i3-4170 80C within a few seconds of Prime95 :/

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CompuTronix
GUYS,

Hold it right here!

THIS THREAD CONTAINS MISINFORMATION!

Let's get this straightened out.

(1) Intel desktop processors have thermal sensors for each Core, plus a sensor for the entire processor, so a Quad Core has five sensors. Heat originates within the Cores where Digital sensors measure Core temperatures. A single Analog sensor embedded in the substrate under the Cores measures overall CPU temperature.

Core temperature is 5C higher than CPU temperature due to this difference in sensor location. Intel's Thermal Specification is "Tcase", which is CPU temperature, NOT Core Temperature. Tcase for the i3 4170 is 72C.

Tcase + 5 makes the corresponding Core...
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Make sure you aren't mixing up temps. There's several types:
Tcase
Tjmax
etc.

Tcase always runs cooler as that's the circuit board component not the actual CPU chip itself which is probably closer to 105degC Tjmax.

Also, Intel will THROTTLE down the CPU if it overheats so i wouldn't worry about it.
 
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Your CPU should have throttled itself quite heavily if 72 is the supposed TJ Max. Anywho, Prime95 with stock coolers is a terrible idea. Same with overclocking on a stock cooler. I highly recommend an aftermarket cooler. Coolermaster makes pretty solid air CPU Coolers that won't break the bank.
 
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ive no plans to oc.. i just wanted to stress test. Guess im just used to low temps. This is replacing my old oced e8400. Which ran in the 60s under prime95 with just a tower cooler... with no fan on it heh :)
 
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CPU temperatures, average and max, often change with each new family of CPUs.
 
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Again, as I said the 72degC is the Tcase which is the circuit board component of the CPU.

The actual chip can run hotter and I know other Haswell CPU's have a max of 105degC on chip before throttling occurs.

As for warning you to NOT use Prime95 I suggest you ignore that. Intel has had the ability to throttle to avoid damage or even CRASH the system if for some reason it overheated even further (i.e. the CPU cooler fan failed).

On another happy note:
a) Many DX9, DX10 and DX11 games are performing nearly identically on the i3-4170 as on an i5/i7, and
b) DX12 based games are even more CPU efficient.

So it will be interesting to see how much difference we see between CPU's in the future for gaming.
 
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Update:
The only real benefit to a new CPU cooler is in terms of NOISE reduction.

1) CM Hyper 212 EVO:
Roughly $30. Quieter than stock but not as quiet as Noctua NH-U12S.

I had a spare Noctua 12cm fan which I swapped for this when building my sister a quiet PC. It's not loud by any stretch but it is noticeable depending on where it sits. The Noctua fan made a noticeable difference unfortunately they aren't cheap so it would end up costing about the same as the Noctua NH-U12S anyway.

2) Noctua NH-U12S:
Roughly $60. *SILENT (300RPM at 20% max RPM) if setup properly for idle/light usage. Under LOAD it's barely audible.

OTHER:
*Make sure your FAN SOFTWARE for the motherboard is setup for the ideal noise/cooling ratio. I'm only GUESSING for the stock cooler but it might be:

50% until 50degC-> RAMP up to 100% at 90degC
 
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GUYS,

Hold it right here!

THIS THREAD CONTAINS MISINFORMATION!

Let's get this straightened out.

(1) Intel desktop processors have thermal sensors for each Core, plus a sensor for the entire processor, so a Quad Core has five sensors. Heat originates within the Cores where Digital sensors measure Core temperatures. A single Analog sensor embedded in the substrate under the Cores measures overall CPU temperature.

Core temperature is 5C higher than CPU temperature due to this difference in sensor location. Intel's Thermal Specification is "Tcase", which is CPU temperature, NOT Core Temperature. Tcase for the i3 4170 is 72C.

Tcase + 5 makes the corresponding Core temperature 77C. <-- This is the spec.

The relationship between Core temperature and CPU temperature is not in the Thermal Specifications; it's only found in a few engineering documents.

Most owners don't know that Tcase is CPU temperature, NOT Core temperature, and that there's a 5C difference which Intel doesn't seem to want anyone to know about, apparently because it provides them with an extra 5C thermal cushion for warranty purposes.

Most users don't realize that when Core temperature reaches "Throttle temperature" at 100C (TjMax), CPU temperature is right behind it at 95C (Tcase)! Also, most don't know that Core temperature is the standard for thermal measurement because it's consistently more accurate than CPU temperature.

(2) "TjMax" for Core i 3rd Generation Ivy Bridge and 5th Generation Broadwell processors is 105C.
"TjMax" for most Core 2 1st and 2nd Generation processors, as well as Core i 1st, 2nd, and 4th Generation Haswell processors is 100C.

(3) Do NOT run any versions of Prime95 later than 26.6. Here's why:

Core i 2nd, 3rd and 4th Generation CPU's have AVX (Advanced Vector Extension) instruction sets. Recent versions of Prime95, such as 28.5, run AVX code on the Floating Point Unit (FPU) math coprocessor, which produces extremely high temperatures. The FPU test in the stability testing utility AIDA64 shows similar results.

Prime95 v26.6 produces temperatures on 3rd and 4th Generation processors more consistent with 2nd Generation, which also have AVX instructions, but do not suffer from thermal extremes due to having a soldered Integrated Heat Spreader and a 35% larger Die.

Your Core temperatures will test 10 to 20C lower with v26.6 than with v28.5.

Guys,

If you're not up to speed on this topic, then please read this Tom’s Sticky: Intel Temperature Guide - http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-1800828/intel-temperature-guide.html

Thanks,

CT :sol:
 
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Solution
Standard Ambient temperature is 22C, which is normal room temperature, and is a reference value for Intel’s Thermal Specifications. Knowing your Ambient temperature is important because Ambient directly affects all computer temperatures.

Use a trusted analog, digital or IR thermometer to measure Ambient temperature. If you don't have a thermometer, then most homes have a thermostat/thermometer in the hallway which should give you a rough idea of the ambient temperature near your computer.

Here's the temperature conversions and a short scale:

Cx9/5+32=F ... or ... F-32/9x5=C ... or more simply ... an increase of 1C = an increase of 1.8F

30.0C = 86.0F Hot
29.0C = 84.2F
28.0C = 82.4F
27.0C = 80.6F
26.0C = 78.8F Warm
25.0C = 77.0F
24.0C = 75.2F
23.0C = 73.4F
22.0C = 71.6F Standard ... or ... 22.2C = 72.0F
21.0C = 69.8F
20.0C = 68.0F
19.0C = 66.2F
18.0C = 64.4F Cool

With conventional air or liquid cooling, no temperatures can be less than or equal to Ambient.

As Ambient temperature increases, thermal headroom and overclocking potential decreases.
 
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Thanks for your in depth answers to my question. I always hope i get someone like you when i ask a question on the net! 😀

No trusted analog, digital or IR thermometer to measure with here. No thermostat/thermometer in the hallway either! heh.. I'm just going to guess its between 20 and 25 in here. Not cold or hot. Anyways .. im not worried about my new CPU anymore. Still gonna buy a cooler down the road. To loud when at full load. 😀
 
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Hey CompuTronix:


All I got wrong was the Tjmax value and that's because Intel doesn't seem to have the spec where I can find it anymore.

Now here's what I find CONFUSING:

If Tcase max is supposed to be 72degC, and it is actually 95degC at the point throttling occurs (100degC) then why isn't the CPU throttling when Tcase is 72degC instead?

*If I understand this correctly, are you saying:

1) Tcase should not exceed the spec (72degC in this case)
2) The CPU only throttles based on the Tjmax (core) value for desktop CPU's (mobile uses Tcase).

By this logic (and it seems correct based on Intel's site) this suggests that by the time the CPU starts to throttle it's well above the recommended Tcase value. So frankly, I can't understand why they aren't throttling the CPU based on Tcase.
 
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Go back and read my first post. Tcase is CPU temperature, NOT Core temperature.

Core temperature is 5C higher than CPU temperature. Tcase is 72C for the i3 4170, so Tcase +5 is the corresponding Core temperature, which is 77C. Got it?

The "j" in TjMax is "Junction". The complete term is T(Temperature)J(Junction)Max(Maximum).

Tjunction is CORE temperature.

Real Temp, Core Temp and many others read Core temperatures. Core temperature is the standard for measuring processor temperatures because it's consistently more accurate than CPU temperature, due to the differences in the design, location and calibration of the sensors.

Please read the Intel Temperature Guide to get a good understanding of the differences between CPU temperature and Core temperature.

For Core temperature, mid 70's are safe. As a rule of thumb, just keep it under 80C.

And, yes ... 100C is damned HOT! Nevertheless, Intel has designed their processors to take a lickin' and keep on tickin' under the most severe and adverse conditions, such as a laptop being used for field work under mission critical situations in very hot environments. You have to use your imagination a little here.

Yes, it'll "Throttle", but it WILL keep running.
 
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