Question i9 10900k Idling at 50c, gaming at 75~90

GhosTsReapeR

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Greetings,

I'm having troubles getting my CPU's temp below 30c, even after a clean start up, it always idles at 40+, averages at 50c after some usage.

Gaming temps are always 70~90, no less, rarely higher up to 95-98

I'm using I9-10900k with Corsair's H170i Elite Capellix 420mm AIO cooler attached to the top of my case.

Case is Thermaltake View 71, with 3x 120mm front intakes, 3x 120mm side intakes, 2x 120mm bot intakes, 1x 120mm rear exhaust, and 3x 140mm top AIO exhaust.

I dont think airflow is an issue with this case and many fans, CPU Core temps is always between 48-50c, and CPU Socket temps sits around ~37c.

What could be the issue?


P.S, Before i have it as it is right now. i had 3 x120mm on top as exhaust.
i had MSI 360R AiO as side exhaust, but my CPU was idling at 60c+ and gaming at 90~98c always.

So i moved top exhaust to side intakes, and replaced MSI 360R AIO with Corsair H170i 420mm AIO as top exhaust

As a result, Idle temp reduced to 45~50c, and gaming down to 70-90 temp
 
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Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
WHICH View 71 case do you have, exactly? Because there are various versions including front panel TG and front panel mesh. The TG front panel has some restrictions.

Take the side panel off and run it. See if you have the same thermal performance.
 

Karadjgne

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You don't have airflow. You have air-Fill. The exhausts can only move so much air, the rear actually moving more than the Aio. The intakes are barely putting air into the case as the back pressure from all the intakes combined, with unequal exhaust means the intakes are just shoving as much air as they can, regardless of rpm.

But that doesn't mean it's going anywhere except in circles, nor picking up case heat on the way through, just recycling it. More fans doesn't mean better air Flow, just makes more noise.

Disconnect the rear and side intakes. The fronts don't do all that much, the bottoms will do more. Not having the rear means the case acts as a chimney, so interior heat actually has a direction, up and out. The rear fan will pull more as it's unrestricted, which starves the aio of air.

You want the air to Move, not just flood the case.
 

Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
Disconnect the rear and side intakes.

It doesn't have rear intakes. It has side, bottom and front intakes with top and rear exhausts. That alone should be "ok" but the concern I have is that those cases with TG panels generally have very poor intake airflow. Would be nice to know exactly which version of this case they have.

IF they have the version with the mesh front it would make a lot more sense to move that radiator to the front, because it supports 420mm radiators in front, and make the top locations all exhaust with no restriction to have to push through. Removing the side panel should tell us if airflow is even the problem though as there'll be direct ambient to the radiator then.
 

Phaaze88

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GhosTsReapeR

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WHICH View 71 case do you have, exactly? Because there are various versions including front panel TG and front panel mesh. The TG front panel has some restrictions.

Take the side panel off and run it. See if you have the same thermal performance.
There is mesh on the front, top and bottom. Its the TT View 71 TG i got.
 

GhosTsReapeR

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You don't have airflow. You have air-Fill. The exhausts can only move so much air, the rear actually moving more than the Aio. The intakes are barely putting air into the case as the back pressure from all the intakes combined, with unequal exhaust means the intakes are just shoving as much air as they can, regardless of rpm.

But that doesn't mean it's going anywhere except in circles, nor picking up case heat on the way through, just recycling it. More fans doesn't mean better air Flow, just makes more noise.

Disconnect the rear and side intakes. The fronts don't do all that much, the bottoms will do more. Not having the rear means the case acts as a chimney, so interior heat actually has a direction, up and out. The rear fan will pull more as it's unrestricted, which starves the aio of air.

You want the air to Move, not just flood the case.
Yes i am getting as much air in as possible, but exhaust shouldnt have a problem since the case is open on all sides, the TG allows air in and out from all 6 sides.

I dont have rear intakes, its an exhaust, do you still recommend to take it off?
 

GhosTsReapeR

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Jan 27, 2016
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You don't have airflow. You have air-Fill. The exhausts can only move so much air, the rear actually moving more than the Aio. The intakes are barely putting air into the case as the back pressure from all the intakes combined, with unequal exhaust means the intakes are just shoving as much air as they can, regardless of rpm.

But that doesn't mean it's going anywhere except in circles, nor picking up case heat on the way through, just recycling it. More fans doesn't mean better air Flow, just makes more noise.

Disconnect the rear and side intakes. The fronts don't do all that much, the bottoms will do more. Not having the rear means the case acts as a chimney, so interior heat actually has a direction, up and out. The rear fan will pull more as it's unrestricted, which starves the aio of air.

You want the air to Move, not just flood the case.
P.S, Before i have it as it is right now. i had 3 x120mm on top as exhaust.
i had MSI 360R AiO as side exhaust, but my CPU was idling at 60c+ and gaming at 90~98c always.

So i moved top exhaust to side intakes, and replaced MSI 360R AIO with Corsair H170i 420mm AIO as top exhaust
 

Karadjgne

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I think you mistake what airflow actually is. It's all about pressure, not volume. Flooding a case with air doesn't make airflow, it just floods the case with air.

Pressure is what makes air actually move. When a fan blade moves, the pitch of the blade as it's moving creates a low pressure area behind it, multiply that by the number of blades and rpm of the blades and you get a low pressure area in front of the fan. The byproduct of that is air forced out the rear of the fan. So your rear fan and aio fans create that low pressure area in that top-rear corner. The bottom and front fans are exhausting air into the case.

Nature abhors a vacuum, so the higher pressure area by the intakes will naturally move to the low pressure top rear, taking case heat with it. But. You have side intakes blowing that moving air right back on itself. You also have a rear fan that's got zero restriction vs the aio fans with considerable restriction, so the rear fan is a stronger source of low pressure, eats up most of what gets close to the aio.

You have fans fighting each other. More does not always equal better.
 

GhosTsReapeR

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Jan 27, 2016
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I think you mistake what airflow actually is. It's all about pressure, not volume. Flooding a case with air doesn't make airflow, it just floods the case with air.

Pressure is what makes air actually move. When a fan blade moves, the pitch of the blade as it's moving creates a low pressure area behind it, multiply that by the number of blades and rpm of the blades and you get a low pressure area in front of the fan. The byproduct of that is air forced out the rear of the fan. So your rear fan and aio fans create that low pressure area in that top-rear corner. The bottom and front fans are exhausting air into the case.

Nature abhors a vacuum, so the higher pressure area by the intakes will naturally move to the low pressure top rear, taking case heat with it. But. You have side intakes blowing that moving air right back on itself. You also have a rear fan that's got zero restriction vs the aio fans with considerable restriction, so the rear fan is a stronger source of low pressure, eats up most of what gets close to the aio.

You have fans fighting each other. More does not always equal better.
What do you suggest?
 

Karadjgne

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Run a baseline bench test, something that'll stress both cpu and gpu simultaneously, run that for 30 minutes with the exact setup you have. Notate the temps. Check your fan profile for all the fans, see what % they are running during the test.

Disconnect the side and rear fans, or just shut them down with software. Run the exact same test again for 30 minutes, notate the temps on cpu/gpu and compare with the baseline. Increase fan speeds if that's an option.

Reactivate the side/rear and shut down the front. Repeat the test. Play with the fan curves.

What you are looking for is actual airflow, air in and air out in a smooth stream that takes away the ambient case heat, which increases the efficiency of the heatsinks, which drops temps.

Balance that with actual use. The gpu tends to be the biggest heat producer by far in most gaming pc's and boosts are very limited by high temps, so a gpu at 80 and cpu at 50 is less preferable to a gpu at 75 and cpu at 60.

There's no instant fix, there's no one-size-fits all answer, your pc is different to anyone else's, it'll behave differently, has its own quirks and strengths etc. So you'll need to figure out exactly what works best for you. That might be changing fans for ones with higher pressure or higher airflow, might need fronts maxed with rear slow and higher speeds on the aio, might be better not using the fronts at all (NZXT H510 series is a perfect example, better temps with No front fans)....
 
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GhosTsReapeR

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Ok, so there is mesh in front, but there is also tempered glass OVER the mesh, right? The mesh part isn't directly open to the outside air?
yes there is TG over the mesh, with about 2cm gap.

Update on the situation, i did test a day of gaming without side panel, gaming temp dropped to 40~60, idle temp is 35~40
 

Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
So, I'm a bit confused on your cooling configuration since you said that you have side intakes, but based on the product specifications for that case, and what I can see of it, there are only fan locations for front, bottom, top and rear. There are no indications of side mounted fans being possible. Are you referring to the front as the side or do you have some other configuration I'm not understanding?

Truthfully I think the best configuration for this case would be moving the radiator to the front and configuring it's fans as intake, and populate the rear and top locations as exhaust.

Another option, that you probably won't like, is to replace that case with one that is actually designed better for airflow. TG front panels look nice, but almost all of the cases that have TG in front have poor airflow and end up having thermal problems just like you have.
 

GhosTsReapeR

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Jan 27, 2016
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So, I'm a bit confused on your cooling configuration since you said that you have side intakes, but based on the product specifications for that case, and what I can see of it, there are only fan locations for front, bottom, top and rear. There are no indications of side mounted fans being possible. Are you referring to the front as the side or do you have some other configuration I'm not understanding?

Truthfully I think the best configuration for this case would be moving the radiator to the front and configuring it's fans as intake, and populate the rear and top locations as exhaust.

Another option, that you probably won't like, is to replace that case with one that is actually designed better for airflow. TG front panels look nice, but almost all of the cases that have TG in front have poor airflow and end up having thermal problems just like you have.
Here's a photo of all the fans in the case currently : https://ibb.co/kgYcnJp
Maybe this should clear any confusion.

Switching the case isnt a viable option for me now, i'd prefer to optimize the current setup to provide best cooling to the cpu/gpu
 

GhosTsReapeR

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Jan 27, 2016
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Run a baseline bench test, something that'll stress both cpu and gpu simultaneously, run that for 30 minutes with the exact setup you have. Notate the temps. Check your fan profile for all the fans, see what % they are running during the test.

Disconnect the side and rear fans, or just shut them down with software. Run the exact same test again for 30 minutes, notate the temps on cpu/gpu and compare with the baseline. Increase fan speeds if that's an option.

Reactivate the side/rear and shut down the front. Repeat the test. Play with the fan curves.

What you are looking for is actual airflow, air in and air out in a smooth stream that takes away the ambient case heat, which increases the efficiency of the heatsinks, which drops temps.

Balance that with actual use. The gpu tends to be the biggest heat producer by far in most gaming pc's and boosts are very limited by high temps, so a gpu at 80 and cpu at 50 is less preferable to a gpu at 75 and cpu at 60.

There's no instant fix, there's no one-size-fits all answer, your pc is different to anyone else's, it'll behave differently, has its own quirks and strengths etc. So you'll need to figure out exactly what works best for you. That might be changing fans for ones with higher pressure or higher airflow, might need fronts maxed with rear slow and higher speeds on the aio, might be better not using the fronts at all (NZXT H510 series is a perfect example, better temps with No front fans)....
I see, i'll try to test as you said then in hopes of finding a better setup
 

Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
Where are those fans installed against the "side", which is actually just the extended part of the motherboard tray, supposed to be drawing air from? Because honestly, looking at that case, I can't see where they'd draw air from anywhere other than already inside the case. Especially since they don't list that as a valid fan location in the specifications for that case.

Front:
3 x 120mm , 2 x 140mm
Top:
3 x 120mm , 3 x 140mm
Rear:
1 x 120mm, 1 x 140mm
Bottom:
2 x 120mm

Assuming of course that THIS is your case: https://www.thermaltake.com/view-71-tempered-glass-edition.html

I realize that in ONE image they show fans mounted there, but those are not listed locations in the specs for fans AND more importantly, there is nowhere for fans mounted there to draw ambient air from other than already heated air in the case from what I can see. I'd ditch those fans, move the radiator to the front so that it is using the MOST cool air available, which is always outside air, and configure whatever fans you put in place of the radiator up top as exhaust fans so that you end up with three 140mm intakes in front on the radiator, three exhaust fans in the top and one exhaust fan in the rear. If that doesn't resolve your thermal issues then you simply aren't likely to do so with that case, whether the fact is agreeable or not.
 

GhosTsReapeR

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Where are those fans installed against the "side", which is actually just the extended part of the motherboard tray, supposed to be drawing air from? Because honestly, looking at that case, I can't see where they'd draw air from anywhere other than already inside the case. Especially since they don't list that as a valid fan location in the specifications for that case.

Front:
3 x 120mm , 2 x 140mm
Top:
3 x 120mm , 3 x 140mm
Rear:
1 x 120mm, 1 x 140mm
Bottom:
2 x 120mm

Assuming of course that THIS is your case: https://www.thermaltake.com/view-71-tempered-glass-edition.html

I realize that in ONE image they show fans mounted there, but those are not listed locations in the specs for fans AND more importantly, there is nowhere for fans mounted there to draw ambient air from other than already heated air in the case from what I can see. I'd ditch those fans, move the radiator to the front so that it is using the MOST cool air available, which is always outside air, and configure whatever fans you put in place of the radiator up top as exhaust fans so that you end up with three 140mm intakes in front on the radiator, three exhaust fans in the top and one exhaust fan in the rear. If that doesn't resolve your thermal issues then you simply aren't likely to do so with that case, whether the fact is agreeable or not.
Yes, its this one https://www.thermaltake.com/view-71-tempered-glass-rgb-plus-edition.html

the right side panel, isnt sealed to the case, there is arround 1 cm gap on all 4 sides, thats where it draws air from.
 

Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
They can't draw much air from there, because even though that panel on the backside IS open, it is still a pretty serious restriction. And more importantly, as Karadjgne mentioned already earlier, in some cases, too much airflow is sometimes not a beneficial condition.

It can interfere with an otherwise good air path, creating turbulence where none should exist. I think that's probably the case here especially since whatever air IS being drawn from the gap on the backside of that case is most likely largely warmed already.

Personally, I really think these specific types of case designs are problematic and undesirable. Thermal tests prove it out. So really you just need to optimize since removal of the side panel brings you down to where you should be, you basically just need to configure things to have the same outcome WITH the side panel on.
 

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