[SOLVED] Home wifi extended 200' to workshop??

[blkdog1954]

I ahev a workshop thats located 200 feet from the house. I have a central router in the house, and the workshop is line of sight from the house with no obstructions. Can I use a wifi outdoor access point on a post at the front of the house to send wifi to the workshop without hardwiring it? If so, what wifi outdoor acess device would be recommended for this distance?
Thanks.

 

[bill001g]

Only if you are lucky. All you did was reduce 1 wall you still have the wall on the remote end to deal with. The signals are fairly weak to start with and you may have interfering signals from neighbors. You could try it I guess.

The real solution is to use directional bridges. Companies like ubiquiti sell many models. You may get by with one on only 1 end but generally they are used in pairs but you are at a fairly short distance.

Not sure what you mean by hardwiring it. The largest problem with any outdoor equipment is getting power to the units so even if you did a wifi repeater you still have to get power and solve the problem of it getting wet.

That is another advantage of outdoor bridge equipment. It is powered over the ethernet cable and is designed for outdoors.

 

[Solandri]

200 ft is short enough you might be able to get away with just one directional antenna, instead of a pair to make a bridge. I've gotten one of these to connect to a regular WiFi router several hundred feet away. Just put one in your workshop and aim it at the WiFi router in your house. (Contrary to popular misconception, a directional antenna at just one end helps with both transmit and receive.)

https://www.amazon.com/Ubiquiti-NanoStation-loco-M2-Wireless/dp/B00HXT8FFI
https://www.amazon.com/Ubiquiti-Networks-LOCOM5-NanoStation-loco/dp/B004EHSV4W

If you get a pair and put them in bridge mode, they can connect up to several km away, which is complete overkill for this application. But you can go that route if you find the connection is not as rock-solid as you'd like. The 2.4 GHz tends to penetrate obstacles (like trees) better, but is more prone to interference from other 2.4 GHz hotspots, microwave ovens, and rain. Get the 5 GHz device if these are a concern and your router supports 5 GHz.

The Nanostation will send one Ethernet connection down to your workshop (with a power over ethernet adapter). If your device has an ethernet port, you can just plug it in. if you want WiFi in your workshop, you should buy a wireless router and configure it to operate as a WAP. Plug the cable from the nanostation's POE adapter to the WAP/router.

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/36406-43-convert-wireless-router-wireless-access-point

 

[blkdog1954]

Thanks Bill and Solandri....very quick response for which I thank you. Just so I have this clear, if I went with one unit, it would be located outside the shop and would need to be connected to a router in the shop to provide WiFi, or I can just plug a device into its ethernet port for direct connection....am I okay so far? Also, if I go with two units, the one at the house would be connected to the house modem by ethernet cable and mounted outside facing the shop, and the one at the shop would pick up the signal and I could plug into the ethernet cable on it directly, or runit into a router and then have wifi in the shop? Thanks again....if you could clear this up I'll be off to purchase these tomorrow

 

[Solandri]

If you get one, it's basically acting as a big WiFi adapter with ethernet output. It's just another device which connects to your WiFi router, just that the antenna is directional so you can connect from further away. You can plug one device into the ethernet port to ride its WiFi connection. Or plug in a router to connect multiple devices. You might even be able to plug it into a switch - I think it has a bridged client mode which would allow that (client mode makes it like a WiFi adapter so only a single device can use it, bridged client mode makes devices connected to it act like they're connected to your home router's WiFi).

Mounting it outside would be best, but unless your workshop has a metal exterior it shouldn't strictly be necessary. It is just WiFi so has some ability to pass through walls. Metal (which creates a Faraday cage) and water (which resonates at 2.45 GHz) are the things that will severely block it.

If you get two, you'd be setting them up as a bridge. The two Nanostations can connect only to each other over WiFi (this hop is the bridge). The ethernet for one Nanostation plugs into your home router (not the modem, unless you only want Internet in your workshop, not in your home). Once the bridge is set up, it is transparent. The Ethernet cable coming from the Nanostation in your workshop acts just like a really long Ethernet cable plugged into your home router. You can plug a device or another router into it.

 

[blkdog1954]

Thanks Solandri. I apologise for being a pain but I'm not very technically literate, so have to ask.....If I only buy one nanostation, it should be mounted on my workshop, pointed at the router in the house, and the ethernet cable that runs from it can either be plugged into a device, or a router that would give me wifi in the workshop? I think I have this right
If I go with two nanostations, one should be mounted on the house and hooked by ethernet to the router and pointed at the workshop. The second should be mounted on the workshop pointed back at the house, with the ethernet cable either plugged into a device, or alternatively, plugged into a router thus giving me wifi for several devices?
Thank you for your patience with this problem.

 

[bill001g]

Your understanding of how you need to hook it up is correct.

 

[blkdog1954]

Thanks Bill...
I really appreciate the patience with an old duffer

 

[blkdog1954]

MERGED QUESTION
Question from blkdog1954 : "RE: Extending wifi to shop 200' from house- another question"

Hi again everyone,
I asked a question a few days ago about the above captioned problem, and recieved some
excellent advice from both Solandri and Bill001g...
As a result I contacted Ubiquiti to get more information about the device recommended, and was told by an on-line agent that the model suggested
Ubiquiti Nanostation LOCO M5 Outdoor MIMO 2x2 802.11n 5GHz
was a "legacy" product and consequently "EOL"
She explained that EOL means end of life...my question is does this mean this product (while still being produced according to her) has been replaced by a better more updated model? I've searched the Ubiquiti site and been unable to get a straight answer....can anyone advise?
I have a local computer store that can provide the model listed above, but before I go ahead and order I'd like to make sure I'm getting the latest technology
Thanks for your patience, I'm not very technologically literate hence looking for some help.

 

[bill001g]

I forget the exact newer models they sell 802.11ac models. They should get faster throughput because of the higher encoding. They sell models that they say run on 2.4g but 802.11ac does not run on 2.4g and I have been too lazy to see what they mean by that. I guess it depends how much difference in price there is.


I have some of the even older nanostations that do not even run mimo but they are in a box someplace since I no longer use them.

There is nothing wrong with the older units. They run their airos on all their units so all the models get all the new patches. I suppose at some date in the future the software image may no longer fit in the memory and they will drop support. That does not mean they stop working you just do not get any bugs fixed.

 

[blkdog1954]

I forget the exact newer models they sell 802.11ac models. They should get faster throughput because of the higher encoding. They sell models that they say run on 2.4g but 802.11ac does not run on 2.4g and I have been too lazy to see what they mean by that. I guess it depends how much difference in price there is.


I have some of the even older nanostations that do not even run mimo but they are in a box someplace since I no longer use them.

There is nothing wrong with the older units. They run their airos on all their units so all the models get all the new patches. I suppose at some date in the future the software image may no longer fit in the memory and they will drop support. That does not mean they stop working you just do not get any bugs fixed.

 

[blkdog1954]

Thanks Bill,...can I assume then that rather than get more confused looking for a different Ubiquiti device that it would be okay to go ahead with the one recommended? I guess I can give it a shot and if it doesn't work I'll return it...support is important to me as I have already mentioned I'm technologically challenged!!
Looked quickly at the Ubiquiti site again and the descriptions seem so technical I have a hard time with what would be an alternative.

 

[bill001g]

I think the new model is the "nano station ac loco" it is the same price more or less than the the other nano station loco things. I have only used the older loco models but I can't believe they would make worse products.

The one big thing to be careful of is if you plan to only buy 1 unit then you must decide if you want 2.4g or 5g since your router will be on one end. Most these units unlike routers or wifi nic cards do not operate on both frequencies, you must buy a unit that matches.

If you buy 2 units as long as they are the same they will connect with each other.

Now if you have the big buck you buy their airfiber units at over $1000 each

 

[blkdog1954]

Cheers Bill001g....now I'm totally confused ;_0
If I buy two of these, in order to get wifi for multiple devices in the workshop, wont I also have to run a router from the unit receiving in the shop?

 

[bill001g]

Not a router a AP but any router can act as a AP.

You need to think of the bridge units as a ethernet cable. Its only purpose is to provide a connection to the remote location. Just as if you had a ethernet cable you need a radio unit to talk to the end devices in the remote building.

Since you are using actual ethernet cable to connect between the inside of the building and the bridge units you also solve the problem of trying to transmit through the exterior walls.

 

[blkdog1954]

Thanks again Bill001g, after re reading your last post I realised what you meant. Now there's a big hiccup in the shape of my wife!!! She does not want ethernet wire run outside the walls in the basement as it's finished, and she thinks it would look ugly. I don't know of any way to get the signal from the router outside to an access point without ethernet cable......is there such a thing as a wireless access point that would pick up the existing wifi from the basement and be able to re-distribute it to the shop without ethernet cable? Not concerned at the shop end, but only in the basement. I suppose the other alternative would be to ask the cable company to run a separate wire from the pole to the shop for wifi....then I will have to pay for an additional hookup and modem. Any suggestions? (apart from ones about the wife !!)

 

[bill001g]

If you have a window it might work. It is very hard to get wifi signal through a concrete wall.

Maybe if you are lucky powerline might work at the distance. The remote building must be connect to the main house power panel.

 

[blkdog1954]

Fortunately, the wall of the basement on the shop side is stick framed so no concrete...will wait to see what the cost will be for the cable co. to run to the shop....probably prohibitive but we'll see. Shop has a separate sub panel but I'm not sure it's hooked to the main house panel...I guess it must be as there is no separate bill for the shop. Just moved here so not really sure. I also read that repeaters/extenders cut the internet speed in half...not sure about that one.
Thanks Bill001g

 

[Solandri]

A WiFi repeater/extender will cut your wireless bandwidth in half. A powerline repeater will not. The signal goes along powerline from the router to the repeater. The repeater then acts as a wireless access point. (I wish they'd just call them powerline WiFi access points instead, but they call them repeaters so that's the name we're stuck with.)

Ethernet along the walls is not difficult to hide. You can run it up in the corner and cover it up with some sort of cord covering kit.

https://www.amazon.com/Cable-Concealer-Wall-Cover-Raceway/dp/B01JKO8724

Am I understanding this right - your main router is in the basement? Does it have to be there? If this is cable Internet, you should be able to plug the cable modem into any cable TV outlet in the house, and set the router up there. If there's a TV connected, you can use a coax cable splitter. It's not ideal, but I've found it usually works without signal degradation.

 

[blkdog1954]

Thanks Solandri,
Yes, the cable modem is in the basement, but was installed in a electrical panel-like cabinet with all wires running into the cabinet. I don't think moving it is an option. Have contacted the cable company and am waiting to hear about a designated install for the shop...then I guess I'll have to make a decision

 

[blkdog1954]

Hi again...still pursueing this issue and trying to become well informed before making a decision.
I wanted to ask people's opinion on the PiFi system provided by SimpleWifi who I believe are out of Florida?
It seems their system would work for me without having to run any wires at the house, but as they seem to be only an internet based company I'd like some feedback before going any further.....anyone on the forum have or currently use this system, and if so, any feedback?
Thanks a bunch.

 

[bill001g]

Never saw that brand but it looks similar to the ubiquiti products. Ubiquiti sells seperate antenna and radios but it is more expensive that way.

Pretty much it is the same as the bridge units discussed in thread just in 2 parts. They use a direction product attached to a router/ap in the second building.

They pretend it magically solves the problem of getting into the house on the other end. The equipment they sell is still limited by the same legal regulation as any other equipment. It will not transmit at any higher power.

 

[blkdog1954]

Thanks Bill001g.....when you say "they pretend...." are you saying that perhaps this is not a viable solution for me?
It seemed the answer to my issue....not running anything from the house... but perhaps you could explain what they "pretend"?
Thanks.

 

[blkdog1954]

Also bill, tried the ubiquti site for something similar through them, but all the product descriptions are way too technical for me....do you know if they have something exactly like the Simple WiFi setup......a remote antenna that will pick up the house wifi signal and distribute it at the shop without running wires in the house? If so, where should I be looking?
Thanks.

 

[bill001g]

They sell a bullet product as well as a couple other radios that take external antenna. They also sell a large selection of antenna.

This is the old way to do this. The more modern version is to put the radio electronics inside the antenna since the electronic is small. The units that have external antenna generally are used when you want to connect multiple directional antenna.

In any case the problem is still the same. Just because some company draw a picture of a house with a signal inside does not mean they can actually get the signal. They can't undo the problem of the wall absorbing the radio signals.

All that matters is the total gain of the antenna and the radio. This is regulated by the government. If enough signal from the router can make it outside the house then the units from ubiquiti will work about the same. From what I can tell ubiquiti products are a fraction of the cost but you have to buy your own router/ap and mounting hardware