Question i9-9900K now or wait?

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Quick question: Is the EVGA 2080 Ti FTW3 Ultra worth £50 more than the XC Ultra?

As far as I can see there is virtually no difference in real world performance (~1-2%) and the FTW3 is louder, but runs cooler.

Reviews:

XC Ultra: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/evga-geforce-rtx-2080-ti-xc-ultra/
FTW3 Ultra: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/evga-geforce-rtx-2080-ti-ftw3-ultra/
If you think 1-3% extra performance in worth £50, go for it?

Also, didn't you already place the order? XD

Cheers!
 

R_G_S

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If you think 1-3% extra performance in worth £50, go for it?

Also, didn't you already place the order? XD
No, I don't think 1-3% is worth it (often even less!). Especially when the noise levels are 38 dBA as opposed to 35 dBA with the XC. But the FTW3 is normally a lot more expensive than the XC model, hence why I'm asking - is there something I'm missing here?

I have placed the order, but they have not yet started the build, hence I can still make changes if I want to.
 
No, I don't think 1-3% is worth it (often even less!). Especially when the noise levels are 38 dBA as opposed to 35 dBA with the XC. But the FTW3 is normally a lot more expensive than the XC model, hence why I'm asking - is there something I'm missing here?

I have placed the order, but they have not yet started the build, hence I can still make changes if I want to.
Well, there could be a difference in components, but EVGA rarely puts cheap components on cards, from what I understand. I would imagine the difference is only at the silicon lottery level. Or I'd hope it is the case.

Cheers!
 

R_G_S

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RRP seems to be £1,220 for the XC Ultra and £1,400 for the FTW3 Ultra...

The FTW3 is OC'd higher and (I think) has more power available, but performance doesn't seem much better, negligible in fact. Looking at the price difference, I think I must be missing something.

EDIT: I think the FTW3 has 2 bios options, one of which is for (extra) overclocking, if this doesn't void the warranty it seems as though it can considerably improve performance, particularly at 4K.
 
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I would imagine the FTW line is the "top of the crop" for overclocking and, probably, breaking records?

Kind of like the difference between the ROG Crosshairs and Formula motherboards from Asus and the "normal" lineups.

Cheers!
 

Darkbreeze

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I'd stick to the XC models. As far as I know, and I don't know it all that's for sure, but from what I DO know, the XC models are the only EVGA models that have binned GPUs on the 2070, 2080 and 2080 TI.
 
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R_G_S

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I believe the FTW range is EVGA's flagship line and thus would imagine the card is likely binned. From the research I've done it seems that non-OC performance is close to identical to the XC Ultra, despite the FTW3 having a boost clock of 1755 MHz (vs the XC's 1650 MHz). The XC Ultra runs a bit quieter than the FTW3, but the FTW3 is cooler. EVGA has bumped the stock power limit up to 300 W for the FTW3 and the card has 2 BIOS options, normal and OC.

Video reviews here:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEo99mdKh7w&t=612s


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tctr4HcI9I


Seems like the card has to be OC'd to see any (real-world) performance gains, but they can be substantial as evidenced above, for e.g. JayzTwoCents' card shows a 12% average FPS increase over a stock XC Ultra (8-18% min/max). Whilst not a fan of overclocking, it seems I have the motherboard and PSU to handle it (should I wish) and it appears to be covered under EVGA's warranty. The FTW3 is longer than the XC Ultra though, meaning it would sit very close to a large intake fan (blowing air right across it is good, but I wonder if, so close, it might affect the operation of the end card fan).

Humm...
 
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My 2080 Ti XC Gaming version runs at 2012Mhz out of the box for a reference point to this thread. However, this is with liquid cooling and low temps. For ones you are looking at, the performance difference is going to be minimal for out of the box experience. The FTW3s are really made for OCing from power limit increases, VRM design changes on custom PCB, ect.
 
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On that note, my XC GAMING "non ultra" is a 400A as well. I'm still doubtful that even the top model really OC's much better than other 400A variants. Curious as to what real world FPS gain is. Guessing a good portion is higher maintained boost clocks from lower avg. temps.
 

R_G_S

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Am leaning towards sticking with the XC Ultra as non-OC'd performance is identical for all intents and purposes, but the XC Ultra is shorter and (if the TechPowerUp review is correct) considerably quieter under load, especially if using the FTW3's OC BIOS (35 dBA XC Ultra vs 38/40 dBA FTW3). Noise is subjective though, some say the FTW3 is quiet (even though registering 42 dBA in the same review), others that it's loud.

The FTW3 finishes about 1 cm from one of my 2 main 180 mm intake fans; whilst comfortably within the case spec (314 mm case max, 302 mm card length), not sure that's ideal. The XC Ultra's length is 269 mm, about in line with my MB.

OTOH, I do like having the top model (air at least) and I guess that OC headroom is there if needed.

One thing WCCFTech were saying about the Super cards is that they would have unrestricted power which would result in a large performance increase; the FTW3 has the power, but there is no real performance increase out of the box (overclocking's another matter).
 

R_G_S

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You are already purchasing the best of the best. Even though the performance may be negligible, i'd spend the extra money if you've already gone this far. It really makes no difference in the grand scheme of your budget.
If it was hands down 'the best,' I'd agree. My concerns are that it may be louder than the XC Ultra however and therefore worse, if not overclocking. It's also quite a beast, size-wise and draws more power. It is cooler, but the XC Ultra is no slouch in that department.

Were it cooler and quieter I'd have it in a heartbeat. I might be basing too much on a single review as regards noise levels, but difficult as not all reviews are specific and opinions tend to vary.

Size comparison (bear in mind, no real-world extra performance at stock):



 
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If it was hands down 'the best,' I'd agree. My concerns are that it may be louder than the XC Ultra however and therefore worse, if not overclocking. It's also quite a beast, size-wise and draws more power. It is cooler, but the XC Ultra is no slouch in that department.

Were it cooler and quieter I'd have it in a heartbeat. I might be basing too much on a single review as regards noise levels, but difficult as not all reviews are specific and opinions tend to vary.

Size comparison (bear in mind, no real-world extra performance at stock):



Damn that card is big... The PCB is humongous! Just go with the smaller one, as it seems to be "reference" sized. If you ever wanna go CLC with it, you have better chances of finding something that fits? XD

Which 2080 ti model is the best and most expensive, is there something like Lightning model? I just want to know should i buy new gpu or house for myself
Please, create your own thread for those questions :)

Cheers!
 

R_G_S

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Yes, it's an absolute beast! Aside from the tight fit (which I'm not all that keen on), I kind of like the size, particularly as it'd be sitting in a beast of a case on a beast of a motherboard ;).

That it's so much larger than the XC Ultra whilst sharing the same stock performance does seem a little silly though! I like that it runs cool, just wish I could get a definitive answer as to noise levels.
 
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R_G_S

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Darkbreeze, theoretically, would you still go for the XC Ultra over the FTW3 if both cards were the same price?

It seems that the fans can be controlled via software and all run independently depending on board temp. With the FTW3 running so cool (low 60s under load), I would imagine there's room to match or even exceed the XC Ultra's noise levels.

The main draw of the card is clearly overclocking potential - I'm not sure if I'd take advantage of this or not, but that it's covered by warranty (10 years...) I'm more tempted to than I would otherwise be (which, to be frank, I wouldn't).

I must admit I somewhat like the idea of the flagship card (flagship on air at least), but I don't know if the XC Ultra just makes more sense, being smaller, quieter (maybe) and with lower power draw. That said JayzTwoCents' overclocks show a good 12% average performance gain which might be nice to have a couple of years down the line and would probably outdo any Super variant.

For ease of reference, here are the two TechPowerUp reviews again; power draw and noise levels are of particular interest:

XC Ultra: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/evga-geforce-rtx-2080-ti-xc-ultra/
FTW3 Ultra: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/evga-geforce-rtx-2080-ti-ftw3-ultra/

Power draw highlights:

XC Ultra
Idle: 11 W
Average (gaming): 283 W
Peak (gaming): 303 W

FTW3
Idle: 15 W
Average (gaming): 304 W
Peak (gaming): 342 W

I really have no idea whether that significant increase in power consumption is something to be concerned about or not...
 
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R_G_S

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I can get a very good deal (well, relatively speaking, in the RTX scheme of things... ;)) on the FTW3 which is why I say to ignore the price; it's irrelevant at this point, I am just interested in which is best.

When you say 'heat' presumably you mean that generated by the card and expelled into the case, as the card itself runs very cool indeed.

What are your thoughts on the power consumption?

EDIT: Sorry to bug you, but no one else I know has the remotest interest in such things, let alone the knowledge to be of any help!
 
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Well, then this now becomes a "will it fit inside your case?" type of thing.

My argument was in case you want to tweak it further and possibly get a CLC on it, but if you're just going to put the GPU in and just use it, toss a coin? XD

Cheers!
 

Darkbreeze

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You won't be sorry with either card, and since you've already shown a propensity for wanting to have the flagship component even if it offers little benefit, if you can get them both for the same price, and it will fit in your case, and you feel the other items I mentioned are not of import, then go with that card. I think either card will do more than you really need it to in any case.

On a positive note, by the time you decide what you want to do in regards to the card, the Super models might be available. :)

Just playing with you.
 

R_G_S

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On a positive note, by the time you decide what you want to do in regards to the card, the Super models might be available. :)
Yeah, I know - the thought had crossed my mind too! At least the delay isn't my fault this time, my system builder has a backlog and thus my machine (though paid for) will not be put together until 5 July, with delivery on the 9th!

Though pretty settled on the components, I can make changes any time up until the 5th. I have been keeping an eye on prices however as should anything drop during that time I can get the cheaper price - that's how I came across the FTW3, as opposed to actively seeking it out!

I have now paid for both cards (the FTW3 was very low on stock and am sure would run out by/over the weekend) so will do more research and then commit to one on Mon/Tues. Following that, we'll prob have the Super announcement which might shake things up again!

Originally I wasn't even considering the FTW3 due to the price, but they have it at £250 off, so £1,150 vs the £1,100 I paid for the XC Ultra. RRP for the FTW3 is £1,400 and the XC Ultra, £1,220 in the UK, or seems that way at least (the FTW3 has even been sold for an eye-watering £1,500!).

Now, I do have a bit a of a 'problem' when it comes to going with the top-end models (as noted!) but as SgtScream mentioned above, £50 in the grand scheme of the build isn't much + I'll be hanging on to it for a long time, so 'the best' is preferable. My dilemma now is, "Is the FTW3 actually the best, or to be more specific, 'better' card?"

Here are my pros and cons:

XC Ultra:
  • Fits the case better (same length as the motherboard; neater look and more space between the intake fan)
  • Runs quieter (apparently, need confirmation as regards fan profiles etc.)
  • Lower power consumption
  • Virtually identical to the FTW3 in stock config.
  • Is not the flagship model (so what? - my freakishness strikes again!)
  • less overclocking headroom (a feature I'm not sure I'd use, so...)
  • Higher temps than the FTW3 (though still good, and lower than the FE, low 70s under load)
FTW3:
  • Flagship model, custom design and higher power delivery (for overclocking)
  • Fans operate independently, dependent on board temperature
  • Runs super cool, low 60s under load (I believe the fans on both cards don't spin until hitting 60 degrees; in which case might the FTW3 remain silent for longer than the XC Ultra due to the much larger heat sink?)
  • Should have the best overclocking potential, with gains of ~12%
  • Large size places the end of the board ~2 cm from a main intake fan with the shroud at 1 cm (not sure if this is a good or bad thing really, but feels as though it might disrupt the airflow being so close?)
  • For all the 'flagship' fan-fare and excitement (some reviews are quite gushing, especially considering the full price!) there is virtually no performance gain at stock over the XC Ultra.
  • Uses a fair bit more power than the XC Ultra even at stock
  • Possibly louder than the XC Ultra (again, pending confirmation)
Looking at the list it seems like the XC Ultra is the clear winner, particularly as I'm not a huge fan of overclocking! The primary draw of the FTW3 is that it's 'something special' and that the price is very good (LOL, you know what I mean!). All my other components (barring the RAM, which isn't shabby) are top-of-the line; the case (like it or not!), the motherboard, the PSU, the CPU and CPU cooler - the best, no compromise (thankfully decent reductions on most of them at least!) - they are also pretty large! When I saw the FTW3 for virtually the same price as the XC Ultra (actually cheaper, currently) I thought "What the hell, might as well just max it out and go the whole hog," particularly with the "What we have here is something very special" type reviews, but as I delve deeper into the specs I'm not so sure.

Spending vast sums over stock cards never seems to yield much in the way of performance and I really can't understand people paying almost half again for a uptick of 2-3% (says I, with my build... :rolleyes:). The basic Black edition is £1,020, but I plumped for the XC Ultra for the cooler and quieter operation (fans off at idle is a big deal to me and the Black is apparently a lot louder under load), particularly as it was reduced so 'only' £80 more. I'm really on the fence with the FTW3; despite these long posts I'm actually very busy right now, which makes research difficult.

Darkbreeze - would it be considered bad form to open a thread on this specific topic over on the GPU forums? I'd like to get some answers from owners if possible and it's somewhat buried in here under the 9900K title.

Thanks again guys for putting up with all the toing and froing... If it's any consolation, it's driving me nuts too!

Also, please don't think I want the top tier parts for 'bragging rights' or some such as aside from this topic no one but me will know (or likely care!). It's just a personal preference, I like knowing that the components are of the highest grade and therefore tend to last longer + I'm a sucker for well made/manufactured items.

Cheers!

(EDIT: Presumably the 850 W PSU I've chosen should be sufficient for which ever I go with, even if overclocking?)
(EDIT 2: I note some reviews are stating the FTW3 card costs $1,350, though that is the price of the non-Ultra version. EVGA's own site lists the price of the FTW3 Ultra at $1,499 [P/N: 11G-P4-2487-KR]. Odd, or did the price go up this year?)
 
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