Question if a quality PSU provides a wattage very close to its max (in the absence of margin) does it "ruin" the PSU itself or "ruin" the powered components?

[Grealish01]

ex. 460 watt PSU with an i5 12600K and a 6500xt gpu, in this situation the PSU holds up (I know for sure), but it is still in a stressful situation because eg. is supplying 350/400 watts to the build when its max is 460. In this situation what little problems could there be? are my 2 hypotheses or does the PSU gradually degrade and shorten its life, or are the powered components ruined? you think? I hope the second hypothesis is not true, because in the end it is the PSU that is in stress, but the energy it provides is always the same, whether a 460 watt provides 400 watts or a 1000 watt provides 400 watts, again I ask confirmation. Thank you have a nice day

 

[Lutfij]

If the PSU is stressed beyond it's comfort zone, it'll shut itself off tp prevent it and/or other devices connected to it from dying. Repeated attempts might not be a good idea. A good quality PSU will not run beyond it's comfort zone for long and in retrospect, you shouldn't be doing what you're hypothesizing, unless your gear is expendable. Get a PSU that's reliably built, with more wattage than your system needs to have headroom and call it a day.

 

[Grealish01]

If the PSU is stressed beyond it's comfort zone, it'll shut itself off tp prevent it and/or other devices connected to it from dying. Repeated attempts might not be a good idea. A good quality PSU will not run beyond it's comfort zone for long and in retrospect, you shouldn't be doing what you're hypothesizing, unless your gear is expendable. Get a PSU that's reliably built, with more wattage than your system needs to have headroom and call it a day.

I was not talking about beyond its comfort zone, but close, which means that the margin will be 20/30/40 watts. I wanted to know what could happen in THAT situation, not the one you just described to me.

That is, sorry maybe I expressed myself a little badly, assuming that I have a margin such that the psu does not switch off, but still minimal, there would be repercussions or changes with respect to the powered part? what is the risk i could take? the components do not lose their life?

 

[Satan-IR]

With that kind of load (which translates into more heat); the first thing that pops into mind is that the PSU will most probably have a shorter life.

Depending on the design and build quality if it's really a good quality one and user is lucky (as one of the PSU components is not one of those that pass QC but are not 100% OK for long) it will try to provide the nominal power to the system as long as there are no big spikes. That is if it's not connected to a system with component that would have large transients. But, transients happen anyway on any system.

If you see threads asking 'what PSU should I get?' you see in almost all of them people advise the OP to get a good quality one with some 20% headroom. That is if the system requires 450W at maximum load they're told to get a 550W unit. As PSUs lose some of their nominal capacity each yeah - good ones less than mediocre or bad ones.

So I wouldn't recomment doing this either - running a PSU with those margins.

A good quality PSU will not run beyond it's comfort zone for long and in retrospect, you shouldn't be doing what you're hypothesizing, unless your gear is expendable.

And this means don't do it unless you don't care if you lose your components. It mean if you run a PSU with those kinds of margin YES it might very well "ruin the powered components".

Also almost all PSUs (decent and really good quality) operate best and most efficiently between 50-80% load - not almost 100% load. hence, "comfort zone".

 

[Grealish01]

With that kind of load (which translates into more heat); the first thing that pops into mind is that the PSU will most probably have a shorter life.

Depending on the design and build quality if it's really a good quality one and user is lucky (as one of the PSU components is not one of those that pass QC but are not 100% OK for long) it will try to provide the nominal power to the system as long as there are no big spikes. That is if it's not connected to a system with component that would have large transients. But, transients happen anyway on any system.

If you see threads asking 'what PSU should I get?' you see in almost all of them people advise the OP to get a good quality one with some 20% headroom. That is if the system requires 450W at maximum load they're told to get a 550W unit. As PSUs lose some of their nominal capacity each yeah - good ones less than mediocre or bad ones.

So I wouldn't recomment doing this either - running a PSU with those margins.


And this means don't do it unless you don't care if you lose your components. It mean if you run a PSU with those kinds of margin YES it might very well "ruin the powered components".

Also almost all PSUs (decent and really good quality) operate best and most efficiently between 50-80% load - not almost 100% load. hence, "comfort zone".

I don't know what you mean by transient. However, I say when the PSU works well without switching off and without having power peaks, the powered components are not affected, right? only the PSU is affected which, even if it works normally, is in a stressful condition, but that was obvious, I would be interested in understanding if mobo and CPU would be "healthier" if they received 350 watts from a 700 watt PSU compared to a 460 watt? I don't think this is true, but I ask you

 

[DSzymborski]

Honestly, you're asking for a question that can't be answered in a neat and tidy fashion. Quality of PSUs vary greatly as do the types of load/stress you're placing on them.

Rather than theoretical questions, which won't yield answers of much value, it's best to ask specifically about the situation you're wondering about.

 

[Satan-IR]

That question would require writing textbooks but I try a short one.

In electrically-powered systems (PSUs - PCs) the sinusoidal wave deviates from its normal form whenever there is a sudden change in the system such as by addition or removal of loads or power outages. This short (miliseconds) sudden deviation/change from the normal sine wave is called transient.

They can have external srouces like a power outage. Also interal sources. Every time you turn on, turn off, load, or unload an inductive device, you produce a transient. Power switching, FETs in other components in the system (motherboard, graphcis card) also cause transients.

Also when an electric circuit is switched on, the current reaches to maximum value almost in zero time and when the circuit is switched off, the current drops to zero from maximum value in no time.

But if there is inductors or capacitors in a circuit (which are in PSUs), the current will not become maximum from zero or from maximum to zero in no time. The current will take a finite time or one can say it is a gradual process. Thus the electric current which takes finite time to become maximum from zero or zero from maximum in circuits having inductors and capacitors, then such currents are called transient currents (in that certain finite period of time).

Transients, depending on conditions, result in voltage drops. However, in a good quality the voltages should remain within the regulation limits defined by the ATX specification.

MOBO and CPU being "healthier" has many factors. One of them is VRM (voltage regulation modules) of the board itelfs and how it handles the power it gets from PSU and how it distributes it to CPU, RAM, PCIE slots and all other components, which is a complicated process.

That 350W doesn't remain 350W constantly. If this is the maximum some components will need/draw it will change in different stages of the system's operation depending on the load. This is more a matter of efficiency than remaining healthy and also efficiency ratings. A PSU rated at 550W would be usually more efficient providing a 350W load than a 50W load. It's own health and whether it would keep other components healthy are a result of design and build qauality and how tight its regulation and how good its protection mechanisms are.

In real world scenarios, a PSU is working with changing loads all the time, depending on how busy the CPU or graphics cards are. So it is very important, for the PSU, to be able to keep rails within the ranges, defined by the ATX spec. The smaller the rail deviations from nominal voltages the more steady the system will be and as a result less stress will be applied to the components.

P.S. Didn't really read it again to see if any part needs changes. Hopefully, others will have some input too.

 

[Ralston18]

Think of it this way:

On a very gusty, wind shifting day you are standing on the narrow edge of a high steep cliff.

How much "comfort zone" do you want?

 

[Zerk2012]

I can't think of a quality 460 watt power supply.

 

[Grealish01]

Think of it this way:

On a very gusty, wind shifting day you are standing on the narrow edge of a high steep cliff.

How much "comfort zone" do you want?

I can't think of a quality 460 watt power supply.

instead it exists

 

[Zerk2012]

instead it exists

List the make and model number or just post a link to it then.

 

[Grealish01]

List the make and model number or just post a link to it then.

LC Power 6460gp4

 

[Bob.B]

ex. 460 watt PSU with an i5 12600K and a 6500xt gpu, in this situation the PSU holds up (I know for sure), but it is still in a stressful situation because eg. is supplying 350/400 watts to the build when its max is 460. In this situation what little problems could there be? are my 2 hypotheses or does the PSU gradually degrade and shorten its life, or are the powered components ruined? you think? I hope the second hypothesis is not true, because in the end it is the PSU that is in stress, but the energy it provides is always the same, whether a 460 watt provides 400 watts or a 1000 watt provides 400 watts, again I ask confirmation. Thank you have a nice day

As you push up towards the top you take away the margin for error.

If the psu does detect an error and shuts down clean then normally not a problem.

If the psu shuts down dirty/crashes you might be looking at some serious pc damage.

Bottom line.....best not to go there.

 

[Zerk2012]

LC Power 6460gp4

If you look at the 12 V rail it say max combined 426 watts so not a true 460 watt power supply but you could have much worse.

 

[Grealish01]

As you push up towards the top you take away the margin for error.

If the psu does detect an error and shuts down clean then normally not a problem.

If the psu shuts down dirty/crashes you might be looking at some serious pc damage.

Bottom line.....best not to go there.

when the PSA turns off so dirty? and when does it turn off cleanly? what does this depend on?

 

[Grealish01]

If you look at the 12 V rail it say max combined 426 watts so not a true 460 watt power supply but you could have much worse.

the 12v track when does it intervene most?

 

[Bob.B]

when the PSA turns off so dirty? and when does it turn off cleanly? what does this depend on?

No idea.
It's not a feature you want to test when the psu is connected to the pc.

 

[Grealish01]

No idea.
It's not a feature you want to test when the psu is connected to the pc.

I understand, so there is no way to make the power supply turn off when clean? at the very least to increase the likelihood that it will

 

[scout_03]

if you look carefully the 3.3 and 5 volt lines goes to 20 amp and both the 12 volt lines only gives 18 amp each so i would be carefull not to stress it to much on power load it could blow out your better get a higher power psu with a 12 volt line to at least 40 amp and 650 watts up .

 

[DSzymborski]

Ah, that's a low quality PSU. Group-regulated, terrible warranty, could only meet 230V-only 80 Plus Gold despite being a full range PSU, and from a company that has a reputation for lots of junky PSUs.

You already knew all of this before. You've created multiple threads about this.

Build Advice - Advice top of the range PSU, reliable brand, 400/500 watts, 3/5 years warranty

hello, (for those who are a little more expert in power supplies, I ask for some special advice. I thank you regardless, removed I need a power supply that I would use for 3 years and I would change it before the 3 years are over, for these 3 years I will not buy a dedicated gpu, therefore keep...

forums.tomshardware.com

You asked for a quality PSU, you were recommended quality PSUs, and you chose to not purchase one. What you have is what you have.

 

[Grealish01]

if you look carefully the 3.3 and 5 volt lines goes to 20 amp and both the 12 volt lines only gives 18 amp each so i would be carefull not to stress it to much on power load it could blow out your better get a higher power psu with a 12 volt line to at least 40 amp and 650 watts up .

thanks, how can i stress the 12v line less? always if I can do it

 

[DSzymborski]

thanks, how can i stress the 12v line less? always if I can do it

Make sure not to use a GPU that uses much power. Ideally, one that doesn't need supplementary power from the PSU.

 

[Bob.B]

I understand, so there is no way to make the power supply turn off when clean? at the very least to increase the likelihood that it will

The error checking/shutdown circuits are built into the psu.
How well do they function?.......beats me.
It is not a feature I want to test.

 

[scout_03]

your cpu could draw up to 150 watts and for the gpu they ask for a 400 watts psu that do not leave a big amount of power for the other device in system so if you overload the psu it will shut down so you play with it at your risk made sure you have budget for new parts in case .

 

[Grealish01]

Ah, that's a low quality GPU. Group-regulated, terrible warranty, could only meet 230V-only 80 Plus Gold despite being a full range PSU, and from a company that has a reputation for lots of junky PSUs.

You already knew all of this before. You've created multiple threads about this.

Build Advice - Advice top of the range PSU, reliable brand, 400/500 watts, 3/5 years warranty

hello, (for those who are a little more expert in power supplies, I ask for some special advice. I thank you regardless, removed I need a power supply that I would use for 3 years and I would change it before the 3 years are over, for these 3 years I will not buy a dedicated gpu, therefore keep...

forums.tomshardware.com

You asked for a quality PSU, you were recommended quality PSUs, and you chose to not purchase one. What you have is what you have.

your cpu could draw up to 150 watts and for the gpu they ask for a 400 watts psu that do not leave a big amount of power for the other device in system so if you overload the psu it will shut down so you play with it at your risk made sure you have budget for new parts in case .

which means: "you don't leave a large amount of power for the other device in the system"?