I need to build my first PC with huge memory 128GB

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rebelloVW

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Apr 22, 2013
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To keep my development skills up - I decided to purchase a PC to do some application development - however when I looked further into this I found the requirements of the application (will not give any names) are extreme requiring 100+ GB RAM to run all the various server components and databases and there so far isn't a way around this.

So anyhow - I see the only option here from a cost savings standpoint is to build my own server (likely windows 7 64bit pro - or perhaps some flavor of Linux) - which should be a bunch of fun - but I haven't done that before - I have replaced power supplies, memory, video cards etc on my son's various PCs - so I do not feel it would be too difficult.

Since this is a sandbox env I want to build it as cheaply as possible but at the same time not so cheap that the end result is not stable.

Could I get some advice on a decent motherboard to use? I would like to start with 64GB and see if I can get things to work - if not - then I'll need to go the whole 128.

Are there other 'gotchas' when dealing with this much RAM? Or is it really no different from building a simple PC with say 8GB RAM (provided the components are chosen correctly for 128GB.)

Thanks very much
 
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There is no need to get "fast" RAM... that will not hinder work.
however, you might want to read into the software demands -- e.g., need a big pipeline to access CPU, or the RAM use is mostly passive?

In other words, do you need a server CPU, or a desktop version is ok? dual CPUs?
 
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Thanks everyone for the advice so far - I'm leaning towards a single multi-core processor since I have a feeling that these many memory based processes will mostly be up and running - but completely idle - since I'm the only one on the system. So I think the i7 would be a good choice.
 
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Official specs on desktop I7 processors, max out at 64GB for LGA 1011 CPUs and 32GB for LGA1155.
You'll want a Xeon or Opteron system.

And you'll likely have to deal with FB-DIMMs.
 
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if you have multiple processes, will you not be better served just building 2 machines?

There is a huge gotcha, that are few to no motherboards that will support 128g at this time, that MSI one maybe one of your few options.
 
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The EVGA SRX supports up to dual Xeons and 96GB of RAM. But yeah your options are quite limited for the time being.
 
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Thanks again for the great advice and catch about the i7. Seems the way to go is at least to start with a single 64GB desktop with large swap and if really necessary just create a second one. I think the MB choice above with the I7 that supports 64GB is a decent path to take.
 
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You'll want an xeon or opteron to use more than 64gb ram since those high density sticks are only available as ecc which i7 cannot use. Options are not limited, don't look at just x79, look at server chipsets.

Why can't you say what software you are using?
 
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Most importantly though when you buy a server motherboard ALWAYS check the vendors list for recommended CPU and Memory, or it will be a huge headache. They are super picky on memory and you will have to exchange them if they are not on the list as usually they won't even post.

My choice was a dual socket, though you can go cheaper using a cpu with less than the 16 cores and going with a single socket board.
 
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Thanks for the great advice - I wanted to keep the price around 1K but that doesn't seem possible even with a non-server class CPU - so for a few bucks more I think it would be better to take the advice and step up to an Xeon or Opteron and with two sockets for growth.

I'm at around 1700 or so - I found an ASUS and Xeon (Opteron can be found as well) combo from the help above at just over 600$ - and from research - CPU fan - 30.00, PS 100.00, CD/DVD 20.00, HDD 135.00(1TB), Case 80.00 and the memory 64GB 550.00 and this board can support 96GB - so perhaps I'll start with 48GB and get my hands dirty.

Thanks again.

 
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Man this is quite the learning experience - with the earlier ASUS MB it seems the big memory options require what someone mentioned earlier - RDIMM over a certain size which is very expensive - something like 16GB UDIMM anything more - needs to be RDIMM.

I've found the following MB:

SUPERMICRO MBD-H8DCL-IF-O ATX Server Motherboard Dual 1207-pin Socket C32 AMD SR5690

That supports two Opteron processors - and doesn't mention RDIMM only UDIMM - seems fine with UDIMM up to 256GB.

Choices, choices. Site has been a great help and education.

 
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That is incorrect. Udimm is limited to 64 GB. To get 256GB you will need ECC. I wouldn't skimp on the memory. Save on the case, but not the ram.

Edit: Maybe should post sources as well....http://www.supermicro.com/Aplus/motherboard/Opteron4000/sr56x0/H8DCL-if.cfm
"Supports up to 256GB Registered ECC or 64GB Unbuffered ECC/non-ECC DDR3 1600/1333/1066 SDRAM in 8 DIMMs"
Again my suggestion is splruge for a 2 socket motherboard that you can upgrade in the future for another CPU and more ram.
 
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Yep - I realized that a bit later. So one last question for the night - I'm finding it a bit hard to find the RDIMM when I search but when I searched for registered Dimm - I did get a couple of results - ex:

155.00 for 16 GB

Is this about the right price for RDIMM memory (single 16GB stick)? And as long as the Signal Processing is Registered - I'm looking at RDIMM vs UDIMM.

Thanks,
 
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Wintec Server Series 64GB (4 x 16GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM ECC Registered DDR3 1600, comes out to $127.50 per 16 GB.
 
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rebelloVW,

To understand the demands on the proposed system it would help to know the exact applications you will using as well the nature of the projects- molecular modeling, structural analysis or games development have different needs- processor, graphics card, drive speed and quantity- everything.

There are few motherboards with a potential to use 128GB of RAM, most in that category will be a dual processor server motherboard. Having dual processors means either Intel Xeon or AMD Opteron. Of course, dual CPU Xeons are expensive- you would need at least $2,000 for CPU's, so if you're on a budget, a pair of Opterons would be the thing.

For Intel, single CPU, there is an MSI with an LGA 2011 socket that can use 128GB >

MSI Big Bang-XPower II LGA 2011 Intel X79 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 XL ATX $370. (Newegg) > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130626

> and this is a fast X79 with lots of PCIe slots and 6GB/s SATA- which is not common on server motherboards.

Then you need a good LGA 2011 CPU >

Intel Core i7-3930K Sandy Bridge-E 3.2GHz (3.8GHz Turbo) LGA 2011 130W Six-Core Desktop Processor $570.

> I would suggest a 6-core, especially if your work involves rendering or animation, but an Intel Core i7-3820 Sandy Bridge-E 3.6GHz (3.8GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 2011 130W Quad-Core Desktop Processor at $300 might suit.

The RAM will be expensive, but as you mention you could begin with 64GB (about $550) - and then upgrade when necessary.

I would then suggest a fast 240+ GB SSD for the operating system and applications drive, coupled with a RAID 10 of mechanical drives for a lot of storage that is both high performance and protected by mirroring.

The graphics card would depend on whether you were doing 3D modeling or animations or writing code, etc.

Another approach > and potentially cheaper and faster - definitely not in performance but in time -would be to buy a used Dell Precision T7500 as these can use up to 192GB of RAM and will have a Xeon processor >

http://www.ebay.com/itm/DELL-PRECISION-T7500-1-X-INTEL-QC-W5590-3-33GHZ-4GB-RAM-1-X-500B-SATA-/310578674245?pt=Desktop_PCs&hash=item484fee7a45

> which has a single 3.33GHz 4-core Xeon CPU for $750. As is, this computer can support 96GB 1333 ECC RAM- which may be enough(?) With an add-on riser, you can add a 2nd CPU and this also expands the RAM capability to 192GB- defititelyy enough. The Xeon W5590 is a good one > Passmark benchmark is 6619 and rated 113 out of about 1,700 CPU's. A used W5590 on Ebay >

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intel-Xeon-W5590-Quad-Core-3-33GHz-8M-6-40GT-s-CPU-SLBGE-CLEAN-PULL-/200906483453?pt=CPUs&hash=item2ec6f5a6fd

> which is Buy it Now for $280.

The T7500 CPU / memory / heatsink riser>

http://www.ebay.com/itm/DELL-PRECISION-T7500-HEATSINK-FAN-RISER-CARD-CPU-PROCESSOR-UPGRADE-KIT-/330675624988?pt=US_CPU_Fans_Heatsinks&hash=item4cfdcd9c1c

> which is Buy It now for $250.

Then there's the memory and each 64GB will cost about $500.

The subject of a graphics card is open as the applications are not specific, but for this computer a gneric suggestion would be a good used Quadro 4000 (2GB) at about $400 or if you're going to be doing animations or video editing, possibly a Quadro FX 5800 which has 4GB. It's possible you could use a consumer card and for that I'd recommend a GTX 670 or if you're more graphics oreitned tasks, a GTX 580 (3GB). My sense is that a workstation card would be more suitable though.

So, this is in the $2400-3,000 category when completed and/or with a high end graphics card- still not being given away, but this approach means you could start with a system spending about $1,500 - 1 CPU, 64GB RAM, improved but not high end graphics card, and new drives, that is already built and configured and more or less ready to go and then add resources as required.

These are a bit generic suggestions, it would would be necessary to know the exact uses and have a budget to recommend anything very specific.


Cheers,

BambiBoom
 
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Thank you - will definitely consult the MB docs before memory purchase. Seems the RDIMM is not overly more expensive - so that is good news.
 
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BambiBoom - thanks so much that Dell T7500 seems like a hard one to pass up - they seem to be readily available - not to mention all the other options with that - that you have pointed out.

As far as the usage - it is business usage only - no graphics and no scientific calculations - just a bunch of java servers and database supporting all kinds of business flows implemented as web services with authentication etc - mostly it is large and complex with many processes - however since it is a playground env - there really will be no load at all on the system - most of these processes will be idle.

That DELL would do fine.

I'm at the point now - of either the Dell you mentioned or building a dual processor Opteron/XEON of course starting with a single CPU and perhaps 16 or 32GB RDIMM - start my work see if it breaks - then try to workaround or else get more RAM.

One thing you mentioned was the 2K pricetag for the dual XEONs - I do see many options for XEONs below that (ex 619 for MB and 1 XEON bundle with socket open for a second) - of course on the low end of the XEON processor - I would assume that this could work as well (of course not be as powerfull)?

Thanks,
 
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rebellowVW,

Yes, it's more clear now, that what you need is really more of a server than high performance 3D modeller or video editor and that's actually makes the Precision for your use even more appropriate as these are very closely server based.

I use a Precision T5400 which is very similar to a Dell Poweredge 2950- it has sockets for 2 Xeons and even has the 2-PCI-X slots which were almost entirely used in servers for RAID controller cards, plus Precisions always can address a lot of RAM- like the T7500 that can use up to 192GB. I recently bought a used LSI SAS/SATA RAID controller for the PCI-X that came out of a server an experiment which I hope will improve the T5400 disk speed. Also, my T5400 arrived with 4GB memory and the other 12GB I've added all came from a Poweredge 2950. "'Poweredge" RAM can be almost 50% cheaper than "Precision" RAM. The difference with Precisions from servers is that they typically use faster Xeons than a server needs, and higher performance Quadro graphics cards.

Of course, you could certainly build a good system that would also have all new components and I would still recommend a Xeon, but it could be a 2.4GHz instead of a 3.3. I would also still use ECC RAM and the graphics card can be quite ordinary- perhaps a GTX 650. The key would be to have a very good drive controller for high transfer, read, and write rates, perhaps a used LSI PCIe 9260-8i, and good drives made for the long slog which I think could be enterprise grade 6GB/s 7200 RPM SATA mechanical.

Still, even using a MB/ Xeon bundle at "619" -($ or £ ?) will mean a quite a bit more total expenditure than starting with a $750 T7500 and there is the time required to choose components, order, assemble, configure, test, and troubleshoot a new system.

When the use is very specialised, I don't try and dissaude someone from building, as the system would have all new pieces that are tailored to use, and building is a very good way to deeply understand the system to address problems, but the point is that Precisions are already very much like servers and built for long, continuous use. They're not by any stretch sizzling performers, but the reliability means that less time is spent with crashes and quirks and they always seem very expandable. The T5400 I have now is the most reliable computer I've ever had over 20 years and I've spent a total of about $1,000 for a machine with 2- quad core 3.2 Xeons that cost new $1,300 each, 16GB ECC RAM, a Quadro FX 4800 that cost $1,200 new and 1TB of very reliable storage and plenty of room fro expansion such as the PCI-X slots and up to 32GB RAM. As you've seen, there are lot of these going for quite reasonable sums- the T7500 for $750 was likely about $3,500-4,000 or so when new three years ago.

Cheers,

BambiBoom

 
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