, 512 ddr 2700ram, GF4 MX440, XP Pro

 

[pauldh]

Could be the SE coupled with a different driver version running a very OLD benchmark. He should try the same driver version and same settings. The GF4MX probably loses performance past the 4403 drivers anyway.



ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 1GB Corsair XMS 4000 Pro Series, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt

 

[TheGreatGrapeApe]

Yeah the other thing is that really 3Dmk2000 craps out real early and show less gain from far more powerful systems, 3Dmk01 scales far better. I get like ~1000 fps in some tests. And likely any small bottleneck here or there will hurt on card in a way that it doesn't really get held back in a real game. I'm not sure about the 'drop' in results, but really it's not a great test anymore, and for overall performance I'd say 3Dmk2001se has suplanted it.

More tests may expose more areas to look at, but really I don't expect much from the MXs. Upgrading drivers might help, you never know with older cards on newer drivers. I wouldn't go beyond the 50.xx, and even then most results I've seen have done better with the 4x.xx drivers than the 5x.xx or 6x.xx drivers.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK

 

[Snorkius]

But what about the Quake benchies?

To the poster:
Make sure something like 32 bpp, AA or any other settings are the same.

<font color=blue>The day <font color=green>Microsoft</font color=green> will make something that doesn't suck is the day they'll start making vacuum cleaners.</font color=blue>

 

[TheGreatGrapeApe]

The Quake benchies don't say much, they don't really give us much to work with as no mention of settings from what I saw.


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! - <font color=green>RED </font color=green> <font color=red> GREEN</font color=red> GA to SK