How is this 2000 US$ intel gaming build

[zenosworld]

I saw the following build listed in the section where people vote on BestConfigs.

Could I get some feedback from you guys on this build? Would you recommend something else instead? Thanks!


Low Latency Platinum Build
MB - ASUS P8Z77-M GEN3 - $125
CPU - i5-3570k - $220
CPU COOLER - Hyper 212 EVO - $30
CPU COOLER 2nd Fan - Blade Master 120mm - $9
MEM - G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 8GB DDR3-1866 8-9-9-24 1.5v - $75
SSD - Samsung 840 Pro 128GB - $140
HD - Samsung F4 2TB - $110
GPU - EVGA GTX 690 - $1000
BD-RW - LG 14x - $70
PSU - SeaSonic SS-660W Platinum - $140
CASE - Rosewill CHALLENGER-U3 USB 3.0 eSATA 3 Fans - $60

$1979

 

[g-unit1111]

$2K build with a micro ATX board and a freaking Rosewill Challenger??? No. And two 670s will give you the exact same performance as a 690 for $200 less.

Here's how you spend $2K on a build:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($219.99 @ Newegg)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D14 65.0 CFM CPU Cooler ($69.99 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UP4 TH ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($192.86 @ Newegg)
Memory: G.Skill Ares Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($37.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung Spinpoint F4 2TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive ($129.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: A-Data XPG SX900 256GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($189.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce GTX 670 2GB Video Card (2-Way SLI) ($366.97 @ Newegg)
Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce GTX 670 2GB Video Card (2-Way SLI) ($366.97 @ Newegg)
Case: NZXT Switch 810 (White) ATX Full Tower Case ($179.98 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: PC Power & Cooling Silencer Mk II 750W 80 PLUS Silver Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($99.99 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Lite-On iHAS124-04 DVD/CD Writer ($22.98 @ Newegg)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8 (OEM) (64-bit) ($99.99 @ Newegg)
Total: $1977.69
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2012-11-27 00:13 EST-0500)

 

[manofchalk]

^ Good build (except for two things) assuming you have the Surround setup or 120hz monitor to take advantage of the dual cards. If you just have a single 1080p screen, there is no point in Crossfire/SLI.

The two things, a slow Spinpoint drive and an A-Data SSD.
Can get a faster HDD of better repute, cheaper.
Seagate Barracuda 2TB 7200RPM. $110
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148910

And a better SSD.
Samsung 830 256GB. $190
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147138

 

[nvalhalla]

I agree with manofchalk. That's a lot of GPU for 1 screen. If you are only running 1, I would go with a 7970, unless you have your heart set on NVidia, in which case a single 670 would be fine. You can add a second if you find you need more power in a couple years.

Ditto on the drive suggestions, I would use a larger 256GB Samsung.

 

[g-unit1111]

^ Good build (except for two things) assuming you have the Surround setup or 120hz monitor to take advantage of the dual cards. If you just have a single 1080p screen, there is no point in Crossfire/SLI.

The two things, a slow Spinpoint drive and an A-Data SSD.
Can get a faster HDD of better repute, cheaper.
Seagate Barracuda 2TB 7200RPM. $110
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148910

And a better SSD.
Samsung 830 256GB. $190
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147138

That SSD I picked won an editor's choice yesterday: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/240gb-256gb-ssd-review,3313.html

 

[blazorthon]

Samsung 830 is in no way other than price better than 840 Pro. It's slower and uses a little more power with inferior NAND. I'd call the 830s better than the regular 840s because of their higher-endurance NAND (I think that we've nearly reached the point of where smaller processes and such are simply not reasonable for the endurance trade-off), but the 840 Pros use entirely different NAND from the 840s.

 

[urtrapt]

That SSD I picked won an editor's choice yesterday: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/240gb-256gb-ssd-review,3313.html

That's because Samsung, Crucial, and/or Intel wasn't apart of that SSD round up.

 

[manofchalk]

Except they actually were.
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/240gb-256gb-ssd-review,3313-9.html
The A-Data SSD actually beats the 830 by a bit.

Though I would want to see a more detailed comparison before I would recommend the A-Data over the Samsung 830.

 

[blazorthon]

Except they actually were.
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/240gb-256gb-ssd-review,3313-9.html
The A-Data SSD actually beats the 830 by a bit.

Though I would want to see a more detailed comparison before I would recommend the A-Data over the Samsung 830.

No, they weren't. All that you saw with the 830s was a comparison in power consumption and a single synthetic test. The real tests didn't show the 830 in that review and the writers of the article specifically stated this in the comments section.

The A-Data is also remarkably less reliable according to common reviews (one of the few ways of measuring this) and a little slower overall, especially with in-compressible workloads. Ahh, the curse of SandForce...

 

[manofchalk]

I know, I did say I would need a better benchmark comparing the drives to convince me to recommend the A-Data.
Still firmly in Samsung's camp (or OCZ with the Vertex 4 if OP's after write speeds) in this regard.

 

[blazorthon]

I'd also like to throw in my own computer recommendation:
http://pcpartpicker.com/p/pKzZ
CPU i5-3570K $219.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-cpu-bx80637i53570k
CPU Cooler TUNIQ Tower 120 Extreme $64.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/tuniq-cpu-cooler-crt120exbkrv1
Motherboard ASRock Z77 Extreme4 ATX $104.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/asrock-motherboard-z77extreme4
Memory G.Skill Ripjaws X Series 2x4GB F3-14900CL9D-8GBXL $29.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gskill-memory-f314900cl9d8gbxl
Storage Seagate Barracuda ST2000DM001 2TB 7.2KRPM $69.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/seagate-internal-hard-drive-st2000dm001
Samsung 830 Series 256GB $169.95 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/samsung-internal-hard-drive-mz7pc256nam
Video Card X2 (CFX) Sapphire Radeon 7950 100352VXSR $329.99x2=$659.98 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/sapphire-video-card-100352vxsr
Case Antec Nine Hundred Two V3 ATX Mid $96.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/antec-case-ninehundredtwov3
Power Supply SeaSonic SS-750KM 750W 80 PLUS Gold $99.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/seasonic-power-supply-ss750km
Optical Drive Samsung SH-224BB DVD/CD Writer $15.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/samsung-optical-drive-sh224bb
Operating System Microsoft Windows 8 (OEM) (64-bit) $79.98 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/microsoft-os-wn700404

The i5-3570K doesn't need an introduction.

The Ivy K edition CPUs don't get very hot, so they need a very thermally conductive cooler, not a cooler that can manage a ton of heat without getting obtusely hot. So, Direct Touch Heatpipes are almost entirely a must for optimal thermals. This high-end cooler provides them as well as good noise and thermal load. Almost all other high-end coolers lack Direct touch Heatpipes, which although not a big issue for most other CPUs, can be an issue for Ivy Bridge CPUs in overclocking.

I see little reason to go beyond the ASRock Z77 Extreme 4. It's a fairly high end board despite its low end price and anyone who has had one and compared to several much more expensive Z77 boards can usually attest to that. A much more expensive board may be able to beat it, but don't expect a return that's worth the payout. Ivy is still much more limited by thermals than by the motherboard's power delivery and that it's already so high-end makes even the most extreme graphics systems usually not troubled by the i5-3570K with a moderate overclock. This system should have no trouble with afairly extreme overclock anyway.

This memory kit is the best and cheapest used in the builds that I've seen here so far. You could drop another $10 for an otherwise identical DDR3-1600 kit, but when it's a mere $10 with a $2000 budget, the small performance boost is worth the minuscule price premium.

Some others mentioned this hard drive earlier IIRC and really, it's pretty good. I prefer Western Digital, but Western Digital has no reasonably priced 2TB 7.2KRPM models and Seagate Barracuda is the next best in this example.

Samsung 830 continues to be among the best SSDs in almost every way except for write performance. I'd prefer Vertex 4 overall, but Vertex 4 is priced much higher right now.

These 7950s are cheaper than any non-reference, similarly performing to most 670s (even most non-reference models) at stock, and superior overclockers with comparable power efficiency at the same level of performance. It's a meet or win all around when the free games are considered.

I opted for a superior Seasonic 80+ Gold PSU than the others here that just happens to have an incredible price ATM.

The case is much more subjective. I can't justify spending more on the case than about $100 and this excellent Antec case fits nearly perfectly in that.

Paying more for an optical drive doesn't matter unless you want more features (Blu-Ray support, M-Disk support, etc), so I went for the cheapest DVD writer (technically, this is one cent more expensive than the cheapest, but a little better thna the cheapest and the penny is worth it).

I went for Windows 8 (OEM) x64 as the OS like some others did before me. I consider it to be a superior OS than 7 and it has been proven to be superior under the hood. If you dislike the UI, then install Classic Shell (which is free) and you can get back the start menu, boot directly into the desktop, re-install Aero, and much more with it.

 

[g-unit1111]

That's because Samsung, Crucial, and/or Intel wasn't apart of that SSD round up.

Intel SSDs... ugh.

Case Antec Nine Hundred Two V3 ATX Mid $96.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/antec [...] ndredtwov3

Don't get an Antec 900 - no cable management. Plus the drive bays are the worst when it comes to installing new hard drives. The only Antec cases that are worth anything right now are the P280 and the 1100.

The A-Data is also remarkably less reliable according to common reviews (one of the few ways of measuring this) and a little slower overall, especially with in-compressible workloads. Ahh, the curse of SandForce...

True - Sandforce does suck. Maybe I won't be recommending this drive after all.

 

[blazorthon]

Intel SSDs... ugh.

Case Antec Nine Hundred Two V3 ATX Mid $96.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/antec [...] ndredtwov3

Don't get an Antec 900 - no cable management. Plus the drive bays are the worst when it comes to installing new hard drives. The only Antec cases that are worth anything right now are the P280 and the 1100.

The A-Data is also remarkably less reliable according to common reviews (one of the few ways of measuring this) and a little slower overall, especially with in-compressible workloads. Ahh, the curse of SandForce...

True - Sandforce does suck. Maybe I won't be recommending this drive after all.

Okay, how about the HAF XM?
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/cooler-master-case-rc922xmkkn1

 

[g-unit1111]

Okay, how about the HAF XM?
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/cooler-master-case-rc922xmkkn1

Yeah I'd pick a HAF XM over an Antec 900 any day of the week. I really like the Corsair 500R as well.

 

[manofchalk]

The HAF-XM is a great case, you wont be dissatisfied with it.

 

[zenosworld]

Cool. None of you really answered my question and then went off on some other tangent. Idgaf. tl;dr.

How is the build that I suggested above? If it is bad, (i) how is it bad and (ii) how bad is it?

 

[g-unit1111]

Cool. None of you really answered my question and then went off on some other tangent. Idgaf. tl;dr.

How is the build that I suggested above? If it is bad, (i) how is it bad and (ii) how bad is it?

1. Yeah that happens around here. :lol:

2. I'm not going to say it's a bad build. It's a decent start. The 690 is not worth the $1K premium. Two 670's in SLI gives you the same performance within a couple of frames and is $200 cheaper. No reason to get a micro ATX board on that build and pay more for the case. Really a $2K build with a $60 case is an absolute no. Get at least a $100 or $120 case like the Phantom 410 or the Corsair 500R, or HAF XM. Leave the cheap cases behind. The Samsung 840 gets decent reviews - there's better SSDs you could get. If you want to do SLI you'll need at least a 750W PSU with bronze certification or better.

 

[blazorthon]

It's not a bad build, but it's not good either.

You're CPU cooler, SSD, memory, and hard drive choices look rather poor. I don't like your graphics choice either, granted that is a little more subjective.

The CPU cooler isn't very good and throwing on another fan won't help much at all with that CPU. Ivy doesn't generate a lot of heat, so it doesn't need a lot of cooling capacity. Ivy does however have trouble getting rid of what heat it does generate, so it needs low thermal resistance. Something such as a Xigmatek Aegir or Tuniq Tower 120 Extreme would undoubtedly be among your best options (direct touch heat pipes are practically a must).

The SSD choice is way overpriced for an SSD for a gaming computer. You'd be much better off with say an Agility 4 256GB and that's only slightly more expensive than that Samsung 840 Pro 120GB. Heck, even the Samsung 840 and 830 25^GB models aren't too much more expensive than that 840 Pro 120GB. The performance differences are practically irrelevant for gaming, so instead you should shoot for a mix of reliability and price per GB. The SSDs that I mentioned all excel in that whereas 840 Pro, although extremely reliable, has high prices.

The memory is way overpriced for what you're doing. Not only is it unlikely to have any improvement over DDR3-1333, but a 2x4GB DDR3-1866 9-10-9-28 1.5V kit is already available for less than half the price and is the better choice anyway:
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gskill-memory-f314900cl9d8gbxl

The hard drive chocie is an unreliable model and I wouldn't recommend it. Samsung used to make some of the best 3.5" hard drives, but they sold out to Seagate and now they're even worse than Seagate despite mostly selling re-branded Seagate units.

The GTX 690, although very powerful, isn't priced well for its performance. Two GTX 670s in SLI can be had for very roughly $700 (depending on the model, anywhere from a little over $600 to over $900, but $700 is a good approximation for where you should buy around) and would have similar power efficiency and performance with lower noise and GPU temperatures. Even better would probably be two Radeon 7950s, assuming that you aren't a Nvidia fan and/or don't need some specific Nvidia-only technologies such as CUDA for anything that you want to do.

 

[blazorthon]

1. Yeah that happens around here. :lol:

2. I'm not going to say it's a bad build. It's a decent start. The 690 is not worth the $1K premium. Two 670's in SLI gives you the same performance within a couple of frames and is $200 cheaper. No reason to get a micro ATX board on that build and pay more for the case. Really a $2K build with a $60 case is an absolute no. Get at least a $100 or $120 case like the Phantom 410 or the Corsair 500R, or HAF XM. Leave the cheap cases behind. The Samsung 840 gets decent reviews - there's better SSDs you could get. If you want to do SLI you'll need at least a 750W PSU with bronze certification or better.

OP's PSU would do just fine with OP's system. It is not inadequate nor even borderline inadequate. Furthermore, wattage doesn't matter much on a PSU and certification is not even guaranteed to be true, let alone important. I can name Bronze, Silver, and even Gold rated PSUs that are absolute garbage.

 

[g-unit1111]

OP's PSU would do just fine with OP's system. It is not inadequate nor even borderline inadequate. Furthermore, wattage doesn't matter much on a PSU and certification is not even guaranteed to be true, let alone important. I can name Bronze, Silver, and even Gold rated PSUs that are absolute garbage.

Yeah that is true that ratings don't matter much. Seasonic makes excellent PSUs no question but I definitely agree that there is a lot of crap out there.

The CPU cooler isn't very good and throwing on another fan won't help much at all with that CPU. Ivy doesn't generate a lot of heat, so it doesn't need a lot of cooling capacity. Ivy does however have trouble getting rid of what heat it does generate, so it needs low thermal resistance. Something such as a Xigmatek Aegir or Tuniq Tower 120 Extreme would undoubtedly be among your best options (direct touch heat pipes are practically a must).

I could name at least 15 coolers I'd rather buy than anything Xigmatex makes.

The memory is way overpriced for what you're doing. Not only is it unlikely to have any improvement over DDR3-1333, but a 2x4GB DDR3-1866 9-10-9-28 1.5V kit is already available for less than half the price and is the better choice anyway:
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gskil [...] 0cl9d8gbxl

But 1866 RAM is not really useful on Ivy Bridge builds - I know that Intel will void warranties if they find out that you've been using RAM above 1600 on Ivy Bridge and 1333 on Sandy Bridge.

 

[blazorthon]

Yeah that is true that ratings don't matter much. Seasonic makes excellent PSUs no question but I definitely agree that there is a lot of crap out there.

The CPU cooler isn't very good and throwing on another fan won't help much at all with that CPU. Ivy doesn't generate a lot of heat, so it doesn't need a lot of cooling capacity. Ivy does however have trouble getting rid of what heat it does generate, so it needs low thermal resistance. Something such as a Xigmatek Aegir or Tuniq Tower 120 Extreme would undoubtedly be among your best options (direct touch heat pipes are practically a must).

I could name at least 15 coolers I'd rather buy than anything Xigmatex makes.

The memory is way overpriced for what you're doing. Not only is it unlikely to have any improvement over DDR3-1333, but a 2x4GB DDR3-1866 9-10-9-28 1.5V kit is already available for less than half the price and is the better choice anyway:
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gskil [...] 0cl9d8gbxl

But 1866 RAM is not really useful on Ivy Bridge builds - I know that Intel will void warranties if they find out that you've been using RAM above 1600 on Ivy Bridge and 1333 on Sandy Bridge.

Xigmatek has some good and some bad products. If you don't like them, then the Tuniq Tower 120 Extreme is still an option.

My point was that the kit that OP picked out was wrong. Like I said, it is unlikely to have any advantage over even DDR3-1333 and DDR3-1600 in performance and regardless of that, there are much cheaper yet still good DDR3-1866 options available.

Intel can't void the warranty for that if you don't tell them that you did it. Also, that's the first that I've heard of a warranty being voided over using fast RAM. I've heard of them being voided over using high-voltage RAM, but not high frequency 1.5V/1.35V/1.25V RAM. Are you sure of what you said?

 

[g-unit1111]

Xigmatek has some good and some bad products. If you don't like them, then the Tuniq Tower 120 Extreme is still an option.

My point was that the kit that OP picked out was wrong. Like I said, it is unlikely to have any advantage over even DDR3-1333 and DDR3-1600 in performance and regardless of that, there are much cheaper yet still good DDR3-1866 options available.

Intel can't void the warranty for that if you don't tell them that you did it. Also, that's the first that I've heard of a warranty being voided over using fast RAM. I've heard of them being voided over using high-voltage RAM, but not high frequency 1.5V/1.35V/1.25V RAM. Are you sure of what you said?

The speed of RAM doesn't really make much of a difference in how the build performs though, that is what I was trying to get.

As far as the CPU goes - ask Proximon. He tried to RMA a CPU through Intel and after a huge fight they gave him a long list of things they wouldn't accept returns on and they were very strict about the use of RAM speed. It's mainly due to the RAM controller being on the CPU itself.

 

[zenosworld]

Blazorthorn,

Except for the case and maybe the CPU (because of g-unit's worry), I like the quality of your build:

CPU i5-3570K $219.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-cpu-bx80637i53570k
CPU Cooler TUNIQ Tower 120 Extreme $64.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/tuniq [...] 120exbkrv1
Motherboard ASRock Z77 Extreme4 ATX $104.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/asroc [...] 77extreme4
Memory G.Skill Ripjaws X Series 2x4GB F3-14900CL9D-8GBXL $29.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gskil [...] 0cl9d8gbxl
Storage Seagate Barracuda ST2000DM001 2TB 7.2KRPM $69.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/seaga [...] t2000dm001
Samsung 830 Series 256GB $169.95 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/samsu [...] z7pc256nam
Video Card X2 (CFX) Sapphire Radeon 7950 100352VXSR $329.99x2=$659.98 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/sapph [...] 100352vxsr
Case Antec Nine Hundred Two V3 ATX Mid $96.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/antec [...] ndredtwov3
Power Supply SeaSonic SS-750KM 750W 80 PLUS Gold $99.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/seaso [...] ly-ss750km
Optical Drive Samsung SH-224BB DVD/CD Writer $15.99 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/samsu [...] ve-sh224bb
Operating System Microsoft Windows 8 (OEM) (64-bit) $79.98 http://pcpartpicker.com/part/microsoft-os-wn700404

Do you think I can build a better gaming PC than this - my budget is 2000 US$ (no need for peripherals) and I don't like overclocking (due to past problems) - ? I like to use a single graphics card since I've had some issues with dual graphics cards in the past. Also, I get two free games with that graphics card (Borderlands 2 and Assassin's Creed 3). So, I have some incentive to keep that graphics card.

But I'll let you take control and tell me what to build. The help I'm getting from you guys in this thread is very much appreciated.

Thanks!

 

[blazorthon]

Switch out my Antec case for the HAF XM like we amended to my build earlier and it should be great.

The Radeon 7950s come with three free games (FarCry3, HitMan, and Sleeping Dogs) each, so I'd say that you're getting a lot more value. You can sell the free games that you don't use (such as those from the second card and any from the first that you don't want) and that can add up to a lot of *saved* money, especially considering that you're already several hundred dollars cheaper than the GTX 690.

If you're not overclocking, then you could go for two cheap GTX 670s if you wanted to, but it probably wouldn't help you in gaming performance in most games (some may benefit while some others do the opposite), especially overall. However, it is a good option if you so desire and is still better than going for the GTX 690.

The GTX 690 is already two graphics adapters too, just built into a single PCB. Any issues with two graphics cards should be similarly prevalent with the GTX 690.

However, at least these days, multi-GPU technology, especially from AMD (Nvidia had a slight advantage in this until recently, but they're multi-GPU work is still quite excellent right now), has greatly improved and I'm willing to recommend it. No single GPU solution is currently high-end enough to be worth choosing for a $2000 gaming build, so you'd either need to lower your budget or get a dual or triple GPU solution if you want to get the most for your money.

That CPU is your best option. If anything, you'd be better out changing the memory for a DDR3-1600 kit for the warranty's sake, but I'll be honest here: running DDR3-1866 memory is beyond extremely unlikely to hurt the CPU. What may hurt the CPU is using high-voltage memory (1.6v and up) and even then, it's still not likely to be an issue so long as its configured properly.

If you choose to do that, here is a suggestion for your memory kit choice:
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/patriot-memory-pvi38g160c9k

DDR3-1600 9-9-9-24 1.5V 2x4GB kit from Patriot's Intel Extreme Master, Limited Edition series.

 

[zenosworld]

Hmmm...

I've heard some very good things about the GTX 690. Are you sure getting two GTX 670s would be better than one 690? My main concern here is picture quality, graphics quality, smoothness... I just want the games to *look* great (so cost-to-performance is not an issue for me - only performance). Could I slip either one into your build (keeping other things the same)? Let me know.

Also, it seems that I should go for the DDR3-1600 kit, right? I mean (from reading above) the only real difference seems to be voiding the warranty. Yeah? Or no? Will it in fact affect performance?