Help - dilemma/advice buying a used laptop

[northumbria82]

Hi,

My old laptop stopped working properly about a year ago (long story, but quite a few problems with it). But... the 1TB hard drive works fine, and the 8GB of ram is fine too (it's a Toshiba Satellite C855 29L model, if that helps).

I need a new laptop, and one that's going to last.

My mum bought me a used laptop last year, to replace it (it wasn't a Toshiba), she got it from Ebay. The problem is, it stopped working after about 3 - 4 months - an error message popped up saying that 'Windows 7 wasn't genuine', and it completely knackered it.

I need a new laptop, and I've seen a few used ones within my price range on Ebay, of the same spec. But I'm worried that the Windows installations might not be genuine, and the same thing will happen. After looking on the internet, it seems Microsoft now have a way of finding out when dodgy key-codes are used.

So I'm in a dilemma. Not sure what to do. I've tried looking for a laptop of a similar spec, that I can afford, from a normal seller (not a refurb), in the hope it will be an original OS, that I could just do a factory reset to (I've found out how to tell if an OS is genuine) but I can't find any (after much searching).

2 refurb sellers have a good spec laptop at a price I can afford, but they have fresh installs of Windows 7/8, so I'm worried they might not be genuine. They said I won't be able to just do a factory reset, I'd need to install a disc. But I'm guessing that disc could still have an illegal copy on it, 'if' it's not a genuine OS (then I'd have the same problem down the line).

My only other option, I'm thinking, would be to buy a Toshiba and swap my own hard drive into it (I know how to change a hard drive).

If this is the case, I'm wondering, will it have to be the exact same model of Toshiba, or could I buy a different used model, and put my hard rive (and maybe my 8GB ram) into it?

Or might this cause problems/slow it down, if not compatible?

Hope someone can advise me!

Thanks,

Zoe.

 

[Eximo]

You've asked a few different questions here with different answers depending on what you want to do.

C855-29L is a fairly low end system, so replacing it with a brand new system shouldn't be too bad price wise. Which would help if you listed what you are willing to pay. But even entry level laptops should do better than a seven year old entry level laptop.

Windows not being genuine still leaves you a working computer? Why not just buy Windows for that one? Should be much cheaper than buying a new laptop. If you bought a copy and registered it through your e-mail you could keep re-using that on any single system you like.

Microsoft has always had ways to disable entire blocks of product keys. In some cases they are designed to expire, or are single use on specific hardware. Also only takes one other person to use that same key inappropriately to deactivate it. OEM (Original Equipment Manufacturer) keys are not intended to be re-used and that is what some resellers do, take blocks of keys that were originally sold with specific hardware and hand them out as genuine keys. Sometimes you get lucky with them and sometimes not.

Typically OEM products come with a license key specifically for a system. That those laptops list Windows 7 and 8, and not 10, shows they are using whatever it came with and are most likely genuine OEM keys that came with the product in the first place.

Re-installing from disk isn't the problem, you just need to have an appropriate key. You can download the Windows installers directly from Microsoft for free. What they haven't done is use the image provided by the OEM that includes a recovery partition.

Yes, to swap the hard drive into another computer it would need to be nearly the exact same system. The CPU and memory wouldn't need to match, but the motherboard would need to. Windows might not stay activated since typically OEM keys are tied to hardware. Though you might be able to manually activate by calling Microsoft and explaining what you did.

Most laptops will only have the two ram slots, so unless you found one with no memory or less memory it would probably just end up unused.

I do not recommend buying a Windows 7 system. Windows 7 will stop receiving updates next year.

 

[northumbria82]

You've asked a few different questions here with different answers depending on what you want to do.

C855-29L is a fairly low end system, so replacing it with a brand new system shouldn't be too bad price wise. Which would help if you listed what you are willing to pay. But even entry level laptops should do better than a seven year old entry level laptop.

Windows not being genuine still leaves you a working computer? Why not just buy Windows for that one? Should be much cheaper than buying a new laptop. If you bought a copy and registered it through your e-mail you could keep re-using that on any single system you like.

Microsoft has always had ways to disable entire blocks of product keys. In some cases they are designed to expire, or are single use on specific hardware. Also only takes one other person to use that same key inappropriately to deactivate it. OEM (Original Equipment Manufacturer) keys are not intended to be re-used and that is what some resellers do, take blocks of keys that were originally sold with specific hardware and hand them out as genuine keys. Sometimes you get lucky with them and sometimes not.

Typically OEM products come with a license key specifically for a system. That those laptops list Windows 7 and 8, and not 10, shows they are using whatever it came with and are most likely genuine OEM keys that came with the product in the first place.

Re-installing from disk isn't the problem, you just need to have an appropriate key. You can download the Windows installers directly from Microsoft for free. What they haven't done is use the image provided by the OEM that includes a recovery partition.

Yes, to swap the hard drive into another computer it would need to be nearly the exact same system. The CPU and memory wouldn't need to match, but the motherboard would need to. Windows might not stay activated since typically OEM keys are tied to hardware. Though you might be able to manually activate by calling Microsoft and explaining what you did.

Most laptops will only have the two ram slots, so unless you found one with no memory or less memory it would probably just end up unused.

I do not recommend buying a Windows 7 system. Windows 7 will stop receiving updates next year.

Hi, thanks for your reply Eximo.

The reason I was looking for a computer like my old one, is because I know that spec is pretty fast. It has 1TB hard drive and 8RAM. Also it has Windows 8 on it.

I like Windows 8, I really don't like Windows 10. So I'm trying to find a way of buying a laptop preferably with Windows 8 on it. For no more than £200.

I spotted a laptop that looks pretty fast (same spec as my old one) with Windows 8.1 on it, for £135 on Ebay, but the bayer said I can't do a factory reset for some reason. I would have to use a disc that he makes, if I ever want to reinstall it. That made me a bit wary, after what happened last time (I bought a laptop and the whole thing crashed after 3-4 months, it said the Windows 7 wasn't genuine).

If I could get a laptop that's fast, that has a genuine Windows 8 on it, that I could be sure is genuine I'd be happy! It's like a Minefield though, I've been scouring Ebay for a few days now. And when I ask refurb sellers about the OS, they get a big cagey.

Microsoft have the installs for Windows 8.1 on their website. But it doesn't seem to be for sale. More like to reinstall - 'if' it was originally on the laptop in the first place. It's hard to tell what was originally on the laptops on Ebay.

🙁 I'm at a loss. If you can advise, would much appreciate it.

 

[Eximo]

Again, if that is fast enough for you than you won't have to look too hard to replace it. 1TB hard drive and 8GB of ram is somewhat standard in the £300 range. (Though do you actually use 1TB? a small SSD would offer more performance)

There are tools to make Windows 10 look like practically any version of Windows above Vista. Look up Classic Shell or Stardock's Start 10 (Start 8, Start 7)

You can't do a factory reset on that computer because he didn't have access to the system image file that contains a recovery partition from the OEM. What he did is take Windows, install it, and activate it with the included key. Meaning the only possibility is a fresh install from disk or drive. Refurbished systems will not have the previous users content on them unless someone is being very shady.

Windows 8 wasn't common in the business world, so there aren't a whole lot of refurbs. Most companies went from XP to 7, and 7 to 10.

You have to be careful as well, anyone that upgraded a Windows 8.1 laptop to Windows 10 will have invalidated the 8.1 key. So even buying a computer with no drive and a Windows 8.1 sticker on it might not work.

You can still buy Windows 8.1 new from actual re-sellers, but that is going to be most of the cost of the laptops you are looking at. And it is getting pretty rare as well.

To play it safe: https://www.amazon.co.uk/LATITUDE-2...:9708205031,p_n_feature_browse-bin:1481781031

Or this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/HP-Portabl...:9708205031,p_n_feature_browse-bin:1481781031

From Lenovo themselves:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-Thi...:9708205031,p_n_feature_browse-bin:1481781031

 

[northumbria82]

Again, if that is fast enough for you than you won't have to look too hard to replace it. 1TB hard drive and 8GB of ram is somewhat standard in the £300 range. (Though do you actually use 1TB? a small SSD would offer more performance)

There are tools to make Windows 10 look like practically any version of Windows above Vista. Look up Classic Shell or Stardock's Start 10 (Start 8, Start 7)

You can't do a factory reset on that computer because he didn't have access to the system image file that contains a recovery partition from the OEM. What he did is take Windows, install it, and activate it with the included key. Meaning the only possibility is a fresh install from disk or drive. Refurbished systems will not have the previous users content on them unless someone is being very shady.

Windows 8 wasn't common in the business world, so there aren't a whole lot of refurbs. Most companies went from XP to 7, and 7 to 10.

You have to be careful as well, anyone that upgraded a Windows 8.1 laptop to Windows 10 will have invalidated the 8.1 key. So even buying a computer with no drive and a Windows 8.1 sticker on it might not work.

You can still buy Windows 8.1 new from actual re-sellers, but that is going to be most of the cost of the laptops you are looking at. And it is getting pretty rare as well.

To play it safe: https://www.amazon.co.uk/LATITUDE-2-4GHZ-WINDOWS-Certified-Refurbished/dp/B076VMN7NR/ref=sr_1_6?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1551198934&sr=1-6&refinements=p_36:9708205031,p_n_feature_browse-bin:1481781031

Or this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/HP-Portable-Graphics-Certified-Refurbished/dp/B07N1M39KZ/ref=sr_1_16?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1551198934&sr=1-16&refinements=p_36:9708205031,p_n_feature_browse-bin:1481781031

From Lenovo themselves:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-ThinkPad-i5-2520M-1366x768-certified/dp/B01KI2N0Z6/ref=sr_1_26?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1551199621&sr=1-26&refinements=p_36:9708205031,p_n_feature_browse-bin:1481781031

Thanks again, it's really good of you to help me. Really great advice thanks.

I should have said in my post, I'm looking for a screen that's 15'6. I'll be doing creative work on it, so need something with a bigger size screen.

As for the 1TB hard drive, that's just the size of my old one. And because my old one worked fast, I thought I'd better stick to the same specs; if I get a smaller hard drive, will this not affect the laptop's speed/performance? (I have a feeling this is probably a dumb question, but I'm not that technical).

I found with this spec:
Fast HP Probook Core i3-M370 2.4Ghz
1TB hard disk drive
6GB RAM DDR3 1333 MHz RAM
15.6" LED Display gives a resolution of 1600X900 Pixels

and the refurber said he will give me a disc with the windows 8.1 OS on, incase the files ever become corrupted. I don't suppose you could give me your opinion on this?

It seems like a really good deal for a laptop, at the price it's at. But I'm wondering if it's too good to be true. I wouldn't be able to just do a factory reset he said, I'd have to use the disc he supplies me if I ever need/want to do one.

Thanks again,

Zoe

 

[hang-the-9]

Size of disk does not relate to how fast it is at all.
The used market is so big and varied that it's almost impossible to select a single best system since others will pop up every hour.

For factory reset questions, there is probably just no factory reset partition setup on systems. When I work on systems I wipe the disk fully and setup a clean Windows installation on the drive, which wipes any recovery partitions. In many cases there never were recovery partitions since systems would be coming from business that also do their own Windows setups. I suggest people take a disk image of the system when they get it, so they have their own way to restore it if something goes wrong, Macrium Reflect is good for that.

You should be able to get a faster system for 200 than an old i3 with a standard drive if you look around, try to get one with a solid state drive, or get your own and swap it in.

 

[northumbria82]

Size of disk does not relate to how fast it is at all.
The used market is so big and varied that it's almost impossible to select a single best system since others will pop up every hour.

For factory reset questions, there is probably just no factory reset partition setup on systems. When I work on systems I wipe the disk fully and setup a clean Windows installation on the drive, which wipes any recovery partitions. In many cases there never were recovery partitions since systems would be coming from business that also do their own Windows setups. I suggest people take a disk image of the system when they get it, so they have their own way to restore it if something goes wrong, Macrium Reflect is good for that.

You should be able to get a faster system for 200 than an old i3 with a standard drive if you look around, try to get one with a solid state drive, or get your own and swap it in.

Thanks for the advice, it's much appreciated!

Can I ask you... you said that you install a fresh copy of Windows on the drives... where do you get your Windows installs from? Is there a way I would be able to know (before buying one) if the seller has put a genuine copy on?

Thanks,

Zoe

 

[Eximo]

You'll have to trust the seller. You could ask them to show you the activation page I suppose. Assuming they are willing to turn it on and send you the results. They might have these things pre-boxed for shipment.

Some of the ones I've picked out are refurbs from the manufacturer, they wouldn't put bad copies of Windows out there.

That HP looks okay, on par with the Pentium B960, and with hyperthreading it will be able to multitask slightly better. On the other hand it does have inferior graphics, so maybe not the best pick for creative work.

I found this one, if you can stretch to that price I think you will find it more than meets your needs. About 5 years newer too.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-Ide...ature_seven_browse-bin:8322550031,p_36:-30000

Seems like you want to pay somewhere around the 150 mark. I just find it hard to recommend products that old, as you have found out, sometimes they stop working. Older they are the higher the chances of that.

 

[northumbria82]

You'll have to trust the seller. You could ask them to show you the activation page I suppose. Assuming they are willing to turn it on and send you the results. They might have these things pre-boxed for shipment.

Some of the ones I've picked out are refurbs from the manufacturer, they wouldn't put bad copies of Windows out there.

That HP looks okay, on par with the Pentium B960, and with hyperthreading it will be able to multitask slightly better. On the other hand it does have inferior graphics, so maybe not the best pick for creative work.

I found this one, if you can stretch to that price I think you will find it more than meets your needs. About 5 years newer too.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-Ideapad-15-6-Inch-Laptop-Black/dp/B01GCNYZI6/ref=sr_1_3?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1551212640&sr=1-3&refinements=p_n_style_browse-bin:182753031,p_n_feature_browse-bin:1481780031|1481781031,p_n_feature_seven_browse-bin:8322550031,p_36:-30000

Seems like you want to pay somewhere around the 150 mark. I just find it hard to recommend products that old, as you have found out, sometimes they stop working. Older they are the higher the chances of that.

Thanks, it's really kind of you to help me like this. Sorry for being a pain!

The link you gave me, looks like a great computer! But I've noticed it has Windows 10 on it. To be honest, the reason why I don't like Windows 10, is because it has that Cortina program installed on it. I think the world's getting too invasive these days, everyone's gadgets track their every move (likes/dislikes/habits/behaviours). I know everyone's got a different opinion on it, but I'd feel happier with Windows 8.1.

The seller on Ebay, for the laptop I mentioned, has got back to me this evening, he said he has sold over 100 laptops and has never had a problem yet. That it's a genuine copy. And that if I have any problems with it within a year he'll give me a full refund (he has 100% positive feedback).

What do you think?

(When I say I need my laptop for creative work, it's nothing too technical, I just prefer a bigger screen. I'm starting a blog and I need to create images on it. Nothing like complex Photoshop work though. Are the graphics really poor on the HP that I mentioned on Ebay?)

Price range between £150 - £200 ideally.

Thanks,

Zoe

 

[Eximo]

i5-370m is a 1st generation Intel Core chip. The Pentium B960 you had is a second generation Intel Core chip. The potential clock speed alone on the graphics processor is nearly double on the Pentium. Trade off there is less cache, no hyperthreading (less effective cores) so the newer processor was a little slower.

That £50 is getting you a lot of computer, and hopefully that much more longevity. The laptops I listed before were the sub £200.

Cortana can be removed with powershell commands, though she'll come back with each major Windows release. All Windows since Vista send significant telemetry back to Microsoft. Honestly, if you are that paranoid, don't go around posting in online forums and searching on ebay...

You could always switch to Linux, but there you don't know if anyone is sneaking anything into your distribution or the applications you download.

I'm sure my online profile is fascinating in the guvment's database.

Here's a few more to consider: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-B50...,p_n_feature_browse-bin:1481780031|1481781031

Only 4GB though, and Windows 7
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Dell-15-6-..._n_style_browse-bin:182753031,p_36:9708205031

 

[northumbria82]

i5-370m is a 1st generation Intel Core chip. The Pentium B960 you had is a second generation Intel Core chip. The potential clock speed alone on the graphics processor is nearly double on the Pentium. Trade off there is less cache, no hyperthreading (less effective cores) so the newer processor was a little slower.

That £50 is getting you a lot of computer, and hopefully that much more longevity. The laptops I listed before were the sub £200.

Cortana can be removed with powershell commands, though she'll come back with each major Windows release. All Windows since Vista send significant telemetry back to Microsoft. Honestly, if you are that paranoid, don't go around posting in online forums and searching on ebay...

You could always switch to Linux, but there you don't know if anyone is sneaking anything into your distribution or the applications you download.

I'm sure my online profile is fascinating in the guvment's database.

Here's a few more to consider: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-B50-80-80lt00h6us-15-6-Notebook/dp/B015AMYK3A/ref=sr_1_1?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1551218195&sr=1-1&refinements=p_n_style_browse-bin:182753031,p_36:9708205031,p_n_feature_browse-bin:1481780031|1481781031

Only 4GB though, and Windows 7
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Dell-15-6-inch-Bluetooth-Integrated-Professional/dp/B00H5282II/ref=sr_1_10?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1551218142&sr=1-10&refinements=p_n_style_browse-bin:182753031,p_36:9708205031

Hi again,

thanks for your advice.

I wouldn't say paranoid. If you run 'how to uninstall Cortina' through Google, you'll see lots of people have similar concerns.

There has been enough media coverage about the invasiveness of many tech apps. Facebook has really come under the grill about it over the past year.

The reason why I'm wary, is because when my little one was small, I bought a baby monitor for when he was asleep. Only to discover in the news some time later, that hackers had been able to access the streaming, and watch children whilst sleeping.

It really has made me think about the dangers of software and apps that track your every move. For many reasons, particularly security.

But hey-ho, each to their own. I know it doesn't bother many people.

Thanks for your advice, you've been really helpful

Zoe.

 

[northumbria82]

i5-370m is a 1st generation Intel Core chip. The Pentium B960 you had is a second generation Intel Core chip. The potential clock speed alone on the graphics processor is nearly double on the Pentium. Trade off there is less cache, no hyperthreading (less effective cores) so the newer processor was a little slower.

That £50 is getting you a lot of computer, and hopefully that much more longevity. The laptops I listed before were the sub £200.

Cortana can be removed with powershell commands, though she'll come back with each major Windows release. All Windows since Vista send significant telemetry back to Microsoft. Honestly, if you are that paranoid, don't go around posting in online forums and searching on ebay...

You could always switch to Linux, but there you don't know if anyone is sneaking anything into your distribution or the applications you download.

I'm sure my online profile is fascinating in the guvment's database.

Here's a few more to consider: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-B50-80-80lt00h6us-15-6-Notebook/dp/B015AMYK3A/ref=sr_1_1?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1551218195&sr=1-1&refinements=p_n_style_browse-bin:182753031,p_36:9708205031,p_n_feature_browse-bin:1481780031|1481781031

Only 4GB though, and Windows 7
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Dell-15-6-inch-Bluetooth-Integrated-Professional/dp/B00H5282II/ref=sr_1_10?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1551218142&sr=1-10&refinements=p_n_style_browse-bin:182753031,p_36:9708205031

I've just bought one this morning!

HP Pavilion 15-P189NA 15.6" Laptop Core i5 - 4228U 2.66GHz 8GB RAM 1.5TB HDD

It's got Windows 8.1 on it, and the seller said I can do a factory reset if I want. It also comes with a warranty

It looks pretty powerful!

I paid a bit more for it, but I remembered what you said about the graphics on the other one.

Thanks again,

Zoe.

 

[Eximo]

That looks like a good choice.