Question Help for improvement

[1Stone]

Hi, this is my pc benchmark:



UserBenchmarks: Game 47%, Desk 55%, Work 36%
CPU: Intel Core i5-7400 - 70.9%
GPU: AMD RX 480 - 46.9%
HDD: Toshiba DT01ACA100 1TB - 96.9%
RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 2666 C16 2x16GB - 78.6%
MBD: Acer Aspire GX-781

I was wondering what would be a good improvement for my PC, i would like to start streaming. From what i know the newly bought RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 2666 C16 2x16GB Is already a good choice.

 

[MrN1ce9uy]

You need a heavier CPU. Best to go with a new CPU and motherboard, such as Ryzen 7 2700 + B450 motherboard (a good value for streaming). Streaming requires a lot of CPU cores/threads.

 

[4745454b]

If you want to stream you are going to need more cores. A 4C/4T 7400 isn't going to handle new/modern games AND streaming very well. If you are gaming I'd argue the 480 isn't very good either. Stepping up to the newer bigger GPUs are always good for gaming.

 

[geofelt]

It is unclear to me exactly what chipset your motherboard has.
I can find no information on supported cpu upgrades.
OEM builds are not designed to be upgraded, they are built to work with only the components as sold.

Regardless, if it supports a 4 thread i5-7400, it should support a 8 thread i7-7700 or i7-7700K.
Likely you can not overclock the K suffix version, but the better stock speeds may be worth it for streaming.

 

[1Stone]

Everyone thank you for the fast reply.
Geofelt, i checked what kind of uphgrades i could make and the i7-7700k is possible. As for the GPU the AMD RX 5700 seems to work as well. My question is, witch one should i buy first? On the benchmark it shows that GPU is weak, so i guess that one?

 

[MrN1ce9uy]

Everyone thank you for the fast reply.
Geofelt, i checked what kind of uphgrades i could make and the i7-7700k is possible. As for the GPU the AMD RX 5700 seems to work as well. My question is, witch one should i buy first? On the benchmark it shows that GPU is weak, so i guess that one?

You can always lower graphics settings to improve performance, but when your CPU is overloaded there isn't much you can do. Get the CPU first.

 

[4745454b]

Not if you want to start streaming. You need a much better CPU for that. Even the 7700K will have trouble gaming and streaming.

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/game-streaming-encoding-coffee-lake-ryzen,5326-4.html

Up at the top the 7700K pulls an avg of 137.1FPS. But look what happens when you start streaming as well. It goes all the way down to 69.6FPS. It will basically cut your frame rate in half. The other CPUs also lose speed, but not half. If streaming is what you want to do, you need a better CPU. And that might mean better than the 7700K.

 

[geofelt]

What is your budget?
Do you prioritize gaming over streaming?

What types of games do you play?
Some are cpu limited, some are gpu limited, and some like multiplayer need many threads.

What is the make/model of your psu?
That will determine how strong a graphics upgrade can be.
Pre-built pc upgrades are often limited by the psu.
A 5700 upgrade may also need a new psu.

Reduce your graphics settings/resolution and play your game.
If you get in increase in fps, you can make use of a better graphics card.
If fps stays the same, you are likely cpu speed limited.

 

[1Stone]

What is your budget?
Do you prioritize gaming over streaming?

What types of games do you play?
Some are cpu limited, some are gpu limited, and some like multiplayer need many threads.

What is the make/model of your psu?
That will determine how strong a graphics upgrade can be.
Pre-built pc upgrades are often limited by the psu.
A 5700 upgrade may also need a new psu.

Reduce your graphics settings/resolution and play your game.
If you get in increase in fps, you can make use of a better graphics card.
If fps stays the same, you are likely cpu speed limited.

My budged is between 400 and 600.
Im playing warframe, rust, borderlands 3, Cs, Wow, Overwatch, etc. In general, online games. As for the psu I have no idea, I think I have to open it up and take a look, I will try your method with lowering the specs and take a look.

 

[1Stone]

My budged is between 400 and 600.
Im playing warframe, rust, borderlands 3, Cs, Wow, Overwatch, etc. In general, online games. As for the psu I have no idea, I think I have to open it up and take a look, I will try your method with lowering the specs and take a look.

I checked it, made everything on low and still runs with 60 fps. My CPU is at 80 °C from just leaving the game on and nothing else opened. So.. That might be the first thing to change.

 

[4745454b]

That's super hot in my book. Could be causing issues.

 

[geofelt]

I checked it, made everything on low and still runs with 60 fps. My CPU is at 80 °C from just leaving the game on and nothing else opened. So.. That might be the first thing to change.

Your test tells me that your cpu is holding you back for gaming, let alone also streaming.
Your i5-7400 has 4 threads and a passmark rating of 7237 when all threads are fully utilized. The single thread ration is 1945. Your cpu runs at a clock of 3.0 with a turbo of up to 3.5.
Turbo speeds happen on only one thread and only when thermal conditions permit.
80c. is ok from a safety point of view, but it may be inhibiting your turbo.
The stock intel cooler is only ok, not the best.
The conclusion is that your cpu holding you back.

To keep your current motherboard, the strongest cpu upgrade would be a 8 thread i7-7700K.
It has a passmark rating of 11940 and a single thread rating of 2581. The stock clock is 4.2 with a turbo of 4.5.
A i7-7700K seems to sell on ebay for $270 or so. (Your i5-7400 is around $110)
A i7 will likely need a better than stock cooler.

Past that, you are looking at a current gen intel or ryzen processor which will also entail a new motherboard and likely a cooler also.

On the Intel side, a i5-9600K costs about $220 and is perhaps 10% stronger than a 7700K.
You will need a z390 based motherboard which goes for perhaps $115 and a decent cooler in the $40-$80 range.
A i7-9700K has a rating of 17216/2815 and costs some $400.
Either can likely run at 5.0 on all cores with a good cooler.

On the ryzen side you get many cheap threads which is very good for streaming and multiplayer games.
Ryzen 3600X is $240. A X570 based motherboard starts at $150.
You would probably want an aftermarket cooler also.
3600X has 16 threads and a passmark rating of 20520/2916.
Ryzen comes pretty much overclocked so do not expect the added headroom you can get with the intel K suffix processors.

For pure gaming, the better single thread performance comes from Intel.
But, for multitasking as well as gaming, I think the ryzen option would be better.

 

[4745454b]

Your test tells me that your cpu is holding you back for gaming,

Maybe not. Look at what else he said.

My CPU is at 80 °C...I checked it, made everything on low and still runs with 60 fps

First, his CPU could be thermal throttling. You think it's your CPU not being able to keep up, but it could just be the CPU running too hot and not able to do what it should be doing. Second, I always ask people to double check if Vsync is on when they say they only get 30/60FPS. Check in the game and in the drivers. If it's on, 60FPS is all you'll ever see.

As I said above the 7700K might not handle streaming and gaming at the same time. If it cuts your FPS in half while streaming. He can probably dial the stream settings down so it's not so bad. Perhaps stream in 720? But if he wants to do gaming while streaming I know he's going to need better than the 7400.

 

[1Stone]

Maybe not. Look at what else he said.



First, his CPU could be thermal throttling. You think it's your CPU not being able to keep up, but it could just be the CPU running too hot and not able to do what it should be doing. Second, I always ask people to double check if Vsync is on when they say they only get 30/60FPS. Check in the game and in the drivers. If it's on, 60FPS is all you'll ever see.

As I said above the 7700K might not handle streaming and gaming at the same time. If it cuts your FPS in half while streaming. He can probably dial the stream settings down so it's not so bad. Perhaps stream in 720? But if he wants to do gaming while streaming I know he's going to need better than the 7400.

But if I change my motherboard, than I have to change everything inside, or am I wrong?

 

[MrN1ce9uy]

But if I change my motherboard, than I have to change everything inside, or am I wrong?

You would have to reinstall Windows. Other than that, you can keep everything else including RAM since you already have DDR4.

 

[4745454b]

You would have to change your board yes. But that's what needs to happen for anything better than the 7700K.

 

[geofelt]

It is worthwhile to check for the possibility of throttling.
What is your temperature at idle?
I might expect 10-15c or so over ambient if your cooler is mounted well and functioning.
If it is loose or the thermal paste has deteriorated you could remount it.
Check your multiplier with cpu-Z.
Under load, you should see 3.0 unless you are thermal throttling.

A better monitor is HWmonitor.
It gives you the current, min and max temperatures.
If you see a max of 100c. that is the throttle point where the cpu will shut down or reduce performance to protect itself.
The stock intel pushpin cooler should be adequate .
Not the best, and noisy, but adequate for a i5-7400.

But, I think your case does not have good cooling so that may be a problem.
If you buy a stronger processor it will run hotter and need good case cooling.

 

[1Stone]

So that means i would have to buy another case too, because my current case can't handle, just one more fan and that of course wouldn't be enough... Thinking, thinking...
The ryzen 5 3600x is at 220 euro +/- , as for the motherboard could you give me a link or the full name?
And a case/tower name would also be good, under 80 euro would be perfect.

 

[1Stone]

As for the test that i've done, it was only on Warframe. Checked it right now on C.S G.O everything on high, going from 120 Fps, until 240 Fps. While playing it was 80 °C. I guess just Warframe was like that? And either high or low resolution i would only get 60 fps...I'm so confused.

 

[geofelt]

In the usa, I am not conversant with euro prices.
On cases, I would have a few criteria.

1. It must look good to you. Whatever that means. Buy a case you love, it will be with you a long time. Bust your budget for one if you need to.

2. A good case will have at least two 120/140mm front intakes that are filtered. A washable filter will keep your parts clean. I like 140mm fans better, they move more air and are quieter.

3. It must hold your parts. Duh! A ATX motherboard will not fit in a M-ATX case.
vice versa will work. M-ATX has 4 expansion slots, ATX has 7. Mostly you need only one for a pcie x16 graphics card.

4. opinions differ, but in a nice case I like air cooling and 160mm headroom is sufficient for the best.

I have no opinion on ryzen motherboards, I am more of an intel person.
Reviews are difficult to trust. You hear complaints more than kudos.
A motherboard that has been out longer will have the inevitable bios glitches fixed.

 

[geofelt]

Some games are cpu limited, some are graphics limited.

Most games can effectively use only 4-6 threads, but there are exceptions.
Also, some games like many threads like multiplayer games with many participants.

If you play a mix, you probably need both cpu and graphics upgrades.

 

[1Stone]

Thank you, i should have everything i need until now. And i want to build a new pc from 0. haha
Still need to make some choices, like between Ryzen 7 2700X and Ryzen Threadripper 1900X , price almost the same...So, whish me luck xD

 

[Flayed]

Isn't 80 C pretty normal for a stock intel cooler? You could maybe shave off a few degrees by changing the thermal paste to a high performance one

 

[1Stone]

Isn't 80 C pretty normal for a stock intel cooler? You could maybe shave off a few degrees by changing the thermal paste to a high performance one

It is already a high performance one, i especially asked for the best. The case is too small if i want to install more fans. The motherboard doesn't allow me too many uphgrades. If i change the motherboard i have to change pretty much everything. So i would go with AMD because is more afordable and if i'm not mistaken, every CPU can be overclocked as for the intel only the K series.

 

[Flayed]

It is already a high performance one, i especially asked for the best. The case is too small if i want to install more fans. The motherboard doesn't allow me too many uphgrades. If i change the motherboard i have to change pretty much everything. So i would go with AMD because is more afordable and if i'm not mistaken, every CPU can be overclocked as for the intel only the K series.

Well it's clearly not that high performance lol.

Which heatsink is it and which case?