Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (
More info?)
On Sun, 25 Jul 2004 09:25:28 +0100, "David Meadows"
<david@no.spam.here.uk> wrote:
>I have two players toying with the old "twins whose powers are linked"
>cliché. But one twist they want is that they can share any damage done by
>one of them between themselves. Basically, if one of them takes 20 stun
>through his defences, then each actually takes 10 stun. (And probably body
>damage, too, and maybe even endurance.). It would function all the time, at
>any range, with no delay and no conscious transfer of the damage, and can't
>be voluntarily turned off.
I haven't slept all night, so excuse me if I ramble on a while....
The idea itself has merit, in that "twins feeling damage from the
other" has been around in literature for a long time. But this
particular application has potential to be abusive.
One approach is to start with MIND LINK on page 133 in the 5th Edition
rules. We look towards the end under LIMITATIONS and we find
FEEDBACK. The values they give (-1: Stun only and -2: Stun and Body)
are for "whatever you feel, I feel", i.e. you don't split it, they
both feel the full effect. As GMs we feel we can modify this to fit
their concept. But let's look a bit closer.
You'd have 5 points for Mind Link and a 5 point adder for Psychic
Bond. You'd then have a limit of -1 for "only with another person
with the same mind link" and another limit you'd have to decide on for
"no communication". Let's assume you make that -2 because normally
the mind talk is the whole point of Mind Link power. OK, right now
we've got a power that does them no good at all which costs them 2
points each. No abuse so far <grin>.
You then look at this "splitting damage" thing. What does it really
do? Assuming they each get hit for roughly equal amounts of damage
during a given battle they would pass roughly the same amount of
damage back and forth. Doesn't look too bad so far - but here's the
kicker. You have just made both of them essentially immune to being
CON stunned. Whatever had to get through their defenses before to
stun them, you've just doubled it. Are you prepared to bump the
offensive power of your villians by, say, 50%? What happens if the
villians turn their attention to someone besides the twins? It gets
ugly really fast. So you don't modify your villians, and the twins
are essentially immune to being CON stunned (unless you already run a
campaign where Stun = 2xCON routinely gets through defenses, which I
doubt). Let's assume a CON 20 and PD 20. To get a CON Stun you need
to hit him with 60 stun. To get 60 stun means (on the average) a 17d6
attack. You don't want to CON stun them every time, so you back it
down a tad. Maybe at 15d6 you CON Stun them 1 time in 4. Is that the
level of attack you would want to have for a campaign with 20 CON and
20 defenses? Probably not. If you want to use 12d6 attacks you'd
have to average a 5 on each d6 to Stun them - it ain't gonna happen.
(You can do similar computations for whatever values are typical for
your own campaign.)
So you say OK, it won't be a Limitation, it will be an Advantage.
We'll even make it a +2 Advantage, the maximum you normally see.
Isn't that enough? Well, let's see. 5 pts Mind Link, +5 for Psychic
Bond = 10 points. +2 Advantage for Splitting Damage = 30 active
points. -1 for "only with another" and -2 for "no communication" and
it costs them each 7 points to be effectively immune to CON Stun.
Could they get that same immunity if they simply bought up their CON
or their defenses (all of them) with those 7 points. I doubt it.
Let's approach it from another angle. 50% Damage Reduction,
Resistant, for PD, ED and Mental, each with a Side Effect that happens
when the twin takes damage, which we say happens just as often for
both. Using 10d6 attacks and 20 defenses (the "standard superhero"
values on page 15) we see that normally 15 stun gets through the
defenses, meaning 7.5 gets passed through to the twin. When standard
20 defenses apply it would normally take an 8d6 attack (40 active
points) to get this amount through 20 defenses, so this is a -3/4
Limitation. It gets doubled because it essentially happens every time
the power is used (since we said they get hit with equal frequency).
So call it a -1.5 limitation. Each of those damage reductions costs
30 points, with a -1.5 Limitation they become 12 points, and there are
3 of them - for a total of 36 points. Quite a difference from the 7
points we arrived at above! The rules also say that if there are 2
equally valid ways to make the power construct you are supposed to
take the MORE EXPENSIVE one.
Immunity to CON Stun for 36 points - yes, you can certainly live with
that price. For 36 points they could easily raise their CON or their
defenses (assuming this wouldn't violate campaign limits) and get the
same effect or better. Note that they can't put these into an
Elemental Control under standard rules because Damage Reduction isn't
eligible (it doesn't cost END). However, as GM you are allowed to
make exceptions to this. If you decide to let them have an EC with
these three related "Twin Powers", that drops the cost to 24 points.
That's still a reasonable cost and you get credit for generousity for
making the exception for them.
My personal OPINION is that you would be better off to suggest they go
with the standard game rules already laid out, a full psychic bond
including the standard telepathy and 100% feedback, body and stun.
Costs them each 2 points, fits the genre, fits the existing rules
exactly, and they can use the points they save to buy up their
defenses and/or CON an appropriate amount.
>My first thought was that each buys their stun "usable by others", then
>limiting it to "only my twin", maybe costing it as a +1/2 advantage (would
>normally be +3/4 to share at range with anybody).
>
>Then I started thinking: an advantage which isn't an advantage doesn't cost
>anything. And maybe this isn't really an advantage? After all, both
>characters will be together in 90% of their fights so damage spread among
>them will still count against them in the long run. It would be different if
>one stayed at home in bed just to act as a stun battery for the other's
>fights.
>
>On the plus side, the chance of being stunned is reduced and recovery
>becomes twice as fast.
>
>Then on the negative side, one of them could suddenly find himself being
>stunned or knocked out at a crucial moment with no way of defending against
>it.
>
>I just can't predict how this ability would affect game balance. Any
>thoughts?
>
>
>--
>David Meadows
>"Hiding out on a pig farm saved my life." -- Don, Heroes #18
>www.heroes.force9.co.uk/scripts
>A comic book -- without the pictures
>
>
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